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Standard User spongebobhims
(regular) Wed 11-Jul-12 19:54:17
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Phone Causing 21CN Upstream Issues & Drops


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Hi All,

I have recently migrated back to 21CN from LLU as needed to economize a little i am now having real issues with my upstream margin when the phone is used. Every time the phone is picked up the noise margin goes mad and quickly drops from where its sat at the time to 0.1 or there about and causes a resync but has not effect whatsoever on downstream, i have been in touch with my ISP and they have requested a SNR Reset (Now at 9DB) from Entanet and a 10 day test period has been restarted.

I have had a qualified sparky/comms engineer check the line inside the house and both the master and slave socket and all cable going to them all check out fine but just as a matter of course i will replace the filtered faceplate BT fitted some time ago with a new Openreach (Current spec model)

Is there anything i have missed or any suggestions anybody can make, as this is driving me nuts my phone is used a fair bit and so is the net so the constant disconnections are really irritating.

Line Currently connected at

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 5078 kbps 472 kbps
Line Attenuation 47.0 db 26.1 db
Noise Margin 9.4 db 18.4 db

Many Thanks

Standard User 4M2
(experienced) Wed 11-Jul-12 20:42:32
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Re: Phone Causing 21CN Upstream Issues & Drops


[re: spongebobhims] [link to this post]
 
Did the qualified sparky/comms engineer check that the problems still occurred when only a corded phone and the router were connected to the master test socket, i.e. were incoming calls made using a mobile and outgoing calls also made?

If the problem still occured when using only the test socket and a couple of filter/splitters were tried then it's probably a job for Open Reach to sort out after you have reported a broadband line fault to your ISP.

I had a similar problem last year when incoming calls, actually just the phone ringing 6 or more times, would cause a resync due to a burst of noise and this was verified by a visiting OR SFI engineer who eventually established that the fault was at the exchange.
Standard User spongebobhims
(regular) Wed 11-Jul-12 21:16:45
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Re: Phone Causing 21CN Upstream Issues & Drops


[re: 4M2] [link to this post]
 
Did the qualified sparky/comms engineer check that the problems still occurred when only a corded phone and the router were connected to the master test socket, i.e. were incoming calls made using a mobile and outgoing calls also made?


Yes this was checked however the corded phone was old and i had no time to get a new one so most test were performed with a almost new cordless phone. noise and dropouts only happened when the phone was picked up ringing did not seem to touch the margins, i only had a couple filters both BT MT50's

My ISP were aware i was going to do this and asked me to report my findings which i did earlier but the person dealing with it was not in so i await there response.

as for BT Faults they say is there is no fault and my ISP say there is a possible voice fault so i am piggy in the middle at the moment. It does seem funny that this only happened after a migrate to 21CN tho, the line was perfectly happy on LLU.


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Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 11-Jul-12 21:36:50
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Re: Phone Causing 21CN Upstream Issues & Drops


[re: spongebobhims] [link to this post]
 
HR fault caused by the rejumpering when going back to BT Wholesale most likely

Has diagnostics for a HR fault (high resistance) fault being run?

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User 4M2
(experienced) Wed 11-Jul-12 21:38:14
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Re: Phone Causing 21CN Upstream Issues & Drops


[re: spongebobhims] [link to this post]
 
I know what you mean about being "piggy in the middle" frown

Guess your quiet line tests on voice are OK when using the MT50 filters?

When just picking up the phone either to make a call or answer a call then you lose the broadband connection and this has only happened since changing from full LLU to 21CN?

That can be a real hassle when uploading and downloading large files and a connection is dropped!
Standard User spongebobhims
(regular) Wed 11-Jul-12 21:39:04
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Re: Phone Causing 21CN Upstream Issues & Drops


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Hi i have not asked for this as to be honest i have had not had issues in the past and have only ever heard about High Resistance issues on here, i will certainly ask when i speak to my ISP again.

Standard User spongebobhims
(regular) Wed 11-Jul-12 21:44:41
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Re: Phone Causing 21CN Upstream Issues & Drops


[re: 4M2] [link to this post]
 
Guess your quiet line tests on voice are OK when using the MT50 filters?


Yes and No is an honest answer i do get a crackle every now and again on quiet line tests but was unsure of why however now "Mr Saffron" has said it could be High Resistance that may explain that.

When just picking up the phone either to make a call or answer a call then you lose the broadband connection and this has only happened since changing from full LLU to 21CN?


Yes the line was almost perfect on LLU all bar a couple exchange issues causing outages i had not 1 issue with the service not exchange kit. Kind of wishing i didn't jump ship now.

Lucky for me any large downloads i use a manager for due to PEAK/OFF PEAK so that's no big worry.

Standard User Zarjaz
(knowledge is power) Wed 11-Jul-12 21:50:09
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Re: Phone Causing 21CN Upstream Issues & Drops


[re: spongebobhims] [link to this post]
 
Request, via your ISP that they run a CIDT test, see what that comes back with.

To be honest, there is no 'stuck in the middle' about it, if the problem is with your broadband, then it's down to your ISP to sort this, end of.

I'd guess that the fault is in the exchange also, as this is the only thing to have changed with your service. Would be surprised if it were the jumpering, as suggested. I'd be plumping for an issue with the SMPF port itself (the bit that 'makes' the DSL signal).

Your new ISP should be forced, by you, to raise an LLU SFI2 visit. They will threaten you with charges, but you sound like you have covered all the equipment/internals, so charges cannot be passed on by the ISP.

Standard User spongebobhims
(regular) Wed 11-Jul-12 22:00:57
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Re: Phone Causing 21CN Upstream Issues & Drops


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
Request, via your ISP that they run a CIDT test, see what that comes back with.


Ok thanks for that next time i speak to the guy at my ISP dealing with this i will request that is done.

I'd guess that the fault is in the exchange also, as this is the only thing to have changed with your service. Would be surprised if it were the jumpering, as suggested. I'd be plumping for an issue with the SMPF port itself (the bit that 'makes' the DSL signal).


Funny you mention the exchange kit as this line seems prone to that issue but it's never had a effect on upload before, previous ISP'S have told me in the past with issues "Its a LINE CARD Problem" and when replaced or tweaked the problem goes away for a while and then it goes pop again same problem (this has happened at least 4 times since 2005)

Your new ISP should be forced, by you, to raise an LLU SFI2 visit. They will threaten you with charges, but you sound like you have covered all the equipment/internals, so charges cannot be passed on by the ISP.


Well as for this visit i really hope they don't charge for the visit if i replace the Master socket with a new spec Openreach version if it is not the cause but something i haven't touched is, ie the incoming line from the pole or the box on the pole etc.

Standard User 4M2
(experienced) Wed 11-Jul-12 22:18:18
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Re: Phone Causing 21CN Upstream Issues & Drops


[re: spongebobhims] [link to this post]
 
Don't worry about the filtered faceplate, just have a phone and the router connected to the test socket, via a proven filter/splitter, if a SFI engineer comes to your property and then you can demonstrate the problem to him by just picking up the phone. The SFI engineer will probably connect a "very expensive" piece of kit to the test socket and run some tests...
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