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Standard User bluemoon87
(newbie) Wed 04-May-16 22:14:14
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Options when not commercially viable


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Hi all,

So today I got the wonderful news that the new development I moved in to over a year ago is not commercially viable for BT. As a bit of background there are roughly 1000 houses that have been contracted to have fttp all connected to cabinet 92. My little developer built 34 houses next to that development but decided not to persue fibre but have still been connected to cab 92 which has had the unfortunate side effect that we are now not commercially viable.

I have contacted BTs community funding team and expecting to hear some extortionate price but I was really just wondering if there were any alternatives to BT if we are looking at funding new infrastructure? Or is BT actually the best way to go if they are providing fttp in the area around us and current copper is all ducted to the cabinet?

Many thanks for your help
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Thu 05-May-16 06:48:43
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Re: Options when not commercially viable


[re: bluemoon87] [link to this post]
 
If they did the larger development then suggests developer did not want to bother.

The key going forward is rather than appearing as one person to be a collective 34 customers.

Current position is http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/7345-improved-dea... and if the FTTH is so close if all the homes are done at once then price may not be too bad. If developer is still selling homes on site pressure on them may see them meet target, particularly if they see sales falling through due to poor broadband.

Others such as IFNL can and do do FTTH to new build but often need to be involved before things like pavements are laid. If the road is still private and not adopted by the council an obstructive developer could mean you are stuck.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User bluemoon87
(newbie) Thu 05-May-16 17:41:17
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Re: Options when not commercially viable


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
The developer has now been and gone so that has removed any leverage we would have had so any leverage has gone, so my only hope is that all parties play nice.

I'll see what BT come back with and in the meantime let the rest of the residents know there's an issue and see who would be interested in a community scheme.


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Standard User bluemoon87
(learned) Mon 10-Oct-16 22:17:36
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Re: Options when not commercially viable


[re: bluemoon87] [link to this post]
 
So I'm currently waiting on a quote from the community fibre team but have a few questions that BT have been a bit vague and I'm hoping some wonderful people here might be able to shed some light.

1) If we are gap funding a cabinet would we be asked for more money again for future infrastructure upgrades. Worst case scenario is that this 34 house development is the only set of houses not on fttp so could easily see is not being commercially viable again. BT have said FTTC would not affect our commercial viability, which I don't think answered my question.

2). They have said native fttp is a non starter as this would be a custom quote and there is no suitable ducting to extend the fibre to the site entrance. If they are having to take fibre to the cab anyway couldn't they use the same ducting as that which is being used for the copper or am I looking at it to simplistically? The cabinet is roughly 200m from our site entrance so was interested to see if cabling a fibre cabinet is more cost effective than extending native fttp footprint. I can understand FTTC would have less variables in play that could affect costs, so it's probably more for my personal interest.

Thanks in advance, the help is much appreciated.
Standard User Fastman2
(committed) Mon 10-Oct-16 23:41:10
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Re: Options when not commercially viable


[re: bluemoon87] [link to this post]
 
answer to question 1 is no -- that should have been definitve clear answer all future upgradged will be in line with national roll outs-- it will be just another enabled cab

FTTP will be more expensive at a price per premise and there is significant less choice In terms of service provider

the price per premise required for the Gap will be singnficatly higher

the biggest issue is how many of the 34 people you have spoken to and the gap likelty range typically for enablement of an existing cab with FTTc (which such small premises is also likely to be in 15 - 25k range at least
Standard User bluemoon87
(learned) Tue 11-Oct-16 06:06:04
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Re: Options when not commercially viable


[re: Fastman2] [link to this post]
 
Perfect thanks for the responses. I had a feeling it would be in that sort of range. I will be getting more on the developers back on this. You are right the biggest issue I have had is getting backing in the community. Since there are a few different ownership models in play I.e shared ownership, renting, affordable housing and fully owned, it has been difficult to get input / support on this but once I have the quote I'll take the figure back to community, BDUK (they said they were looking at alternative funding models) and the developer to see what arrangements we can come to.
To satisfy my own curiosity if this had been done during build time the developer would have been quoted a fraction of the cost we would have to pay now, right?
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Tue 11-Oct-16 09:48:53
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Re: Options when not commercially viable


[re: bluemoon87] [link to this post]
 
Unsure of the changes during construction, but if all the developers had gone en-masse to Openreach, then as with rest of site FTTP would have probably arrived.

On the ducting if this is a new (i.e. last couple of years build) then ducting for copper network should be able to support FTTP sub-duct if all the normal rules were followed. But while FTTP is possible the funding level you'd need to raise would be higher, while usually FTTP costs more there are some scenarios where it may be less than adding a VDSL2 cabinet - a lot depends on the cost of power to feed cabinet.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User bluemoon87
(learned) Tue 11-Oct-16 12:01:00
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Re: Options when not commercially viable


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for the information it is a construction from within the last 2 years. I will leave it in the hands of the BT planning gods to see what they eventually come up with. As with when I take a car to the garage I have no idea what they do or how they do it but I like to have an inkling that I'm not just being taken for a ride smile
Standard User bluemoon87
(learned) Mon 05-Dec-16 20:44:57
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Re: Options when not commercially viable


[re: Fastman2] [link to this post]
 
Just confirming BT have quoted in that range for FttP. Will be submitting details to see how many properties will be eligible for funding vouchers from the better broadband scheme later this week but still going to need to do a lot of work to generate the rest of the gap. Last time I spoke to the developer they said they wouldn't do it because they had no legal obligation to do so. Who knows maybe they will have a change of heartsmile
Standard User Fastman2
(experienced) Mon 05-Dec-16 21:48:33
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Re: Options when not commercially viable


[re: bluemoon87] [link to this post]
 
who was your developer -- perhaps they will agree to fund a percentage
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