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Standard User Mygri
(learned) Wed 11-Jun-14 12:20:50
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Fibre Bypass


[link to this post]
 
I'm hoping some kind person can show me how to the start resolving our current lack of fibre connection.

The situation is that a fibre feed passes between buildings which are nonetheless excluded from the service. Other nearby buildings are showing a mix of FTTP and FTTC availability according to the BT Broadband Availability Checker, whereas the best we, the excluded, are showing is ADSL2+.

Just to illustrate how seemingly bizarre this is, the link below shows the view from our bedroom window, with one of the distribution point chambers clearly visible in the pavement opposite, 12 paces from our property. Btw, it was installed 18 months ago.

Just to drive the point home, the building in the picture is one of those showing only ADSL2+ availability. About a month ago, a couple of OR guys were at this chamber, connecting someone further up the road. (No, I'm REALLY NOT jealous..... ) When I asked them about the lack of availability, they were extremely helpful and informative, and indicated that in view of the number of residences affected, a petition to BT/OR should result in a survey and the likelihood of the necessary ducts and associated infrastructure being installed. They also indicated that there was plenty of capacity for additional connections.

So there seems to be a way forward, BUT, given the impenetrability of the OR website, I need a point of contact through which I can submit a petition/ expressions of interest; can anyone oblige?

Background info: the location is Newlyn, Cornwall, Postcode TR18 5QH, served by Cabinet 1 from Penzance exchange. I have already e-mailed Superfast Cornwall, and apart from an automated reply referring to their FAQs, have had no response. We are currently getting download speeds of just under 4Mb. 17 residences in all are suffering this bypass, 1 block of 4 flats (inc. us), an adjacent block of 6 flats, 4 flats opposite (as picture) and 3 town houses. I believe that the reason for the FTTP is that this is a conservation area. All the affected building were formerly industrial, now converted to residential, although some other similar buildings do apparently have fibre availability.

I'd be grateful for any pointers.

Picture link: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/aBgLo-Cq5dbhqm...
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 11-Jun-14 13:18:27
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Re: Fibre Bypass


[re: Mygri] [link to this post]
 
There is no obligation to provide everyone a fibre based connection yet, so for some reason they've decided to not do your properties.

Flats add the added complication of landlords and getting permission to install the fibre ducting and blow fibre through the building if its FTTP.

Your point of contact will be the superfast cornwall project people, they work at arms length from the London people and are generally helpful if you are reasonable.

List of postcodes in cabinet 1 area that have FTTP (percentage is % of properties covered)
TR185QZ 100%
TR185QQ 100%
TR185QH 62%
TR185QG 22%
TR185QF 99%
TR185QE 99%
TR185QD 100%
TR185QB 89%
TR185PZ 61%
TR185PT 41%
TR185PS 86%
TR185PR 83%
TR185PN 75%
TR185JB 37%
TR185JA 42%
TR185HZ 60%
TR185HY 100%
TR185HX 100%
TR185HW 40%
TR185HU 99%
TR185HT 100%
TR185HS 99%
TR185HR 100%
TR185HQ 57%
TR185HP 100%
TR185HN 25%
TR185HJ 100%
TR185HH 75%
TR185HG 100%
TR185HF 100%
TR185HE 100%
TR185HB 100%
TR185HA 100%
TR185DU 5%
TR185DS 66%
TR185DF 100%
TR185DB 100%
TR185BZ 100%
TR185BY 50%
TR185BX 37%
TR185BU 100%
TR185BT 100%
TR185BS 100%
TR185BQ 50%
TR185BG 95%
TR185BE 94%
TR185BD 37%
TR185BB 100%
TR185BA 99%
TR185AZ 99%
TR185AY 8%
TR185AQ 100%
TR185AD 75%
TR185AB 66%

Use BT wholesale checker can see for example that FTTP is available to TOLCARNE FM HOUSE, TOLCARNE, NEWLYN, PENZANCE, TR18 5QH but some others it is not.

When were the buildings converted? If during or after the roll-out then that would be the issue. Have any flats in the area of cabinet 1 got FTTP available, if no then the issue of landlords and extra hassle (read time, read expense) means you have been bypassed.

It may also be influenced by the ducting, i.e. one side was easier to do, and your side needed more roadworks, i.e. expense and permission issues

My next step would be to take plot out on a map the exact situation for TR18 5QH the pattern may emerge of it being a cluster. Also take to landlords, since I presume the flats all have leaseholds and see if any were approached, a combined residents with landlords on board and willing to get things up and running would help.

They only upped their planned coverage to 95% target in 2013, so it may be they will come back to you, the old target was 80%.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Mygri
(learned) Wed 11-Jun-14 17:13:56
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Re: Fibre Bypass


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for your response.
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
There is no obligation to provide everyone a fibre based connection yet, so for some reason they've decided to not do your properties.
Hmm... same as broadband generally then?
Flats add the added complication of landlords and getting permission to install the fibre ducting and blow fibre through the building if its FTTP.
We are the landlords of our building, although this doesn't apply in other cases. In various conversations I've had, it is apparent that flats seem to present difficulties that OR prefer to avoid if they can. That this is also a conservation area has probably given them the vapours and caused them to file it under 'too hard'.
Your point of contact will be the superfast cornwall project people, they work at arms length from the London people and are generally helpful if you are reasonable.
They also seem to work at arms length from the population they are supposed to be serving. As I indicated in my original post, I've already e-mailed them and been ignored - far from encouraging!
List of postcodes in cabinet 1 area that have FTTP (percentage is % of properties covered)
TR185QZ 100%
TR185QQ 100%
TR185QH 62%
TR185QG 22%
TR185QF 99%
TR185QE 99%
TR185QD 100%
TR185QB 89%
TR185PZ 61%
TR185DF 100%
TR185DB 100%
TR185BD 37%
TR185BB 100%
TR185BA 99%
TR185AZ 99%
TR185AY 8%
TR185AQ 100%
TR185AD 75%
TR185AB 66%
A very comprehensive listing - I'm impressed! I've removed the one's not in the immediate vicinity. I'm not actually bothered which variety of fibre can be supplied, as long as it's one of them, FTTP or FTTC.
Use BT wholesale checker can see for example that FTTP is available to TOLCARNE FM HOUSE, TOLCARNE, NEWLYN, PENZANCE, TR18 5QH but some others it is not.

When were the buildings converted? If during or after the roll-out then that would be the issue.
All were completed by about 2008, well before the launch of superfastcornwall.
Have any flats in the area of cabinet 1 got FTTP available, if no then the issue of landlords and extra hassle (read time, read expense) means you have been bypassed.
In TR18 5QH, one block of flats has FTTC availability, and another building with two or three residences (but not a flat) has 2 or 3 residences and is FTTP.
It may also be influenced by the ducting, i.e. one side was easier to do, and your side needed more roadworks, i.e. expense and permission issues

My next step would be to take plot out on a map the exact situation for TR18 5QH the pattern may emerge of it being a cluster.

See map at this link: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/Lv78Bgg1uZhE5d...
The area within the red outline is currently showing ADSL2+ only, all others, FTTP or FTTC; I don't think we've been so much bypassed as run through!
Also talk to landlords, since I presume the flats all have leaseholds and see if any were approached, a combined residents with landlords on board and willing to get things up and running would help.

They only upped their planned coverage to 95% target in 2013, so it may be they will come back to you, the old target was 80%.
Clearly support from those affected will be what it will be. My next step was to canvas them, but my biggest misgiving is superfastcornwall. Their failure to respond to my e-mail does not give me confidence in a productive interaction...

Anyway, your comments and thoughts are much appreciated - many thanks.

Mike


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Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 11-Jun-14 18:38:11
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Re: Fibre Bypass


[re: Mygri] [link to this post]
 
Once you have an idea of how many are wanting to upgrade to FTTP and SFCornwall are still playing the ignore game then email me Andrew@thinkbroadband.com with a link back to this thread and I'll pester.

A lot depends on exactly what is in the chambers (ag node, fibre splitter or manifolds and how fully utilised they are, and state of ducting into the unserved properties.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Mygri
(learned) Wed 11-Jun-14 19:10:10
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Re: Fibre Bypass


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Thank you.

It may take a little while to contact the appropriate landlords, but if SFCornwall then still have their tin ears turned on I'll certainly take up your kind offer.

BRs

Mike

Edited by Mygri (Wed 11-Jun-14 19:10:44)

Standard User Mygri
(learned) Thu 12-Jun-14 12:07:20
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Re: Fibre Bypass


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
A follow-up question, if I may.

In your list of postcodes, you indicate TR18 5DB and TR18 5QZ as having 100% FTTP availability. Both of these are fully within the redlined area I indicated. Where did you get the information? When I use the BT broadband checker https://www.dslchecker.bt.com/pls/adsl/adslchecker.w... (address option, just enter postcode), both these show zero fibre availability or prediction.

I don't want to head off on the wrong tack if the BT checker info is incorrect.

Cheers

Mike
Standard User Mygri
(learned) Fri 20-Jun-14 12:08:52
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Re: Fibre Bypass


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
I've managed to contact most of the people affected - 12 definitely interested out of 17 potential residences - but before I go knocking on SuperfastCornwall's door again, I'd like to clarify the availability situation as per my query qoted below. If your info is better than the BT checker, I'd like to know where it came from and how good it is.

Thanks

Mike
In reply to a post by Mygri:
A follow-up question, if I may.

In your list of postcodes, you indicate TR18 5DB and TR18 5QZ as having 100% FTTP availability. Both of these are fully within the redlined area I indicated. Where did you get the information? When I use the BT broadband checker https://www.dslchecker.bt.com/pls/adsl/adslchecker.w... (address option, just enter postcode), both these show zero fibre availability or prediction.

I don't want to head off on the wrong tack if the BT checker info is incorrect.

Cheers

Mike

Edited by Mygri (Fri 20-Jun-14 12:15:55)

Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Fri 20-Jun-14 12:31:31
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Re: Fibre Bypass


[re: Mygri] [link to this post]
 
There are assorted errors in the various BT databases which can mean things do NOT always marry up.

The information is from one source that I cannot name

Some FTTP is definitely live in the area of BON VILLAS, NEWLYN, PENZANCE, TR18 5BZ on Exchange PENZANCE is served by Cabinet 1

There must be something odd about the local area as TR18 5DB is showing as cabinet 1
TOLCARNE STORES, CREEPING LANE, NEWLYN, PENZANCE, TR18 5DB on Exchange PENZANCE is served by Cabinet 1 but no FTTP availability.

The FTTP footprint can have holes in it, either due to the roll-out pausing with the aim to come back later, or the unlucky addresses are missing out in the current project.

It is these sort of issues that make it so difficult to say with certainty what is going on.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Mygri
(learned) Fri 20-Jun-14 13:00:23
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Re: Fibre Bypass


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for a speedy response -
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
There are assorted errors in the various BT databases which can mean things do NOT always marry up.
Indeed - the BT/OR postage list for this area is frankly a complete shambles, and bears little relation to the Royal Mail database which is bang up to date, although it does reflect a seriously fragmented postcode collection which could do with some rationalisation, imho.
The information is from one source that I cannot name
Understood
Some FTTP is definitely live in the area of BON VILLAS, NEWLYN, PENZANCE, TR18 5BZ on Exchange PENZANCE is served by Cabinet 1

There must be something odd about the local area as TR18 5DB is showing as cabinet 1
TOLCARNE STORES, CREEPING LANE, NEWLYN, PENZANCE, TR18 5DB on Exchange PENZANCE is served by Cabinet 1 but no FTTP availability.

The FTTP footprint can have holes in it, either due to the roll-out pausing with the aim to come back later, or the unlucky addresses are missing out in the current project.

It is these sort of issues that make it so difficult to say with certainty what is going on.
It's definitely not a straightforward situation, sadly.

So I'll now go and try to communicate with SuperfastCornwall to see if they can throw any light on this.

Thanks again - I may well be back to take up your offer.

Cheers

Mike
Standard User Mygri
(learned) Wed 25-Jun-14 16:37:41
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Re: Fibre Bypass


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Progress!!

Had an e-mail response from a very helpful man at SuperfastCornwall, who provided links for submission of interest forms (to OR) for both landlords (the key that would appear to open up the whole situation), and also for residents (not needed, at least not at this stage).

I don't know how deeply buried these form links are, but I was unable to find them despite extensive trawling of the OR site. The SC man did apologise for their previous lack response, saying that they had 1000s of messages... hmmm...

Anyway, the ball now seems to be rolling, and I shouldn't be needing to take up your offer smile

I'll post updates as things (hopefully) progress.

Thanks again

Mike
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