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Standard User ollieports
(newbie) Sun 17-Jul-16 14:41:06
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FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


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Hello,

Some help needed with the below situation please!

We recently purchased a house in a new development in Maidenhead. Within this development the majority of properties are fitted with a super fast fibre broadband service as standard (FTTP).

It appears our property (which we bought second hand) was one of the first properties built on the site (now 2.5 years old) and at the time of build, Openreach and the developer didn't get timings right and therefore missed out installing the FTTP service the row of properties on our road.

The current situation has left us with a very slow internet connection (around 6meg) which is not fast enough to allow us to work from home, due to the nature of the work we do.

We've now been in discussion with BT's executive complaint team and The developer for over three months with no resolution. It's been verified to me by an Openreach engineer on site that the fibre cabling is right outside our property and just needs to be pulled up to the house through existing conduit, which is a very quick job. The database can then be updated and BT place an order for fibre. Speaking with BT, they have no way to initial this process with Openreach and on the other hand The developer are saying it has to be initiated by BT.

It's a very frustrating situation given our neighbours opposite and surrounding us are connected up to the fibre service (300meg speed) and we have no current hope of getting it.

The industry regulator can't help us, so any advice on how to proceed with solving this would be greatly appreciated

Many thanks,

Ollie

Edited by ollieports (Sun 17-Jul-16 20:40:17)

Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 17-Jul-16 19:58:02
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
Hi there Ollie, and welcome to the forum.

Is this the 'Kingfisher Drive' estate ? If so which part are you in ?

Standard User ollieports
(newbie) Sun 17-Jul-16 20:34:33
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
Hi there

Yep that's right, we're in Brambling Way

Thanks

Ollie


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Standard User B31
(member) Sun 17-Jul-16 21:08:35
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
Have you considered contacting your MP, see if they can give everyone a kick into life?



BT ADSL customer getting 4.9 Mbps (0.8 Mbps up) on a new road / new build development - it was around 1.6 to 1.9 Mbps when I first moved in though.
CAB not FTTC enabled, not part of the 66% commercial plan. Not a BDUK area. Hoping the council will let VM in-fill!
Standard User TheEulerID
(experienced) Sun 17-Jul-16 21:12:57
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: B31] [link to this post]
 
His MP is rather busy putting a government together just at the moment...
Standard User B31
(member) Sun 17-Jul-16 21:21:26
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: TheEulerID] [link to this post]
 
Oh...

Well, hopefully she can delegate it to one of her assistants / parliamentary researchers.



BT ADSL customer getting 4.9 Mbps (0.8 Mbps up) on a new road / new build development - it was around 1.6 to 1.9 Mbps when I first moved in though.
CAB not FTTC enabled, not part of the 66% commercial plan. Not a BDUK area. Hoping the council will let VM in-fill!
Standard User ollieports
(newbie) Sun 17-Jul-16 22:11:39
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: B31] [link to this post]
 
Good shout - we've actually already done this, there is an assistant on the case but doesn't appear to be getting anywhere currently.

Any further thoughts on how the situation could be resolved?
Standard User gah789
(member) Mon 18-Jul-16 00:50:03
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
Money and/or wait. Openreach has no obligation to provide you with an FTTP connection. Nor does the developer have any obligation unless (a) there was a provision in the original sale that guaranteed FTTP access, and (b) this was transferred to you when you bought the house.

Either you can wait until the USO is introduced in which case you can ask for a 10 Mbps connection and Openreach might install FTTP as the simplest way of providing that speed. Or, you find out how much you have to pay Openreach to install the FTTP connection. Since BT Retail lack imagination or the systems to do this, go to an ISP that is willing to go out of its way to organise the connection. The most obvious one is A&A. You will, of course, finish up paying for the time and effort that they have to put into organising the connection.

A final option is to get a leased line - i.e. money again. The fibre is there so there should be no excess construction charge but the annual cost will be much higher than an FTTP line because you will have to pay for dedicated IP transit.

The core problem is that FTTP is expensive to install and operate (due to the bandwidth provided) but Openreach does not charge a corresponding amount extra in annual rental. So someone has to make up the difference. For new estates that someone is the developer. However, it sold your house without needing to pay the premium required. There is no particular reason why it should do that 2 years later, which puts the onus on you if you want FTTP badly enough.

Sadly, we come back to caveat emptor.

Edited by gah789 (Mon 18-Jul-16 00:51:59)

Standard User WWWombat
(knowledge is power) Mon 18-Jul-16 02:06:28
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
Have you tried these direct?
http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/t/4493231-re-...
Standard User Fastman2
(committed) Mon 18-Jul-16 06:21:04
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
assume you are on slough120 they are you
Standard User Icaras
(experienced) Mon 18-Jul-16 07:29:58
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: gah789] [link to this post]
 
Gah789, that all seems a bit excessive. From what he's said he's in an FTTP area, it sounds more of a database issue now. If it just needs cable pulling through, ONT fitting etc that's not a big deal for Openreach. The question really should be how does he go about getting his house on the correct database so that an order will be accepted?

Leased line is irrelevant. It doesn't use the same infrastructure as native Openreach FTTP anyway, and is more likely to be a dedicated fibre connection back to the local exchange. Rather than with native FTTP which would be going back to the nearest fibre headend, often not the local exchange. So it would be like starting from scratch there.

Edited by Icaras (Mon 18-Jul-16 07:33:19)

Standard User ollieports
(newbie) Mon 18-Jul-16 07:51:53
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: Icaras] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for the comments all,

So to clarity this is a new estate built from the ground up (previously a field) the original plan was for it to be fibre only, but timings got messed up at the start so they ended up doing copper only to some of the initial properties.

The FTTP is there, live in houses directly opposite and the cabling is in the BT drain 2.5metere outside my front door
Standard User TheEulerID
(experienced) Mon 18-Jul-16 08:55:17
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
You could try writing to Clive Selley. Some times and approach to the top helps, especially if there's the hint of bad publicity in the media.
Standard User ollieports
(newbie) Mon 18-Jul-16 09:25:20
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: TheEulerID] [link to this post]
 
Thanks - we did do this originally, then got through to the executive complaints team who have not managed to find a solution
Standard User lee111s
(experienced) Mon 18-Jul-16 09:31:18
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
Perhaps go back to Gavin Patterson right at the top. CEO's don't like repeat emails smile
Standard User Icaras
(experienced) Mon 18-Jul-16 09:51:01
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
Well the New Sites team (responsible for new builds) presumably intended the whole estate to be FTTP, yet you're on the estate and can't get it. So on that basic level it would appear something has gone wrong. Yes write another email.
Standard User B31
(member) Mon 18-Jul-16 10:35:59
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: lee111s] [link to this post]
 
yes, email again, and keep emailing every month, then every week, until they get fed up of you.

It's bad enough being stuck in a new build without FTTC, but knowing FTTP goes right past your house, that must be really annoying.



BT ADSL customer getting 4.9 Mbps (0.8 Mbps up) on a new road / new build development
(It was around 1.6 to 1.9 Mbps when I moved in)
CAB not FTTC enabled, not part of the 66% commercial plan. Not a BDUK area. Hoping the council will let VM in-fill.
Standard User Fastman2
(committed) Mon 18-Jul-16 11:27:18
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
but timings got messed up at the start so they ended up doing copper only to some of the initial properties - that was either they only asked for copper or asked to late for FTTP -- they woyuld have needed to sign a contract for FTTP.
Standard User MHC
(sensei) Mon 18-Jul-16 14:38:12
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
The EC complaints team will be the one that works on behalf of the main BT board. There will be an equivalent one that deals with high level complaints within the OR division. Surely the ones you are dealing with must be able to speak with their counterparts in OR and get them to cascade it down through the OR management chain.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User lee111s
(experienced) Mon 18-Jul-16 15:26:31
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: MHC] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MHC:
The EC complaints team will be the one that works on behalf of the main BT board. There will be an equivalent one that deals with high level complaints within the OR division. Surely the ones you are dealing with must be able to speak with their counterparts in OR and get them to cascade it down through the OR management chain.


That's exactly how it should be beingn dealt with.
Standard User MHC
(sensei) Mon 18-Jul-16 15:38:41
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: lee111s] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lee111s:
In reply to a post by MHC:
The EC complaints team will be the one that works on behalf of the main BT board. There will be an equivalent one that deals with high level complaints within the OR division. Surely the ones you are dealing with must be able to speak with their counterparts in OR and get them to cascade it down through the OR management chain.


That's exactly how it should be beingn dealt with.


Exactly, but is it?

The cost of the EC complaints team, per hour, will be way higher than an OR Tech and overall dealing with this will have cost more than doing the work.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User ollieports
(newbie) Mon 18-Jul-16 15:41:59
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: B31] [link to this post]
 
thanks - the thing is we have now had a formal letter from the BT exec complaints team saying this is there final position. I will drop the CEO another note, it's a very annoying situation having it literally 2.5 meters outside the front door
Standard User PaulKirby
(fountain of knowledge) Mon 18-Jul-16 15:49:39
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: lee111s] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lee111s:
In reply to a post by MHC:
The EC complaints team will be the one that works on behalf of the main BT board. There will be an equivalent one that deals with high level complaints within the OR division. Surely the ones you are dealing with must be able to speak with their counterparts in OR and get them to cascade it down through the OR management chain.


That's exactly how it should be beingn dealt with.
Yes it "should", but saying that, it still might not help due to they have to contact "Openreach" and most of they time it ends with a fob off date that comes and goes, like mine has done for 4.5 years and I have had an "Executive Level Complaints; BT Consumer" on the case for the last couple of years.

Strangely enough I have got more information out doing research and openreach than what the EC Team have, which might of helped.

I have emailed everyone I could find, my Local MP which has done loads to help, BT, Openreach, CEO of Openreach (Clive Selley) and there was a few others.

But if you email them too much they just ignore your emails, openreach are also known to just stop responding when you show proof that contradicts what they have said, they really hate that LOL.

And to the OP, yes its annoying to know that the FTTP Hardware that would be used is live, in our case out of several linked FibreDP Hardware only one home can order FTTP and is currently using it since Jan 2016, to be stuck on ~4 Mbps when 4 doors has 330 kind of sucks.

But now according to the last email from Openreach they say light loss testing was dated to of started last week and that CPS will have the ready for service on the 20th July, which the EC team at BT was also told, so if that doesn't happen there will be hell to pay LOL

Paul
Standard User PaulKirby
(fountain of knowledge) Mon 18-Jul-16 16:02:15
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: MHC] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MHC:
In reply to a post by lee111s:
In reply to a post by MHC:
The EC complaints team will be the one that works on behalf of the main BT board. There will be an equivalent one that deals with high level complaints within the OR division. Surely the ones you are dealing with must be able to speak with their counterparts in OR and get them to cascade it down through the OR management chain.


That's exactly how it should be beingn dealt with.


Exactly, but is it?

The cost of the EC complaints team, per hour, will be way higher than an OR Tech and overall dealing with this will have cost more than doing the work.
Well yes and no.

Well in my case we have had 3 "Executive Level Complaints, BT Consumer" team member dealing with our case for the last 3 years, 2 of them just gave up and said there was noting they could do and closed the case.

The 3rd and latest current one seems to be doing more than the other two, maybe due to all the emails that I have sent all other the place like the CEO etc, also photo evidence also might of helped which was also sent to the CEO smile

As for the cost, you are probably correct there, the issue with our FibreDP, Manifold Hardware (as Openreach call it Fibre Equipment) is that it is live and all connected up and one home is using it already.

So all openreach needs to do is push the update switch so that it shows up as ready for service for the rest of us on that hardware.

Paul
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 18-Jul-16 18:57:47
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
OK, sorry for the slow reply.

The site has both copper (cab is in the alleyway almost opposite the sales office as you turn into Kingfisher Drive) and FTTP for most addresses, but on the latest part being built I am unsure if there is both copper and FTTC available.

Was at an address near yours a couple of weeks back, it would seem, at that point, that none could get FTTP service, and would appear that the splitter node has been connected to the wrong head end equipment in the exchange ....... whether this has now been resolved I know not.

Standard User ollieports
(newbie) Mon 18-Jul-16 19:56:26
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for this info, yea we can literally see the cabinet from our garden...

With the properties in phases 2&3 of the development it appears the FTTP has been pulled to the houses by default as they all have the little grey Openreach box on the front... For whatever reason phase 1 (which includes ours) has been missed. Do you know if there are plans to go back around and connect us lot with slow connections?
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 18-Jul-16 21:10:21
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
Do you know if there are plans to go back around and connect us lot with slow connections?

I bumped into an Openreach guy who was going back in to do work on some of the flats on Grebe way, these appeared 'missed" so there is hope I suspect.

Are the developers still in evidence ? For it is they who will know what they asked Openreach to provide.

Edited by Zarjaz (Mon 18-Jul-16 21:11:55)

Standard User Fastman2
(committed) Mon 18-Jul-16 21:34:25
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
whether it is out the Door or not -- which may or not be the case -- the develpement was built with copper so suggest you see if the developer wants to fund as they sorted all the other phases -- who are the developer
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 19-Jul-16 21:01:42
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
Was actually working on that estate this afternoon !

The problem I mentioned with misrouted fibre/head end is now resolved.

There was at least one gang of FTTP 'new sites' bods in evidence.

Standard User ollieports
(newbie) Tue 04-Oct-16 15:29:10
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: Fastman2] [link to this post]
 
Hi Guys,

A few months have passed now and we still don't have a resolution. Our local MP's team are on the case with the developer and BT Openreach but nothing yet has been sorted.

Is there any Openreach engineers who have worked on Boulters Meadow who can advise what needs to actually be done here to resolve the issue?

We now have houses directly opposite, two doors down and behind with FTTP connections going in. We're stuck on 7meg copper and I'm unable to work from home because of this poor speed

Many thanks,

Olllie
Standard User Fastman2
(committed) Tue 04-Oct-16 18:01:29
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: ollieports] [link to this post]
 
My understanding is that this cab will be enabled with FTTC and not FTTP think an contract agreement reached between Management company and Openreach recently
Standard User ollieports
(newbie) Tue 04-Oct-16 18:30:04
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Re: FTTP - Installation Missed - New Build


[re: Fastman2] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for this information Fastman.

So would I be right in assuming that all properties with FTTP in phases 2/3 stick with that, then we in phase 1 with the slow copper connection will get upgraded to the standard fibre speeds?

If this is the case it's brilliant news. Do you have any idea of timescale for this?

Regards,

Ollie
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