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Standard User IamQ
(experienced) Wed 24-Jul-13 22:00:20
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So will the internet be the internet for much longer...?


[link to this post]
 
What is Zen's stance on the .gov.uk deciding what we should & should not be allowed to see/view on the internet?

Is there any comment yet?

Interesting take by A&A here

Raises the question - won't gov.uk just make all the backhaul provider run man-in-the-middle proxies against any 'internet' connection?

Thought...Comments... smile
Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Wed 24-Jul-13 22:19:57
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Re: So will the internet be the internet for much longer...?


[re: IamQ] [link to this post]
 
Raises the question - won't gov.uk just make all the backhaul provider run man-in-the-middle proxies against any 'internet' connection?
And who is going to pay for this? not only that but it isn't their responsibility to do that,

And scamerCon's bright idea won't work regardless, The backhaul providers wouldn't filter traffic it's not their part of the ship, Government and IT don't mix well

And IMO AAISP have got the right idea i hope there are a lot more who do the same & say bog off to this stupid idea

Edited by tommy45 (Wed 24-Jul-13 22:24:51)

Standard User IamQ
(experienced) Wed 24-Jul-13 22:46:54
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Re: So will the internet be the internet for much longer...?


[re: tommy45] [link to this post]
 
And who is going to pay for this? not only that but it isn't their responsibility to do that.

And IMO AAISP have got the right idea i hope there are a lot more who do the same & say bog off to this stupid idea


Indeed - but .gov.uk could say anyone provided an internet connection must have this wonderful false choice of filtered or not... It would be made the 'providers' problem. So any provider who was proving a service that was intended for *public* consumption may be forced to comply as part of there licensing terms as a licensed telecoms provider etc.

Thin end of the wedge is this. Porn, then anything violent, then anything against any law in any land, anything that might offend Mrs Jones at the bridge club, anything that might offent the reverend at the local church, video games, films which may offend this is going to be great fun.

Oh no wait - what about evolution to creationists ?!? or anything on the Daily Mail list of things that might kill you, or corrupt us, or anything which mum's net might think will kill our kids.

With a bit of luck all of the good ISP's willl tell .gov.uk where to poke it - either that or we just build an overlay internet based on heavy crypto (et-al TOR)

Edited by IamQ (Wed 24-Jul-13 22:54:35)


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Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Wed 24-Jul-13 22:55:01
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Re: So will the internet be the internet for much longer...?


[re: IamQ] [link to this post]
 
A carrier would still not be required to filter it's data as they do not supply service's direct to the public as such, they only provide services to ISP's , it is the individual isp's who sell a service to the public

Edited by tommy45 (Wed 24-Jul-13 23:03:09)

Standard User IamQ
(experienced) Wed 24-Jul-13 23:03:03
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Re: So will the internet be the internet for much longer...?


[re: tommy45] [link to this post]
 
I'm not 100% sure.

All the leaf ISP's who provide services via other ISP's (so UKFSN via Enta) for example - may find it becomes an obligation of there connection contract or something.

I can think of several ways in law I could draft something which would be made to stick and be bound up with terms of licenses and access agreements. If .gov.uk really wanted to be an ass about it they could find a few ways.

It also raises the question then of 'who is an ISP'

Me selling service to my neighbor - am I an ISP? I had this issue with BT Cloud, OpenZone and JaNET etc, and the 'issues' about 'open' wifi and public networks.

Edited by IamQ (Wed 24-Jul-13 23:04:47)

Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Wed 24-Jul-13 23:24:19
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Re: So will the internet be the internet for much longer...?


[re: IamQ] [link to this post]
 
Thing is there is going to be an opt in by default ,So only if you don't opt out to remove the porn filter will they try and block access to porn sites, So they will either end up with a huge list of names on their data base, or there would be an increased demand for ofshore VPN services, And the Peado's will continue to do what they do,
So how does it make the internet a safer place for kids ? in reality it won't achieve this

But parents can do this, by filtering their own connections (router level) if they ain't knowledgeable enough to do this, then perhaps they should pay someone to do it, instead of rely on the isp's to do it, so we all end up being affected, isp level filtering is not a good thing it will no doubt block a lot of other sites too, and then there's mission creep ,
A little like the iwf that now also filters sites for violating copyrights , when it was intended solely for blocking links to CP Have a read of some of the coments about this on the register ,
Standard User yarwell
(sensei) Wed 24-Jul-13 23:48:49
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Re: So will the internet be the internet for much longer...?


[re: IamQ] [link to this post]
 
Opt out of being filtered. End.

--

Phil

MaxDSL - goes as fast as it can and doesn't read the line checker first.

MaxDSL diagnostics
Standard User IamQ
(experienced) Thu 25-Jul-13 00:18:58
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Re: So will the internet be the internet for much longer...?


[re: tommy45] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by tommy45:
But parents can do this, by filtering their own connections (router level) if they ain't knowledgeable enough to do this, then perhaps they should pay someone to do it, instead of rely on the isp's to do it, so we all end up being affected, isp level filtering is not a good thing it will no doubt block a lot of other sites too, and then there's mission creep ,
A little like the iwf that now also filters sites for violating copyrights , when it was intended solely for blocking links to CP Have a read of some of the coments about this on the register ,


Indeed - & I will have a read through what people are saying there. This is one of those things which is going to take on a life of its own.

Someone at work just raised a valid point / fair question;

"Mobile data providers (o2, T-Mobile etc) all block a lot of stuff by default as part of there under 18 policy - in order to access some stuff which *they* decide is not suited to those under 18 you have to go through a credit check process reveal your identity and all the rest of it, surely this is no different..."
ISP Representative Zenops
(isp) Thu 25-Jul-13 09:34:18
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Re: So will the internet be the internet for much longer...?


[re: IamQ] [link to this post]
 
I have written a blog on this subject which will be going live on our website soon here; http://www.zen.co.uk/blog.

our position is supportive of Active Choice but not default on, Mandatory Blocking.

Regards
Gary

ZeN Internet - Regulatory Manager


-------------------------IMPORTANT---------------------
The opinions expressed here are my own and not necessarily
those of my employers "Zen Internet".

Please note, I will not respond to unsolicited private messages.
------------------------------------------------------------
The above post has been made by an ISP REPRESENTATIVE (although not necessarily the ISP being discussed in the post).
Standard User IamQ
(experienced) Thu 25-Jul-13 09:50:35
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Re: So will the internet be the internet for much longer...?


[re: Zenops] [link to this post]
 
Cheers for the Gary - will keep an eye out. Interesting to see what providers are coming out and saying in light of this all.
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