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Standard User BRYACC657
(newbie) Fri 02-Nov-12 18:39:42
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Line Speed Issues - Is this action legal


[link to this post]
 
Further to my earlier post concerning the Line Speed Issues with AOL surely they can't tell you that you have unlimited downloads but then remove the facility that allows you to make use of this "benefit".
I have spoken to Trading Standards and they consider this to be a Restrictive Practice or Unfair Contract Term.
Basically they say that you can't provide a benefit, in this case an Unlimited Download Facility, and then remove or restrict the ability to use that facility.
My problem is that the speed is reduced from around 11.00 am each, sometimes earlier,
and it can remain at Dial Up Speeds until 11 or 12pm.
By way of an example it is around 6.00pm and a Speedtest has returned 281Kbps Downstream and 360Kbps upstream - worse than useless.

The Ofcom Code of Practice states that if an ISP can't provide a consistent Speed in line with a users contract the user must be allowed to leave that ISP without penalties being imposed. Has anyone used this argument successfully?
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Fri 02-Nov-12 19:48:56
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Re: Line Speed Issues - Is this action legal


[re: BRYACC657] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by BRYACC657:
The Ofcom Code of Practice states that if an ISP can't provide a consistent Speed in line with a users contract the user must be allowed to leave that ISP without penalties being imposed.
Where do they say that? Link?

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
Standard User wanapoo
(committed) Fri 02-Nov-12 20:18:51
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Re: Line Speed Issues - Is this action legal


[re: BRYACC657] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by BRYACC657:
The Ofcom Code of Practice states that if an ISP can't provide a consistent Speed in line with a users contract the user must be allowed to leave that ISP without penalties being imposed. Has anyone used this argument successfully?


I maybe wrong, but this doesn't apply to you as you are on an UP TO 8Mbps product. Your speed could be anything bellow that.


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Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Fri 02-Nov-12 23:17:13
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Re: Line Speed Issues - Is this action legal


[re: BRYACC657] [link to this post]
 
What is the proof that AOL is removing the facility for unlimited downloads?
Where have they ever promised to give you unlimited speeds at speed X 24/7?

If you are on an AOL product in an area where they do not have their LLU network, then you are probably just experiencing contention and the problem of a massed market product at a low price

It is actually possible that you may have triggered a fair use policy, particularly if running a SamKnows box 24/7

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User BRYACC657
(newbie) Fri 02-Nov-12 23:18:10
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Re: Line Speed Issues - Is this action legal


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
Ref Line Speeds & Associated issues are covered by the Ofcom 2010 Voluntary Code of Practice Broadband Speeds.
Paragraph 26 Section e refers to ISP's providing details in writing of Access Line Speeds.
Paragraph 28 Section b says that ISP's should provide Actual & Access Line Speeds to Customers.
Paragraph 32 Section 4 (1V) Describes what action should be taken if ISP can't provide expected line speed to customer - one option being to allow cancellation of contract without penalty.
The rest of this section describes how ISP's should make their best efforts etc.

The comment made in another post that I am on an up to 8 Mb package and therefore the above facility to cancel would not apply to me can't be true.

If I don't get the same level of support from Ofcom or The Ombudsman or Trading Standards for whatever package I am on that would mean that ISP's could do whatever they liked to people in my position without any hope of redress if anything went wrong..

I am not aware of any condition which says that someone on an up to 8Mbps Broadband Package is in a better or worse situation than someone who is on an up 80Mps package - if it was any different that would be discriminatory
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Fri 02-Nov-12 23:22:50
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Re: Line Speed Issues - Is this action legal


[re: BRYACC657] [link to this post]
 
Note that line speed is very different to measured throughput, hence why I believe you had been asked earlier for information on the speeds the router is connecting at.

Ofcom will not pursue this on your behalf, they simply log the complaint and if they get 10000's they might investigate. First stage is complaint via AOL, and then once deadlock reached the ombudsman

BUT you really should be checking that it is not a line sync issue, as lines can be affected by time based interference

Andrew Ferguson, andrew@thinkbroadband.com
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User BRYACC657
(newbie) Fri 02-Nov-12 23:46:11
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Re: Line Speed Issues - Is this action legal


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
I am supposedly on an up to 8Mb Package from AOL which is uncapped. AOL's traffic management policy states that Traffic will be managed during busy times. If a lead is taken from other ISP's this generally means from 5 > 6pm and up to 10.30 > to 11pm.
I get 6.5Mbps from around 5am until around 11.30am when my speed generally drops quite considerably to around 1.0Mbps at 4pm and recently 0.02Mbps in the evening.
My line has been tested by Open Reach & they have confirmed that it runs at 8.1Mbps both at the exchange and at the Master Socket in my house. When I connect the speed drops to whatever AOL has decided they will give me at that particular time.
The Sam Knows box has no known adverse effect on my line it just receives & returns packets from Sam Knows on a regular basis and to my knowledge does not suggest to AOL that I am a File Sharer or Heavy Downloader.
If you have an uncapped tariff surely that implies that your ISP does not restrict your downloads. There are obviously Fair Use Policies to stop Heavy Users hogging bandwidth for their own purpose.
I feel that as my line is restricted by AOL ( according to the information which I have received from Open Reach ) they are using a Restrictive Practice to limit my access to a viable line speed.
What is the point of providing an Unlimited Download Facility if you then restrict the users ability to use this benefit. Trading Standards have told me that they consider this to be an Unfair Contract Term and that won't be tolerated by them.
Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Fri 02-Nov-12 23:54:14
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Re: Line Speed Issues - Is this action legal


[re: BRYACC657] [link to this post]
 
How are you measuring these speeds?


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Standard User BRYACC657
(newbie) Sat 03-Nov-12 00:02:25
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Re: Line Speed Issues - Is this action legal


[re: BatBoy] [link to this post]
 
They are measured by Sam Knows on a daily basis and I carry out regular speedtests using BT's Speedtester.

Open Reach Confirmed that my ADSL line is stable at 8.1 Mbps. Tests have been carried out at various times of day by Open Reach to confirm the integrity of my line.

Open Reach have confirmed that the exchange is not congested. Plus Net's Speed Tester suggests that I should get 3.5 Mbps Minimum, 5.0 Mbps Average and 7.5Mbps Maximum for my connection. Other ISP's have confirmed similar details.
Standard User wanapoo
(committed) Sat 03-Nov-12 00:02:50
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Re: Line Speed Issues - Is this action legal


[re: BRYACC657] [link to this post]
 
I may need to double check the following in the morning to be sure, but your broadband is an upto 8Mbps and I'm sure your AOL contract does not include a SLA (Service Level Agreement).

Edited by wanapoo (Sat 03-Nov-12 00:08:48)

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