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Standard User oldskool
(member) Thu 15-Aug-13 15:08:55
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Bras Profile after using LLU


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Hello

I've been with o2 LLU for quite some time now, but thinking of switching to an bras profile provider - if that is the correct term these days.

From what i remember from my non LLU days before o2, i had quite bad speeds and it was very sensitive to bad syncs. I understand BT have evolved the profiling system a bit since then.

So my question is about sync speeds and throughput. After some time cleaning up wiring around the house and at the master socket, with a Billion router and an SNR tweak down to 3dB i currently achieve a sync of 16873Kbps. Very happy with that.

If i run a speedtest i achieve pretty much exactly 14Mbps. Quite a bit down from the actual sync speed. Is this speed drop to be expected on LLU connections?

My bras profile will be funnily enough 14Mbps assuming i get the same sync speeds (i hope) when i swicth provider. But, will my speedtests on my 14Mbps profile also be around 2.8Mbps lower than the profile.

Is the difference between sync and speedtest going to be the same on LLU and non LLU (i.e. is the difference in speed something attributed to my local machine and wifi network perhaps).

If so, it seems i will be much better off speed wise sticking with a LLU provider unless sky is really bad when it migrates.

thanks
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 15-Aug-13 15:32:57
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Re: Bras Profile after using LLU


[re: oldskool] [link to this post]
 
Providing you have 21CN WBC (ADSL2+) at your exchange you will get about the same speeds as LLU. They are both ADSL2+ after all.

Nowadays on WBC, IP profile is usually instantaneously 88.2% of sync. The old laggy stepwise IP Profile of ADSL Max no longer applies to it.

So, on a sync of 16873 K your IP Profile will be 14882 K and your throughput will be about 14.1 Meg.

Another advantage of WBC DLM is it will award a 3 dB NM on stable lines.

What is your exchange? What is your attenuations so we can see what you should get on WBC?

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 20 Meg WBC
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Thu 15-Aug-13 15:59:17
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Re: Bras Profile after using LLU


[re: oldskool] [link to this post]
 
The expected throughput on O2 is between 81% and 84% of sync, dependent mainly on the conditions of the particular line. It looks as though you have yours fairly clean.

The loss is basically down to TCP/IP and ATM overheads.

The WBC IP Profile system approximately takes care of the larger of those two - I always forget which and it doesn't matter for this purpose. The 88.2% figure they have chosen, with immediate adjustment, is far better than the 20CN one of huge steps with 1-5 days wait for it to update. The smaller overhead then hits that 88.2% and you end up with around the same final speed as with O2 LLU.

As XRaySpeX says, the new WBC also automatically drops lines to 3dB if they are working well, but it cannot be fixed at that in the way O2 would set it for you. Depending on your router, you do of course have the possibility of tweaking it yourself.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk | Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet UnLim Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 51.8/16.8Mbps @ 600m. - BQM

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.


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Standard User oldskool
(member) Fri 16-Aug-13 15:34:17
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Re: Bras Profile after using LLU


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Thanks both that is good to know

Seems i should be in the same sort of speed region then.

I manually tweak my router down to 3dB and it hangs on. If i go down to 2dB it does tend to eventually reboot after a few days.

My tweaking seems to have paid off and many of the street stats showing typically speeds of 10Mbit.

My exchange is this one : http://www.samknows.com/broadband/exchange/WMSTO

Does indicate 21CN is enabled.

p.s. my attenuation is 32dB indicated by the Billion Router. I think it varies very slightly depending on the router i use.

My Billion router uses a broadcom chipset, is this a match with BT equipment or should i be looking at another ADSL router for best sync speeds?

Edited by oldskool (Fri 16-Aug-13 15:37:55)

Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Fri 16-Aug-13 23:04:41
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Re: Bras Profile after using LLU


[re: oldskool] [link to this post]
 
Broadcom based should be fine. Sync speed looks OK for that attenuation, at 3dB SNRM.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk | Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet UnLim Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 51.8/16.8Mbps @ 600m. - BQM

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Fri 16-Aug-13 23:48:57
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Re: Bras Profile after using LLU


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
Sync speed looks OK for that attenuation, at 3dB SNRM.
But those are current stats on non-BT. Doesn't indicate anything about using Broadcom chipset to BT kit.

However, before using Brightbox on BT based Orange I used Netgear DG834GT Broadcom based and it was OK. Slightly slower sync than Brightbox, unknown chipset, but put that down to router.

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 20 Meg WBC
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sat 17-Aug-13 00:07:53
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Re: Bras Profile after using LLU


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
I answered two unconnected questions on one line. Sheer laziness. The speed for the attenuation was to do with the cleanliness of his line.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk | Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet UnLim Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 51.8/16.8Mbps @ 600m. - BQM

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 17-Aug-13 00:58:44
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Re: Bras Profile after using LLU


[re: oldskool] [link to this post]
 
I've never really gone for the myth of matching router/DSLAM chipsets; they are talking to a standard after all.

I believe BT uses all different chipsets in its various Home Hubs, all talking to its own DSLAMs.

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 20 Meg WBC
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