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Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Sun 03-Dec-17 10:57:11
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TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[link to this post]
 
My ISP is TalkTalk Business and my emails are hosted with Vidahost on their server ns31.sovdns.com
I am using Outlook 2013 as my email client and connect using IMAP. I have a fixed IP..

Everything was working just fine until a week ago when the flow of emails suddenly stopped. On to Vidahost to get it sorted.who quickly pointed out that a tracer route from my network to their server failed while still within the TalkTalk network. They confirmed that my IP was white listed on there server.

On to TalkTalk to get it resolved but given the complete run around asking for quite irrelevant information to determine if my configuration within Outlook was correct. and they would will get an email expert to look into the issue and report back within 48 hours, When I pointed out that it was a network specialist was really required, TTB said it couldn't escalate the issue until it was established that there were no problems with the email setup.

Received a text message from TTB around 60 hours later to say the fault had been fixed - it wasn't. So back onto TTB where we discovered the ticket had been closed and that another 48 hours would be required to investigate the matter further and this is still ongoing.

Within Outlook there is another email account that is working perfectly.

Decided to VPN into a friends network and found that my emails came through just fine all be it with asmall time delay.

I know a number of people who also use TTB and asked them to carry out the same trace route I used, on their PC. The trace route failed for them as well. My daughter is on Zen and the trace route completed satisfactory as did a close friend who uses BTInternet.

For a rapid resolution to the issue, Vidahost have offered to move my domain to another server. Or i could move to another ISP. Either choice would see my email service working but it would be a lot of reconfiguration for me to do. .

I just can not understand why TTB are taking so long to resolve this issue, Can anyone offer an insight why this is so difficult to fix? Meanwhile does a tracert to ns31.sovdns.com fail for you as well?
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sun 03-Dec-17 11:52:12
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Isn't that just their DNS server? Not the email server.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. 200GB. Sync 74145/13476Kbps @ 600m. BQMs - IPv4 & IPv6
Standard User baby_frogmella
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 03-Dec-17 13:35:26
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
I presume you've already sent across the results of your failed tracert to TTB support? That's the real proof in the pudding which will show the problem is at TT's end and not elsewhere.

Btw no issues on my FluidOne connection

C:\>tracert ns31.sovdns.com

Tracing route to ns31.sovdns.com [195.238.172.50]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 1 ms 1 ms 2 ms READYSHARE [192.168.1.1]
2 22 ms 20 ms 19 ms 77-89-165-7.fluidata.co.uk [77.89.165.7]
3 22 ms 19 ms 22 ms 77-89-165-29.fluidata.co.uk [77.89.165.29]
4 22 ms 19 ms 20 ms 77-89-177-66.fluidata.co.uk [77.89.177.66]
5 22 ms 19 ms 20 ms 83-223-115-33.as29017.net [83.223.115.33]
6 22 ms 20 ms 20 ms xe-0-0-1.border-1.sov.lon.uk.as29017.net [89.145.125.26]
7 23 ms 20 ms 21 ms uk.slo.ld5.101.r1.misp.co.uk [195.66.225.228]
8 25 ms 21 ms 22 ms uk.slo.prgn.aggr.sw1.misp.co.uk [185.52.26.185]
9 26 ms 21 ms 22 ms uk.slo.prgn.b10.stk1.misp.co.uk [185.52.26.180]
10 23 ms 20 ms 20 ms ns31.sovdns.com [195.238.172.50]

Trace complete.

C:\>

FluidOne FTTP On Demand 330/30 Mbps
Netgear Nighthawk X10


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Standard User Apprentice
(knowledge is power) Sun 03-Dec-17 14:13:10
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Meanwhile does a tracert to ns31.sovdns.com fail for you as well?

Got there in the end with my ADSL 3Meg connection tongue

Tracing route to ns31.sovdns.com [195.238.172.50]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.1.254
2 44 ms 43 ms 42 ms 410.xe-2-2-0.central10.pcn-bng04.plus.net [84.93.253.88]

3 44 ms 43 ms 45 ms 411.be8.pcn-ir01.plus.net [84.93.253.91]
4 44 ms 44 ms 44 ms core1-BE1.colindale.ukcore.bt.net [195.99.125.132]
5 45 ms 45 ms 45 ms peer6-hu0-6-0-2.telehouse.ukcore.bt.net [62.172.103.13]

6 44 ms 45 ms 44 ms t2c3-et-7-3-0-0.uk-lon1.eu.bt.net [166.49.211.230]
7 45 ms 45 ms 44 ms hu0-6-0-4.ccr22.lon01.atlas.cogentco.com [130.117.14.65]

8 45 ms 45 ms 45 ms be2870.ccr41.lon13.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.58.173]
9 46 ms 46 ms 46 ms be2791.ccr21.lon02.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.56.78]
10 45 ms 45 ms 44 ms 149.6.149.46
11 46 ms 46 ms 46 ms 185.52.26.128
12 47 ms 47 ms 47 ms 185.52.26.183
13 52 ms 52 ms 53 ms uk.slo.prgn.b10.stk1.misp.co.uk [185.52.26.180]
14 47 ms 46 ms 46 ms ns31.sovdns.com [195.238.172.50]

Trace complete.

John Lewis Broadband
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Sun 03-Dec-17 15:17:09
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:
I presume you've already sent across the results of your failed tracert to TTB support? That's the real proof in the pudding which will show the problem is at TT's end and not elsewhere.

Btw no issues on my FluidOne connection

C:\>tracert ns31.sovdns.com

Tracing route to ns31.sovdns.com [195.238.172.50]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 1 ms 1 ms 2 ms READYSHARE [192.168.1.1]
2 22 ms 20 ms 19 ms 77-89-165-7.fluidata.co.uk [77.89.165.7]
3 22 ms 19 ms 22 ms 77-89-165-29.fluidata.co.uk [77.89.165.29]
4 22 ms 19 ms 20 ms 77-89-177-66.fluidata.co.uk [77.89.177.66]
5 22 ms 19 ms 20 ms 83-223-115-33.as29017.net [83.223.115.33]
6 22 ms 20 ms 20 ms xe-0-0-1.border-1.sov.lon.uk.as29017.net [89.145.125.26]
7 23 ms 20 ms 21 ms uk.slo.ld5.101.r1.misp.co.uk [195.66.225.228]
8 25 ms 21 ms 22 ms uk.slo.prgn.aggr.sw1.misp.co.uk [185.52.26.185]
9 26 ms 21 ms 22 ms uk.slo.prgn.b10.stk1.misp.co.uk [185.52.26.180]
10 23 ms 20 ms 20 ms ns31.sovdns.com [195.238.172.50]

Trace complete.

C:\>


Thank you for your interest in this issue. Cutting to the chase we want to see a compete trace route to 195.238.172.50 to compete from our own networked connected desktop.. If it does then emails would operate normally.

But sadly from our desktop we grind to a halt at hop 6 while still within the TalkTalk network

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tracing route to lorage.co.uk [195.238.172.50] over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 1 ms 1 ms <1 ms 192.168.134.1
2 18 ms 18 ms 18 ms host-62-24-254-203.as13285.net [62.24.254.203]
3 22 ms 19 ms 20 ms host-78-151-228-51.as13285.net [78.151.228.51]
4 20 ms 19 ms 19 ms host-78-151-228-56.as13285.net [78.151.228.56]
5 18 ms 19 ms 19 ms host-78-144-9-65.as13285.net [78.144.9.65]
6 19 ms 24 ms 20 ms host-78-144-14-7.as13285.net [78.144.14.7]
7 * * * Request timed out.
8 * * * Request timed out.
9 * * * Request timed out.
10 * * * Request timed out.
11 * * * Request timed out.
12 * * * Request timed out.
13 * * * Request timed out.
14 * * * Request timed out.
15 * * * Request timed out.
16 * * * Request timed out.
17 * * * Request timed out.
18 * * * Request timed out.
19 * * * Request timed out.
20 * * * Request timed out.
21 * * * Request timed out.
22 * * * Request timed out.
23 * * * Request timed out.
24 * * * Request timed out.
25 * * * Request timed out.
26 * * * Request timed out.
27 * * * Request timed out.
28 * * * Request timed out.
29 * * * Request timed out.
30 * * * Request timed out.

Trace complete.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This trace has indeed been shared with TTB

To eliminate any issues with the computer or the LAN itself the trace route command was invoked from within the router, which unfortunately doesn't show hostnames, with this result., ::

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
traceroute to 195.238.172.50, 30 hops max through WAN2 protocol ICMP
1 62.24.254.203 30 ms
2 78.151.228.51 20 ms
3 78.151.228.56 20 ms
4 78.144.9.65 20 ms
5 78.144.14.7 40 ms
6 Request timed out. *
7 Request timed out. *
Trace complete.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Again it grinds to a halt when we reach 78.144.14.7. The same command was also invoked from the routers of other TTB customers without success although the hops stoped at a different IP address in the range 78.44.14.1 to 250.

Just for the record here is my tracert from my router:displays:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
traceroute to 195.238.172.50, 30 hops max through WAN1 protocol ICMP
1 62.3.80.17 20 ms
2 62.3.80.38 20 ms
3 77.67.66.225 20 ms
4 Request timed out. *
5 4.69.167.94 10 ms
6 4.69.167.94 10 ms
7 212.187.195.54 10 ms
8 185.52.26.128 20 ms
9 185.52.26.183 20 ms
10 185.52.26.180 30 ms
11 195.238.172.50 20 ms
Trace complete.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Not perfect, but we get there.in the end.

Will all TTB subscribes be able to join the party real soon? No that is the big question.
Standard User baby_frogmella
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 03-Dec-17 15:43:19
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
I suggest you email your trace routes to TTB's network team directly, they sorted out ping issues on my line very quickly last year. Obviously mention your closed/existing ticket numbers

techconnect@talktalkbusiness.co.uk

FluidOne FTTP On Demand 330/30 Mbps
Netgear Nighthawk X10
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Sun 03-Dec-17 16:13:39
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:
I suggest you email your trace routes to TTB's network team directly, they sorted out ping issues on my line very quickly last year. Obviously mention your closed/existing ticket numbers

techconnect@talktalkbusiness.co.uk


Would welcome by PM if necessary the email address to use. Thank You.
Standard User BatBoy
(sensei) Sun 03-Dec-17 16:20:43
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
At a guess I'd say it is techconnect@talktalkbusiness.co.uk
Standard User Charlaba
(newbie) Tue 05-Dec-17 18:48:04
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Have exactly same issue, in that I can not see my web site. It just times out.
Have raised a ticket with Vidahost in hope they have more clout to get issue resolved. Have you done this too? After all not in Vidahost's interest for their clients to be inaccessible.
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Tue 05-Dec-17 22:23:07
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: Charlaba] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Charlaba:
Have exactly same issue, in that I can not see my web site. It just times out.
Have raised a ticket with Vidahost in hope they have more clout to get issue resolved. Have you done this too? After all not in Vidahost's interest for their clients to be inaccessible.


Interesting. I'll be interested to to see your tracert to your website. Any chance you could PM me with the trace?
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Wed 06-Dec-17 12:20:07
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: Charlaba] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Charlaba:
Have exactly same issue, in that I can not see my web site. It just times out.
Have raised a ticket with Vidahost in hope they have more clout to get issue resolved. Have you done this too? After all not in Vidahost's interest for their clients to be inaccessible.


Vidahost have a bank of servers to host domains on and it looks as though you are also on the same server that we are on which is ns31.sovdns.com This server seems to be the only one that TTB cannot see despite a trace route from other community members from their ISP completing.

To us Vidahost have offered to move our hosting to one of their other servers which TTB can see. The implications of this would mean reconfiguring all our email clients with the new server address, no mean task. But the sting in the tail would see all historical emails being duplicated in Outlook.

Least pain for us would be to change ISPs but a migration can't be completed until after Christmas, requires a migration fee and entering into a new 12 month contract. The ongoing monthly fee would be about £10 more against TTB prices. And all because TTB cannot provide routing to ns31.sovdns.com - it all worked fine until two weeks ago, so what has gone tits up?
Standard User BatBoy
(sensei) Wed 06-Dec-17 12:24:33
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Was it this? https://help.vidahost.com/status/report/6238
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Wed 06-Dec-17 13:25:31
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: BatBoy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by BatBoy:
Was it this? https://help.vidahost.com/status/report/6238


What a coincidence this is when the ebb and flow of emails using TalkTalk stopped for us.
Standard User Charlaba
(newbie) Wed 06-Dec-17 17:26:22
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Hi, we have been on to TalkTalk and they are referring to their network team. But they say may take a few days....
Happy to do what you want if you tell me what command you want me to run.
None of my friends with talktalk broadband can see the Vidahost server 195.238.172.50 or my web site www.coachcottagenorfolk.co.uk which sits on the server ns31.sovdns.com .
Have raised a ticket with Vidahost - Viewing Ticket #2249237 but as yet no response from them. waiting on chat for a reply. Would expect action from Vidahost as surely not in their interest to have their clients sites invisible.
Standard User Charlaba
(newbie) Wed 06-Dec-17 17:32:13
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by trolleybus:
In reply to a post by BatBoy:
Was it this? https://help.vidahost.com/status/report/6238


What a coincidence this is when the ebb and flow of emails using TalkTalk stopped for us.


Interesting. Curious though that Sky Virgin and BT broadband users can see my domain and appear to have no problem.....
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Wed 06-Dec-17 18:06:48
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: Charlaba] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Charlaba:
Hi, we have been on to TalkTalk and they are referring to their network team. But they say may take a few days....
Happy to do what you want if you tell me what command you want me to run.
None of my friends with talktalk broadband can see the Vidahost server 195.238.172.50 or my web site www.coachcottagenorfolk.co.uk which sits on the server ns31.sovdns.com .
Have raised a ticket with Vidahost - Viewing Ticket #2249237 but as yet no response from them. waiting on chat for a reply. Would expect action from Vidahost as surely not in their interest to have their clients sites invisible.


Your domain name is hosted by Vidahost and it sits on the same server that our domain uses. Its IP address is 195.238.172.50

A TalkTalk subscriber who does a tracert command for coachcottagenorfolk.co.uk will find there isn't a path through to the target server, Whereas there are no known instances of a failure from any other ISP.. As end punters we can't imagine what the issues are or how to fix them. But what is blatantly true is there is nothing wrong with our set up when using a VPN connection . All we can say is it used to work fine but hasn't worked ever since the server ns31.sovdns.com was rebooted.

The command prompt command to use is tracert coachcottagenorfolk.co.uk

I'll come back to you later with an update.
Standard User baby_frogmella
(fountain of knowledge) Wed 06-Dec-17 18:20:47
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Perhaps Vidahost are blocking TalkTalk IP addresses? In that case there's nothing TT can do about it, only Vidahost can. I would get on the blower to Vidahost and firmly ask them to sort it out with Talktalk, irrespective of who is to blame.

FluidOne FTTP On Demand 330/30 Mbps
Netgear Nighthawk X10
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Wed 06-Dec-17 18:59:08
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:
Perhaps Vidahost are blocking TalkTalk IP addresses? In that case there's nothing TT can do about it, only Vidahost can. I would get on the blower to Vidahost and firmly ask them to sort it out with Talktalk, irrespective of who is to blame.


Nope not the case, we are assured our fixed IP address is not blocked and they have gone the extra mile by even white listing.our fixed IP. All other servers at Vidahost can 'communicate' with TalkTalk.

The issue started following a kernel update to the ns31.sovdns.com on the 29 November. Probably the number of users that have the combination of being a TalkTalk Business customer AND are hosted on ns31.sovdns.com is tiny but this thread has brought up one other user experiencing the same problem.

As a temporary fix, we have a VPN connection to friend not with TalkTalk and everything is working fine but obviously slower through this scenic route.

To me TalkTalk have messed up big time with the kernel update to ns31.sovdns.com and don't know how to fix the issue. Complete assumption on my part, but what else am I to think?

What a lovely thought of Vidahost and TalkTalk working together to resolve this issue. I think a pig would have to fly over the moon first,

Moving our domain off of ns31.sovdns.com has unacceptable consequences. For that reason we have taken the first steps to migrate to another ISP.
Standard User BatBoy
(sensei) Wed 06-Dec-17 19:04:24
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by trolleybus:
To me TalkTalk have messed up big time with the kernel update to ns31.sovdns.com and don't know how to fix the issue. Complete assumption on my part, but what else am I to think?
I can't see how TT are implicated in any way in a problem occurring when Vidahost updated one of their servers. The fault to me obviously lies with Vidahost.
Standard User Ixel
(committed) Wed 06-Dec-17 19:07:34
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: BatBoy] [link to this post]
 
I agree, I doubt TalkTalk Business are responsible for this at all. Vidahost must have done something their end, possibly blocked TalkTalk Business's IP range? I tried tracerouting from my connection as I'm on the TalkTalk Business backhaul, albeit with an AAISP IP address and obvious result was I could traceroute to the domain name mentioned a few posts ago without any problems.
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 07-Dec-17 09:29:23
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
It is theoretically possible that the server problem caused a routing table issue and that for some reason TalkTalk's routers/switches have a duff routing table following that. In that case it would be TalkTalk that would have to resolve it by refreshing the routing.
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Fri 08-Dec-17 11:12:28
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ian72:
It is theoretically possible that the server problem caused a routing table issue and that for some reason TalkTalk's routers/switches have a duff routing table following that. In that case it would be TalkTalk that would have to resolve it by refreshing the routing.


We have found it impossible to get this issue resolved through any channel available to us. It's a ping pong game of Vidahost saying the issue is with TalkTalk and TalkTalk saying the problem is with Vidahost. And to throw a spanner in the works both organisations suggest it is my setup that is at fault with a firewall setting.

The only factual evidence we can put forward is that there is an incomplete trace route between TalKTalk and Vidahost's server ns31.sovdns.com an issue not present if the same command is issue from any other ISP or indeed between TalkTalk and any other server maintained by Vidahost.

It also has to be noted that connectivity issues started immediately after a security patch was applied to ns31.sovdns,com on 29th November. Effectively from that date the ebb and flow of emails to us stopped although 4 days latter we had a work around through the use of VPN technology.

A trace route between TalkTalk and ns31.sovdns.com still fails today. We could move our domain to another of Vidahost servers and all would work OK, but that would mean re-configuration of the email settings of 18 devices with an end result of duplication of historical emails in each client.

A more satisfactory solution for us is to switch ISP and we have kicked off that process. The new ISP will provide us with a VPN service until the new service goes live on 29 December. It is not without costs which we should not have to bear but at least we are spared the time and effort of repeating the same old tests required by TalkTalk and Vidahost.

So that's it for now but forever any customer of TalkTalk will not be able to see our web site hosted on ns31.sovdns.com or send us an email A most unsatisfactory situation.
Standard User jelv
(knowledge is power) Fri 08-Dec-17 17:31:27
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
What you need is for as many people as possible who are on TalkTalk to raise a fault with TalkTalk saying they can't reach the website.

jelv

AAISP November 2016
(Previous ISP Plusnet November 2001 to October 2016) Why I left Plusnet
Telephone rental: Pulse8
Standard User BatBoy
(sensei) Fri 08-Dec-17 18:00:24
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
It would have been easier to move the website to an accessible server and fix the Outlook problem which I don't believe is as described.
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Sun 10-Dec-17 23:26:32
Print Post

Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: BatBoy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by BatBoy:
It would have been easier to move the website to an accessible server and fix the Outlook problem which I don't believe is as described.


I have the greatest respect for you and indeed on the surface looks the better option to take. However,
make any kind of configuration change to Outlook and you'll find that historical emails sitting on the server will download again causing duplication to what you already have. There is also not the insignificant issue of going to each email client to enter the new information. The transfer process of moving hosted material from one server to another is estimated to take 24 hours followed by an indeterminate amount of time to sync up the server with all the clients using a pretty slow internet connection. Could be two days before normality returns.

Switching providers is estimated to take no more than a four hour total loss of service and has the benefit of not requiring a change to each email client. What is more the new ISP chosen will be providing a like for like service a lot cheaper. While we wait for the new service to go live, a free VPN service will be provided.

It doesn't solve the issue of TalkTalk customers not being able to communicate with us using email, nor being able to see our web site but at least we can move on with running our business. Eventually the weight of other subscribers in a similar position might see the fault repaired, and good luck to them. Is the fault with TalkTalk or Vidahost? The jury's still out on that one
Standard User BatBoy
(sensei) Sun 10-Dec-17 23:28:16
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Ok, you're the boss. Good luck
Standard User jelv
(knowledge is power) Mon 11-Dec-17 09:14:09
Print Post

Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Not sure I understand the bit about TalkTalk users being unable to email you. Are you saying TalkTalk's mail servers can't contact your mail server? If it's just user routing that is affected surely it is only people running their own mail servers and not relaying via TalkTalk's servers that would be affected. That would not be that many.

jelv

AAISP November 2016
(Previous ISP Plusnet November 2001 to October 2016) Why I left Plusnet
Telephone rental: Pulse8
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Mon 11-Dec-17 10:50:10
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: jelv] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jelv:
Not sure I understand the bit about TalkTalk users being unable to email you. Are you saying TalkTalk's mail servers can't contact your mail server? If it's just user routing that is affected surely it is only people running their own mail servers and not relaying via TalkTalk's servers that would be affected. That would not be that many.


If you are a TalkTalK Business customer you will find that a trace route to ns31.sovdns.com fails to complete. This means you can neither see our site nor send us an email. No issues at all if your with any other ISP.

ns31.sovdns.com is one of a bank of servers operated by Vidahost to host customer domains, That server had a critical security patch applied on 29th November from which point only TalkTalk could not communicate with it, but all other ISPs could. Logically the fault lies with Vidahost, but they claim the issue is with TalkTalk or even our own setup. Over at TalkTalk, it is a blame game suggesting our setup is at fault or sort it out at Vidahost.

It is true you would be hard put to find many computer user who use TalkTalk Business as their ISP and host their domain with Vidahost but remarkably this thread has located another user with the same issues. As we are no closer in having the issue resolved we have three choices of either migrating to anther ISP, finding another hosting company, or shifting our domain to be hosted on another at Vidahost which doesn't have this issue.

The least amount of effort on our part is to simply move to another ISP especially as the other two options would cause significant issues with Outlook which would be a disaster for us. We do not use TalkTalk's email servers to avoid relay issues when connected to any other ISP while travelling.
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Sat 16-Dec-17 12:09:42
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ian72:
It is theoretically possible that the server problem caused a routing table issue and that for some reason TalkTalk's routers/switches have a duff routing table following that. In that case it would be TalkTalk that would have to resolve it by refreshing the routing.


My highest accolades go to Ian72 who was spot on with his diagnoses! This morning it was observed that emails were flooding into our mobile devices and sure enough a trace route now completes whereas prevously it failed:

Tracing route to ns31.sovdns.com [195.238.172.50]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 29 ms 29 ms 28 ms 192.168.134.1
2 47 ms 79 ms 45 ms host-62-24-254-203.as13285.net [62.24.254.203]
3 46 ms 46 ms 45 ms host-78-151-228-51.as13285.net [78.151.228.51]
4 47 ms 46 ms 46 ms host-78-151-228-56.as13285.net [78.151.228.56]
5 47 ms 47 ms 47 ms host-78-144-9-65.as13285.net [78.144.9.65]
6 47 ms 48 ms 48 ms uk.slo.ld5.101.r1.misp.co.uk [195.66.225.228]
7 52 ms 49 ms 48 ms uk.slo.prgn.aggr.sw1.misp.co.uk [185.52.26.185]
8 56 ms 50 ms 49 ms uk.slo.prgn.b10.stk1.misp.co.uk [185.52.26.180]
9 47 ms 47 ms 47 ms ns31.sovdns.com [195.238.172.50]

Trace complete.


The turning point to success was an email from TalkTalk on 15 December 2017 at 08:21 which read:

I apologise that previous agents have not grasped the issue you are having. I agree there seems to be a routing issue. I have put the trace routs to our network team to investigate.

And amazingly, within 24 hours the problem was sorted.

We lost our email service on 29th November and obviously contacted our hosting provider Vidahost to resolve the issue. Testing over the next few days illustrated that the problem was well and truly with TalkTalk and a ticket was opened with them on 5th December. Meanwhile the previous day a VPN connection was established to another user who was a BT subscriber to enable us to receive and send emails. No re-configuration of Outlook was required as we use the email servers of Vidahost and not those of TalkTalk.

TalkTalkís repeated assertions over the next two weeks or so, was that as it was an email issue with another provider, a resolution was only possible by them (Vidahost) despite us demonstrating it was a routing issue within the TalkTalk network, Sensing that we were in a deadlock position we decided to start the process off of migrating to another ISP with our choice being Cloudscape. The migration date is set for 29th December. As it will be a like for like service and Cloudscape will save as money, there seems little point in pulling the plug on this migration.

We now know that a more clued up TalkTalk Business support service could have solved the problem almost instantly but failing to do so has lost them a customer. For sure we our considerably out of pocket with the whole sad affair and thoughts turn to compensation, but there is no chance on that front!
Standard User BatBoy
(sensei) Sat 16-Dec-17 12:11:42
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Good result in time for Christmas smile
Standard User baby_frogmella
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 16-Dec-17 12:39:28
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by trolleybus:
As it will be a like for like service and Cloudscape will save as money, there seems little point in pulling the plug on this migration.


I wouldn't be so sure. Have a look at this recent thread, where severe peak time congestion issues on Cloudscape are being reported. TT/TTB, for all their faults, operate a rock solid network. I really hope you don't regret your move to Cloudscape...

http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/4574904-under...

FluidOne FTTP On Demand 330/30 Mbps
Netgear Nighthawk X10
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Sat 16-Dec-17 13:20:05
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:
In reply to a post by trolleybus:
As it will be a like for like service and Cloudscape will save as money, there seems little point in pulling the plug on this migration.


I wouldn't be so sure. Have a look at this recent thread, where severe peak time congestion issues on Cloudscape are being reported. TT/TTB, for all their faults, operate a rock solid network. I really hope you don't regret your move to Cloudscape...

http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/4574904-under...


O dear,need to go into a dark room and have a lie down! It might be possible to pull the plug on the migration, I just do not know at this stage. On the other hand are Cloudscape's issues a blip or more of a persistent nature? For the last three weeks, TalkTalk hasn't excactly done us proud with their "rock solid network".

A small player in the market place doesn't always mean a sub-standard service either

Difficult one this and something that many TTB readers don't seem to get right judging by the number of ISPs they have been with.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 16-Dec-17 13:34:20
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
A routing problem in the TT network caused by Visihost fixing a problem router of their own was not picked up, and was wrongly handled by first-line support.

I wouldn't call that a migration-forcing issue as long as similar does not occur regularly. (I agree that as it looked as though TTB weren't going to fix it, migration was the best course in your case).

The alternative being a relative unknown that may be fine in principle but perhaps needs to scale up a bit before it is suitable for a critical business connection.

As for the migration, you can stop it by simply telling Cloudscape you no longer wish to proceed. (Ofcom General Conditions Section 22). Though if it is the last day before migration it might be difficult as the instruction may not reach Openreach in time.

Only if Cloudscape refuse can you then contact TTB and get them to cancel the migration for you. They are forbidden from cancelling it unless and until the gaining provider refuses to.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. 200GB. Sync 74145/13476Kbps @ 600m. BQMs - IPv4 & IPv6

Edited by RobertoS (Sat 16-Dec-17 13:35:25)

Standard User BatBoy
(sensei) Sat 16-Dec-17 13:46:57
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Look on the bright side, their offices are really handy for the http://www.retrocomputermuseum.co.uk/
Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Sat 16-Dec-17 13:58:24
Print Post

Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
A routing problem in the TT network caused by Visihost fixing a problem router of their own was not picked up, and was wrongly handled by first-line support.

I wouldn't call that a migration-forcing issue as long as similar does not occur regularly. (I agree that as it looked as though TTB weren't going to fix it, migration was the best course in your case).

The alternative being a relative unknown that may be fine in principle but perhaps needs to scale up a bit before it is suitable for a critical business connection.

As for the migration, you can stop it by simply telling Cloudscape you no longer wish to proceed. (Ofcom General Conditions Section 22). Though if it is the last day before migration it might be difficult as the instruction may not reach Openreach in time.

Only if Cloudscape refuse can you then contact TTB and get them to cancel the migration for you. They are forbidden from cancelling it unless and until the gaining provider refuses to.


Thank you for your observations. It is most useful for the decision making process. Probably have to kiss bye bye to the upfront connection charge paid to Cloudscape by not migrating.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 16-Dec-17 15:59:09
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Re: TalkTalkBusiness taking forever to fix a fault


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by trolleybus:
Thank you for your observations. It is most useful for the decision making process. Probably have to kiss bye bye to the upfront connection charge paid to Cloudscape by not migrating.
It's debatable whether or not a upfront connection charge is refundable or not.
Customerís termination rights

22.5 When the Customer enters into a contract for the provision of Communications Services, the Gaining Provider must allow the Customer to terminate the contract from the point of sale to the completion of the Transfer Period without charge or any other form of compensation being required to be given by the Customer to the Gaining Provider.
GC 22.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. 200GB. Sync 74145/13476Kbps @ 600m. BQMs - IPv4 & IPv6
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