General Discussion
  >> BTwholesale DSL Implementation


Register (or login) on our website and you will not see this ad.


  Print Thread
Standard User XRaySpeX
(knowledge is power) Mon 05-Sep-11 14:04:57
Print Post

Do non-LLU ISPs auto provide ADSL2+ at 21CN exchanges?


[link to this post]
 
Do non-LLU providers, like O2 Access and Sky Connect, automatically switch their users from IPStream ADSL Max to WBC ADSL2+ when their exchange goes 21CN.

Or do they continue on IP Stream ADSL Max, at least for some period. while BT BB customers get ADSL2+ ?

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
Standard User smurf46
(member) Mon 05-Sep-11 15:47:14
Print Post

Re: Do non-LLU ISPs auto provide ADSL2+ at 21CN exchanges?


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
SamKnows explanation of 21CN says the following:
Following the successful trials of the voice component of 21CN in South Wales, the original plan was to initiate a two-stage migration process for IPSteam users to 21CN. The first step was to move users to the 21CN variant of IPStream via a process they dubbed "Transfer Engineering".

However, problems with the testing of this migration has led BT to cancel the automatic migration of IPStream connections. This sudden change of plans surprised and angered some ISPs. BT's stance is that this means that ISPs can migrate users directly to WBC-based products in a single step. This certainly simplifies the process and reduces the chance of error.

which although perhaps not updated recently seems to be supported by this O2 thread:
http://forum.o2.co.uk/viewtopic.php?p=126309 .

There appears to be a long-stop for 21CN exchanges of Spring 2014 on this news item: http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/4712-bt-to-withdr...

No-one was ever convinced by what I said, but by what they understood.

Edited by smurf46 (Mon 05-Sep-11 15:48:31)

Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Mon 05-Sep-11 23:15:06
Print Post

Re: Do non-LLU ISPs auto provide ADSL2+ at 21CN exchanges?


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
I think they do, but at a steady pace, not all their users on that exchange in one fell swoop.

Re your two examples, as far as I'm aware no WBC service is available on O2 Access, and I can't remember seeing it mentioned on Sky Connect either. Both are "up to 8Mbps" services, supplied (these days) through IPSC I expect on non-WBC, (though perhaps there are still a few BT Centrals around), and a mix of that and transferred ones on WBC exchanges being placed on "ADSL Max" type profiles. (Not to be confused with IP Profiles).

A case in point is Plusnet. They automatically transfer customers at some time after the upgrade, but I think keep them on an ADSL profile not ADSL2+ for a while. However if a customer is aware that their exchange has been upgraded they can request an immediate move to ADSL2+.

In the end, each ISP will have its own policy so I don't think a general answer can be given. If you want to know for a specific ISP then I may be able to dig something out. If you are thinking about Orange via BT Wholesale White Label then I have no idea.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - IDNet Home Starter Fibre. Live BQM.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.


Register (or login) on our website and you will not see this ad.

Standard User XRaySpeX
(knowledge is power) Tue 06-Sep-11 03:45:08
Print Post

Re: Do non-LLU ISPs auto provide ADSL2+ at 21CN exchanges?


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
I am just thinking generally.

So, in essance the A is No, users are not put on WBC auto; it is at the whim of the ISP.

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
Standard User chris6273
(member) Fri 09-Sep-11 20:22:09
Print Post

Re: Do non-LLU ISPs auto provide ADSL2+ at 21CN exchanges?


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by XRaySpeX:
Do non-LLU providers, like O2 Access and Sky Connect, automatically switch their users from IPStream ADSL Max to WBC ADSL2+ when their exchange goes 21CN.

Or do they continue on IP Stream ADSL Max, at least for some period. while BT BB customers get ADSL2+ ?


Yes and no.

Only providers which operate over the 21CN network will get their customers migrated over to the 21CN MSANs.

Some packages like Sky Connect only operate over the 20CN network which hands data over to the ISPs completely differently than 21CN.

Providers which do own MSILs on the new 21CN network will switch their customers over, but some will require their customers to renew their contracts with them first.

-------------------------------------------------------------------
My Broadband Speed Test

Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 8128 kbps 448 kbps
Line Attenuation 13.0 db 10.0 db
Noise Margin 16.8 db 24.0 db
Max(Kbps): 11616 1056
Standard User XRaySpeX
(knowledge is power) Fri 09-Sep-11 21:56:10
Print Post

Re: Do non-LLU ISPs auto provide ADSL2+ at 21CN exchanges?


[re: chris6273] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by chris6273:
Only providers which operate over the 21CN network
Which are they, do you know?
In reply to a post by chris6273:
will get their customers migrated over to the 21CN MSANs.
By whose initiative?

I can't see that BTw could auto migrate non-LLU ADSL Max users to WBC ADSL2+, because that could violate the ISP's commercial pricing & packaging policies.

So the decision has to be in the hands of the non-LLU ISPs themselves. They could then choose which of the following strategies to adopt:
  1. Do nothing and keep everyone on ADSL Max. As you say Sky is doing (& presumably O2). Maybe they dug a hole for themselves by selling a separate named 8 Mag non-LLU package unlike other ISPs who sell the same package in both LLU and non-LLU areas, but price and spec them differently.
  2. Do nothing until individual users ask to be upgraded and then take the business opportunity to lock them into a new term contract and maybe increased price.
  3. Do the right thing grin and auto upgrade all their users over time; thus giving them a freebie upgrade to be in line with their LLU counterparts.


1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
Standard User chris6273
(member) Fri 09-Sep-11 22:53:26
Print Post

Re: Do non-LLU ISPs auto provide ADSL2+ at 21CN exchanges?


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
I believe it is down to the ISPs to request their customers to be moved onto the new MSANs (They place orders to BT Wholesale to get the move done).

As for the ISPs, I don't know every one but to name a few:

BT Retail
PlusNet
AAISP

-------------------------------------------------------------------
My Broadband Speed Test

Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 8128 kbps 448 kbps
Line Attenuation 13.0 db 10.0 db
Noise Margin 16.8 db 24.0 db
Max(Kbps): 11616 1056

Edited by chris6273 (Fri 09-Sep-11 22:53:39)

Standard User adslmax
(fountain of knowledge) Fri 09-Sep-11 22:55:30
Print Post

Re: Do non-LLU ISPs auto provide ADSL2+ at 21CN exchanges?


[re: chris6273] [link to this post]
 
no they cannot transfer to new 21CN MSANs unless the exchange had MSANs support and ready or otherwise they staying on old IP Profile on the 21CN non-MSANs.

If the BTSpeedtester show 0 and 5 at the end of the profile it mean it not on the 21CN MSANs

plusnetADSL2+13 Meg

Edited by adslmax (Fri 09-Sep-11 22:56:40)

Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Fri 09-Sep-11 23:06:59
Print Post

Re: Do non-LLU ISPs auto provide ADSL2+ at 21CN exchanges?


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
If the BTSpeedtester show 0 and 5 at the end of the profile it mean it not on the 21CN MSANs
?
What do you base that statement on please? As a minor point how does something end in two different digits simultaneously?

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - IDNet Home Starter Fibre. Live BQM.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
  Print Thread

Jump to