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Standard User sunteam_paul
(newbie) Sat 15-Sep-12 11:35:25
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Suddenly no ADSL on new router...old still works?


[link to this post]
 
I'm having broadband issues recently and trying to troubleshoot them is boggling my mind because I just don't know enough to figure out exactly what's wrong. It can get a bit complicated so I'll try to make it as clear as possible.

Routers involved in this issue are (from oldest to newest):
ROUTER A: Netgear DG834v2 (wired modem/router)
ROUTER B: Netgear DG834Gv4 (wireless ADSL2+ modem/router)
ROUTER C: Netgear Wireless-N 300 Router with DSL Modem

I had the first issue in June this year - ROUTER B had been working fine for as long as I'd had it (well over a year) when suddenly it stopped receiving the ADSL signal (not connection to the web, but the ADSL signal itself). So I swapped it with the old ROUTER A, which worked fine. I assumed ROUTER B was broken and I needed wireless, so I purchased ROUTER C.

After installing ROUTER C, it also had issues finding the ADSL signal. I chatted to Netgear about this and switch my old ADSL filter with the new one that came with the router. It worked fine. Annoyingly, ROUTER B also worked with the new filter.

Yesterday, ROUTER C stopped receiving the ADSL signal. ROUTER B also fails to connect. ROUTER A works.

My assumption is that it might be the ADSL filter again (still the new one, not changed anything recently). Is this likely? Could a filter work only with an old wired router and not newer ones and are they really prone to fail? Are there different grades of filter or could it be that the newer routers are just cheaply made and something internal has failed?

All this is confusing to me, any advice would be appreciated.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 15-Sep-12 11:43:27
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Re: Suddenly no ADSL on new router...old still works?


[re: sunteam_paul] [link to this post]
 
The router stats with the different filters may help to show if they are causing an issue

A microfilter should only be blocking the telephone signal from affecting the ADSL. They are designed with a low pass filter, so that only signal 'under around 20 KHz are passed to the phone.

Things like dry solder joints can cause all manner of issues, and these can be intermittent, and also behave differently based on level of moisture in the air

IMPORTANT If there are no telephone devices connected to the telephone line no need for a microfilter, just need the right lead to plug the ADSL modem into the telephone socket. This will let you test hardware without any effects from the microfilter

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User 4M2
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 15-Sep-12 12:09:22
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Re: Suddenly no ADSL on new router...old still works?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
IMPORTANT If there are no telephone devices connected to the telephone line no need for a microfilter, just need the right lead to plug the ADSL modem into the telephone socket. This will let you test hardware without any effects from the microfilter


Or something like this: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Socket-Straight-Wired-Phone-... - which would allow the use of an existing good quality rj11 to rj11 adsl lead?


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Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sat 15-Sep-12 12:12:24
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Re: Suddenly no ADSL on new router...old still works?


[re: sunteam_paul] [link to this post]
 
Have you changed the cable between the socket/filter and the routers, or are you using the same one all the time? if you are, try swapping it.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Connection - Plusnet Extra Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 56.0/13.9Mbps @ 600m.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
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Standard User sunteam_paul
(newbie) Sat 15-Sep-12 13:25:47
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Re: Suddenly no ADSL on new router...old still works?


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for your replies.

I have tried 2 different cables to connect the router to the filter. The same results with both: ROUTER A works, B and C do not.

However, I had a thought and did an experiment with interesting results: I have 2 separate sockets in the house, one which goes to the router + a Sky box, another to the phone + another Sky box. I unplugged the telephone/Sky filter from the wall and ROUTER C made the connection. I plugged it back in and the connection dropped again.

This is odd as it's been connected in this way for years.

I pulled out a brand new filter (still sealed) that I had and tried that in the phone socket - but again the router drops the signal as soon as it's plugged in. It's not that simple though.
Here's the sequence of events:
1. Nothing in second phone socket - router connects OK
2. Plug in new filter on its own - router still connected.
3. Plug telephone into filter - router loses signal.
4. Unplug telephone from filter, but keep filter in socket - router still cannot connect.
5. Unplug filter completely - router still failed to connect, left for maybe 5-7 minutes trying this.
6. Started ripping my hair out. Restarted router a couple of times, plugged and unplugged things. My current (new) router ROUTER C only connected after I had plugged in the old ROUTER A, then switched the lead back to it.
7. Plug in new filter on its own to second phone socket - connection seems stable.
8. Plug in phone to filter - signal drops, router disconnects.
9. Remove phone and filter from second phone socket - 1:22pm. 2 mintes later it connects.


Note that throughout all of this, the old wired ROUTER A works all the time, regardless of what's plugged in elsewhere.

P.S. I'm not sure that I have a lead which allows me to connect the router directly into the wall, so I can't check that yet.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 15-Sep-12 13:29:48
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Re: Suddenly no ADSL on new router...old still works?


[re: sunteam_paul] [link to this post]
 
You need to remove the wiring of the second socket so that only one socket works in the property and is the one electrically closest to where the telephone enters the property.

Then use this to check all the hardware.

It may be that there is some odd wiring coming into play

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User sunteam_paul
(newbie) Sat 15-Sep-12 13:35:34
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Re: Suddenly no ADSL on new router...old still works?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
I just plugged the phone into the socket that leads to the router. I can get ADSL and phone OK throught this socket. That leads me to conclude it's the second wall socked that is faulty.

As this will probably cost an arm and a leg to get BT out to look at it, I might just run the phoes from this one from now on, hoping that nothing else goes wrong.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 15-Sep-12 13:38:33
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Re: Suddenly no ADSL on new router...old still works?


[re: sunteam_paul] [link to this post]
 
As fault is in the extension then you can fix it, or pay a private phone engineer to do it for you.

Or take photos of both ends wiring and people will explain what to do.

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User sunteam_paul
(newbie) Sat 15-Sep-12 13:45:33
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Re: Suddenly no ADSL on new router...old still works?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for all your help so far.

What I don't get is how one router works yet two others don't. Are they more sensitive to noise on the line or something?
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 15-Sep-12 13:47:30
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Re: Suddenly no ADSL on new router...old still works?


[re: sunteam_paul] [link to this post]
 
yes different routers behave very differently, If we were to see the stats it is often possible to infer if a line is under performing, and a common cause is internal wiring

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
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