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  >> Home Networking, Internet Connection Sharing, etc.


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Standard User Noki
(newbie) Thu 04-Oct-18 14:23:55
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Virgin and Sky Broadband working in harmony... (help!)


[link to this post]
 
Hi all, long story short I need help with my new 2 router setup.

Background
I've had Virgin everything for years and decided to ditch it for Sky. All except the broadband, and since it's cheaper to get the full Sky TV, Telephone and Internet package I now have 2 internet lines from 2 ISPs. I kept the Virgin internet as it gives me around 380MB. Sky gives me around 8MB as I chose the lowest package for that.

Problem
Right, the problem is that when I plug them both in to the network the Sky Router takes over everything. Even my phone connected via wifi directly to the Virgin Router reports 8MB speed when tested through speedtest.net. So the Virgin Router in all instance gets the internet from the Sky router if it's available. As soon as I power off the Sky Router the internet speed increases and it's clearly back on the Virgin line.

I don't get why though. I have disabled DHCP on the Sky Router and can't find any settings that seem helpful to stop this from happening. The UI is more limited that a normal non-ISP router. (I do have a spare netgear router which I could use, but want to configure this to all work together).

Taking my Desktop as an example, this is connected via gigabit LAN like this:

My PC > Switch > Virgin Router

The Virgin router then runs downstairs to another Swich like so:

Virgin Router > Second Switch > Sky Router

So why would my Desktop pass through the Virgin router to get to the Sky Router to get to the internet?

Ultimately I want the Virgin Internet to be primary and the Sky Internet to be secondary. Having both in the mix gives me WIFI upstairs and downstairs. If I have to turn one into Modem only mode then I lose WIFI in part of the house.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Thu 04-Oct-18 16:24:36
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Re: Virgin and Sky Broadband working in harmony... (help!)


[re: Noki] [link to this post]
 
if the issue is Wi-Fi connectivity then no need for the two to be connected, i.e. just connect over Wi-Fi to the one you want.

As for the DHCP turned off, have you checked what IP ranges each router is using, i.e. there may be a clash and what IP address is the PC using, plus gateway and DNS settings.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Noki
(newbie) Thu 04-Oct-18 17:18:53
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Re: Virgin and Sky Broadband working in harmony... (help!)


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for responding, to answer your points:

1) Wifi sucks in this house, the signal dips so low when switching from upstairs to downstairs I need extra access points to make it usable.

2) Each router has it's own IP and I can manage them both at the same time through my browser.

3) I've tried setting my Desktop's gateway address to match the Virgin Router and still it ends up going through the slower Sky connection to the net. I believe the Virgin Router is doing this, I just can't see why it would pass onto the Sky Router when it has an internet connection directly.

I cannot see any options on either router that would cause this.


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Standard User TechServ
(newbie) Thu 04-Oct-18 18:22:56
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Re: Virgin and Sky Broadband working in harmony... (help!)


[re: Noki] [link to this post]
 
Neither Router is designed to operate the way you desire (Primary / Secornday), you'd need a dual WAN Router for that.

As to why you are seeing these results, if you have turned off DHCP on the Sky Router as you say, you'd need to refresh the DHCP lease on each device to obtain a new lease from the Virgin router not the Sky Router.

You'd need to post a network layout including IP addresses and DHCP leases to understand what is happening, but if you want that setup then you'll need a Dual WAN router and Access Points (Powerline, Mesh or Wired Ethernet) to achieve your desired outcome.

Depending on your cabling you may also need managed VLAN capable Switches to Trunk the Virgin & Sky Incoming connections to your Dual WAN router and Trunk LAN for WiFi AP's back again.

Post some details of the Router ranges and the DHCP leases of clients including DNS & Gateway and it may be clearer

Also verify that turning off DHCP on Sky Router actually does turn it off (test with a wired client device)
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Thu 04-Oct-18 18:54:52
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Re: Virgin and Sky Broadband working in harmony... (help!)


[re: TechServ] [link to this post]
 
From their description I suspect the PC has just one IP address e.g. something like 192.168.1.x

In theory if you give the PC two IP addresses in different local ranges to match the routers and do not set DNS and gateway for one interface then internet access will be via the one where the gateway and DNS are configured. A painful setup with consumer hardware often.

As the aim seems to be wireless access point use, the Sky router does not need to be plugged into a phone line and you do not need to be paying Sky for broadband. Or just buy a wireless access point and don't connect the two broadband routers together and just plug the wireless access point into the Virgin router.

Is the Sky router the newer Sky Q device? Or the older Sky Hub?

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User baby_frogmella
(knowledge is power) Thu 04-Oct-18 19:01:02
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Re: Virgin and Sky Broadband working in harmony... (help!)


[re: Noki] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Noki:
Ultimately I want the Virgin Internet to be primary and the Sky Internet to be secondary. Having both in the mix gives me WIFI upstairs and downstairs. If I have to turn one into Modem only mode then I lose WIFI in part of the house.

Seems a bit strange that you got a significantly slower connection on Sky just to get better wifi in another part of your home?

Anyway as your Virgin 380 Mb/s connection is far, far superior to your 8 Mb/s Sky connection I would just turn off & remove the Sky router altogether and invest in a wireless mesh system such as this and you will find that easily solves your wifi issue on the Virgin router.

FluidOne FTTPoD 330/30
Linksys EA9500v2
Standard User Noki
(newbie) Thu 04-Oct-18 19:14:50
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Re: Virgin and Sky Broadband working in harmony... (help!)


[re: TechServ] [link to this post]
 
That sounds more complex than my needs. I didn't realise I would need a separate piece of hardware to achieve this setup. Given that the Sky is only 8MB I can always plug it back in if my main Virgin line goes down.

As I said I have another Router (Netgear WGR614 v9) spare that I can use to give me Wifi downstairs more easily and cheaply than buying a new device.

Given that it is literally 50/50 on which Internet connection would be used it really is my luck that it would pick the super slow one. I plugged in the Virgin one before the Sky thinking that would be enough to make it primary. I may need to flush it all as you said so may try this when I have some time.

It's a shame as It would be nice to have a completely connected and redundant network, but what am I google or something? On the rare occasion the Virgin net breaks and can get off my ass and plug in the Sky one.

Desktop (1) ### Smart TV ### Laptop (Devices Upstairs)
\ | /
\ | /
Netgear Switch GS108Tv2 (also Upstairs)
|
|
Virgin Router (also Upstairs and is DHCP server)
|
| < (cable run top to bottom)
|
Netgear Switch GS608 v2 (This is Downstairs)
/ | | \
/ | | \
Sky Q Router ### Desktop (2) ### Sky HD Box ### NAS Drive (Devices Downstairs)

(I tried to draw a diagram in text but the spaces are removed, but you get the gist.)
Standard User Noki
(newbie) Thu 04-Oct-18 19:26:49
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Re: Virgin and Sky Broadband working in harmony... (help!)


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
As the aim seems to be wireless access point use, the Sky router does not need to be plugged into a phone line and you do not need to be paying Sky for broadband. Or just buy a wireless access point and don't connect the two broadband routers together and just plug the wireless access point into the Virgin router.

Is the Sky router the newer Sky Q device? Or the older Sky Hub?


I'm hadn't thought of simply unplugging it from the wall, that way it functions as just an access point which is all I need. A second redundant Internet line is just decadent.

It is a brand new Sky Q Router (the basic one).

Edited by Noki (Thu 04-Oct-18 19:27:19)

Standard User Noki
(newbie) Thu 04-Oct-18 19:30:07
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Re: Virgin and Sky Broadband working in harmony... (help!)


[re: Noki] [link to this post]
 
Also as for the speed difference I don't want to use the slower Sky connection at all really (unless the Virgin lines goes down, not important at all at home).

Besides downstairs is mainly for Kindle download and phone browsing so doesn't need crazy speed.

Upstairs is for gaming and high speed shiz.

I think I have a solution that suits my need. I was just curious what I was doing wrong (if anything) and how I could fix it whilst having an other the top setup at home.

Thanks everyone for helping and pitching in, much appreciated smile.

Edited by Noki (Thu 04-Oct-18 19:31:35)

Standard User TechServ
(newbie) Thu 04-Oct-18 19:36:29
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Re: Virgin and Sky Broadband working in harmony... (help!)


[re: Noki] [link to this post]
 
If you want cheap and simple

Setup the SkyQ Router and the Virgin Router to both have the same IP address range and gateway address plus use a third party DNS (Google or OpenDNS). Also set the same WiFi name and password on both routers. then power off the SkyQ Router but leave Ethernet connected to your switch setup

Use your other Netgear device as an Access Point setup on the same IP subnet

Use Virgin as the main router. If that ever goes down, simply power off the virgin router and power on the Sky router and your entire network will function as normal, just the gateway will now be sky not virgin. Even devices that havent renewed the DHCP lease will continue to work as the gateway and dns will be the same
Standard User Noki
(newbie) Thu 04-Oct-18 19:44:19
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Re: Virgin and Sky Broadband working in harmony... (help!)


[re: TechServ] [link to this post]
 
Thanks I have a few options that work fine and are simple. For now I have just unplugged the Sky Router from the wall so now it just does WIFI and I get fast internet everywhere.

I may play with settings as you guys have suggested when I have some more time.

Like I said with it being literally 50/50 on which it would default to and it chooses the slow one. Just my luck.

Edited by Noki (Thu 04-Oct-18 19:47:42)

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