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Standard User garethr
(member) Wed 05-Feb-14 01:03:36
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FTTx Commercial, BDUK or BOTH. Confused.


[link to this post]
 
So, I've been looking into the local areas BDUK data. I'm hoping someone can help me with some rather strange observations.

Lets take a random road and dig a little deeper.

MK10 9DW Monkston in Milton Keynes

Feel free to play along at home.

If we use the checker at

https://bedford.firmstep.com/popup.aspx/RenderForm/F...

It returns

BDUK PHASE 1 BDUK.

That's interesting because if I look at the BT ADSL checker at

http://www.dslchecker.bt.com/adsl/ADSLChecker.address

and go through all the address in the street I get the following:

Bradwell Abbey Cabinet S1 Monkston - Yes S1 its a TIPON rearrangement. Long story.

MK10 9DW 2. FTTP
MK10 9DW 4. FTTP
MK10 9DW 6. FTTP
MK10 9DW 8. ADSL
MK10 9DW 10. ADSL
MK10 9DW 12. FTTP
MK10 9DW 14. FTTP
MK10 9DW 16. FTTP
MK10 9DW 20. FTTP
MK10 9DW 22. FTTP
MK10 9DW 24. FTTP
MK10 9DW 26. FTTP
MK10 9DW 28. FTTP
MK10 9DW 30. FTTP
MK10 9DW 32. FTTP

Right, so BDUK (rural broadband) funding is required to connect 2 houses in a modern estate that hosted the BT trial FTTP network.

Even more interesting if you consider the extract from an e-mail I got from DCMS.

"I refer you to paragraph 20 of the National Broadband Scheme State aid decision which defines white areas for both NGA and basic broadband,
please see attached link - http://ec.europa.eu/competition/state_aid/cases/2432...

Which states

(20) Target areas: The funding provided under the current scheme may be used to deliver local
(or community) basic broadband projects in "basic broadband white areas" and NGA
projects in "white NGA areas". For the purposes of this aid scheme, "basic broadband
white areas" are areas where basic broadband services at a minimum download speed of 2
Mbps are not available at affordable prices18 and there are no private sector plans to deliver
such services in the next three years.19 For the purposes of this aid scheme, "white NGA
areas" are areas where NGA broadband services at an access (download) speed of more
than 30 Mbps20 are not available at affordable prices21 and there are no private sector plans
to deliver such services in the next three years. The targeted "white NGA areas" shall be
considered as "white" or "grey" areas from basic broadband point of view, as there are no
two competing broadband infrastructures (such as cable and xdsl) in place22.

OK so I've found 1 street...

Ok so here's another 80 odd which might be as many as 1100 properties.

*** However, there could be some errors in this so the information should be treated with some caution ***

Postcode Number of Properties with FTTP Already BDUK Phase
MK109BA 9 1
MK109BW 21 1 and 3
MK109BX 22 1 and 3
MK109DR 11 1
MK109DW 14 1
MK109DX 4 1
MK109DZ 6 3
MK109ET 7 3
MK109EU 3 3
MK109EW 8 1 and 3
MK109EX 15 3
MK109EY 42 3
MK109FG 48 1
MK109FH 10 1
MK109FJ 16 1
MK109FL 7 1
MK109FN 7 1
MK109FW 42 1
MK109FX 17 1
MK109FY 5 1
MK109FZ 11 1
MK109GE 2 1
MK109GH 6 1
MK109GN 10 1
MK109GP 25 1
MK109GQ 9 1
MK109GT 10 1
MK109HG 15 1
MK109HH 35 1
MK109HJ 5 3
MK109HQ 18 1
MK109HR 22 1
MK109HU 11 1
MK109HW 3 1
MK109HX 3 1
MK109HY 11 1
MK109JB 24 1
MK109JD 5 1
MK109JE 14 1
MK109JZ 47 1
MK159ED 2 8
MK77AE 2 1 and 8
MK77AF 4 1 and 8
MK77AP 10 1
MK77AS 13 1
MK77AT 5 1
MK77AU 3 1
MK77BA 33 1
MK77BB 7 1
MK77BD 14 1
MK77BE 8 1
MK77BG 12 1
MK77BH 19 1
MK77BJ 14 1
MK77BL 15 1
MK77BN 2 1
MK77BP 30 1
MK77BQ 10 1
MK77BX 17 1
MK77DD 8 1
MK77DE 6 1
MK77DF 1 1
MK77DL 23 1
MK77DP 16 1
MK77DQ 2 1
MK77DR 39 1
MK77DS 11 1
MK77DT 45 1
MK77DU 10 1
MK77DZ 8 1
MK77ED 5 1
MK77EG 9 1
MK77EL 2 1
MK77EN 35 1 and 8
MK77EP 9 1
MK77EQ 37 1
MK77ES 7 1
MK77ET 2 1
MK77EU 3 1 and 8
MK77EW 26 1
MK77LR 10 1 and 8
MK77LS 10 1
MK77LT 6 1

Total 1150


Draw your own conclusions. I am.


Regards,

Gareth
BT Internet 21CN ADSL 1.4Mbps/400Kbps
BT Infinity FTTP 166Mbps/20Mbps soon
Standard User Ignitionnet
(knowledge is power) Wed 05-Feb-14 09:47:40
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Re: FTTx Commercial, BDUK or BOTH. Confused.


[re: garethr] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by garethr:
Draw your own conclusions. I am.


You have too much time on your hands?

Apologies, churlish I know, but too easy.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 05-Feb-14 11:12:53
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Re: FTTx Commercial, BDUK or BOTH. Confused.


[re: garethr] [link to this post]
 
Conclusion:

BT rolled out FTTP then the accountants costed up the hours to install it, versus the number of people buying it and said it is uneconomic to continue this roll-out, and the money saved will connect more homes via FTTC.

So if BT has declared a property or two uneconomic then it can have funding, there is a small amount of overlap allowed - the exact amount open to interpretation. As some of the FTTP work will be done already in the street, checking invoices for work would need to be done carefully.

As things stand, if BT does want to do it commercially and objects are raised on state aid the conclusion may be that the missing properties get no upgrade. There is no pressure to deliver anything above 2 Mbps to everyone yet.

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.


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Standard User Ignitionnet
(knowledge is power) Wed 05-Feb-14 11:43:53
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Re: FTTx Commercial, BDUK or BOTH. Confused.


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
So if BT has declared a property or two uneconomic then it can have funding, there is a small amount of overlap allowed - the exact amount open to interpretation. As some of the FTTP work will be done already in the street, checking invoices for work would need to be done carefully.


Being more serious, this. Some properties on a cabinet missing from the NGA rollout leave it eligible for funding. The existing ones are considered 'collateral damage'.

It won't have much of an impact in the grand scheme as far as premises passed go.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 05-Feb-14 12:09:53
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Re: FTTx Commercial, BDUK or BOTH. Confused.


[re: garethr] [link to this post]
 
In an email you said the two ADSL properties cannot get 2 Mbps.

Checker suggests 1 to 4 Mbps. So question is what are the connection stats for the properties, a good number of people due to wiring have slower speeds than they could otherwise get.

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User garethr
(member) Sat 08-Feb-14 12:00:07
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Re: FTTx Commercial, BDUK or BOTH. Confused.


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Andrew,

There are plenty of people that can only get <1 Mbps in the area. The average about 400Kbps to 1.5Mbps when stable.

Unless you're telling me that if the line will syncs at 2Mbps for a few hours it is 2Mbps and that's it.

Having a analogue CATV cable wrapped around your phone line doesn't help matters.

The area was part of the extended range ADSL trial and FTTP trial. But before that was TIPON and people couldn't get ADSL.

Regards,

Gareth

Gareth
BT Internet 21CN ADSL 1.4Mbps/400Kbps
BT Infinity FTTP 166Mbps/20Mbps soon
Standard User Fastman2
(newbie) Sat 08-Feb-14 14:29:28
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Re: FTTx Commercial, BDUK or BOTH. Confused.


[re: garethr] [link to this post]
 
could be also the developer decided not to talk to the operator to deploy broadband after the FTTP pilot was already completed and so they only have copper -- for voice - thats a big problem in a large fttp area already built so you end up with new hoiuses (2 -3 years on 1 meg and hours 4 -5 years ond on 300 meg
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