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Standard User freeflowfruits
(newbie) Sun 25-Feb-18 16:06:27
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Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[link to this post]
 
We have been problems for month now with internet/adsl disconnecting randomly and every time the phone rings. Openreach have changed many items at the exchange ,but have not fixed the problem. They have know told my service provider, who has been pressurizing openreach to fix the fault,that they( openreach want to withdraw the service/cease the line, as they can not fix the fault!Can they legal do this, leave us with no telephone and broadband and no mobile reception in a very rural hamlet? Can we not insist to keep the line running?

Any ideas welcome.
Thanks
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sun 25-Feb-18 16:33:50
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: freeflowfruits] [link to this post]
 
They can withdraw broadband not not basic telephone.

Issue may be if you are with a bundled provider ceasing broadband also ceases phone line

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User uno
(knowledge is power) Sun 25-Feb-18 17:10:30
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: freeflowfruits] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by freeflowfruits:
Can they legal do this, leave us with no telephone and broadband and no mobile reception in a very rural hamlet? Can we not insist to keep the line running?


They can as MrS says, but only for the broadband. Once that is done, it is likely you won't be able to re-order broadband with any provider (who uses Openreach) as the address will be marked as not suitable for service (with current technologies).

You may be able to insist but it may be on the understanding that there may be nothing more than can do and the fault you have isn't one that can be raised any further or has any alternative solutions.

These kind of outcomes are rare but not unheard of.

Matt

uno Communications
t: 0333 773 7700
Official Maidenhead, Milton Keynes & Sheffield Speedtest.net Host

Edited by uno (Sun 25-Feb-18 17:10:53)


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Standard User freeflowfruits
(newbie) Sun 25-Feb-18 17:43:38
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Strange if they can supply my neighbors surely they can supply me? Who can one turn to and complain about unfair treatment with openreach?

Thanks
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sun 25-Feb-18 19:08:26
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: freeflowfruits] [link to this post]
 
The contract is with the company you pay for your broadband and phone with.

There is NO legal obligation for Openreach to provide broadband, only obligation is a voice phone line - so question is this, does the phone work when you have unplugged all the broadband kit?

Fixed a missing NO

Edited by MrSaffron (Mon 26-Feb-18 22:13:23)

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User 69bertie
(member) Sun 25-Feb-18 19:31:23
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: freeflowfruits] [link to this post]
 
Start thinking political - your MP would be a good place to start.

You really need to find out why OR are going down this route. Maybe you are in the same boat that I was in when I moved in - had a phone line on the house but never gave it a thought that the main box didn't have any spares going back to the exchange. My original set of wires had been given to someone else while the house was empty. Maybe they haven't any spares and your set of wires are naff. Might be OK for voice but not for the internet.

I contacted my MP, I also contacted the CEO of BT (presumably OR have the same setup). I can remember at the time writing to BT along the lines of, 3rd world countries can do better....... I'd just come back from Vietnam where you got connected the same day you ask for an internet connection!

Took 6 months to sort but in the meantime I was given free WiFi access - basically piggybacking on my neighbours already dire connection using their FON side. Not a good way to surf the internet though. Like you, mobile networks were pretty bad at the time - still are, if I was to be so blunt. Go upstairs, or outside, to make a call!

After about 6 months! BT/OR eventually laid new ducts etc back to the next village (3km) and ended up running in a new cable - seems I wasn't the only one waiting.

You don't say what part of the country but a fairly popular way to get connected round these parts is Wireless. Even though we have fibre now, quite a few properties have since gone for the wireless setup, Some have even ditched the phone line totally. You need to find out what is available in your area. Time to think outside the box!

Standard User freeflowfruits
(newbie) Mon 26-Feb-18 07:30:13
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Yes the phone always works, it is just a bad line sometimes, it just broadband disconnects when phone rings and at other times. There are not many people here where we live and this happens to about 25% of subscribers according to my research. i would have thought openreach would just say we can not fix it,but you can keep the service as it is now??

Thanks
Standard User kingbiscit
(member) Mon 26-Feb-18 07:39:33
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: freeflowfruits] [link to this post]
 
I had the exact same issue a few years ago.

I was with Zen internet and had ADSL on a long line. I got a download of 2mbit. Whenever the phone rung ADSL dropped.

I must have had around 15 - 20 engineer visits and no one could fix it. In the end ZEN suggested I try a provider who have there own kit in the cab e.g. SKY, TalkTalk etc T

I switched to SKY and the problem instantly went away.

I'm now back with ZEN with FTTC.

You would just need to be sure your cab is unbundled by the provider you choose.

Edited by kingbiscit (Mon 26-Feb-18 07:41:56)

Standard User Ignitionnet
(knowledge is power) Mon 26-Feb-18 10:07:59
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: kingbiscit] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by kingbiscit:
I had the exact same issue a few years ago.

I was with Zen internet and had ADSL on a long line. I got a download of 2mbit. Whenever the phone rung ADSL dropped.

I must have had around 15 - 20 engineer visits and no one could fix it. In the end ZEN suggested I try a provider who have there own kit in the cab e.g. SKY, TalkTalk etc T

I switched to SKY and the problem instantly went away.

I'm now back with ZEN with FTTC.

You would just need to be sure your cab is unbundled by the provider you choose.


Sky don't unbundle cabinets.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 26-Feb-18 10:10:50
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: freeflowfruits] [link to this post]
 
Without access to exactly what Openreach has said this may be exactly what they've said...i.e. providers interpretations of Opennreach messages are not renowned for being 100%.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 26-Feb-18 10:11:23
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: kingbiscit] [link to this post]
 
Cabinets are NOT unbundled, exchanges are.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User kingbiscit
(member) Mon 26-Feb-18 10:27:04
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Sorry exchange is unbundled then smile
Standard User hypertony
(experienced) Mon 26-Feb-18 12:01:24
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: freeflowfruits] [link to this post]
 
I had the same issue in the past. Thankfully I was with AAISP who was willing to fight for me.

Openreach did the following:

* Lift & shift
* New line from house to pole
* New master socket.

And it was resolved.

So I would suggest that you tell your ISP to pull their finger out and resolve it.

- Tony Sutton
- Check out my Ford Focus ST170 site | View my Car's Dashcam Videos
Standard User kingbiscit
(member) Mon 26-Feb-18 12:55:54
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: hypertony] [link to this post]
 
I had a lift and shift and it fixed it for a week or so, but then came back.
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 26-Feb-18 20:21:50
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Surely it should read - Openreach have NO legal obligation to provide broadband ?

Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 26-Feb-18 22:13:36
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
Fixed

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User DougM
(member) Tue 27-Feb-18 10:56:16
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: freeflowfruits] [link to this post]
 
I definitely recommend moving to AAISP; they are relentless dealing with Openreach and guarantee to fix your line:

We pride ourselves in having a very capable team of people that deal with faults. We have a close working relationship with BT, and our team are well known within all parts of BT for not tolerating being fobbed off. We are also well known for testing how well wet string works for ADSL!

We have detailed monitoring of lines that allow us to quickly identify faults and take action to resolve them (whether BT, customer equipment, or changes at your end).

In fact, we are so confident we know what we are doing, we'll even take on problems other ISPs leave behind, and that is why we make this offer.


-==-
DougM
Standard User freeflowfruits
(newbie) Tue 27-Feb-18 12:10:57
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: DougM] [link to this post]
 
thanks
Standard User MHC
(sensei) Tue 27-Feb-18 12:48:39
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: freeflowfruits] [link to this post]
 
Why not call Virgin Media and ask them to provide service.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User MatHal
(newbie) Tue 27-Feb-18 19:26:43
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: freeflowfruits] [link to this post]
 
It sounds like Openreach have simply abandoned you as you are not one of their customers. Your ISP should be able to test the line and force Openreach to repair it.
From what you say about a noisy phone line it is obvious that there is a bad connection somewhere. No amount of changing stuff at the exchange is going to solve that, it needs fault-finding properly. That will be time-consuming (i.e. costly) for OR, which is why they've given up.
You should report the PHONE line as faulty in the first instance.
If your neighbour has an acceptable service then there is no good reason why you cannot have the same!
I had a similarly faulty line at my address for over 30 years. BT refused to repair it, even though they (and I) knew exactly where the bad connection was. Only after adding internet to the line did they finally agree to fix it.
If OR do withdraw service I suggest you move the phone line to BT and then persistently report the noisy line until it gets repaired. Also report the issue to your MP.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Tue 27-Feb-18 20:23:47
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: MatHal] [link to this post]
 
An ISP cannot force Openreach to repair a line - i.e. usually a good ISP can get things done but there does become a point at which any further repairs become uneconomical

What we don't know is the ISP, some have track records of blaming Openreach rather than exerting any pressure at all to get things fixed.

If this is a line that is 10km long then a good chance Openreach may want to mark it is as not broadband possible

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 28-Feb-18 08:27:46
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: MatHal] [link to this post]
 
It sounds like Openreach have simply abandoned you as you are not one of their customers
Only the ISPs are the customers of OpenReach and they are required to treat all ISPs equally. It is irrelevant which ISP the OP is with from that perspective. The difference comes down to how persistent the ISP is with OpenReach as some may get more traction than others. But, as MrS says if OpenReach decide it is no longer economical to repair a line then there is nothing the ISP can do. Even once the USO kicks in there will be a limit to the amount OpenReach will be required to spend and anything above that would have to be funded by the customer.
Standard User bobble_bob
(knowledge is power) Sat 03-Mar-18 10:46:54
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
I really think a broadband connection of some sort should be treated in the same way as gas and electricity. Its not acceptable for a company to just wash there hands with a customer and cut off what is now a vital service in this day and age
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 03-Mar-18 11:36:18
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: bobble_bob] [link to this post]
 
Hence the USO that is shuffling through Ofcom/Gov procedures.

NOTE: Gas and electric can ask for contributions to deliver to a new premise and are often very keen on recovering costs for repairs inside your property boundary.

One big benefit Gas and Electric has it that they charge per unit, and if we went full utility on broadband charges per GB might be back on the table.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Michael_Chare
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 03-Mar-18 13:35:15
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: bobble_bob] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by bobble_bob:
I really think a broadband connection of some sort should be treated in the same way as gas and electricity. Its not acceptable for a company to just wash there hands with a customer and cut off what is now a vital service in this day and age
I would say like water, electricity and phone. Gas is not universally available and for many, easy to live without.

Michael Chare

Edited by Michael_Chare (Sat 03-Mar-18 13:37:19)

Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 03-Mar-18 14:21:23
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: bobble_bob] [link to this post]
 
So donít let this, essential in your opinion, service be provided by private companies ....

Or maybe part of the USO should be that people can only reside in certain pre designated areas ?

It really isnít such a black and white issue.

Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 05-Mar-18 09:34:58
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: bobble_bob] [link to this post]
 
Openreach are not the only supplier that exists. Why not have a go at Virgin not supplying to the address or Gigaclear or Cityfibre? Any company could supply but if it isn't economically viable to do so then what is a private company expected to do?
Standard User dewt
(learned) Mon 05-Mar-18 11:04:58
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Re: Openreach thinking of withdrawing service


[re: MatHal] [link to this post]
 
Having had slow/unstable broadband for over 4 years I symapthise with the OP however as has been pointed out the provision of a line suitable for broadband is not a legal right. Contacting my various ISPs seemed to do nothing and even today I still get quoted a guaranteed speed of 1Mbps from the few ISPs willing to take me on. My speed has increased from that to 4Mbps thanks to constantly reporting faults to my ISP (currently Vodafone) and contacting my MSP (Willie Rennie). Between them they managed to get Openreach to fix a fault on my line that improved the stability a bit. We are still working on getting them to fix the distribution pole so engineers are willing to climb it (4 vseparate engineers refused on safety grounds) as I'm convinced the remaining problems lie in the drop cable from there to my cottage. I regularly have a very noisy phone line and report it to my ISP every time although we have agreed not to call Openreach out to them until they fix the leaning pole (currently in the planning stage).

So my advice is to persevere and as a matter of urgency get in touch with your MP.
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