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Standard User Jovetic
(newbie) Fri 20-Sep-13 18:59:57
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Unable to get Fibre Stll


[link to this post]
 
My Exchange has been enabled for a long time, 2 years now I think. Yet I still can't get Fibre. Someone said I live too close and am going directly into the Exchange, this doesn't make too much sense. Although my attenuation is incredibly low.

CF82 7EF

Connection Speed 23999 kbps 1137 kbps
Line Attenuation 4.0 dB 3.8 dB
Standard User Spectral
(committed) Fri 20-Sep-13 19:49:31
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Re: Unable to get Fibre Stll


[re: Jovetic] [link to this post]
 
If you are close enough to the exchange to be directly connected too it then it is true that you can't get fibre. The fibre available at the moment is fibre to the cabinet as you are connected to the exchange directly you are not connected to a cabinet.
Standard User pcoventry76
(knowledge is power) Fri 20-Sep-13 20:37:57
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Re: Unable to get Fibre Stll


[re: Jovetic] [link to this post]
 
Indeed mate,

The exchange appears to be behind the Scout hut and the English Baptist Misson church on Central Street. You can always tell a BT exchange usually the windows are all boarded up with grey metal.

The exchange in Torfaen is the only one I know of where the windows are clear. (only ever seen that in the buildings around the BT tower)

But i'd say the chances of you being directly wired are very very high - those starts especially. AS other person has said, this being the case you won't be able to get FTTC - FTTP might be possible when/if it's bought to the exchange. BT are never in a rush to remove Exchange Only lines. One of the houses I own in Sheffield has had this problem for 20 years and I have been trying to get BT to move it off and onto the cab outside but they just aren't interested.

I am actually impressed an exchange with 5,110 lines on it got fibre. We struggled like hell to get our local one done and it has over double on it.

But at least you have a good connection. Okay so you can't get fibre but think about me next time you feel hard done by (meant politely)

I have fibre cabs all around me but mine is not going to be touched and at best I can get on the phone network is 7mbps. And this is smack bang in the middle of Newport.

"Virgin Media - The only company I've ever dealt with who can end a complaint call trying to sell a Mobile "

Edited by pcoventry76 (Fri 20-Sep-13 20:40:26)


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Standard User broadband66
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 21-Sep-13 11:46:18
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Re: Unable to get Fibre Stll


[re: pcoventry76] [link to this post]
 
At least you've got VM.

Was Eclipse Home Option 1 & VM 2Mb
Now O2 standard
Standard User pcoventry76
(knowledge is power) Sat 21-Sep-13 15:05:44
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Re: Unable to get Fibre Stll


[re: broadband66] [link to this post]
 
I did but I don't anymore.

Which just goes to show which is better in my area anyway - and it's not VM

"
Standard User simon194
(committed) Thu 26-Sep-13 00:39:59
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Re: Unable to get Fibre Stll


[re: Jovetic] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Jovetic:
My Exchange has been enabled for a long time, 2 years now I think. Yet I still can't get Fibre. Someone said I live too close and am going directly into the Exchange, this doesn't make too much sense. Although my attenuation is incredibly low.

CF82 7EF

Does the BT ADSL checker give a cabinet number when you enter your phone number? Link here. If it does have a cabinet number then it's possible Openreach decided the cabinet wasn't economically viable for FTTC.
Standard User pcoventry76
(knowledge is power) Thu 26-Sep-13 09:48:58
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Re: Unable to get Fibre Stll


[re: simon194] [link to this post]
 
We have already established they are close to the exchange.

A house I own In Sheffield is no more than 200 yards from the exchange and all the houses round there are direct wired with no cabs at all (so no FTTC even though it is in the area)

This is the houses checker

WBC ADSL 2+ Up to 17 -- 10 to 19.5 Available (but when I do this I just get "address is on Exchange MOSBOROUGH" so no cab number

When I had 02 I could get 22.5 down and 2.5 up.


This is the OP's

WBC ADSL 2+ Up to 17 -- 10 to 19.5 Available (so roughly same stats)

Several Houses on that street are served by cabinet 13 which is at the end of the lane to the right from the exchange so FTTC is possible but as you said - With so many houses direct wired that cab wouldn't be worth the upgrade.

I know FTTP can only be got by people who can get FTTC right now but I wonder if FTTP will include direct wires in the future? After all it's been done over overhead wires in the past as we know.

"

Edited by pcoventry76 (Thu 26-Sep-13 09:57:24)

Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Thu 26-Sep-13 11:26:15
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Re: Unable to get Fibre Stll


[re: pcoventry76] [link to this post]
 
The issue with the FTTP direct from exchange is cost and who pays.

Commercially the numbers affected are low enough and many get well past USC level speeds that BT can ignore them. Harsh but in a commercial world things hurt

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User David_W
(experienced) Thu 26-Sep-13 11:52:16
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Re: Unable to get Fibre Stll


[re: pcoventry76] [link to this post]
 
Exchange only lines, which run direct to the MDF in the exchange without going through a PCP (cabinet) fall into two broad categories, which can be summarised as "near exchange" and "other". Those I classify as "near exchange" are the sort you describe - lines so close to the exchange that there was felt to be little point establishing a PCP as it was just as easy to run them direct to the MDF. The "other" lines are a much more diverse group, which include lines in areas so sparsely populated that a PCP wouldn't cover enough lines to be worth establishing.


There's four solutions to provide FTTx on the "near exchange" lines:
  • establish a PCP near the exchange and re-route the lines through it
  • install FTTP
  • use future FTTDP (fibre to the distribution point) technology as a sort of mini FTTC cabinet for small groups of exchange-only lines
  • run VDSL2 from the exchange

The problem is that there's a cost attached to all of these, whilst customers on near exchange EO lines are potentially the least likely to take FTTx products because they already enjoy high ADSL2+ speeds.


Moving the lines to a PCP has been done in some areas, sometimes using BDUK money. In your case it might be possible to rearrange the network to run some of the EO lines via PCP 13, making it worthwhile to deploy FTTC at that PCP.


FTTP roll-out is very slow nationwide at the moment.


FTTDP is under development at present, in the hope that running fibre even deeper into the network will provide higher speeds than FTTC without the costs of full FTTP, but in a way that can later be upgraded to FTTP.

I'd guess it is likely to be more expensive to use FTTDP for near exchange EO lines than establishing a conventional PCP and FTTC twin. However, there may be some scenarios where using FTTDP for EO lines is cost-effective, especially if the attempts to produce line powered FTTDP solutions come to fruition, removing the cost of a mains feed to the street equipment.


VDSL2 from the exchange is essentially prohibited by the Analogue Network Frequency Plan, because of the near-end crosstalk problems that would arise with originating ADSL and VDSL2 at the same location. It's possible that vectoring may allow the development of VDSL2 frequency plans and power masks suitable for VDSL2 from the exchange, but I think this unlikely. Vectoring may mitigate ADSL interference with VDSL2 lines, but is not likely to do anything for VDSL2 interference with ADSL lines.

VDSL2 from the exchange might only come about if, at a future time, ADSL from the exchange is withdrawn, either to be replaced by ADSL from the cabinet for those customers remaining on ADSL (which potentially has similar crosstalk issues to VDSL2 from the exchange, despite the power being lower), or because all remaining customers can switch to VDSL2.


From an equipment standpoint, discontinuing ADSL becomes easier over time. New consumer equipment will increasingly be ADSL/VDSL2 multi-standard, whilst modern MSANs and DSLAMs at most need a different line card for VDSL2 or ADSL. I have heard mention of at least one ADSL/VDSL2 multi-standard line card, but if I recall correctly it didn't support VDSL2 vectoring and had a lower port density than single-standard cards, both of which are serious drawbacks.

A potentially serious problem with VDSL2 for all is long lines. Others are more qualified to comment than I am, but my understanding is that VDSL2 typically performs less welle on long lines than ADSL. If VDSL2 cannot be made to perform as well as ADSL on long lines, moving all ADSL customers to VDSL2 is clearly a non-starter.

Standard User pcoventry76
(knowledge is power) Thu 26-Sep-13 12:23:26
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Re: Unable to get Fibre Stll


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
It does.

But to be fair also 20-22mbps is not exactly slow..

"
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