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Standard User webandITstudio
(newbie) Mon 07-Jul-14 12:30:55
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UL versus DL speeds on VDSL2


[link to this post]
 
Hi all, I recently swapped to FTTC with EE from ADSL2.
Whilst i am happy with the download speed I am concerned about the rather low UL speed.
I am getting 11.8Mbps DL and .49 Mbps upload.
I am out of the 10 day training period and those are the sync speeds not the throughput which is very very close to those figures anyway. The DL speed is in line with what I would expect after having consulted the graphs etc. for a 1.6kKm line length with a downstream attenuation of 33dB but I'm sure I should get at least 1Mbps upload on that line.
EE say it's within their suggested speed profile for my line so they won't escalate it with BT.
I would really appreciate your advice on this please.

Edited by webandITstudio (Mon 07-Jul-14 12:59:35)

Standard User Seansmit17
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 07-Jul-14 13:56:11
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Re: UL versus DL speeds on VDSL2


[re: webandITstudio] [link to this post]
 
Its hard to say whats going on with out any current line stats.

But I would of thought your upload would be higher as well.

hat modem have you got? ECI or HG?

If its a HG612 You can "unlock" it to get your line stats. It can be done with the ECI as well but its not as easy to do.

TalkTalk 80Mb
Current Line Status (Est)

Connection Speed 79999 Kbps 19999 Kbps
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 07-Jul-14 14:07:27
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Re: UL versus DL speeds on VDSL2


[re: webandITstudio] [link to this post]
 
Due to the way upload and download bands are handled on FTTC VDSL2 Profile 17a you cannot expect upload to hold up as well as it used to for long lines.

While generally one would expect slightly better upload, it is by no means guaranteed and if the line is testing clear of voice level faults then probably nothing to be done, other than revert to ADSL2+ if that was better.

The line stats may give a clue or two, but ideally having them from day 1 would help. The training period is never over by the way, your speeds might still go down, or might go up. It is just that after a day or two generally things have settled into the rough region of where they will stay.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.


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Standard User webandITstudio
(newbie) Mon 07-Jul-14 14:32:22
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Re: UL versus DL speeds on VDSL2


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Thanks MrSaffron and SeanSmit17 for the replies. I will post the line stats that are available within the modem - it's one of the new EE Brightbox2 routers.

On adsl2+ I was getting a fairly steady 6Mbps DL and 0.95 Mbps UL.

The BT wholesale checker says I can get 3.5 on ADSL and 8.6 to 13.6 on VDSL so I would say my line is actually very clean. The same checker reports I should get between 0.8 and 1.2 Mbps UL which I would be happy with.

I think the DL speed is more important to me but I do a lot of uploading of pictures and websites so I want to maximise UL as well. I certainly don't expect it to be less than ADSL2+. EE are holding me to an early termination fee if I were to request to go back to ADSL.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 07-Jul-14 14:41:15
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Re: UL versus DL speeds on VDSL2


[re: webandITstudio] [link to this post]
 
At line lengths over 1km it is very much a hit or miss affair and since lines this long are fortunately fairly rare the ISP and us do not have masses of data to make clear projections on.

Suspect you are at that length where just part of one set of upstream blocks is available, and down to negotiation on costs of leaving, Openreach can sometimes be persuaded if the line is really bad to let the contract lapse, but generally they only panic over download.

If I was at that location and could not move, I'd get a second line in using ADSL2+ for its upload and flip between the two connections depending on what I need to do.

I get 21 down, 5 up as around 1 to 1.2km line on FTTC and have two lines and do exactly this for large downloads and uploads, so that I always keep one line clear for work stuff.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User MHC
(sensei) Mon 07-Jul-14 14:44:18
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Re: UL versus DL speeds on VDSL2


[re: webandITstudio] [link to this post]
 
Have a look at: www.netsys.com.tw/support/download/VDSL2_WP.pdf Figure 2 on page 4 shows how Upstream and downstream can be combined. That one looks at profile 30a - 30MHz whereas the UK only implements 17a - but the principle is the same. In each case, profile, 8, 12, 17, 30 there are several bandplans - each slightly different which allocate individual tones block to up stream and down stream.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User webandITstudio
(newbie) Mon 07-Jul-14 15:30:16
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Re: UL versus DL speeds on VDSL2


[re: Seansmit17] [link to this post]
 
Here are the stats that my router has available after a 68 hour uptime. You can see that the upstream sync speed is crippled.

Configured Current
Line Status -- UP
Link Type -- Interleaved Path
Operation Mode Automatic G.993.2 (VDSL2)
DATA RATE INFORMATION
Upstream 495 (Kbps)
Downstream 11879 (Kbps)
DEFECT/FAILURE INDICATION
Operation Data Upstream Downstream
Noise Margin 6.4 (dB) 5.9 (dB)
Line Attenuation 0.0 (dB) 33.0 (dB)

Indicator Name Near End Indicator Far End Indicator
Output Power 5.3 (dBm) 7.7 (dBm)
Fast Path FEC Correction -- --
Interleaved Path FEC Correction 0 0
Fast Path CRC Error -- --
Interleaved Path CRC Error 0 0
Loss Of Signal Defect 0 3
Fast Path HEC Error STR -- --
Interleaved Path HEC Error 0 16806
Error Seconds 4335 3
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 07-Jul-14 15:34:16
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Re: UL versus DL speeds on VDSL2


[re: webandITstudio] [link to this post]
 
Crippled but not with lots of spare noise margin

The DLM most likely has reacted to the Error Seconds suggesting that even though you are syncing at a low speed the line may still be getting errors due to length and local RF conditions.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Seansmit17
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 07-Jul-14 17:41:35
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Re: UL versus DL speeds on VDSL2


[re: webandITstudio] [link to this post]
 
It does seem you may be stuck with that .4mb upload for now.

Maybe when Vectoring comes along you MAY get a better upload but thats a big maybe.

TalkTalk 80Mb
Current Line Status (Est)

Connection Speed 79999 Kbps 19999 Kbps
Standard User webandITstudio
(newbie) Wed 09-Jul-14 19:45:41
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Re: UL versus DL speeds on VDSL2


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Thanks very much for looking at these stats for me guys.

So we can say that EE are not capping me in any way and it's just down to the modem negotiation?

Is it possible a different VDSL2 modem might help me?

Edited by webandITstudio (Wed 09-Jul-14 19:52:49)

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