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Standard User kadison44
(committed) Fri 03-May-13 17:27:29
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Considering fibre with Zen/others - am I missing something?


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I want to upgrade my connection (currently O2/Be ADSL2+) to one of the 76Mbps fibre offerings. I've looked at Zen, IDnet and BT. I've never been with BT because in the past, the smaller providers although a little more expensive, provided a better more consistent service. I've previously been with Eclipse (before they went downhill!) and Aquiss who were excellent but couldn't provide ADSL2+ at the time which I wanted.

Zen and IDnet are basically the same price as each other, have 100GB cap (for me to get a reasonable price / GB ratio) and I'd have to pay a £100 connection charge.

BT are offering totally unlimited and non-traffic managed broadband. Yes the contract is 6 months longer but the price is £10 a month cheaper and I'd pay no connection fee.

Help - I'm struggling to see why I'd go with a smaller provider anymore! I've drilled into BT's terms and they say there's absolutely no throtting or caps on the Infinity 2 product. Over an 18 month period the difference in price between them and Zen adds up to hundreds.

Am i missing something that Zen can give me that BT can't? Are Zen able to provide a more stable/faster/consistent service or are BT just pricing out the competition with their wholesale products? frown

Thanks

Kadison44
Netgear DG834G v4
Standard User iand
(fountain of knowledge) Fri 03-May-13 19:13:52
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Re: Considering fibre with Zen/others - am I missing somethi


[re: kadison44] [link to this post]
 
if you do not need a static IP address then I suggest you move to the SKY FTTC service, from your O2 ADSLxx service managed by SKY.

IanD
Standard User hpyatt
(newbie) Sat 04-May-13 21:26:28
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Re: Considering fibre with Zen/others - am I missing somethi


[re: kadison44] [link to this post]
 
My ISP history is 1990-99 BT, 99-2006 Eclipse, 2006 to date Zen. Each time I have moved because of poor customer service after a problem. To date Zen has been perfect. I have just upgraded to FTTC 76 after BT offered me a similar deal to you. I chose to pay the higher connection and monthly charges in the knowledge that I will receive a good reliable connection and *if* there are any problems Zen will provide hassle free resolution. I am now the happy user of a service that often runs at 70+ dropping at peak times to 40+ so the variation is much larger that under ADSL but why should I worry when the constraining download limit is now my wireless connection speed !

The bottom line is how much do you value peace of mind. Watch the BT FTTC forum for a bit and then jump based on what you read.


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Standard User bernado
(newbie) Sun 05-May-13 08:59:22
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Re: Considering fibre with Zen/others - am I missing somethi


[re: hpyatt] [link to this post]
 
But ultimately if there is a problem won't Openreach be called in to play anyway, albeit via Zen as the middle men?
Standard User kadison44
(committed) Sun 05-May-13 10:25:12
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Re: Considering fibre with Zen/others - am I missing somethi


[re: bernado] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by bernado:
But ultimately if there is a problem won't Openreach be called in to play anyway, albeit via Zen as the middle men?


This is sort of what I was getting it, it's all BT anyway so apart from getting through to customer service *if* goes wrong what am I gaining? doesn't it all go down the BT pipes anyway?

In reply to the first reply, I can't get sky at more than 40Mbps (no pro available here) so it rules them out. I'm not making the move to fibre without a massive jump in speed smile

Edit: spelling

Kadison44
Netgear DG834G v4

Edited by kadison44 (Sun 05-May-13 10:28:42)

Standard User lexden16
(member) Sun 05-May-13 14:13:56
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Re: Considering fibre with Zen/others - am I missing somethi


[re: kadison44] [link to this post]
 
I think that you are asking a very difficult question as each customer's needs, circumstances and location are different. ISPs do have total control over their part of the network but, yes, OR provides the ISP Hub to customer modem links. Niche ISPs make play of the fact that they 'manage' their networks such that there is always spare capacity to cover such events as, say, the Olympics. Moreover, niche ISPs tend not to attract high downloaders in the droves that favour BT, Sky and TalkTalk. This is important as it means that customers rarely see a fall off in speeds or traffic shaping.

I have been with both IDNet and Zen and their network management is first-class. On my Zen FTTC line, I can test my speeds at anytime of the day and get a consistent 75+ Down and 16.5+ Up with a Ping below 20. IDNet and Zen support is good but OOH support has in the past been an issue for IDNet and, on balance, I think that Zen's communication with its customers is better than that of IDNet.

All that said, a key factor in my decision not to go with BT, was the simple fact that I only download about 35GB a month. I am on Zen's 80/20 100GB service with phone rental and the extra charge per month is not that significant.

Finally, by way of balance, my daughter and her tribe have BT Infinity and are very happy with it. She doesn't have to worry about how much bandwidth they consume and although the speeds vary from 60 to 30Mbps at various times in the day she reminds herself that 30Mbps is 20 times faster than she used to get on her ADSL line.

Edited by lexden16 (Sun 05-May-13 14:45:45)

Standard User hpyatt
(newbie) Sun 05-May-13 14:21:19
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Re: Considering fibre with Zen/others - am I missing somethi


[re: kadison44] [link to this post]
 
The service problems I have suffered always have two components - the "harware" dealt with by Openreach and the "software" dealt with by the ISP. You always have to go through yout ISP regardless so that interface is the critical one. With BT I had great problems in getting them to understand the problem, having to reiterate every time I phoned. With Eclipse the ticket system was there but the competence of the call centre engineer was limited. With Zen I have a converstaion with an intellegent person who a) reads and understands my problem without me having to repeat myself for the nth time.b) understands that Zen's reputation is at stake and will make sure my concerns are dealt with. It's a bit like finding a good doctor, dentist, hairdresser or any other service provider - once you have found them and are happy with them you realise that the price is a lesser consideration. Have a look at this link before deciding http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/bt/t/4231681-infini...

Edited by hpyatt (Sun 05-May-13 14:25:30)

Standard User bigbadpirate
(learned) Sun 05-May-13 14:59:29
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Re: Considering fibre with Zen/others - am I missing somethi


[re: hpyatt] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by hpyatt:
My ISP history is 1990-99 BT, 99-2006 Eclipse, 2006 to date Zen. Each time I have moved because of poor customer service after a problem. To date Zen has been perfect. I have just upgraded to FTTC 76 after BT offered me a similar deal to you. I chose to pay the higher connection and monthly charges in the knowledge that I will receive a good reliable connection and *if* there are any problems Zen will provide hassle free resolution. I am now the happy user of a service that often runs at 70+ dropping at peak times to 40+ so the variation is much larger that under ADSL but why should I worry when the constraining download limit is now my wireless connection speed !

The bottom line is how much do you value peace of mind. Watch the BT FTTC forum for a bit and then jump based on what you read.



Good advise. Depends what you want from your connection. Long time Zen customer here and BT frikken openworld previous to that and time still didn't heal the memory of that debacle of a company. I've had one bad experience with Zen and that was quickly sorted to my satisfaction.

Unlimited was tempting at first but then I read the BT forums on here and see people having 56k type latency. Stability is key to me for my enjoyment of the internet, high pings i can deal with as long as the connection is stable. If I was a leach and stole everything I might go the BT route. My only worry is how large some of the HD films are getting and they will only keep getting bigger. Nextflix/lovefilm are not getting the good films fast enough and i can't see that changing soon so 100gb a month is fine for me but who can blame people for wanting an unlimited connection if the film companies are still stuck in the 1990s.

As i understand it BT don't mind overselling and lying to their customers about their product and screwing over all their customers in turn and that's fine for most of their customers. Zen focus more on quality over quantity and charge a fair price for the service they provide.
Standard User Sandgrounder
(knowledge is power) Sun 05-May-13 23:31:21
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Re: Considering fibre with Zen/others - am I missing somethi


[re: kadison44] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by kadison44:
.... , it's all BT anyway.


BT Wholesale, yes. But BT retail do not compare with Zen.



Line One:- Zen - DrayTek Vigor 2600VG
Line Two:- EntaNet (Aquiss) - DrayTek Vigor 2600
Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Tue 07-May-13 04:13:58
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Re: Considering fibre with Zen/others - am I missing somethi


[re: kadison44] [link to this post]
 
I am also considering zen but only because I need a static ip, if you dont need a static ip I wouldnt bother.

Also zen seem very inflexible on varying usage patterns, they have what seems to me a horrific topup price structure £1,50 per gig (am I wrong?). Alternatively one can upgrade to a higher package to avoid that but it means paying off the old package whilst starting a new min term for the new package meaning cant do things like upgrade for just 1 month.

BT retail for the most part performs well, now has no p2p throttling on the unlimited product. The only real downside is the ip situation.

BT Infinity 2 Since Dec 2012
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