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Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Fri 04-Jan-19 12:17:44
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Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[link to this post]
 
At present my master socket is in my living room, in an awkward position. A couple years ago I had my house cabled with Cat6 with the termination point being the garage where the patch panel and network switch are. Whilst doing this, the installer ran what looks like Cat5 or Cat6 from my master socket into the garage too.

I now wish to take advantage of this and move my BT Openreach modem and Asus router into the garage. My knowledge of BT faceplates and sockets isn't great. I've unscrewed the master socket and from the top of my head, terminals 2 and 5 have been punched in and are going into the garage. In the garage, the other end of the cable is waiting to be wired into a socket.

Is it just a case of wiring in a new socket/faceplate? If so, which one do I need?

At present I have this in my living room. I use a microfilter with this into which my modem goes.

Existing Socket
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Fri 04-Jan-19 13:20:19
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question EDIT


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
So you have an extension wired to the faceplate but nothing at the end of the wires

If going to do it so there is minimal impact on any FTTC speeds

Replace the small removable faceplate with https://amzn.to/2SA79aj (when wiring in the new faceplate the extension will need connecting to the A/B terminals on the faceplate rather than simply reconnecting to 2/5 - plate should come with set of instructions showing this) and at the end of extension install https://amzn.to/2Rtrilc

This avoids the needs for microfilters

You can get by without changing anything at the master socket, just make sure that any phones plugged in use a microfilter and then fit the https://amzn.to/2Rtrilc on the end of the extension.

EDIT to make it clear that if going the faceplate route that will need to wire up to A/B on the faceplate for the extension to support ADSL/VDSL

Edited by MrSaffron (Sat 05-Jan-19 13:49:45)

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User dect
(newbie) Fri 04-Jan-19 14:18:10
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
The only thing I would add to what Andrew has already said is hopefully when the Cat 5 or Cat 6 cable was connected to the master socket (aka NTE 5) the Blue/White was connected to terminal 2 and White/Blue was connected to terminal 5, if this is the case just make sure you connect the same colours to the same terminals in the extension socket, Always use a matching pair (e.g. both blues or both oranges or both greens or both browns) as they will be twisted together throughout the length of the cable which is important to get the best possible speed.


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Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Fri 04-Jan-19 15:18:58
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
So you have an extension wired to the faceplate but nothing at the end of the wires

If going to do it so there is minimal impact on any FTTC speeds

Replace the small removable faceplate with https://amzn.to/2SA79aj and at the end of extension install https://amzn.to/2Rtrilc

This avoids the needs for microfilters

You can get by without changing anything at the master socket, just make sure that any phones plugged in use a microfilter


So in my garage I should use this? https://amzn.to/2Rtrilc
This is a faceplate yeah? What type of socket do I need to install the faceplate on to?

And in my living room I should install this? https://amzn.to/2SA79aj
Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Fri 04-Jan-19 15:19:58
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by dect:
The only thing I would add to what Andrew has already said is hopefully when the Cat 5 or Cat 6 cable was connected to the master socket (aka NTE 5) the Blue/White was connected to terminal 2 and White/Blue was connected to terminal 5, if this is the case just make sure you connect the same colours to the same terminals in the extension socket, Always use a matching pair (e.g. both blues or both oranges or both greens or both browns) as they will be twisted together throughout the length of the cable which is important to get the best possible speed.


Yep - off the top of my head they were definitely blue/blue-white and were connected to 2 and 5.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Fri 04-Jan-19 15:22:27
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
Yes

And you'll need a punch down tool to make the connections again

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Fri 04-Jan-19 17:53:26
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
Yes

And you'll need a punch down tool to make the connections again


Thanks - sorry for sounding stupid but what type of socket does the faceplate you mentioned go on to? I'm just looking to order everything from Amazon now smile
Standard User Realalemadrid
(member) Fri 04-Jan-19 18:22:18
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
It isn't a faceplate, it is a stand alone dual socket that fits on backbox, you don't need any other socket.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Fri 04-Jan-19 18:23:13
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
You posted a picture http://www.skyuser.co.uk/forum/attachments/cabling-f...

In that the lower part with the two screws is what your extension wiring should be connected to (i.e. on the back) and the new faceplate will replace this smaller faceplate. The larger box with the Openreach logo on it remains untouched,

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Fri 04-Jan-19 19:23:32
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
You posted a picture http://www.skyuser.co.uk/forum/attachments/cabling-f...

In that the lower part with the two screws is what your extension wiring should be connected to (i.e. on the back) and the new faceplate will replace this smaller faceplate. The larger box with the Openreach logo on it remains untouched,


Thanks, i get the living room bit but what i don't get is what I should install in the garage. I have no backbox either as mentioned above. I'd be grateful if you could link me to exactly what I need to install in the garage. I know you linked me to a filtered faceplate for the garage bit that should go on to a backbox?

Thanks in advance
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Fri 04-Jan-19 19:29:45
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
I'm not happy with any of this, unless I'm misreading the OP. To me, the following doesn't make sense:-
At present my master socket is in my living room, in an awkward position. A couple years ago I had my house cabled with Cat6 with the termination point being the garage where the patch panel and network switch are. Whilst doing this, the installer ran what looks like Cat5 or Cat6 from my master socket into the garage too.

I now wish to take advantage of this and move my BT Openreach modem and Asus router into the garage. My knowledge of BT faceplates and sockets isn't great. I've unscrewed the master socket and from the top of my head, terminals 2 and 5 have been punched in and are going into the garage. In the garage, the other end of the cable is waiting to be wired into a socket.
How is the master socket fed, for a starter! The OP says the termination is in the garage, where there is a patch panel and a network switch. Plus an unterminated wire he thinks is from the master ending up back in the garage.

That simply does not make sense unless the patch panel and switch are not in use. In particular not connected to the master.

If either of them is feeding the master then the termination is indeed in the garage and the wiring is all wrong. Classic star wiring.

If neither is, i.e. they are not in use and the termination is still on the A/B terminals of the master, then the feedback to the garage needs to me from the auxiliary A/B terminals of the recommended new master faceplate not 2/5, assuming that particular one has such, and connect to 2/5 or whatever the appropriate terminals on the suggested extension are, as it seems to be a dual socket extension with further auxiliary A/B connectors.

I assume the router will feed the network switch. (It's decades since I used to set up modem <> router <> switch configurations so I may have that part a bit confused). Which makes me wonder how any extensions are currently supplied unless all are on wifi from the router.

I also wonder if we are talking about a boarding house/small hotel.

Have I developed brain-fade somewhere when reading the OP?

Thinks - maybe. Perhaps the current master is fed normally, direct from the incoming line and not through the garage. In other words the garage is the termination for the CAT6 network, not the incoming line. In which case we will still have a mess as the suggested filtered faceplate master socket will output VDSL2 + PSTN into the sitting room from the VDSL2 socket. Not ethernet from the router.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Fri 04-Jan-19 19:41:39
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
The one I linked to comes with the backbone

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Fri 04-Jan-19 19:55:34
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question *DELETED*


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
Post deleted by RobertoS
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Fri 04-Jan-19 19:56:26
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
Did your CAT6 installer install an ethernet socket in your living room? Or are you intending to connect wirelessly to your router once it is in the garage?

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Fri 04-Jan-19 20:56:58
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
I'm not happy with any of this, unless I'm misreading the OP. To me, the following doesn't make sense:-
At present my master socket is in my living room, in an awkward position. A couple years ago I had my house cabled with Cat6 with the termination point being the garage where the patch panel and network switch are. Whilst doing this, the installer ran what looks like Cat5 or Cat6 from my master socket into the garage too.

I now wish to take advantage of this and move my BT Openreach modem and Asus router into the garage. My knowledge of BT faceplates and sockets isn't great. I've unscrewed the master socket and from the top of my head, terminals 2 and 5 have been punched in and are going into the garage. In the garage, the other end of the cable is waiting to be wired into a socket.
How is the master socket fed, for a starter! The OP says the termination is in the garage, where there is a patch panel and a network switch. Plus an unterminated wire he thinks is from the master ending up back in the garage.

That simply does not make sense unless the patch panel and switch are not in use. In particular not connected to the master.

If either of them is feeding the master then the termination is indeed in the garage and the wiring is all wrong. Classic star wiring.

If neither is, i.e. they are not in use and the termination is still on the A/B terminals of the master, then the feedback to the garage needs to me from the auxiliary A/B terminals of the recommended new master faceplate not 2/5, assuming that particular one has such, and connect to 2/5 or whatever the appropriate terminals on the suggested extension are, as it seems to be a dual socket extension with further auxiliary A/B connectors.

I assume the router will feed the network switch. (It's decades since I used to set up modem <> router <> switch configurations so I may have that part a bit confused). Which makes me wonder how any extensions are currently supplied unless all are on wifi from the router.

I also wonder if we are talking about a boarding house/small hotel.

Have I developed brain-fade somewhere when reading the OP?

Thinks - maybe. Perhaps the current master is fed normally, direct from the incoming line and not through the garage. In other words the garage is the termination for the CAT6 network, not the incoming line. In which case we will still have a mess as the suggested filtered faceplate master socket will output VDSL2 + PSTN into the sitting room from the VDSL2 socket. Not ethernet from the router.


Apologies for not being clearer. The patch panel and network switch in the garage are purely for my Cat6 runs which serve my media players and servers etc. They have nothing to do with anything telephone related.

I live in a 2 year old house which has a master socket in the living room and when I got my Cat6 cabling installed, the installer ran (an extension?) a cable from the master socket to my garage. That cable lies unterminated in the garage however the blue/blue-white wires are connected to terminals 2 and 5 in the master socket.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Fri 04-Jan-19 22:05:39
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for that, but in some ways even more confusing. To me at least.

Sorry if I go on a bit, but I'm still not convinced you have been advised correctly wrt the sitting room faceplate.

When you say "... my media players and servers etc. They have nothing to do with anything telephone related", do you mean nothing to do with the internet? To me, the internet is in this context telephone related because it comes over the phone wires. Where do they get their content?

Do you intend only to use wifi to access the internet with any devices in the lounge, such as a smart TV? The proposed setup enforces wifi.

The VDSL2 socket in the lounge is not needed, whatever you do if your modem and router are in the garage, as that socket provides output only to a modem or modem/router.

However if you wish to plug a landline phone into the master then you will need either the suggested replacement faceplate and ignore the VDSL2 socket, or retain the otherwise redundant dangly filter into the existing the socket to provide a phone socket.

(A phone cannot be directly connected to that existing socket. It would get a screaming noise from the VDSL2 signal. The dangly filter and also the filtered faceplate allow both VDSL2 and phone signals through to the VDSL2 socket, but filter out the broadband signal from the phone socket).

If you do install the suggested faceplate in the living room then you do not reconnect that wire from the garage to T2 and T5 of that faceplate. You connect them to another couple of terminals on it labelled A and B. If they exist.

If they don't exist then it isn't suitable, as T2 and T5 should just carry the phone signal. Similar to the description of the recommended extension faceplate for the garage, which does have auxiliary A/B for providing broadband further down the chain as long as it got to the extension in the first place smile.

Assuming the incoming telephone line comes directly to the master socket from outside you simply install the suggested filtered extension socket in the garage and as others have said blue/white wires do go to T2 and T5 on the new extension in the garage. Not to the extension's A/B terminals.

Finally, another possibly strange-sounding question. Are there any telephone extension sockets in the house, probably installed by the builder, whether or not you use them? I ask because if there are, and that wire from T2/T5 does go directly into the garage, then your internet speed is already seriously impacted. Quite apart from being unusable for phones without dangly filters.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User dect
(learned) Fri 04-Jan-19 22:25:32
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
I believe the OP said his master socket was in his living room and he currently has a cat 5 or 6 cable connected to terminals 2 and 5 and that cable goes into his garage were it is not currently connected. All he wants to do is connect an extension socket onto the end of that unconnected cable so he can move his modem and router nearer to his patch panel. I believe the information he has previously been supplied by Andrew and I is valid for what he is trying to achieve

Edited by dect (Fri 04-Jan-19 22:45:00)

Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Fri 04-Jan-19 22:56:18
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by dect:
I believe the OP said his master socket was in his living room and he currently has a cat 5 or 6 cable connected to terminals 2 and 5 and that cable goes into his garage were it is not currently connected. All he wants to do is connect an extension socket onto the end of that unconnected cable so he can move his modem and router nearer to his patch panel. I believe the information he has previously been supplied by Andrew and I is valid for what he is trying to achieve


thanks bud - you're spot on. This is what I need in the garage.
This

Should I notice any performance impact?

I don't use the landline much so I'm not too fussed about the living room. I'm happy to leave the faceplate as is and use a ADSL filter as suggested.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Fri 04-Jan-19 22:57:07
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
Only as corrected by myself.

Though on re-reading Andrew's first post in the thread I see his final paragraph there does agree with one of my suggestions. His first suggestion, and your agreement, are incomplete in at least two respects and therefore wrong. One way critical, and one way minor.

We have also been supplied with much more information by the OP as a result of my first post. As the existence of the patch panel and network switch, which you both ignored, made no sense until explained by him. There could have been some nasty side-effects. Still may be, hence my latest questions

I will leave you to work out what those two respects are. I have explained them to the OP.

I have further introduced the question of the possible existence of other extension sockets. Nothing to do with the OP's original question, but highly relevant to the performance of the internet connection.

smile.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User dect
(learned) Sat 05-Jan-19 09:25:50
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by bapesta786:
Should I notice any performance impact?


Most people will say the best possible setup is to have your modem and router connected directly to the master socket (preferably an NTE 5) and I agree with that. If you extend your wiring it does come with risks to your broadband speed (there are so many factors that can affect it) but as the wiring is already there and all you're doing is putting a socket on the end what you got to loose, you can always revert if your unhappy with the out come. Try not to power on/off too many times while your relocating the kit as that can also cause issues like possibly extra interleaving and banding that you'll want to avoid.
Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Sat 05-Jan-19 09:32:05
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by dect:
In reply to a post by bapesta786:
Should I notice any performance impact?


Most people will say the best possible setup is to have your modem and router connected directly to the master socket (preferably an NTE 5) and I agree with that. If you extend your wiring it does come with risks to your broadband speed (there are so many factors that can affect it) but as the wiring is already there and all you're doing is putting a socket on the end what you got to loose, you can always revert if your unhappy with the out come. Try not to power on/off too many times while your relocating the kit as that can also cause issues like possibly extra interleaving and banding that you'll want to avoid.


Ta. I definitely want to avoid multiple power cycles for the reason you mentioned.

I have a spare one of these (link below), would this be ok to use in the garage (with a filter of course) or should i go with what's been mentioned above?

NTE5a
Standard User dect
(learned) Sat 05-Jan-19 09:39:55
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Good morning Bob,

I am here to use the 30+ years of telecoms knowledge I gained by working for PO/BT during the 70s, 80s and 90s to help others where I can. I am sorry if you feel I made a critical error while trying to help this OP.
Standard User dect
(learned) Sat 05-Jan-19 09:58:58
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by bapesta786:
I have a spare one of these (link below), would this be ok to use in the garage (with a filter of course) or should i go with what's been mentioned above?

NTE5a


Really not a good idea using a master socket (e.g. NTE 5) on extension wiring as it will introduce a second resistor, capacitor and lighting arrester across the incoming line.
Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Sat 05-Jan-19 10:02:06
Print Post

Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by dect:
In reply to a post by bapesta786:
I have a spare one of these (link below), would this be ok to use in the garage (with a filter of course) or should i go with what's been mentioned above?

NTE5a


Really not a good idea using a master socket (e.g. NTE 5) on extension wiring as it will introduce a second resistor, capacitor and lighting arrester across the incoming line.


Ok ill go with what's been suggested and report back in due course. I have a tool running on a server which connects to the modem to provide me all sorts of line stats for the past few months. At least I've got something to compare to should there be any performance issues.

Thanks for your help on this.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 05-Jan-19 11:32:52
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question *DELETED*


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
Post deleted by MrSaffron
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 05-Jan-19 11:41:56
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by bapesta786:
Ok ill go with what's been suggested and report back in due course. I have a tool running on a server which connects to the modem to provide me all sorts of line stats for the past few months.
I didn’t see this post before posting my reply to duct, as I’d been drafting it for a while and this wasn’t there when I started. Then I was interrupted by a couple of long phone calls.

So you do have some sort of internet/ethernet connection to your servers. That clears that up, to some extent at least.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 05-Jan-19 12:18:57
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question *DEL


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Removed post due to inappropriate comment about another poster.

Feel free to question/correct/show mistakes but name calling and derogatory phrases are not welcome.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 05-Jan-19 12:21:58
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
On the solwise faceplate filter being wrong

The user guide at https://www.solwise.co.uk/downloads/files/adsl-ntefa... which one presumes comes with the faceplate shows what to do, i.e. connect the unfiltered extension to the A/B connections on the back of the Solwise plate

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 05-Jan-19 12:38:31
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question *DEL


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
How about you agree with what I have said repeatedly in the thread about your (forgivable, as I explained) omission of the vital information about the required connections if the OP had adopted your top suggestion, about fitting the Solwise filtered master socket faceplate?

My corrections have been ignored throughout by yourself and contradicted more than once by the person I seem now to have upset with a very mild colloquial expression frown.

As it stands, and as the now delighted but wrong poster seemed ignorant, the OP could innocently have adopted your first solution and it would simply have not worked!

T2-T2 and T5-T5 would be incorrect with that faceplate. Fine with the existing one which is the way he is going.

You should not have let dect act as he did with his own cocky but invalid statements and comments about my correct posts.

I am still concerned about the other issue I have repeatedly raised, as to whether there are telephone extensions in the house, used or unused. If that wire from the living room to the garage is straight through as implied then are phone extensions must be being fed pre-master, creating bridge taps and severely impacting xDSL.

The only correct info in this thread other than what I have given is your second suggestion and the wiring advice relevant to that, whilst leaving the living room faceplate alone and just fit the filtered extension in the garage. The other poster has been wrong throughout when contradicting me. No wonder I got displeased with him and his ignorance on a subject he claims thirty years plus experience of.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 05-Jan-19 12:41:59
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
You posted whilst I was drafting. But this reply of yours, whilst correct, would rely on the OP reading, understanding and being confident enough not to come back and query the instructions given by the other poster.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 05-Jan-19 13:47:26
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question *DEL


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
A simple 'you forget to mention that wires will need connecting to the A/B on the faceplate rather than 2/5' would suffice.


As for the rest, there seems to be a disjoint in attitudes so can I suggest chill pills all round, rather than continue down an escalating longer and longer set of explanations that serve no-one.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 05-Jan-19 13:50:49
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
I think given the attitude shown in later posts the original poster and anyone else is not reading this now...

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User broadband66
(knowledge is power) Sat 05-Jan-19 15:27:57
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
I'm thinking if you don't understand what is required for a basic fitting then get someone, who knows what they are doing, to do the installation.

Was Eclipse Home Option 1, VM 2Mb & O2 Standard
Now Utility Warehouse (up to 16mbps) via Talk Talk
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 05-Jan-19 15:51:15
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
I think given the attitude shown in later posts the original poster and anyone else is not reading this now...
The only person that matters is the OP. I shall be replying to him in a moment with something else that is rarely mentioned in instructions, that he needs to know.

The fact remains I have been right throughout, you never acknowledged that I was right about the terminals despite dect claiming everything necessary had been said, when it hadn't, and nobody seems at all bothered about the possible bridge taps if there are any phone extensions builder-installed. (Not directly relevant to the original question but important given what now appears to be a sophisticated internet-facing server system).

If there are phone extensions the single wire which may go direct to the garage is a clue. If the wire emerging in the garage is in fact the end of a daisy-chain things are probably OK. If it is direct then those extensions will be screwing up the internet speeds.

You may not care. Dect may not care. The OP needs to be aware of the phone extensions question frown.

Dect may boast of decades in telecoms. I can boast of being a highly successful project manager, which you only become by making sure all contingencies are covered. Avoiding project failure and non-completion, or very late over-budget completion, both of which remain prevalent in the IT world.

My posts did not warrant snotty supercilious sarcasm like:-
In reply to a post by dect:
Good morning Bob,

I am here to use the 30+ years of telecoms knowledge I gained by working for PO/BT during the 70s, 80s and 90s to help others where I can. I am sorry if you feel I made a critical error while trying to help this OP.
It was my mild annoyance at that which you deleted. Dear me frown !

If my post was reported then we clearly have someone with a delicate disposition around who can give but not take. Whether or not it was, an injustice was done by the deletion.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 05-Jan-19 15:53:31
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question *DEL


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
A simple 'you forget to mention that wires will need connecting to the A/B on the faceplate rather than 2/5' would suffice.
See, in my first reply to the OP:-
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
The VDSL2 socket in the lounge is not needed, whatever you do if your modem and router are in the garage, as that socket provides output only to a modem or modem/router.

However if you wish to plug a landline phone into the master then you will need either the suggested replacement faceplate and ignore the VDSL2 socket, or retain the otherwise redundant dangly filter into the existing the socket to provide a phone socket.

(A phone cannot be directly connected to that existing socket. It would get a screaming noise from the VDSL2 signal. The dangly filter and also the filtered faceplate allow both VDSL2 and phone signals through to the VDSL2 socket, but filter out the broadband signal from the phone socket).

If you do install the suggested faceplate in the living room then you do not reconnect that wire from the garage to T2 and T5 of that faceplate. You connect them to another couple of terminals on it labelled A and B. If they exist.


My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 05-Jan-19 16:03:41
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
One thing you also need to note, that is rarely covered in instructions, is that when punching down the wires into the IDC connectors do not strip back the inside insulation. The connectors are designed to cut through it to contact the wire. IDC = Insulation Displacement Contact.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Sat 05-Jan-19 21:09:06
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for the replies all. And yes I'm still reading this of course however it seems this escalated quickly. To answer your question - there are no other extensions or sockets in the house other than the master socket.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 05-Jan-19 22:00:16
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
smile

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User dect
(learned) Sun 06-Jan-19 10:31:13
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by dect:
hopefully when the Cat 5 or Cat 6 cable was connected to the master socket (aka NTE 5) the Blue/White was connected to terminal 2 and White/Blue was connected to terminal 5, if this is the case just make sure you connect the same colours to the same terminals in the extension socket
This clearly refers to what is already there and what the OP needs to do to connect an extension socket to the unterminated cable which was the second option by Andrew, I made no reference to Andrew's first suggestion to replace the master socket faceplate.


In reply to a post by dect:
I believe the information he has previously been supplied by Andrew and I is valid for what he is trying to achieve
This just confirms our posters were valid it does not say your posts weren't.


In reply to a post by RobertoS:
The only correct info in this thread other than what I have given
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
The fact remains I have been right throughout
I will leave others to make up their mines on how you portray yourself in these two posts while communicating with Andrew the moderator


In reply to a post by RobertoS:
incomplete in at least two respects and therefore wrong
Incomplete doesn't mean wrong! it mean incomplete. If you follow your own theory you would have to tell people even how to use a screwdriver for the advise to be complete.


In reply to a post by dect:
I am here to use the 30+ years of telecoms knowledge I gained by working for PO/BT during the 70s, 80s and 90s to help others where I can.
This is true so no error here although someone who is looking for a fight and being very aggressive could call it snotty supercilious sarcasm.


In reply to a post by dect:
I am sorry if you feel I made a critical error while trying to help this OP.
Again not snotty supercilious sarcasm, It was an honest attempt to say sorry for something you wrongly thought I had done.


In reply to a post by RobertoS:
I can boast of being a highly successful project manager, which you only become by making sure all contingencies are covered. Avoiding project failure and non-completion, or very late over-budget completion, both of which remain prevalent in the IT world.
This explains a lot and not in a good way, the ability to ask relevant questions and separate out waffle from key facts quickly is a skill sadly not everyone has I'm afraid, those who don't have this skill just keep asking more and more irrelevant questions.


In reply to a post by RobertoS:
an injustice was done by the deletion.
Your post was deleted because it must have over stepped the mark and not for any other reason so no injustice was done. Sadly some people never think they are wrong.

Edited by dect (Sun 06-Jan-19 10:38:29)

Standard User broadband66
(knowledge is power) Mon 07-Jan-19 15:40:08
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
"This explains a lot and not in a good way, the ability to ask relevant questions and separate out waffle from key facts quickly is a skill sadly not everyone has I'm afraid, those who don't have this skill just keep asking more and more irrelevant questions."

Doesn't help!

Was Eclipse Home Option 1, VM 2Mb & O2 Standard
Now Utility Warehouse (up to 16mbps) via Talk Talk
Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Wed 09-Jan-19 09:21:17
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question EDIT


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
So you have an extension wired to the faceplate but nothing at the end of the wires

If going to do it so there is minimal impact on any FTTC speeds

Replace the small removable faceplate with https://amzn.to/2SA79aj (when wiring in the new faceplate the extension will need connecting to the A/B terminals on the faceplate rather than simply reconnecting to 2/5 - plate should come with set of instructions showing this) and at the end of extension install https://amzn.to/2Rtrilc

This avoids the needs for microfilters

You can get by without changing anything at the master socket, just make sure that any phones plugged in use a microfilter and then fit the https://amzn.to/2Rtrilc on the end of the extension.

EDIT to make it clear that if going the faceplate route that will need to wire up to A/B on the faceplate for the extension to support ADSL/VDSL

So I attempted to install the extension in the garage. I connected the wires to terminal 2 and 5 however I got no dial tone. I did use the cheap yellow non impact punch down tool however I've borrowed a Krone tool off a friend so I shall re-attempt using this.
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 09-Jan-19 10:32:13
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question EDIT


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
Might be worth getting a cheap test meter. Twist the two wires together at one end and check continuity at the other - you might find it is either a duff cable or possibly the wrong cable...
Standard User bapesta786
(newbie) Wed 09-Jan-19 10:39:19
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question EDIT


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ian72:
Might be worth getting a cheap test meter. Twist the two wires together at one end and check continuity at the other - you might find it is either a duff cable or possibly the wrong cable...


Any chance of an Amazon link to one?
I know that it's definitely Cat5 or Cat6.
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 09-Jan-19 10:51:33
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question EDIT


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
Just a simple electrical test meter would do for a continuity test assuming you can get to the cables at both ends (I am assuming they don't have connectors on the end of them for what you are doing). Something like this.

It won't test the LAN capabilities but if you just want to test the wires have continuity and you definitely have the right cable/pair then it does a simple job very well.
Standard User bapesta786
(learned) Wed 09-Jan-19 10:58:51
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question EDIT


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ian72:
Just a simple electrical test meter would do for a continuity test assuming you can get to the cables at both ends (I am assuming they don't have connectors on the end of them for what you are doing). Something like this.

It won't test the LAN capabilities but if you just want to test the wires have continuity and you definitely have the right cable/pair then it does a simple job very well.


Nice. Same day too - ordered lol.
I can get to the wires on both ends. So basically twist the blue and blue/white wires on the unterminated side, and remove the faceplate in the living room and contact terminals 2 and 5 using the meter?
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 09-Jan-19 11:01:23
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question EDIT


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
You will need to take the cable out at the master socket as well otherwise you will be testing the continuity of the master socket as well - it may be ok but better if you can temporarily remove them - and if you have a Krone tool then putting them back in should be no issue.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Wed 09-Jan-19 11:04:01
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by bapesta786:
So I attempted to install the extension in the garage. I connected the wires to terminal 2 and 5 however I got no dial tone. I did use the cheap yellow non impact punch down tool however I've borrowed a Krone tool off a friend so I shall re-attempt using this.
Another of my seemingly daft questions, when you got no dial tone, was the master face plate plugged into the wall socket, or hanging loose?

It has to be plugged in.

Edit - Firmly.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.

Edited by RobertoS (Wed 09-Jan-19 11:05:47)

Standard User bapesta786
(learned) Wed 09-Jan-19 11:12:40
Print Post

Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question EDIT


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ian72:
You will need to take the cable out at the master socket as well otherwise you will be testing the continuity of the master socket as well - it may be ok but better if you can temporarily remove them - and if you have a Krone tool then putting them back in should be no issue.


thanks - i'll try this
Standard User bapesta786
(learned) Wed 09-Jan-19 11:13:18
Print Post

Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
In reply to a post by bapesta786:
So I attempted to install the extension in the garage. I connected the wires to terminal 2 and 5 however I got no dial tone. I did use the cheap yellow non impact punch down tool however I've borrowed a Krone tool off a friend so I shall re-attempt using this.
Another of my seemingly daft questions, when you got no dial tone, was the master face plate plugged into the wall socket, or hanging loose?

It has to be plugged in.

Edit - Firmly.


Was plugged in smile
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Wed 09-Jan-19 11:23:36
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
The obvious can be missed smile. Even by people who have been doing the job for years.

Be careful not to strip back much of the inner insulation for this test. You could end up with unreliable ends of the cable.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User bapesta786
(learned) Wed 09-Jan-19 11:24:49
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
The obvious can be missed smile. Even by people who have been doing the job for years.

Be careful not to strip back much of the inner insulation for this test. You could end up with unreliable ends of the cable.


I think you mentioned the inner insulation earlier on too - what do you mean by this? And how do you prevent from stripping it back when punching down?
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Wed 09-Jan-19 11:36:50
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
The IDC connector cuts through it as you pushed the wire between them. That’s why I posted what IDC stands for. It ensures no uninsulated wire can be touched by any other conducting item.

Professional Krone tools even snip off the protruding part of the wire as well.

AIUI stripping back the insulation can also cause the final contact to be imperfect, though personally I don’t see why it should.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests 35-45Mpbs down, 9-15 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 09-Jan-19 12:15:02
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REMOVE FACEPLATE FIRST


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
You need to remove the faceplate first before doing any continuity testing i.e. to ensure you are not inadvertently twisting together the pair from the actual phone line

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 09-Jan-19 18:55:09
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question EDIT


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
Not really been following all this ...

Are you able to post some pictures of what’s at either end, with all the terminations on show ?

So you’re trying to provide dial tone and DSL on the ‘extension’ end ?

Standard User dect
(learned) Thu 10-Jan-19 08:44:30
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Re: Relocating my Modem and Router - Faceplate question


[re: bapesta786] [link to this post]
 
Hi bapesta786

Is there any possibility the unterminated cable in your garage (the one you are putting the extension socket on) does not come directly from the original faceplate of the master socket (NTE5) in your lounge?

Edited by dect (Thu 10-Jan-19 08:55:44)

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