User comments on ISPs
  >> PlusNet plc


Register (or login) on our website and you will not see this ad.


Pages in this thread: 1 | 2 | (show all)   Print Thread
Standard User knowhowe
(newbie) Sat 01-Jun-13 12:29:44
Print Post

Plusnet Fibre Broadband speed- what is true?


[link to this post]
 
Hi all,

Could somebody please advise?

Taking advantage of the half-price offer, we upgraded to Plusnet's fibre broadband (we've been with them for many years by the way) and must say we're very pleased with the speed improvement.

The service is advertised as being able to deliver "up to 80 BbS"

However, having been alerted by a pal of an administative ordering cockup, we found that PlusNet had hobbled us to half that speed. I rang them to chat about it. They readily admitted to this and I was assured that "someone would get back to me when the mistake had been rectified".

This happed three times. Each call had been made around 1-2 am, night owl that I am. Never heard back from anyone and speed tests showed getting on for 40 MbS each time.

A fourth call to Plusnet, this time in the afternoon, got me a guy who told me the connection at their end was indeed now "up to 80" but that the local exchange couldn't yet deal with that speed. When the exchange was upgraded, I would be too. In the meantime, there was nothing to do but wait.

What do we think? Is he right and is there any way I can get BT's thoughts on this? Being that those three previous staffers had failed to give me this information, have I been fobbed off by a fourth? If I pay for a full bag of apples and only half a bag is delivered, should I be paying for the missing half?

As I said, we've been with Plusnet for years and have generally been very happy with the service and quality of the technical support. The issue just discussed, plus a real doozie a few months back which I won't discuss here, leads me to wonder if this is still the case?

--

The Black & White Picture Place
GoodHiding Leather
Chester Guided Walks...
all at The Handel's Court Gallery,
by the Northgate,
Chester CH1 2HT
Tel 0775 1521 600
knowhowe@bwpics.co.uk
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 01-Jun-13 13:00:57
Print Post

Re: Plusnet Fibre Broadband speed- what is true?


[re: knowhowe] [link to this post]
 
Cabinets which offer FTTC offer both the 40 and 80 Meg variants the speed you actually get is determined by your distance from the green street cabinet.

So it may be someone is trying to say that as you are several hundred metres from the green street cabinet you can only ever expect 40 Meg type speeds.

What was the actual estimate you got at sign up time, rather than the headline speed in the advert which would have been up to 76 Mbps.

BTW on the paying too much for too slow a speed, yes the 40 Meg is cheaper, but by only a small amount each month.

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User WWWombat
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 01-Jun-13 13:26:43
Print Post

Re: Plusnet Fibre Broadband speed- what is true?


[re: knowhowe] [link to this post]
 
If I pay for a full bag of apples and only half a bag is delivered, should I be paying for the missing half?

In this case, you are paying for an unlimited amount of data, passed over a connection made using technology that supports "up to 80Mbps".

I guess you can complain if they deliver only half of an "unlimited" total, or if they ever go at a speed above 80Mbps. Until then, though, you are getting the advertised service.

In reply to a post by knowhowe:
What do we think? Is he right and is there any way I can get BT's thoughts on this? Being that those three previous staffers had failed to give me this information, have I been fobbed off by a fourth?

Maybe.

All cabinets have equipment to support "up to 80Mbps" - there is nothing further to upgrade in either the cabinet or the exchange (*) to reach this speed.

However, like ADSL, FTTC is still a technology (using VDSL2) that is dependent on the distance, although the distance is now between your house and the cabinet, not the exchange. Generally, you can get 80Mbps within 300-400 metres of the cabinet,while you can get 40Mbps between 400 and 600 metres away.

So - you might be limited by your distance, which places a "laws of physics" limit to your sync speed.

Complicating this is that there are three other limits that can tie you to lower speeds, all of which are artificial limits...

One is that the order placed with Openreach is for a 40/10 package - where sync speeds are limited to 40, even if the line could go faster. This kind of order gets placed if you chose the "Essentials" package, rather than the "Unlimited" one. It has been known for Plusnet to order the wrong thing here.

The second is that BT's network allocates you an "IP Profile" value, based on your sync speed.It then uses this to control the rate at which data is sent over their core network to you, so that nothing gets thrown away. This IP Profile is set automatically, so shouldn't ever be wrong - but if it *is* wrong, you get the slow speeds. It has been seen to go wrong on ADSL lines, but hasn't yet been seen to be wrong on FTTC.

The third is that Plusnet's network has a copy of BT's "IP Profile", which it uses to control the routers that manage your traffic, and prioritise it correctly. This too should be set automatically, getting updated from BT. Again, if this is wrong, your speed is limited. This one can easily get set to the wrong value when you first subscribe to fibre, and is known to go wrong at later times too. This is the one that is most likely to be wrong, of all 3.

So, presumably you want to know what to do to check these...

(*) Save for future technology enhancements, which may increase the "up to 80Mbps" to some higher number, or might extend the range at which 80Mbps is possible, but is likely to improve almost everyone's speeds. Trials from Summer 2013.


Register (or login) on our website and you will not see this ad.

Standard User WWWombat
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 01-Jun-13 13:37:18
Print Post

Re: Plusnet Fibre Broadband speed- what is true?


[re: WWWombat] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by WWWombat:
So, presumably you want to know what to do to check these...


The first step is to find out your sync speed. Unfortunately, the modem is locked, so you can't get it directly.

If you have a Huawei modem, you can unlock it by flashing new software onto it.

Without that step, which may feel a little drastic, the best bet is to jump to step 2...

The second step is to find out BT's copy of the IP Profile value, for both downstream and upstream. To get this, you have to run The BT Wholesale speedtest, and once it has finished, hit "Further Diagnostics".

This will then give you both the speedtest results and the IP profile values.

The upstream value is always the full package speed, rather than the sync speed, so it helps indicate if you have been provisioned on a 40/2, 40/10 or 80/20 package.

The downstream value then tells you how fast you should expect things to go. The actual sync speed of the modem will be about 3% higher than this value.

Step 3 is to check that Plusnet's copy matches the BT value.

To do this, go to the portal page under "My Account" > "Connection Settings > "High Speed Broadband" (or click here ). The "Current Line Speed" value should match the BT IP Profile.
Standard User kasg
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 01-Jun-13 13:50:00
Print Post

Re: Plusnet Fibre Broadband speed- what is true?


[re: knowhowe] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by knowhowe:
A fourth call to Plusnet, this time in the afternoon, got me a guy who told me the connection at their end was indeed now "up to 80" but that the local exchange couldn't yet deal with that speed. When the exchange was upgraded, I would be too. In the meantime, there was nothing to do but wait.

Surely, notwithstanding what others have said, isn't this information just plain wrong?

Kevin

plusnet Unlimited Fibre - BQM
Using OpenDNS
Domains and web hosting with TSOHOST
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sat 01-Jun-13 14:35:49
Print Post

Re: Plusnet Fibre Broadband speed- what is true?


[re: kasg] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by kasg:
In reply to a post by knowhowe:
A fourth call to Plusnet, this time in the afternoon, got me a guy who told me the connection at their end was indeed now "up to 80" but that the local exchange couldn't yet deal with that speed. When the exchange was upgraded, I would be too. In the meantime, there was nothing to do but wait.
Surely, notwithstanding what others have said, isn't this information just plain wrong?
Yes.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk | Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet UnLim Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 53.4/16.8Mbps @ 600m. - BQM

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.
Standard User ultra
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 01-Jun-13 14:49:00
Print Post

Re: Plusnet Fibre Broadband speed- what is true?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Think it was set up on the 40/10 speed initially like so many others were, because of PN/Openreach ordering problem.

Can quite understand if the people are too far away (my estimate is 33 to 35 Mbps, but no fibre to try out yet) but it sounds like the first three CS reps agreed his "product" should have been 80/20 (but was ordered as 40/10) and the last one is saying something very different - that it's an Openreach issue, at the exchange.

I must admit I wondered when I first saw the estimate of my speed, whether the kit might only deliver 40 Mbps to the cabinet, and asked about it, but am resigned {until I move} to the fact it may indeed be limited.

Think the speed for this user is probably not the issue so much as inept handling by CS. First few times they were meant to get the product changed but didn't. That's inexcusable. If the person you talk to cannot do the change, it should be queued up for someone who can do it...

If the product change has gone through and speed is unchanged, then that's acceptable (but down to distance) unlike the mess up in the ordering by Plus.Net of the wrong product initially. Nothing Plus.Net can do about that bit, but it would have been better if they had dealt with this better from the start, really.

Anyway, seems like the speed is probably acceptable, and on "half a bag of apples" comment, I don't think that was a strong view, just a reasonable expectation that they should have ordered the proper product in the first place. But talking about the exchange needing an upgrade... seems like a red herring from all the comments here. I could have accepted it (based on my speed estimate and seeing others getting well over 70 Mbps) but now understand it will just be down to distance.

Of course, the bigger question is Plus.Net's policy on telling all the people who have ordered the 'Unlimited' Fibre that the wrong product was ordered. Any comments please, from Plus.Net or is this going to remain one for handling individually when a customer asks (which seems not to have worked at all well for this guy, asking three times before it may have been done).

Plus.Net seems to be pretty poor at communicating when it wants to be... eg people on a Market 2 exchange who were left paying higher monthly amounts than newcomers on the same exchange - would Plus.Net either (a) let them know, or (b) reduce the cost automatically? No, I think was the case for both options. Deplorable customer care, in my view.

I also saw someone post on another forum {Bob Pullen will have seen it} who had been on a 'legacy' "unlimited account" paying 25 quid a month feel extremely annoyed (and probably has left by now) because of not getting any notification from Plus.Net about the new accounts launched in December.

It's on a par with the finance sector (in earlier years) offering a high initial interest rate on savings, but dropping it like a stone after 12 months... and not telling their customers. Even now, the "annual statement" means that some might not notice a significant change in the rate.

Could do better (in the public relations stakes, Plus.Net).

---

If you run a business, have a second ISP and backup web hosting...
Standard User zom22
(learned) Sat 01-Jun-13 16:58:00
Print Post

Re: Plusnet Fibre Broadband speed- what is true?


[re: ultra] [link to this post]
 
The business naivete of people on forums never fails to amaze me
Businesses are in business to make a profit - otherwise they would not bother and sit at home instead.

Now if you are prepared to pay £x per month for some product you are clearly happy paying that price - why would a business tell you suddenly that you can get the product cheaper from them?
All that is going to do is to reduce their profit margin from you!
The only case when a price reduction is a good idea is when the customer is suddenly going to go out and start buying a lot more of the same product so to get the business's overall profit levels up to even more than they were prior.

So it is up to you as a customer to ensure you get the best deal - and that requires you to be proactive and not expecting things to be given to you on a plate with no effort required on your behalf.
This equally applies to purchasing departments inside businesses themselves who are in exactly the same position as you. Well actually no, they do indeed know fully well that their sub-supplier is not going to pass on any cost reductions in the product as a reduced price to them.
It is up to the purchasing dept to get alternative quotes and then use these to either negotiate a price reduction schedule or change supplier ( after taking into account the cost of the 'aggro' such a change invariably causes).

This is how businesses and the world works - everywhere. Agree a price with a customer and then try and get the product cost down to increase the profit margins and not tell the customer you are doing this.
People and businesses who are proactive in getting the best deal for themselves (applies also to pay rises) will get the best deal. Those who sit back and "do nothing" will not.

In reality any business is in competition not just with other businesse in the same market but also with its customers who want more for less and with its suppliers who want to supply less for more.

Welcome to the world.

Now do you understand why Plusnet is not going to tell existing customers they can get their broadband cheaper by changing packages.
Standard User ultra
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 01-Jun-13 17:38:49
Print Post

Re: Plusnet Fibre Broadband speed- what is true?


[re: zom22] [link to this post]
 
While I completely accept Plus.Net is a business, they also use word of mouth as a means of building numbers, but also have an "opt in" e-mail newsletter (not that I can remember the date of the last one). If you're a customer, you would perhaps remember the fact they encourage one to save money by telling prospective users about Plus.Net.

I feel sure they have also announced their "product refresh" from time to time, and while I (and several others) do check at intervals, it really is bad business for them to not announce (especially for those who recommend them to others) just what they are doing, and the pros and cons of any new products.


I don't follow every bit of news about Plus.Net (or any other ISPs) but do find out and do look at primarily news (rather than comparison) sites such as TBB and ISPreview, and thus find out about some aspects of several ISPs rather than just following what Plus.Net announces.

Point is they did put news of their new products on their website, but they probably "think" about Marketing in the way many Media firms do - that Facebook, Twitter, and Blogs are "the only worthwhile way" to promote themselves, and forget that not everyone bothers with RSS, Twitter, etc, and even when there was stronger support for USENET, some of the staff seemed to forget that it was an easy mechanism for them to announce (and support) products.

So it's fine to say "welcome to the world" but Plus.Net has done things differently in the past, and it's far from unreasonable to expect them to either tell customers by way of a "newsletter" or tell those who used to get a newsletter that from now on they will only be using their website to make announcements.

It's better from a PR viewpoint to be open and honest with customers, something Plus.Net has attempted for some time. They sent one of their marketing newsletters 2 months before they launched the new accounts, "plugging" their phone service.

They could have announced the new accounts that way. It would encourage those of their customers who promote their products to do more promoting {and after all, surely those customers should know what they are offering} so I don't accept your viewpoint (and implied criticism of me) that just because it is a business and {like every [??] business} is out to take whatever it can. That doesn't work if you don't keep your customers aware of the products you offer, if you also hope they will promote them. Hope you can see that makes sense.

By the way, here's an extract from that very (19/10/2012) newsletter, sent by e-mail:

"Please note that by changing your preferences, you won't receive promotional emails from Plusnet, including free gifts, competitions and information about new services."

Presumably you are not a customer of Plus.Net so can be excused for being unfamiliar with some of their history.

---

If you run a business, have a second ISP and backup web hosting...
Standard User aks
(committed) Sat 01-Jun-13 21:25:40
Print Post

Re: Plusnet Fibre Broadband speed- what is true?


[re: knowhowe] [link to this post]
 
This happened to me - see this thread.

The support team on the end of the phone seem unable to resolve it, however, PN support staff here on the forums sorted my problem out.

---
Tony
Pages in this thread: 1 | 2 | (show all)   Print Thread

Jump to