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Standard User trolleybus
(member) Tue 26-Mar-13 08:42:01
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Phone and Broadband on LLU


[link to this post]
 
Difficult to know which section of the forum to post this issue on, so let's try here.

For reasons I do not wish to go into it is vital that the telephone number supporting the broadband service is changed. What minefield of issues am I getting into?
Standard User Zarjaz
(knowledge is power) Tue 26-Mar-13 08:48:45
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Re: Phone and Broadband on LLU


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
No matter what any support staff tell you, an number change very often generates an automatic cease order for the associated broadband services. You might get lucky, but I suspect not.

Might it be worth changing ISP and voice supplier at the same time, get a new number in the process and save hassle ?

Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Tue 26-Mar-13 09:51:14
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Re: Phone and Broadband on LLU


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
While it can go wrong, it is not meant to cause problems with the broadband when changing the number if its for a genuine abuse issue.

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.


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Standard User yarwell
(sensei) Tue 26-Mar-13 10:58:45
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Re: Phone and Broadband on LLU


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
if the phone and the broadband are both on LLU then it depends on the provider(s).

If the phone was on BT Retail things can go wobbly with a change of number generating a cease order that needs to be cancelled or countered, but changing of number can be done without that happening as long as it's all clear and understood what services are involved. It could of course go wrong.

The abuse departments should be able to pull it together, if it's genuine abuse, which provider(s) ?

--

Phil

MaxDSL - goes as fast as it can and doesn't read the line checker first.

MaxDSL diagnostics
Standard User trolleybus
(member) Tue 26-Mar-13 11:46:18
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Re: Phone and Broadband on LLU


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
While it can go wrong, it is not meant to cause problems with the broadband when changing the number if its for a genuine abuse issue.


Let me explain the background to this by reproducing below an email sent to TalkTak yesterday. It falls outside being "a genuine abuse issue" but more of an administrative failure by one or more parties, but it is causing genuine distress. Feel free to add any comments you may have but my thoughts are to have the existing numbers transfered permanently to the correct number and to have new numbers issued to the two lines in question.

To avoid any possible confusion we are dealing with TalkTalk Business. Our still live former broadband service, also with TTB, remains live but was on a BT reseller's line which could not be transferred over to TTB because we are only half way through a long contract period. It was stated by TTB that to have their FTTC service the line had to be with them.

Now in, and up and running, we now find that the availabilty of FTTC isn't available to us anyway because OR are in dispute with the local council over the siting of the new cabinet and therefore pushed back a year or more. Something we were not aware of when the order was placed. [Midhurst Cabinet P11].

For obvious reasons, some private data has been blanked out.

----------------

I spoke at length with Samantha in the provisioning team having been transferred by customer services. I wanted to speak with a manger in your organisation about a recent installation of a broadband service using a new telephone line provided by TalkTalk because eventually we wished to upgrade to FTTC when available. My file shows that your order number for the installation was ****** with the work being carried out at Midhurst Engineering situated at Rumbolds Hill in Midhurst using the telephone number 01730 ******.

The physical installation was to our complete satisfaction and indeed the improved broadband speeds was welcomed, and of course the service is at a lower cost than previously paid, but beyond that it has been an utter disaster with the administration side of your organisation. This is not helped by your requirement to set out my concerns in writing and the indicative time scale for a resolution to a serious complaint which in the meantime has had, and will continue to have, very serious consequences for the business of the Company resulting in financial loss and inconvenience to those wishing to contact the Company in emergency situations.

You will note from our web site at [link removed] that an arm of our business is to provide a breakdown service 24/7 using telephone number 01730 812162 where sophisticated facilities are in place to answer incoming calls whenever the call may come in.

From the outset it was made VERY clear that the new telephone number was to be ex-directory and yet from the instant that a phone was connected to the line, we were receiving many nuisance calls but more worryingly also from various organisations wishing to advertise Midhurst Engineering in various directories, in some cases believing that we had relocated. Very rapid contact was made with TalkTalk who assured us that the number was indeed ex-directory and categorically stated that no information of the identity of customers was passed to any third party. Well, whether that is true or not, we now have an instance where a stranded motorist wishing to contact Midhurst Engineering early this morning, was given by “BT” directory enquiries, the number of 01730 ****** which would have been unmanned at that time of day. Our emergency number is, and always has been, 01730 812162.

The motorist was subsequently forced to find another recovery company resulting in lost business and good will quite apart from a long wait in freezing conditions. I suspect this will continue to happen while directory enquiries continues to have 01730 ****** to hand and an immediately resolution to this issue is sought. How this can be achieved, bearing in mind the line supports our essential broadband service, I have absolutely no idea, but something needs to be done FAST.

We also appear to have very similar issues on the other new line installed by you at ***** ******** where the number is 01730 ******; not so severe, but a worry nevertheless. If that wasn’t bad enough the installation issue could not have got any worse requiring three separate visits to the premises totalling over 18 hours of my time as Project Manager to resolve when the time allocated was just 2-3 hours. How some of these errors manifested themselves are beyond my comprehension, but reached new heights of administration and engineering incompetence which are almost worthy of an entry into the Guinness Book of Records.

Sadly getting TalkTalk to acknowledge that the problems were outside the control of the end user was almost impossible to achieve and instead we were lead to believe we had defective hardwire or wiring and perhaps failing to configure the router correctly. At the end of the day it was all down to being connected to the wrong service, faulty exchange equipment and the wrong logon credentials supplied. Eventually we were connected to a senior person who very efficiently sorted out everything within an hour and also supplied tips to tweak the router for better performance.

Be as that maybe, it seems that what should have been routine installations have been nothing but ideal and the problems still keep on coming in of TalkTalk’s making. Is it too much to ask that you get a grip on these issue in the same way that our Company responds to motorists in trouble; with the current problem it might just be that you need our help when you breakdown and sadly with directory enquiries giving out the wrong number, we just wouldn’t know you were in trouble. We have opted for a business class service from a leader in the field, where is that service when we need it most?

----------------------------

It is perhaps unfair to TalkTalk to reproduce this letter here, but 24 hours have now passed without any update being received on the action that they will take. I sure readers of this entry can appreciate the seriousness of the issues which don't seem to have been grasped fully by TalkTalk.
Standard User Zarjaz
(knowledge is power) Tue 26-Mar-13 11:58:47
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Re: Phone and Broadband on LLU


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Hmm, that's not good.

So it's not just a renumber you are after. As a stop gap, can you get/put a temporary divert on the *new* line, so as calls from prospective punters goes to the 812162 number ?

Standard User trolleybus
(member) Tue 26-Mar-13 12:03:08
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Re: Phone and Broadband on LLU


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
An update for everyone. Being a bit peeved about the situation of the dispute between OR and the local council, I emailed NGA Enquiries to get some background information. My email first, followed by the response received.

----

Have watched with interest the roll out of FTTC in Midhurst, West Sussex and when it was clear that orders were being accepted, jumped in with an order with TalkTalk as my preferred supplier. To ensure total continuity of service it was considered that the best option would be to have the FTTC service on a brand new line which was eventually installed a couple of months later. A new broadband service is on the line giving us an immediate tripling of up speed to 15Mpps but hardly any improvement to the up speed. A cease order for the original broadband service has been put in with the line reassigned to other duties in the office.

It was anticipated that a FTTC would be available sometime in April this year but it now transpires this could be a year, or more, later and therefore an order for FTTC cannot be placed. It seems that we would be connected to Cabinet P11 on the Midhurst Exchange which was to be placed at the end of the access to our yard but objections for this location have been lodged and apparently no suitable alternative location can be found. So what does this mean for getting a FTTC service to our premises? Clearly being so close to the cabinet would have given us a superior service. Does it mean that we will have to be connected to a more distant cabinet and thus a less than optimal connection or do you have other options available. The company’s entire business plan for 2013 was built around a faster internet connection for remote CCTV monitoring and VPN connectivity which is now blown out of the water.

Your observations and comments on this matter would be welcomed.

---------

Thank you for your enquiry about fibre broadband on cabinet SD/MDHRS 11. When we attempted to deploy the fibre cabinet associated with the telephony cabinet, we were informed that the proposed location was not suitable as it fell within a conservation area. The council gave us a new location, however, this was 180m from the telephony cabinet which is 80m further than our deployment specifications will allow.

Therefore the cabinet has been deferred out of the deployment programme until further notice.

It is not possible to get fibre broadband by being connected to a different cabinet for several reasons. The underground infrastructure cannot support the rearrangement of lines this way, this is because each cabinet has its own bespoke network serving specific premise. The increased line length from being served by another cabinet would be increased to a point where the fibre broadband would not work.
There are options open for a faster broadband service, one being an Ethernet based service, details are:- http://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/products/ethern...
You could also look at other areas of provision such as satellite broadband or possible a 4g based service.

We may re-examine cabinet 11 at the end of our commercial rollout but I cannot give timescales of when or if this may occur.

-----------------

I am alarmed to read that FTTC may never happen. Considering the number of business premises that will be served by this cabinet, some heads need knocking together to get a resolution to this issue.
Standard User trolleybus
(member) Tue 26-Mar-13 12:06:35
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Re: Phone and Broadband on LLU


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Zarjaz:
Hmm, that's not good.

So it's not just a renumber you are after. As a stop gap, can you get/put a temporary divert on the *new* line, so as calls from prospective punters goes to the 812162 number ?


Yes that would be a resonable solution for the time being and something I would have expected TalkTalk to have provided immediately - but 25 hours later still no response from TalkTalk on this issue.
Standard User yarwell
(sensei) Tue 26-Mar-13 13:11:18
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Re: Phone and Broadband on LLU


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
For what it's worth a TT residential line near me was renumbered due to excessive junk / harassment / misdialled calls and the new number was actually worse for incoming junk. Maybe your experience points out why - there's some mechanism in place releasing the new number to the spammers.

I know it means you taking on some cost / responsibility but could you use call forwarding on the line to get the incoming calls to the right place, or would that conflict with your out of hours regime.

--

Phil

MaxDSL - goes as fast as it can and doesn't read the line checker first.

MaxDSL diagnostics
Standard User trolleybus
(member) Tue 26-Mar-13 14:05:02
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Re: Phone and Broadband on LLU


[re: yarwell] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by yarwell:
For what it's worth a TT residential line near me was renumbered due to excessive junk / harassment / misdialled calls and the new number was actually worse for incoming junk. Maybe your experience points out why - there's some mechanism in place releasing the new number to the spammers.

I know it means you taking on some cost / responsibility but could you use call forwarding on the line to get the incoming calls to the right place, or would that conflict with your out of hours regime.


Para 1: It is actually worse than that because a number of callers actuall knew the address that the phone was installed at [including the other line at the MDs home]. It was initally suggested by TalkTalk that it was a re-issued number and that I should register the number with TPS.

Para 2: In the grand scheme of things the cost of having call forwarding added as a service and using it as required is quite small but you pay for the re-directed leg of the call which could add up to a significant sum of money. Not an ideal situation but it might have to be adopted if TalkTak drag their feet over this matter.

26 hours and still waiting a response from TalkTalk on this urgent issue.
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