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Standard User Spudgun
(regular) Tue 18-Oct-16 22:08:00
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Poor single thread performance problems return?


[link to this post]
 
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Speed test is really struggling tonight for single threaded performance on BNG1, anyone else seeing similar things?
Standard User 23Prince
(member) Wed 19-Oct-16 09:54:31
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return? *DELETED*


[re: Spudgun] [link to this post]
 
Post deleted by 23Prince
Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Wed 19-Oct-16 17:21:04
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Spudgun] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Spudgun:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Speed test is really struggling tonight for single threaded performance on BNG1, anyone else seeing similar things?
Not to the same extent but sometimes i see around 6-8mb difference in single threaded , to tbb speedtesters, but i enter zen's network from manchester, though shortly after the work on the london side was done there has been a slight increase in latency to some places tbb is one, and the jitter levels are creeping up again in the day time


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Standard User craski
(member) Wed 19-Oct-16 19:02:56
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Spudgun] [link to this post]
 
I'm seeing same on my Zen connection.
HTTPx6 runs at expected speed of about 70Mb but HTTPx1 is bursting all over the place and struggles to do more than 15 to 20Mb and is often <10Mb.

Zens inability to maintain a good quality connection beyond a few weeks at a time is getting very tiring.

Zen Unlimited Fibre Office BQM

Edited by craski (Wed 19-Oct-16 19:07:37)

Standard User Kste
(newbie) Wed 19-Oct-16 23:11:43
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craski] [link to this post]
 
I have the same issues, and have had them since May.

There are no updates from Zen, each time I have to go to them to get more info. I can see nothing on their website, no public acknowledgement of this issue.

Before I got 70, now 10-25.

Zen used to be good, but its like they only care about business customers now.
ISP Representative jongreen84
(isp) Thu 20-Oct-16 11:20:40
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Spudgun] [link to this post]
 
Hi all,

Sorry to hear that you’re having issues. We’ve had a number of reports of this and are already investigating. Could anyone affected please raise a fault with our Tech Support teams, and mention this thread. Could you also then PM me your username/fault ref and I’ll make sure your fault is linked to the wider issue.

Thanks,

Jon
The above post has been made by an ISP REPRESENTATIVE (although not necessarily the ISP being discussed in the post).
Standard User Kste
(newbie) Thu 20-Oct-16 23:22:27
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jongreen84] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jongreen84:
Hi all,

Sorry to hear that you’re having issues. We’ve had a number of reports of this and are already investigating. Could anyone affected please raise a fault with our Tech Support teams, and mention this thread. Could you also then PM me your username/fault ref and I’ll make sure your fault is linked to the wider issue.

Thanks,

Jon


Hello,

I have been in contact with support several times and provided speed test screen shots, my fault is already linked with the wider issue.

I have PM'ed you all the same.
Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Thu 20-Oct-16 23:30:28
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Spudgun] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Spudgun:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Speed test is really struggling tonight for single threaded performance on BNG1, anyone else seeing similar things?

How long has this been ongoing?
Also out of interest how much do you pay Zen for this abysmal service?
As a reference, I have two services, BT residental and TalkTalk
BT I pay for 55Mbps: Line rental + £11 a month = £29ish
TalkTalk I pay for 38Mbps: just line rental at £17.70 + £0 (discounted) for fibre medium = £17.70 total
My speedtests (all over 5Ghz wireless with 2 walls between me and the router). On both BT & TalkTalk the lines are so identical you cannot even distinguish the single vs multi threaded:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Dare I say it, if this has been going on for a while, I would seriously be considering an ISP switch in your shoes. I get the feeling you could save a lot as well, especially if we factor in Quidco Cashback.

EDIT: Just seen it has been ongoing since MAY! That is far too long - jump ship mate.
For reference I am based in London where usage is bound to be really heavy and it's still fine.

Edited by ukhardy07 (Thu 20-Oct-16 23:34:42)

Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Thu 20-Oct-16 23:57:40
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: ukhardy07] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ukhardy07:
In reply to a post by Spudgun:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Speed test is really struggling tonight for single threaded performance on BNG1, anyone else seeing similar things?

How long has this been ongoing?
Also out of interest how much do you pay Zen for this abysmal service?
As a reference, I have two services, BT residental and TalkTalk
BT I pay for 55Mbps: Line rental + £11 a month = £29ish
TalkTalk I pay for 38Mbps: just line rental at £17.70 + £0 (discounted) for fibre medium = £17.70 total
My speedtests (all over 5Ghz wireless with 2 walls between me and the router). On both BT & TalkTalk the lines are so identical you cannot even distinguish the single vs multi threaded:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Dare I say it, if this has been going on for a while, I would seriously be considering an ISP switch in your shoes. I get the feeling you could save a lot as well, especially if we factor in Quidco Cashback.

EDIT: Just seen it has been ongoing since MAY! That is far too long - jump ship mate.
For reference I am based in London where usage is bound to be really heavy and it's still fine.
please don't suggest BT consumer they have [censored] cs and tech support, that is as well as no static IP and their web censorship bs,

Edited by tommy45 (Thu 20-Oct-16 23:58:47)

Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Fri 21-Oct-16 00:09:17
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: tommy45] [link to this post]
 
Agree standard CS is not good but there are a few good teams within BT. You just need to know where to email / call. Once you reach UK support they are very good, as many have found out on here when i have put them in touch with said people.

Web censorship is no worse than virginmedia or sky in my experience.

Static IP fair enough.
BT Business is an option where these features are required.

The point is the op has had congestion since May, that's almost 6 months of congestion, so my advice stands to migrate out to another ISP.

If advanced features are not required standard residential broadband is fine.
For more features / better CS, TalkTalk Business and BT business are decent options.
Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Fri 21-Oct-16 00:34:40
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: ukhardy07] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ukhardy07:
Agree standard CS is not good but there are a few good teams within BT. You just need to know where to email / call. Once you reach UK support they are very good, as many have found out on here when i have put them in touch with said people.

Web censorship is no worse than virginmedia or sky in my experience.

Static IP fair enough.
BT Business is an option where these features are required.

The point is the op has had congestion since May, that's almost 6 months of congestion, so my advice stands to migrate out to another ISP.

If advanced features are not required standard residential broadband is fine.
For more features / better CS, TalkTalk Business and BT business are decent options.
quite how BT business justify a fee each month for a static ip i do not know , as it costs nothing to the isp
ISP Representative jongreen84
(isp) Fri 21-Oct-16 09:23:41
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Kste] [link to this post]
 
Hi Kste,

PM received and added to my list. Apologies that this has been going on for so long.

We're working closely with our backhaul provider to resolve at least one issue that could be causing this. It has been escalated and we're chasing them daily, so we are taking this very seriously. We're also looking into possible workarounds while our backhaul provider investigates.

Cheers,

Jon
The above post has been made by an ISP REPRESENTATIVE (although not necessarily the ISP being discussed in the post).
Standard User craski
(member) Fri 21-Oct-16 10:01:42
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Kste] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Kste:
Zen used to be good, but its like they only care about business customers now.


I am a business customer and still get mediocre performance. This is a fairly typical graph shape for me, not terrible but not great either:-
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14770...

Zen Unlimited Fibre Office BQM
ISP Representative jongreen84
(isp) Fri 21-Oct-16 10:49:06
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craski] [link to this post]
 
Hi,

I'd like to get this looked into. Could you please raise a fault if you've not done already, and PM me your username?

Thanks,

Jon
The above post has been made by an ISP REPRESENTATIVE (although not necessarily the ISP being discussed in the post).
Standard User Kste
(newbie) Sat 22-Oct-16 01:27:49
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jongreen84] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jongreen84:
Hi Kste,

PM received and added to my list. Apologies that this has been going on for so long.

We're working closely with our backhaul provider to resolve at least one issue that could be causing this. It has been escalated and we're chasing them daily, so we are taking this very seriously. We're also looking into possible workarounds while our backhaul provider investigates.

Cheers,

Jon


Hello,

I PM'ed you, and the issue appears to have gone, getting single thread at around 60-70.
Standard User 23Prince
(member) Sat 22-Oct-16 16:53:11
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: tommy45] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by tommy45:
In reply to a post by ukhardy07:
In reply to a post by Spudgun:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Speed test is really struggling tonight for single threaded performance on BNG1, anyone else seeing similar things?

How long has this been ongoing?
Also out of interest how much do you pay Zen for this abysmal service?
As a reference, I have two services, BT residental and TalkTalk
BT I pay for 55Mbps: Line rental + £11 a month = £29ish
TalkTalk I pay for 38Mbps: just line rental at £17.70 + £0 (discounted) for fibre medium = £17.70 total
My speedtests (all over 5Ghz wireless with 2 walls between me and the router). On both BT & TalkTalk the lines are so identical you cannot even distinguish the single vs multi threaded:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Dare I say it, if this has been going on for a while, I would seriously be considering an ISP switch in your shoes. I get the feeling you could save a lot as well, especially if we factor in Quidco Cashback.

EDIT: Just seen it has been ongoing since MAY! That is far too long - jump ship mate.
For reference I am based in London where usage is bound to be really heavy and it's still fine.
please don't suggest BT consumer they have [censored] cs and tech support, that is as well as no static IP and their web censorship bs,


Talk Talk Business, every time.
ISP Representative jongreen84
(isp) Mon 24-Oct-16 09:23:22
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Kste] [link to this post]
 
That's excellent news, thanks for letting us know.

We'll be working on the plan for the other affected exchanges over the next few days, and I'll provide an update when we have one. The workaround we've applied in this case isn't always possible, so some exchanges will need additional work.

I'll also look at getting a service alert up that lists the affected exchanges.

I'd encourage anyone else experiencing slow single-thread download speeds to raise a fault with our tech support teams if not done so already, and PM me your username/fault reference.

Thanks again,

Jon
The above post has been made by an ISP REPRESENTATIVE (although not necessarily the ISP being discussed in the post).
Standard User craski
(member) Tue 25-Oct-16 07:40:43
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jongreen84] [link to this post]
 
PM sent.
I'm still seeing single threads busting up and down all over the place.

Zen Unlimited Fibre Office BQM
ISP Representative jongreen84
(isp) Tue 25-Oct-16 10:56:35
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craski] [link to this post]
 
Hi Craski,

Thanks, I've replied to your PM. It looks like this isn't linked to the wider issue that Spudgun and Kste's lines are, so it'll need to be progressed with our Tech Support teams.

Thanks,

Jon
The above post has been made by an ISP REPRESENTATIVE (although not necessarily the ISP being discussed in the post).
Standard User Spudgun
(regular) Tue 25-Oct-16 19:37:54
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jongreen84] [link to this post]
 
I'm delighted to say that the fix that Zen have put in place over night has fixed this issue for me.

Today's speedtest looks completely different from the one in the opening post of this thread

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Thank you to Jon and the rest of the technical services team for fixing this smile

Edited by Spudgun (Tue 25-Oct-16 20:29:29)

ISP Representative jongreen84
(isp) Tue 25-Oct-16 19:57:56
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Spudgun] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Spudgun:
I'm delighted to say that the fix that Zen have put in place over night has fixed this issue for me.

Today's speedtest looks completely different from the one in the opening post of this thread

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest.html?utm_sou...

Thank you to Jon and the rest of the technical services team for fixing this smile


Excellent news, thanks for taking the time to update the thread! It looks like your speedtest link needs fixing though, and I do want to see the results!

We're working our way through the list of affected exchanges to check if we can apply the same fix. As we've discovered with Craski's line though, even though symptoms appear similar, we can't always apply the same fix, and so far have identified at least three separate causes of similar symptoms.

Happy for anyone to PM me their username if they want me to take a look.
The above post has been made by an ISP REPRESENTATIVE (although not necessarily the ISP being discussed in the post).
Standard User Spudgun
(regular) Tue 25-Oct-16 20:29:06
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jongreen84] [link to this post]
 
Sorry about the link, this one should now work

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

The difference to my connection is night and day, thank you so much for fixing this, I am mightily impressed!
Standard User craski
(member) Wed 26-Oct-16 08:27:56
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Spudgun] [link to this post]
 
Nice. Good result.

Zen Unlimited Fibre Office BQM
Standard User Deft
(experienced) Mon 31-Oct-16 21:53:50
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jongreen84] [link to this post]
 
I still see this problem on my connection. I e-mailed support in June about it I think. I can PM my username.
Standard User Deft
(experienced) Wed 02-Nov-16 18:53:42
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Deft] [link to this post]
 
Mine now appears fixed, thanks to Jon @ Zen for looking into it for me.
ISP Representative jongreen84
(isp) Wed 02-Nov-16 19:32:05
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Deft] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Deft:
Mine now appears fixed, thanks to Jon @ Zen for looking into it for me.


That's excellent news. No problem at all, glad I could help.

Thanks to everyone who's provided their details so far. Please keep them coming!
The above post has been made by an ISP REPRESENTATIVE (although not necessarily the ISP being discussed in the post).
Standard User Samadeus
(learned) Fri 04-Nov-16 10:58:07
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jongreen84] [link to this post]
 
Just wondering if you could have a look at my line, I've been having problems since May and I'm starting to lose the will to live, it's been 6 months, I've moved from Zen backhaul to BT backhaul and I'm now seeing the same issues.

zen271052

When I've got the music, I've got a place to go.

BTopenworld > ZeN > Virgin > BTBroadband > ZeN 80/20
Standard User rippedcotton
(experienced) Mon 14-Nov-16 12:35:39
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jongreen84] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jongreen84:
In reply to a post by Deft:
Mine now appears fixed, thanks to Jon @ Zen for looking into it for me.


That's excellent news. No problem at all, glad I could help.

Thanks to everyone who's provided their details so far. Please keep them coming!


I'm seeing about 20Mbps on single thread speed test, but about 70Mbps on 6 threads. Is this the same issue?

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

If it is then I assume I can raise a fault report via the customer portal and then PM you my details here?

Cheers!

--

Brian

Zen Fibre 2 - 80/20 sync

Edited by rippedcotton (Mon 14-Nov-16 12:38:28)

ISP Representative jongreen84
(isp) Mon 14-Nov-16 13:01:13
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: rippedcotton] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by rippedcotton:
I'm seeing about 20Mbps on single thread speed test, but about 70Mbps on 6 threads. Is this the same issue?

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

If it is then I assume I can raise a fault report via the customer portal and then PM you my details here?

Cheers!


Just PM me your username please and I'll look into your account and advise further.

Jon
The above post has been made by an ISP REPRESENTATIVE (although not necessarily the ISP being discussed in the post).
Standard User rippedcotton
(experienced) Tue 15-Nov-16 10:31:50
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jongreen84] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jongreen84:
Just PM me your username please and I'll look into your account and advise further.

Jon


Done...

--

Brian

Zen Fibre 2 - 80/20 sync
Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Fri 18-Nov-16 18:26:55
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: rippedcotton] [link to this post]
 
Worse tonight BTW was better

And Zen's own tester Speedtest.zen result


html 5 tester

Edited by tommy45 (Fri 18-Nov-16 18:37:08)

Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Fri 25-Nov-16 13:21:58
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: tommy45] [link to this post]
 
last night

today

Edited by tommy45 (Fri 25-Nov-16 13:23:09)

Standard User 3MbBik
(learned) Fri 25-Nov-16 13:31:55
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jongreen84] [link to this post]
 
During the three months when my 80-20 VDSL was regularly reduced during the working day and evening to this typical example;

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Whilst when the peak was over it always provided full speed overnight;

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Zen refused my request to leave without paying an exit fee.

Eventually Zen upgraded their London Hub and my single thread degradation during busy periods disappeared.

Alas I notice that this type of peak time performance degradation is slowly returning;

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

But, I am now relieved to say that my initial 12 month VDSL contract period will end tomorrow.

Godfrey.
Standard User Cruncher
(member) Fri 25-Nov-16 16:36:11
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: 3MbBik] [link to this post]
 
Add another to the list. Wish I'd never moved to Zen now given the other issues I've been having, and its only bee two days....

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...


Edit: waiting to speak to someone on the phone, in a queue.

Asus RT-N66U with Merlin FW - Unlimited Zen Fibre 2 - 80/20 Max Sync, 150m from the cab - My BQM

Edited by Cruncher (Fri 25-Nov-16 16:39:48)

Standard User Cruncher
(member) Mon 28-Nov-16 20:25:40
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Cruncher] [link to this post]
 
Fixed.

So they put me on a new VLAN (I think thats what they said they were doing, I was at work and doing several things at once when they called) Apparently the one I was on was congested.


The result:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Asus RT-N66U with Merlin FW - Unlimited Zen Fibre 2 - 80/20 Max Sync, 150m from the cab - My BQM
Standard User craski
(member) Tue 29-Nov-16 10:26:01
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Cruncher] [link to this post]
 
Looks like a definite improvement. I hope the fix works long term for you.

I've been shuffled onto different SVLANs several times in an effort to avoid congestion and the problems for me always return. I'm on BT Wholesale back-haul and my particular problem has been blamed on BT Wholesale continually overloading their SVLANs. Its been a never ending battle to maintain a decent connection, a huge waste of time and effort.

Zen Unlimited Fibre Office BQM
Standard User Cruncher
(member) Tue 29-Nov-16 10:35:16
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craski] [link to this post]
 
Sounds bad dude. Hopfully it doesn't degrade again, if it does I'll be back on to them.

Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Wed 30-Nov-16 03:54:09
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Cruncher] [link to this post]
 
Mine is still not fixed yet, this was a early morning test when things are quiter , looks like it's congestion because it's nowhere near during the day time or evenings even after 12am , this result isnt quite perfect on the single thread , but nearly maxing
Speed test result
Daytime
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14805...
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14805...

Edited by tommy45 (Wed 30-Nov-16 14:32:33)

Standard User rippedcotton
(experienced) Wed 30-Nov-16 10:50:39
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Cruncher] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Cruncher:
Fixed.

So they put me on a new VLAN (I think thats what they said they were doing, I was at work and doing several things at once when they called) Apparently the one I was on was congested.


The result:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...


That looks somewhat better than mine, I have about 50Mbps single thread vs 73Mbps for 6 threads. At one point the single thread number was 20Mbps so it's been improved.

I don't know how much Zen can do, my line is on GEA whereas it was originally on BT WBC backhaul.

--

Brian

Zen Fibre 2 - 78/20 sync
Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Wed 30-Nov-16 19:27:23
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: tommy45] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by tommy45:
Mine is still not fixed yet, this was a early morning test when things are quiter , looks like it's congestion because it's nowhere near during the day time or evenings even after 12am , this result isnt quite perfect on the single thread , but nearly maxing
Speed test result
Daytime
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14805...
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14805...


Evening http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14805...
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14805...


To me this is congestion or a contention issue, perhaps if they didn't route so much via their London data centre and used their Manchester one instead this wouldn't be happening? What is even more disappointingly is that unlike most if not all isp's Zen are unique in that they have peering and other data transit connectivity in or near Manchester but choose not to use it and overload other parts of their network doing this doesn't make any sense to me

Edited by tommy45 (Wed 30-Nov-16 19:58:32)

Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Thu 01-Dec-16 17:36:20
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: tommy45] [link to this post]
 
Still not fixed Early eve test
Still waiting since Wednesday for that callback after one of zen's tech support staff called saying that some changes had been made and asked if there was any improvement, and requested a speed test on zen's speed tester ,which also showed the issue was still present
Out of the speed tests i have ran, a few show that the single thread throughput actually starts off at the max but then backs off, Then there are some ,where it won't go above 35-40mbps
So, my patience with this is starting to wear thin 2weeks so far with degraded performance , all because someone decided to migrate my circuit to GEA (which in itself isn't the issue) but then also route all my traffic via a congested or defective part of the network when an alternative existed and still does route via manchester instead none of this ,revert my circuit back onto WBMC ,

And as i also have a potential HR fault ,i don't want this preventing zen from being able to investigate this further by running the C I D T ect due to an order to migrate blah blah blah, Enough of the bs

Edited by tommy45 (Thu 01-Dec-16 22:11:51)

Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Fri 02-Dec-16 09:37:34
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: tommy45] [link to this post]
 
Well the circuit was migrated back to WBMC just after midnight , back on a lower sync and fast path after another DLM reset, but until i rang Zen i had no internet router couldn't auth, was down to something their end, And now i have this which i never had before they migrated the circuit over to GEA what have they done,? 2 weeks of a degraded service and some 8hrs with no service woeful at best WBMC test
I am now hoping that it will be sorted later today and no later like next week

Edited by tommy45 (Fri 02-Dec-16 09:42:08)

Standard User NICK_ADSL_UK
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 03-Dec-16 18:20:40
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Spudgun] [link to this post]
 
I have just spoke to zen and it appears to be a ongoing problem with no sign of a solution

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Standard User bet_here
(member) Sun 04-Dec-16 00:36:36
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: NICK_ADSL_UK] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by NICK_ADSL_UK:
I have just spoke to zen and it appears to be a ongoing problem with no sign of a solution


The single-thread issue started for me over a year ago now - I bailed out to AAISP when they told me the same thing back in August.
Standard User NICK_ADSL_UK
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 04-Dec-16 12:03:07
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: bet_here] [link to this post]
 
i'm sure they'll work it out. ?

Wilders Security Admin
Microsoft MVP - Windows Insider


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Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Mon 05-Dec-16 16:06:48
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: NICK_ADSL_UK] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by NICK_ADSL_UK:
i'm sure they'll work it out. ?
woefull

Again poor

Single thread thinks its adsl2+

Edited by tommy45 (Mon 05-Dec-16 18:40:24)

Standard User NICK_ADSL_UK
(fountain of knowledge) Wed 07-Dec-16 18:50:30
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: tommy45] [link to this post]
 
just a update in that my Poor single thread performance problem has now been fixed

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Wilders Security Admin
Microsoft MVP - Windows Insider


For the latest in virus software signatures
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Edited by NICK_ADSL_UK (Wed 07-Dec-16 18:53:00)

Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Wed 07-Dec-16 21:08:33
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: NICK_ADSL_UK] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by NICK_ADSL_UK:
just a update in that my Poor single thread performance problem has now been fixed

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...
I thought mine had until today worked ok last night and until a BT OR engineer unplugged the modem to access the test jack to run tests, He found a fault on the E side, reset DLM and the issue has returned 7/12/16
Standard User Scottish_Pete
(member) Wed 07-Dec-16 22:45:20
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: NICK_ADSL_UK] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by NICK_ADSL_UK:
just a update in that my Poor single thread performance problem has now been fixed

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Zen must have put me on your old bit of kit

Scottish_Pete

Zen Unlimited Fibre 2 connected to Local Exchange
TBB SPEEDTEST
MY BQM
Standard User NICK_ADSL_UK
(fountain of knowledge) Wed 07-Dec-16 23:32:57
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Scottish_Pete] [link to this post]
 
your best bet Pete is to pm (ISP) jongreen84 and let him and the team take a look

Good luck smile

Wilders Security Admin
Microsoft MVP - Windows Insider


For the latest in virus software signatures
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Wilders security

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Edited by NICK_ADSL_UK (Wed 07-Dec-16 23:33:57)

Standard User apone
(newbie) Tue 20-Dec-16 18:44:48
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jongreen84] [link to this post]
 
Anyone know what the fix is for some of us who have the same problem with other ISPs?
Standard User baby_frogmella
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 20-Dec-16 18:59:36
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: apone] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by apone:
Anyone know what the fix is for some of us who have the same problem with other ISPs?


Move to a different ISP if your current ISP is unwilling to fix/acknowledge the issue.

°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°
TalkTalk Business 80/20
Netgear R9000 X10 running OpenWRT
My Broadband Quality Monitor
°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°
Standard User craski
(member) Tue 20-Dec-16 19:54:38
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
... or unable to fix it.

Zen acknowledge the issue on my line but seem unable to fix it. My ~70Mb line is down into single digits at times for me again.

Zen Unlimited Fibre Office BQM
Standard User baby_frogmella
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 20-Dec-16 20:02:34
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craski] [link to this post]
 
In that case your only option is to move, plenty of ISPs out there (many cheaper than Zen) where the same issue doesn't exist.

°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°
TalkTalk Business 80/20
Netgear R9000 X10 running OpenWRT
My Broadband Quality Monitor
°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°
Standard User 23Prince
(experienced) Tue 20-Dec-16 22:46:27
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
meanwhile on TTB - business as usual and all is well wink

Sorry - had to promote them, I think they are the best i've been with so far.
Standard User Mac99
(newbie) Wed 21-Dec-16 05:49:42
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: apone] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by apone:
Anyone know what the fix is for some of us who have the same problem with other ISPs?


What ISP are you with?

Regards
Mac
Standard User craski
(member) Wed 21-Dec-16 07:13:42
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: 23Prince] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by 23Prince:
meanwhile on TTB - business as usual and all is well wink


Top of my list wink

Zen Unlimited Fibre Office BQM
Standard User 23Prince
(experienced) Wed 21-Dec-16 12:02:34
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craski] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by craski:
In reply to a post by 23Prince:
meanwhile on TTB - business as usual and all is well wink


Top of my list wink


Using them right now - good choice smile
Standard User 23Prince
(experienced) Wed 21-Dec-16 21:12:35
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craski] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by craski:
In reply to a post by 23Prince:
meanwhile on TTB - business as usual and all is well wink


Top of my list wink


You can tell when I use my connection.. lol

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/57dce2a8406...
Standard User Scottish_Pete
(member) Tue 27-Dec-16 13:05:09
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Scottish_Pete] [link to this post]
 
Are there still some people suffering from the poor single thread speeds with Zen or am I just suffering from congestion?

Scottish_Pete

Zen Unlimited Fibre 2 connected to Local Exchange
TBB SPEEDTEST
MY BQM
Standard User Deft
(experienced) Wed 28-Dec-16 12:19:38
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Scottish_Pete] [link to this post]
 
I've done a few speedtests since mine was fixed 2 months ago, and I've never seen any single thread issues since then.
Standard User Scottish_Pete
(member) Wed 28-Dec-16 16:27:47
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Deft] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Deft:
I've done a few speedtests since mine was fixed 2 months ago, and I've never seen any single thread issues since then.

Thanks for the reply.

How long did you have problems for before Zen fixed it?

Got a wee bit extra speed today, a whole 1.5Mbps.

Will give it till my next billing date and if not any better will start looking for another ISP.

Scottish_Pete

Zen Unlimited Fibre 2 connected to Local Exchange
TBB SPEEDTEST
MY BQM
Standard User Deft
(experienced) Fri 30-Dec-16 10:43:01
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Scottish_Pete] [link to this post]
 
Well it was one of these threads here that alerted me to the issue. You could argue that perhaps I wouldn't have known otherwise, as mostly nowadays providing Netflix and Amazon stream video ok I don't get too twitchy on speed requirements (I sync at around 40/10 FTTC).
I logged a support ticket in June which acknowledged the issue and asked me to try doing direct tests off the Openreach modem too. My setup makes this a bit awkward and it wasn't causing me enough issues to pursue the matter vigorously. I did keep adding the odd speedtest on Zen's version of the Thinkbroadband tester just so they had some more data.
Then I saw this post and it seemed like Zen had found some kind of fix / workaround - PM'ed my Zen username to jongreen further up and it was fixed. No problems since.
Standard User bsdnazz
(learned) Fri 20-Jan-17 09:16:57
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Deft] [link to this post]
 
I've just replaced my Billion 7800N ADSL router (using the HG612 modem and WAN interface on the Billion) with a Ubiquity ER-X router and re-run the speed test.

It's had a marked change on my single thread download which now maxes out at virtually the same speed as the x6 test. I wonder if there's a limit (unintentional I would assume) within the Billion and how much it can download per thread.

Test Results

Second Test

Edited by bsdnazz (Fri 20-Jan-17 11:53:31)

Standard User Scottish_Pete
(member) Wed 08-Mar-17 23:20:20
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Scottish_Pete] [link to this post]
 
After a couple of months of normal service the slow single speed has returned for me.

Anyone else having the same problem?

Earlier Tonight

Just Now

Not only that but I have lost about another 8Mbps of speed and am now synced around the 58Mbps. So in two years I have lost about 20Mbps in speed from the days of 79.9Mbps.

Scottish_Pete

Zen Unlimited Fibre 2 connected to Local Exchange
TBB SPEEDTEST
MY BQM
Standard User Adrian
(experienced) Fri 10-Mar-17 10:30:21
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Scottish_Pete] [link to this post]
 
I'm with IDNet and recently I have been experiencing the same problem. IDNet say they can't see any problem at their end but clearly something is amiss. Are you on Zen or BT backhaul?

Adrian
Standard User Scottish_Pete
(member) Sat 11-Mar-17 01:23:31
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Adrian] [link to this post]
 
Well I was on BT Backhaul.

But, looking in my Portal on Zen I have just seen I have had a "Zen Fibre Migration GEA- Fulfilled on the 08/03/2017", which I take it to mean I am on their backhaul some of the way now, with the closes POP being Stirling, I think.

Coincidently, this is about the same time as my connection started playing up, download speed dropped, slow single thread speed , downstream Interleaving being turned off and G.INP being turned off, but apart from that everything else is the OK.

Scottish_Pete

Zen Unlimited Fibre 2 connected to Local Exchange
TBB SPEEDTEST
MY BQM
Standard User Adrian
(experienced) Sat 11-Mar-17 12:23:14
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Scottish_Pete] [link to this post]
 
Interesting.

I assume I am on BT backhaul, though I believe IDNet do make some use of Zen. IDNet support only ever refer to "our supplier" so I have no way of finding out if Zen is involved.

Adrian
Standard User jaydub
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 11-Mar-17 13:27:50
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Adrian] [link to this post]
 
I would think if IDNet are buying in services from Zen, then it would be their LLU services.

It's difficult to see what IDNet would think there was any value add in terms of buying in BTW services from Zen rather than buying them directly.

Just my 1p's worth.
Standard User David_W
(knowledge is power) Sun 12-Mar-17 11:32:07
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Scottish_Pete] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Scottish_Pete:
But, looking in my Portal on Zen I have just seen I have had a "Zen Fibre Migration GEA- Fulfilled on the 08/03/2017", which I take it to mean I am on their backhaul some of the way now, with the closes POP being Stirling, I think.
You've moved to Zen's network, which means there is no BT Wholesale in use any more for your connection - it's Zen backhaul all the way from the Openreach handover point to Zen's core. The fibres in your area probably go back to a larger exchange where Zen has presence, which could be many miles away. jongreen from Zen tell me that the fibres from my area go back to an exchange nearly fifteen miles away where Zen has presence.

You'll now be on a different VLAN over the Openreach infrastructure. This change of VLAN might have caused a DLM reset, hence your loss of G.INP and all the consequential issues. If you leave things alone, hopefully G.INP will be put back on your downstream and everything else goes back to what it was.

If you have single thread performance issues once things have settled, send a private message to jongreen so that he can investigate if it's the known backhaul configuration issue.



ZeN Unlimited Fibre 2 with native IPv6
thinkbroadband speed test : speedtest.net : thinkbroadband quality monitor IPv4 IPv6
Standard User Scottish_Pete
(member) Sun 12-Mar-17 23:37:12
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: David_W] [link to this post]
 
Well the nearest exchange with a Zen presents that I have found is Stirling which is about 40 miles away or Waverley Exchange in Edinburgh at 50 miles. Unless they now have POP in the Perth Exchange, which is 8 miles by road, or Dundee, 24 miles away as the crow flies, that the details have not been updated.

Will give it till the end of the month and see if it improves. If not and they can't put it back the way it was, I may give Talk Talk Business a try as it says they have presence in my local exchange.

Scottish_Pete

Zen Unlimited Fibre 2 connected to Local Exchange
TBB SPEEDTEST
MY BQM
Standard User Banger
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 27-Mar-17 21:19:04
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Scottish_Pete] [link to this post]
 
Did anyone solve this. My connection was fine on ADSL2+ with TTB now moved onto VDSL2 and my single thread downloads are half of what multi thread downloads are?

See speedtest in signature.

Tim
www.uno.net.uk & freenetname
Asus DSL-N55U and TP-Link WD9970 on 80 Meg LLU Fibre
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14906...
Standard User David_W
(knowledge is power) Tue 28-Mar-17 14:00:37
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Banger] [link to this post]
 
The issue discussed in this thread is specific to Zen's backhaul network, so only affects Zen and those companies using wholesale backhaul from Zen (IDnet, I believe).



ZeN Unlimited Fibre 2 with native IPv6
thinkbroadband speed test : speedtest.net : thinkbroadband quality monitor IPv4 IPv6
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Tue 28-Mar-17 23:23:44
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: David_W] [link to this post]
 
Some other providers have had issues, and suggests there may be some common bit of kit/firmware upgrade/config in core networks thats doing this, but given the majority of speed testers mask the issue people when told to test connection, get good figures

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Banger
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Mar-17 16:29:10
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
That is what I was thinking Andrew there must be something common to this. I know different ISPs but similar Openreach equipment.

My downstream single thread is half of sync although Uno are detecting more than acceptable errors on the line.

Tim
www.uno.net.uk & freenetname
Asus DSL-N55U and TP-Link WD9970 on 80 Meg LLU Fibre
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14906...
Standard User David_W
(knowledge is power) Wed 29-Mar-17 18:18:29
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
Some other providers have had issues, and suggests there may be some common bit of kit/firmware upgrade/config in core networks thats doing this, but given the majority of speed testers mask the issue people when told to test connection, get good figures
Very true. Zen have understandably been very coy about what the issue was, as well as the topology of their network and the link providers. Of course, this sort of thing is commercially sensitive, so it is understandable that they do not want to comment. It believe that most if not all of the backhaul links in their network are provided by Vodafone (Cable and Wireless), so it's possible that the issue is common to other providers using Vodafone circuits or identical kit / equipment to Zen.

As you say, the way that most speed testers only give multi-threaded throughput figures masks the issue. Thank you for all you and the rest of the thinkbroadband team do in providing your speed test; it is a trusted and invaluable aid to debugging.



ZeN Unlimited Fibre 2 with native IPv6
thinkbroadband speed test : speedtest.net : thinkbroadband quality monitor IPv4 IPv6
Standard User Adrian
(experienced) Wed 29-Mar-17 19:51:26
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Banger] [link to this post]
 
I am with IDNet and for quite a while I have had serious single thread speed issues. As things stand IDNet are planning to move me to "an alternate part of the back haul network from the exchange into our network", though quite what that means in practical terms I have no idea.

I know IDNet do sometimes make use Zen backhaul but that isn't available in my exchange and I have so far been unsuccessful in getting an answer to the question of who's backhaul I am on. In fact the question just gets ignored! TalkTalk backhaul is available but I don't know whether IDNet use them.

Anyway, the change is booked for 11th April so it will be interesting to see what happens.

Adrian
Standard User craski
(member) Wed 29-Mar-17 19:59:42
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Adrian] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Adrian:
Anyway, the change is booked for 11th April so it will be interesting to see what happens.

Please do post back to let us know. I too have had this issue with Zen for past 12 months and gave up trying to get them to fix and have all but accepted nothing single threaded gets full benefit of the connection. For various reasons I'm going to have a second line installed soon and I'm going to try Talk Talk Business on that and directly compare against Zen.

Zen Unlimited Fibre Office BQM
Standard User Banger
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Mar-17 20:52:58
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craski] [link to this post]
 
I am on TTB with single thread half of sync. Let us know how you get on with a second line.

Tim
www.uno.net.uk & freenetname
Asus DSL-N55U and TP-Link WD9970 on 80 Meg LLU Fibre
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14906...
Standard User Adrian
(experienced) Wed 29-Mar-17 22:06:03
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craski] [link to this post]
 
Andrews & Arnold had some issues on some TalkTalk lines where the evening single thread speed plummeted, but being A&A they persisted with it in conjunction with TT and finally found the problem.

This is how a first class ISP handles customer problems and if mine with IDNet isn't resolved to my satisfaction I may consider moving back to A&A despite the higher cost. However, so far I am happy with how IDNET has dealt with the problem, but the proof is in the pudding.

AAISP Fault log

Adrian
Standard User Banger
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Mar-17 22:42:25
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Adrian] [link to this post]
 
That fault log is a good read.

Tim
www.uno.net.uk & freenetname
Asus DSL-N55U and TP-Link WD9970 on 80 Meg LLU Fibre
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14906...
Standard User craski
(member) Wed 29-Mar-17 22:43:19
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Adrian] [link to this post]
 
Impressive stuff. It took a month but they got to the bottom of it. It is frustrating that an ISP like Zen with a good reputation can't match this level of support. In my case by comparison Zen were merely scratching around the surface of the issue. They were speaking with BT complex faults team but I didn't see anything like this level of technical understanding or perseverance to find a solution, there was more interest in making me think I was being fussy and this issue was only something visible in the TBB Speedtest and not something that affected my day to day use.

Good to see Talk Talk working with AAISP to resolve. I wonder if BT would have done the same?

Zen Unlimited Fibre Office BQM
Standard User Mac99
(learned) Thu 30-Mar-17 08:59:45
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craski] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by craski:
Impressive stuff. It took a month but they got to the bottom of it. It is frustrating that an ISP like Zen with a good reputation can't match this level of support. In my case by comparison Zen were merely scratching around the surface of the issue. They were speaking with BT complex faults team but I didn't see anything like this level of technical understanding or perseverance to find a solution, there was more interest in making me think I was being fussy and this issue was only something visible in the TBB Speedtest and not something that affected my day to day use.

Good to see Talk Talk working with AAISP to resolve. I wonder if BT would have done the same?


As has been commented elsewhere the Zen problem seems go back quite a bit. From memory the earliest post, I have seen (possibly Zen forums) was around November 2015. The fact that people seem to be still having the single thread issues with Zen does not look good for Zen.

Admittedly there could be more than one cause, but I agree that what AA did and tends to do is nothing short of magnificent. Their policy of being open and keeping customers fully informed is nothing short of the very best of customer service. It is regrettable that other ISP's do not follow suit and show the same openess rather than to try and dismiss the issue.

Mac
Standard User NeoLojik
(learned) Tue 18-Apr-17 23:39:59
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Spudgun] [link to this post]
 
Is this still an ongoing issue? Recently I've been seeing something very similar on my line:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14925...

Also, going back several months the BQM shows low level packet loss almost 24/7:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/f8f113bd52a...

Any ideas or do I try my luck with Zen CS?
Standard User David_W
(knowledge is power) Wed 19-Apr-17 01:13:18
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: NeoLojik] [link to this post]
 
I suggest you follow the instructions given earlier in the thread (click). That is more likely to get the information into the hands of the right people than just contacting Zen CS.



ZeN Unlimited Fibre 2 with native IPv6
thinkbroadband speed test : speedtest.net : thinkbroadband quality monitor IPv4 IPv6
Standard User Adrian
(experienced) Wed 19-Apr-17 09:22:45
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craski] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by craski:
In reply to a post by Adrian:
Anyway, the change is booked for 11th April so it will be interesting to see what happens.

Please do post back to let us know. I too have had this issue with Zen for past 12 months and gave up trying to get them to fix and have all but accepted nothing single threaded gets full benefit of the connection. For various reasons I'm going to have a second line installed soon and I'm going to try Talk Talk Business on that and directly compare against Zen.

As requested I am reporting back on the changes that IDNet made to my connection. I don't know exactly what they did other than that it involved a "reconfiguration" which took place just after midnight on 11th April, so obviously not requiring the services of a BTOR engineer.

The net result is that I no longer see any packet loss and my single thread speed is back where it should be. The only other difference is that my minimum latency has doubled from 10ms to 20ms, but I am not a gamer so that isn't an issue for me.

I call that a pretty good result and my thanks to Brian at IDNet for seeing it through.

Adrian
Standard User NeoLojik
(learned) Wed 19-Apr-17 16:37:28
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: David_W] [link to this post]
 
Many thanks, I've contacted tech support as instructed and will PM Jon when I get a reference.
Standard User Ixel
(member) Wed 30-Aug-17 13:12:21
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: David_W] [link to this post]
 
I've noticed I'm having terrible single threaded download speeds for quite some time. At first I thought it was something where I am such as my router (DrayTek Vigor 2860ac), but even with QoS turned off, hardware acceleration turned off and other such settings it's still pretty terrible compared to the multi threaded speed test. During the day/evening it actually gets worse, in the early hours of the morning it appears to be better. I've been changing routers/modems, filters and wires to no avail. I've also been getting a very low amount of intermittent packet loss according to my TBB ping graph. I'm also on GEA instead of WBMC.

Early this morning:
https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

Just a moment ago:
https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

I imagine I'm getting similar problems with some kind of congestion?

Assuming the previous instructions are still valid I'll try those and hope I can get a solution rather than have to most probably pay to end the contract early and move to another ISP like A&A.
Standard User radar
(learned) Wed 30-Aug-17 13:26:48
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Ixel:
I've noticed I'm having terrible single threaded download speeds for quite some time. At first I thought it was something where I am such as my router (DrayTek Vigor 2860ac), but even with QoS turned off, hardware acceleration turned off and other such settings it's still pretty terrible compared to the multi threaded speed test. During the day/evening it actually gets worse, in the early hours of the morning it appears to be better. I've been changing routers/modems, filters and wires to no avail. I've also been getting a very low amount of intermittent packet loss according to my TBB ping graph. I'm also on GEA instead of WBMC.

Early this morning:
https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

Just a moment ago:
https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

I imagine I'm getting similar problems with some kind of congestion?

Assuming the previous instructions are still valid I'll try those and hope I can get a solution rather than have to most probably pay to end the contract early and move to another ISP like A&A.


I am also having poor speedtest results and packet loss.
I have a fault open with Zen Support, and the latest email from them said that they had an outage booked for last night 29/08/17 which might solve the issue. I am still getting packet loss this morning and poor speedtest results. I am fed up with this situation, and if it is not rectified very soon I will be leaving Zen.

Standard User Ixel
(member) Wed 30-Aug-17 13:33:41
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: radar] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by radar:
I am also having poor speedtest results and packet loss.
I have a fault open with Zen Support, and the latest email from them said that they had an outage booked for last night 29/08/17 which might solve the issue. I am still getting packet loss this morning and poor speedtest results. I am fed up with this situation, and if it is not rectified very soon I will be leaving Zen.


Oh my, not good!

Yeah, I'll open a ticket with Zen Support as well then. What sucks for me is that I recently restarted a new contract (speed regrade) so I could get DLM reset without needing an engineer after discovering what I believe to be my homeplugs causing some internal issues (where an engineer I doubt would've just been booked to just reset DLM only). Lets hope this can be sorted out or moving ISP will be a little expensive.
Standard User radar
(learned) Wed 30-Aug-17 14:01:01
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Ixel:
In reply to a post by radar:
I am also having poor speedtest results and packet loss.
I have a fault open with Zen Support, and the latest email from them said that they had an outage booked for last night 29/08/17 which might solve the issue. I am still getting packet loss this morning and poor speedtest results. I am fed up with this situation, and if it is not rectified very soon I will be leaving Zen.


Oh my, not good!

Yeah, I'll open a ticket with Zen Support as well then. What sucks for me is that I recently restarted a new contract (speed regrade) so I could get DLM reset without needing an engineer after discovering what I believe to be my homeplugs causing some internal issues (where an engineer I doubt would've just been booked to just reset DLM only). Lets hope this can be sorted out or moving ISP will be a little expensive.


I think the quality of Zen Technical support has been downgraded just lately maybe the bean counters are responsible for this. Zen were a top recommended Internet supplier by the Which magazine not too long ago. My impression from email correspondence with them, that this is no longer the case.
I am synced at 79.997 down and used to get 75Mbps on both single and x6 threads, but no longer get anywhere near that at any time of the day or night.

I run various VOIP applications here such as MMDVMHost and internet telephony line from Sipgate, the packet loss is severely affecting this and the packet loss has exceeded 10% at times.This is the suite of software that I run on a Raspberry Pi which enables me to communicate via DMR and P25 Digital Audio.
https://github.com/g4klx
I am running a similar Draytek router as yourself Vigor 2860Vn-Plus.
I did try the Zen supplied router as suggested by Zen technical support back in March when this packet loss first started, but it made no difference to packet loss and I also lost my IPV6 connectivity.

Regards Dave

Standard User Ixel
(member) Wed 30-Aug-17 14:13:44
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: radar] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by radar:
I think the quality of Zen Technical support has been downgraded just lately maybe the bean counters are responsible for this. Zen were a top recommended Internet supplier by the Which magazine not too long ago. My impression from email correspondence with them, that this is no longer the case.
I am synced at 79.997 down and used to get 75Mbps on both single and x6 threads, but no longer get anywhere near that at any time of the day or night.

I run various VOIP applications here such as MMDVMHost and internet telephony line from Sipgate, the packet loss is severely affecting this and the packet loss has exceeded 10% at times.This is the suite of software that I run on a Raspberry Pi which enables me to communicate via DMR and P25 Digital Audio.
https://github.com/g4klx
I am running a similar Draytek router as yourself Vigor 2860Vn-Plus.
I did try the Zen supplied router as suggested by Zen technical support back in March when this packet loss first started, but it made no difference to packet loss and I also lost my IPV6 connectivity.

Regards Dave


I see, well I'll give them a chance and hope. Hopefully it won't come to disputing an early termination charge for a severely degraded service performance. I also use VoIP for some phone calls via A&A's service. If I have to move eventually then I'll probably go with them despite the higher cost.
Standard User bigbadpirate
(member) Wed 30-Aug-17 16:01:30
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
on the 28 may of this year i was syncing at 79996 now synced at 74412. i know its not zens fault but they wont even ask BT if one of their monkeys(who want to get home early so swap out a known good line, just move the problem onto another customer) have been swapping cables again. im getting a throughput of 66 max. the speed bothers me a little. its the packetloss and jitter that really bothers me. im glad i found this thread and in a way its nice to know others are having the same problem, even though it's not nice to hear of others having trouble.

phoned last month sometime and went throught the usual "have you tried this" with them and the packetloss got beter. is still there sometimes untill monday were i could ping a server and actually see the packetloss starting in their network. i couldnt play quake champions without being disconected constantly and the jitter unbeleivable. they are responsible for the routing am i right?

this thread opened my eyes a bit thats for sure. time to give up on this once great company. hasnt been easy in the past but problems 2 years ago wernt resolved like they were 12 years ago thats for sure. im gona dig my heals in again and make them resolve it thats a given. if its bto cabling thats causing the jitter/packetloss and sync speed loss they better get an engineer out. or it's time to get my MP involved again.

give me a private stable connection for gaming. simple request.

i wont go into other things in a public forum but zen need to have word or sack some people from what i hear. hard to prove in a court of law but word soon gets around. as i understand it giving any info is against privacy laws and im not taking about web sites visited.

Edited by bigbadpirate (Wed 30-Aug-17 22:32:35)

Standard User andew
(member) Wed 30-Aug-17 17:29:06
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: radar] [link to this post]
 
It may be worth sending a PM to jongreen84. I'm fairly sure he will be able to sort this for you.

Andrew
Standard User Ixel
(member) Wed 30-Aug-17 18:13:11
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: andew] [link to this post]
 
Agreed.

I had an email from Zen earlier, they're running a continuous ping test for the next day or so on myself and some other Zen customers on my exchange to determine if it's an exchange end issue and as such get an overall picture.

I'm personally also running a program called WinMTR which is constantly pinging google.co.uk (which I think is a reliable host to ping), hoping this information might help tomorrow when Zen update me regarding their continuous ping test and if they aren't certain by then what's causing this problem.
Standard User bigbadpirate
(member) Wed 30-Aug-17 22:41:53
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
continuios ping test then they do nothing. they see a problem and do nothing. because they know its in their own network. or parly to blame.

i did see bto pulling up the fiber manhole covers in the last few days so maybe im wrong. prolly should have got skilled people to lay the fiber in the first place.

maybe they were looking for a [censored] screwdriver they lost 2 years ago. thats a more plausable explaination.

[censored] monkeys. eh.

even the teachers dont know. i saw him in a hole the other day. main man in charge of teaching people in this area.

quality outfit.

Edited by bigbadpirate (Wed 30-Aug-17 23:22:53)

Standard User Ixel
(member) Thu 31-Aug-17 01:41:29
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: bigbadpirate] [link to this post]
 
I see frown.

Well, I'm pretty certain it has to be congestion somewhere. Just did a speed test and the results are better this time of night, I bet you by lunch time it'll be downhill again.

See https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

Edited by Ixel (Thu 31-Aug-17 01:43:05)

Standard User radar
(learned) Thu 31-Aug-17 09:28:22
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Ixel:
In reply to a post by radar:
I am also having poor speedtest results and packet loss.
I have a fault open with Zen Support, and the latest email from them said that they had an outage booked for last night 29/08/17 which might solve the issue. I am still getting packet loss this morning and poor speedtest results. I am fed up with this situation, and if it is not rectified very soon I will be leaving Zen.


Oh my, not good!

Yeah, I'll open a ticket with Zen Support as well then. What sucks for me is that I recently restarted a new contract (speed regrade) so I could get DLM reset without needing an engineer after discovering what I believe to be my homeplugs causing some internal issues (where an engineer I doubt would've just been booked to just reset DLM only). Lets hope this can be sorted out or moving ISP will be a little expensive.


Well I had a new email from Zen Support stating that the scheduled network upgrade did not solve the problem :-

quote

Hello Dave,

The scheduled network upgrade does not appear to have resolved your packet loss, so we have passed your details to our network operations department who will upgrade your connection at the exchange. This usually takes a few days to have a visible effect at your end and we will contact you when we believe your issue to be resolved.

unquote

So I will wait and see if they manage to rectify the packet loss problem and then see if it also fixes the download speed problem.
This is my latest speedtest at 09:20 this morning 31/08/17 and is unacceptable for a line that is synced at 79.997 :-
https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

Regards Dave

Standard User Ixel
(member) Thu 31-Aug-17 09:40:56
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: radar] [link to this post]
 
I see.

I'm waiting for an update to my ticket, though it won't be till later today I think.

Here's a speed test I did last night in the early hours of the morning: https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

Here's a speed test I did just a minute ago: https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

It has to be congestion. My ping graph doesn't look impressive either - http://i.imgur.com/TBrMlPW.png
Standard User Ixel
(member) Thu 31-Aug-17 19:38:37
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Got a reply this afternoon and thankfully I'm not the only one at the exchange being affected by packet loss (based on early indications). They're looking into a fix for this. Fingers crossed.
Standard User Ixel
(member) Sat 02-Sep-17 02:24:16
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: bigbadpirate] [link to this post]
 
Well, I just had an email again. They noticed that my line has re-synced a lot (some or maybe all of which was from me trying to identify the cause of the packet loss and slow single threaded download speed) and are possibly believing that my line is the main cause of this issue now. They want me to retry changing things like the cables, router, filters or such, and to confirm the dates and times I make these changes. They also want permission to perform intrusive line tests, I'm not 100% certain what that means though?

Finally they tell me if I'm unable to still stabilise the connection that an engineer should be sent out to investigate but charges may apply. I honestly don't know what to do at this point, maybe there is a fault on my line? I asked for some input on the Hlog and QLN I recently posted on another forum and here but I was told the Hlog seemed fine and the QLN graph indicates crosstalk. However, I realise these graphs might not always highlight a potential fault. I do know that I'm suffering a large amount of error seconds (almost one error second for every second of uptime last time I tried) if the HG612 is running with default settings (e.g. not capped), so maybe I should get this looked into and hope the engineer doesn't charge me for potentially 'no fault found' if an engineer is eventually sent out?

Any input welcome before I decide how to proceed. Thanks.

EDIT: Proceeded with this, nevermind.

Edited by Ixel (Sat 02-Sep-17 10:27:15)

Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Sat 02-Sep-17 11:27:04
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
I dont usually defend isps, but I am not convinced in your case.

When congestion is the cause I would expect a dusk hours test to be pretty much perfect, even a very loaded isp can avoid saturation at those hours as the network load is a fraction of peak time demand.

A network config issue can still look worse at peak because even without congestion there can be delays somewhere along the packet route at busier times due to cpu load etc. on the appropriate equipment which can yield the results you are presenting.

You really need to rule out a limited RWIN having a factor here, and then assess you got no MTU/MSS problems as well.

The ping graph looks a bit more damning but packet loss can be caused by interference as much as congestion on dsl. You seem to have no extra jitter/latency on that time range just the packet loss.

I would consider it a priority in your current diagnosis to get perfect results off peak, once you achieve that you are in a better standing to diagnose whats going on at peak.

Edited by Chrysalis (Sat 02-Sep-17 12:26:57)

Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Sat 02-Sep-17 11:51:52
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
You will only get charged if the engineer finds the issue is down to internal wiring in your home.

I was talking to BT Home and also Business sections the other day enquiring about the price differences between the two lots of packages.
And while chatting about all the issues that use to have when I was on ADSLx with the line going dead when it rained etc.

Every time an engineer was sent out I was always worried about being charged that ~£129 if they couldn't find an issue due to it being an intermittent fault, I was told a charge will only occur when the fault is found to be internal, i.e. wiring in the home.

So I was never charged.

So I would check your wiring, extensions if any etc.

Paul

BTBroadband - Infinity 4 310Mbps (down), 31Mbps (up) FVA
TBB Speedtest | Linksys WRT 3200 ACM (BQM)
Standard User Ixel
(member) Sat 02-Sep-17 13:49:11
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Chrysalis] [link to this post]
 
Well, my packet loss is far less at off peak than it is at peak time. However, what I got from the call is that this absurd amount of error seconds I'm getting don't matter once DLM masks the problem (interleaving is applied).

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xdslcmd info --stats
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY statusStatus: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:    Upstream rate = 13890 Kbps, Downstream rate = 54968 KbpsBearer: 0, Upstream rate = 13892 Kbps, Downstream rate = 55790 Kbps
 Link Power State:       L0
Mode:                   VDSL2 Annex BVDSL2 Profile:          Profile 17a
TPS-TC:                 PTM Mode(0x0)Trellis:                U:ON /D:ON
Line Status:            No DefectTraining Status:        Showtime
                Down            UpSNR (dB):        6.1             6.0
Attn(dB):        19.9            0.0Pwr(dBm):        6.9             6.8
                        VDSL2 framing                        Bearer 0
MSGc:           18              18B:              239             238
M:              1               1T:              64              21
R:              0               16S:              0.1369          0.5475
L:              14024           3726D:              1               1
I:              240             255N:              240             255
                        Counters                        Bearer 0
OHF:            5890625         1502528OHFErr:         29797           2
RS:             0               135598RSCorr:         0               12
RSUnCorr:       0               0 
                        Bearer 0HEC:            122794          0
OCD:            4242            0LCD:            4242            0
Total Cells:    1388898485              0Data Cells:     20594630                0
Drop Cells:     0Bit Errors:     0               0
 ES:             7279            2
SES:            0               0UAS:            268             268
AS:             12955 
                        Bearer 0INP:            0.00            0.00
INPRein:        0.00            0.00delay:          0               0
PER:            2.19            8.65OR:             87.30           22.17
AgR:            55877.72        13914.49 
Bitswap:        7118/7123               0/0 
Total time = 3 hours 40 min 23 secFEC:            0               12
CRC:            29797           2ES:             7279            2
SES:            0               0UAS:            268             268
LOS:            0               0LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0Latest 15 minutes time = 10 min 23 sec
FEC:            0               0CRC:            1326            0
ES:             350             0SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0LOM:            0               0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 secFEC:            0               0
CRC:            2047            0ES:             492             0
SES:            0               0UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0Latest 1 day time = 3 hours 40 min 23 sec
FEC:            0               12CRC:            29797           2
ES:             7279            2SES:            0               0
UAS:            268             268LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0LOM:            0               0
Previous 1 day time = 0 secFEC:            0               0
CRC:            0               0ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0Since Link time = 3 hours 35 min 53 sec
FEC:            0               12CRC:            29797           2
ES:             7279            2SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0LOM:            0               0


I'm fairly certain that these error seconds are coming from the mid to upper end of the D3 band, as when I've stopped using that section of D3 on the HG612 (by capping the speed) or disabling D3 on the ASUS I don't get this constant and absurd amount of error seconds anymore. I can't believe heavy crosstalk is simply the cause of this as surely bitswapping should to some degree workaround it?

However, going back to the packet loss I've also changed routers to knock out the possibility that it's a router issue. I've monitored the DrayTek stats in regards to CPU usage and it's fine. I've not had this problem until recently and I've done nothing here that should cause an increase in packet loss mostly at peak time. Zen did state originally that the continuous ping tests they did on my connection and some other Zen connections at my exchange were producing similar amounts of packet loss at similar times, based on early indications, so while indeed there might be an issue with my line around the D3 band I don't feel it's related to why I'm getting packet loss along with some other Zen customers at my exchange (based on their results).

I will do some other checks to determine if I have a bad MTU but I honestly doubt it. The DrayTek is being pinged after all, and that has a setting of 1492 on the PPPoE connection which should by all means be correct. The DSL connection isn't stressed out, just general surfing, VoIP, the odd download such as a driver, YouTube or iPlayer on one or two devices generally. No torrents or related that could really stress the router or the connection itself.

I'll see how the next week or two goes in regards to my current problem with the D3 band, if that remains unresolved and just accepted by DLM masking with interleaving then I might pay the early termination charge and move over to A&A. I hear they have a good history at getting problems resolved, but hopefully it won't come to that. Just right now I'm not too convinced, especially as I see some others are having packet loss issues with Zen.

The packet loss was still occurring mostly during peak time when I didn't have the amount of errors I have now (as I've uncapped the modem). It's perhaps a little worse now but that's understandable given the stats above!

In reply to a post by PaulKirby:
You will only get charged if the engineer finds the issue is down to internal wiring in your home.

I was talking to BT Home and also Business sections the other day enquiring about the price differences between the two lots of packages.
And while chatting about all the issues that use to have when I was on ADSLx with the line going dead when it rained etc.

Every time an engineer was sent out I was always worried about being charged that ~£129 if they couldn't find an issue due to it being an intermittent fault, I was told a charge will only occur when the fault is found to be internal, i.e. wiring in the home.

So I was never charged.

So I would check your wiring, extensions if any etc.

Paul


Thanks Paul. Zen told me something different, that they could charge if there's no fault found. However I'll go along with what you said rather than what I was told by Zen smile. Regarding internal wiring, there's no extension wiring or such, just the master socket with a MK3 SSFP.

Edited by Ixel (Sat 02-Sep-17 13:53:00)

Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Sat 02-Sep-17 14:12:48
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
those ES are way too high to ignore.

I think given the high ES presented, and the fact you cannot get off peak to perform well, you need to move away from the congestion claims at least for now.

Sort out your ES and sort out your off peak problems.

Can you get yourself on MDWS so we can see what time of day these ES are occuring?

Also if you have found disabling D3 fixes the ES, why have you enabled it again.

Your options for the ES seem to be.

1 - Fix yourself via capping sync rate, disabling problematic tones.
2 - Allowing DLM to mask the issue via FEC+interleaving at cost of latency and sync speed.
3 - Getting openreach to fix the underlying problem, probably difficult with zen.

This should be your first priority.

When ES is under control, retest off peak, if it remains poor assess your LAN setup, I dont think zen are to blame if you getting that performance in the morning.

RWIN - depends on OS.

Windows XP - ancient OS shouldnt be used now days, but if you are you deffo need to pump RWIN manually, default is designed for dialup.
Windows vista+, make sure you dont disable auto tcp tuning.
Linux - default configuration is good, boot a live cd open up a browser and run the TBB speedtest.

http://justbrowsing.info/

Router MTU in my opinion can bet set to 1492 but is better to also set client devices to lower MTU, so you not relying on MTU detection algorithms which can be unreliable. More of a pain in the backside to do this way but performs better. Is a big reason I am using sky now to get away from pppoe MTU troubles.

good luck.

Edited by Chrysalis (Sat 02-Sep-17 14:24:00)

Standard User Ixel
(member) Sat 02-Sep-17 14:19:21
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Chrysalis] [link to this post]
 
I see, yeah I agree this is a problem that currently needs sorting before packet loss can be looked into.

I'm already on MDWS - my username is Ixel - you should see at the moment for the last few hours that I'm consistently getting around 2000 ES per hour by the looks of it while the modem is uncapped and fastpath.

Edited by Ixel (Sat 02-Sep-17 14:20:45)

Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Sat 02-Sep-17 14:24:30
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
I just edited with more info, please try the live cd I put in the post. (best to after you sort the ES).

I see you only just started MDWS earlier today so I will wait for at least 24 hour of data plots to analyse more. smile

Edited by Chrysalis (Sat 02-Sep-17 14:28:21)

Standard User Ixel
(member) Sat 02-Sep-17 14:34:24
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Chrysalis] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for that, that looks handy, I'll give that a try once the ES problem is dealt with. Yeah I started it once I responded to Zen this morning to confirm I'm in the test socket at the moment with a microfilter and running the HG612. I'm also curious to see if the error seconds will stop or otherwise significantly decrease before DLM intervenes, I just have a feeling they won't. They'll be getting back to me on Monday but yeah I agree, option 3 might be tricky with Zen where A&A would probably get it done I imagine. If it's absolutely necessary I'll pay an ETC and move to them and hope, but I'd rather not if I don't have to. On the other hand it might kill two birds with one stone if I had to do that in the end. Either way I can't really accept the problem can be classed as resolved if interleaving will just be masking it.
Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Sat 02-Sep-17 15:45:33
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
your ES is horrific, hard to think that wont be service affecting, DLM I expect will be taking action within a day.

Also the zen attitude to the ES doesnt surprise me given previous reports about issues on here and their t&c that strongly discourages openreach callouts.

Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Sat 02-Sep-17 15:47:20
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Some support staff are better than others at Zen, I found that once you have managed to convince them that there is a fault that requires an engineer visit, they will offer that, subject to you accepting to pay the BTOR charges should no fault be found ect
Though it can be frustrating in the early stages when reporting faults
Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Sat 02-Sep-17 15:54:39
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: tommy45] [link to this post]
 
and what is zens attitude if you refuse to accept the BTOR charges?

Standard User tommy45
(knowledge is power) Sat 02-Sep-17 16:09:43
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Chrysalis] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Chrysalis:
and what is zens attitude if you refuse to accept the BTOR charges?
they will refuse to send the engineer,
Standard User Ixel
(member) Sat 02-Sep-17 16:29:59
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Chrysalis] [link to this post]
 
I know, this is why I originally capped the modem downstream speed which stopped or greatly minimised this problem as I was under the impression it might be something that can't be resolved such as crosstalk. However I don't believe this is normal for pretty much any line to produce this number of ES consistently. I've eliminated every possible idea I can think of what could be causing this internally without any success.

I might unfortunately be in for a hard time in getting Zen to agree there's a problem that needs resolving (despite the GEA test passing, although with 'possible copper line fault'), rather than just allowing DLM to eventually apply enough amounts of error correction and/or banding and then them telling me the problem is gone when infact it's just being masked by DLM's intervention(s).

I guess if I can't get anywhere next week then I'll need to weigh the possibilities of looking to leave Zen and possibly paying an early termination charge, or risk an Openreach engineer coming out (if I agree to the risk of being charged a fee) to tell me he/she can't find a fault and then getting me to pay for the visit.

EDIT (02/09 17:59): Interesting, while there's still a small amount of ES the number of them dropped just after 17:15 by the looks of it. I'm starting to wonder if a business nearby might be running something during working hours, if that's the case then I might be out of luck to get this resolved.

EDIT (02/09 18:11): Nevermind, it's back again perhaps.

Edited by Ixel (Sat 02-Sep-17 18:11:48)

Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Sun 03-Sep-17 11:52:21
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
DLM has kicked in now, you can see what the linux test gives off peak.

Standard User Ixel
(member) Sun 03-Sep-17 12:39:07
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Chrysalis] [link to this post]
 
I'll try it late tonight, a bit after midnight should be off peak ideally. While it's worth trying I'm just not entirely certain what it'll confirm. If the router IP address is being pinged and is still getting packet loss intermittently then either it's something external and beyond my control or it's something on the router. Nobody here is using an excessive amount of download or upload speed from what I can see.

Perhaps after tonight's Linux test maybe I should try turning on QoS and configure it at a roughly conservative 80% of the download and upload sync rate. This would hopefully eliminate the remote possibility that something here is consuming a lot of download/upload to cause the router pings to periodically result in packet loss.

As for DLM, yeah that was to be expected. I'm expecting Zen to call me on Monday saying the errors have gone when in reality they are just being masked by interleaving. I've also ordered myself a shortwave radio (1711 to 29999 kHz) which I can tune in to around the impacted frequency to be certain that there's nothing in the house that could be contributing to this problem. I wish I knew why it briefly 'calmed down' at around 17:15 for a short time yesterday.

Edited by Ixel (Sun 03-Sep-17 12:42:39)

Standard User Ixel
(member) Sun 03-Sep-17 21:55:54
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Chrysalis] [link to this post]
 
Interesting...

Well I just noticed my SNR fluctuating, also my D3 band on the SNR graph looks horrific from this morning's sample. Just a moment ago I had a fluctuating SNR and after doing a QLT (no noise) suddenly it's stabilised. Surely this isn't right, there must be a fault? I've lost 1 dB downstream SNR however (down to 5 or so now) rather suddenly from 6 dB.

http://i.imgur.com/Tvrbrm9.png

Also on MDWS as Ixel.

EDIT: Here's D3 band looking awful before I did a QLT - http://i.imgur.com/mDcFQdG.png.

Edited by Ixel (Sun 03-Sep-17 22:54:05)

Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Mon 04-Sep-17 10:57:08
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
I am interested what happened with the speedtest.

Standard User Ixel
(member) Mon 04-Sep-17 11:36:47
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Chrysalis] [link to this post]
 
Did a couple last night and got fairly similar results unfortunately. (EDIT: Sorry linked to an old one, can't find the new ones logged, prob as I wasn't logged in). Single threaded downstream speed started off at the maximum then dropped to half or one quarter of the potential downstream speed, while multi-threaded was fine.

I've got my Tecsun radio this morning and did a check around the frequencies that were severely affected yesterday evening for a short time but when I'm near the master socket I get very little noise other than from the modem (of course). I'm also thinking of changing my DrayTek for a Ubiquiti EdgeRouter to ensure there's zero doubt that there's a performance problem here that's causing packet loss. Just seems like I'm spending a fair bit of money though in order to eliminate everything my end, I honestly can't believe the DrayTek has an issue.

EDIT 2: I've noticed some noise coming from the UPS which is probably the closest thing to the master socket area so I'll eliminate that by turning it off temporarily. Hopefully I can just switch it over to mains only and it will stop generating noise. One other nearby appliance is my computer equipment, it's under a metal loft bed so maybe the metal frame of the loft bed is acting as an antenna enough for the phone wiring along the outside wall or master socket to pick this up? Only way to be sure would be to turn off the PC but then the stats will stop being monitored too so that's a catch 22. I'll try the UPS first and go from there.

EDIT 3: UPS being off made no difference. Router/modem not going via UPS made no difference. Last possibility I can see is the computer but I doubt it. No update from Zen yet but might be a few more hours.

EDIT 4: Update from Zen tomorrow as the person I'm dealing with isn't in today frown. Oh well, these things happen. Otherwise I noticed another significant swing in SNR today, perhaps a little worse than the one yesterday evening.

http://imgur.com/a/yMYxg

Edited by Ixel (Mon 04-Sep-17 16:53:38)

Standard User Ixel
(member) Wed 06-Sep-17 12:04:00
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Well my Ubiquiti EdgeRouter ERPRO-8 arrived this morning and it has now replaced the DrayTek Vigor 2860Vac. It's an impressive bit of kit, and compared to the DrayTek it handles bufferbloat perfectly (smart queue QoS is enabled). Even with QoS on the DrayTek I had about 100-200ms of bufferbloat at times typically, with the Ubiquiti I'm getting around 20-30ms. I did a speed test on thinkbroadband again but I'm still getting a slow single threaded download speed though it might be related to the line fault perhaps. Zen told me they would investigate the intermittent packet loss problem and/or slow single threaded download speed if it still exists after the FTTC connection is better again (e.g. line fault is fixed and minimal errors). Hopefully the line fault will be resolved by the end of the week and the other remaining issues will disappear at the same time.
Standard User radar
(learned) Tue 12-Sep-17 08:09:54
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Ixel:
I see.

I'm waiting for an update to my ticket, though it won't be till later today I think.

Here's a speed test I did last night in the early hours of the morning: https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

Here's a speed test I did just a minute ago: https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

It has to be congestion. My ping graph doesn't look impressive either - http://i.imgur.com/TBrMlPW.png

Zen have finally fixed my packet loss and poor single thread speed problems.
https://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/15051995351...

So lets hope it stays this way.

Dave

Standard User Ixel
(member) Thu 14-Sep-17 22:16:46
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: radar] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by radar:
In reply to a post by Ixel:
I see.

I'm waiting for an update to my ticket, though it won't be till later today I think.

Here's a speed test I did last night in the early hours of the morning: https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

Here's a speed test I did just a minute ago: https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

It has to be congestion. My ping graph doesn't look impressive either - http://i.imgur.com/TBrMlPW.png

Zen have finally fixed my packet loss and poor single thread speed problems.
https://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/15051995351...

So lets hope it stays this way.

Dave


Nice! Mine is still an ongoing issue unfortunately, but there is an underground line fault apparently so I'm waiting for that to be resolved (causing SNRM swings periodically as well as a few other issues such as abnormally high FEC errors) though DLM is doing a job of masking the fault to some degree at the moment with INP 3 and delay 8ms. So, as Zen have told me, once this is fixed then they'll look into the packet loss/single threaded speed issue I'm having too. The results are worst in the evenings I've found, until a little after midnight. Sometimes the multi threaded speed test gives me 10-15 megabits during the evening even though my connection isn't under heavy use. I've currently got a Ubiquiti EdgeRouter ERPro-8, a very powerful router that can process over 2 million packets per second and around 8 gigabits per second I believe. It's connected to a HG612.

TBB speed test I did earlier - https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

Buffer bloat isn't an issue too - https://i.imgur.com/2ZtKOLB.png

Pretty bad as you can see.

I'm expecting to hear tomorrow about what happened today with the underground engineer (who was one day overdue), as something happened this morning which increased my line attenuation by quite a fair amount but the underlying issues are still there.

Edited by Ixel (Thu 14-Sep-17 22:22:08)

Standard User Ixel
(member) Fri 22-Sep-17 15:13:28
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Just to post an update on my situation.

The underground engineer fixed whatever fault there was however there's still a problem with an abnormally large amount of FEC errors, and more CRC errors recently which made DLM change me to INP 4 delay 12ms from INP 3 delay 8ms. I've not noticed significant fluctuations in SNRM though for all I know the INP/delay could be masking that as it's currently masking the continuous CRC errors I had.

Subsequently a phone/voice engineer turned up but was unable to help me as his equipment showed everything passed. He suspects I might be on a faulty port at the DSLAM but it's difficult to verify that without risking further call out charges. The only potential way I can verify that is if I order another line which is what I've now done. Family is still occasionally telling me that there's no dial tone on the line every so often but if there's still an intermittent fault then it's going to be difficult to prove this. I'm not getting re-syncs with the DSL side though. The second line is being installed mid October by which time I should know more about whether it's potentially a faulty DSLAM port or how the second line performs compared to the current line. Credit to Zen however as BT tried to charge me for the voice engineer not finding a fault but I was told there was no agreement about potential charges this time so I'm off the hook and it'll be disputed with BT smile.

Currently I'm waiting for a follow up regarding my packet loss/slow single threaded download speed, last I heard I'm being moved to another peer or something.
Standard User Ixel
(member) Fri 29-Sep-17 12:24:19
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Final update to say the single threaded download speed issue has been resolved, I imagine my packet loss issue will disappear too but I need time to determine that. Thanks to Stefan and Andrew at Zen for helping resolve the problem!

https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but... - Nice single threaded download speed now
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Fri 29-Sep-17 21:55:46
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Test was run over IPv6, its worth just checking using the Run IPv4 button, usually v4 and v6 will take same routes but always a chance of different paths

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Ixel
(member) Fri 29-Sep-17 22:40:10
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
I see. Well I did the test again on IPv4.

https://www.thinkbroadband.com/_assets/speedtest/but...

Looks fine I believe, I know it slowed down slightly a little later on during the test but I'm not the only one browsing the internet here right now so I think that's why.

EDIT 2: Speed tester anomaly. I did a 1GB file a few times and consistently getting around 50 megabits per second according to the EdgeRouter and based on Chrome's MB/sec speed.

Edited by Ixel (Fri 29-Sep-17 23:17:53)

Standard User Ixel
(member) Wed 04-Oct-17 18:19:10
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Oh dear, looks like problems are returning again.

https://imgur.com/a/3XPww

Anyone else having issues, any thoughts?

EDIT: Swinging SNR is back too, see https://imgur.com/a/ojlPM

Edited by Ixel (Wed 04-Oct-17 21:23:14)

Standard User melevittfl
(newbie) Thu 05-Oct-17 07:29:32
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Hi,

Yes, I am still having these issues as well.

My Broadband Speed Test

I was told last Friday that Zen's network operations team were taking a look, but haven't heard anything since.
Standard User Ixel
(member) Thu 05-Oct-17 10:42:00
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: melevittfl] [link to this post]
 
It took a week or so before I heard back regarding what the network operations team said or the fact they've fixed it.

This morning my speeds are reasonable again, but I'm half expecting the problem to return again. Then there's the unresolved and apparent intermittent line fault. Second line is still scheduled to be installed on the 13th going via the TT Wholesale back-haul so can't wait to see how it compares to my current Zen line.
Standard User Nigel_FL
(newbie) Thu 05-Oct-17 19:26:54
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Also seening the same persistent single thread issues that get progressively worse as peak 8-10pm approaches.

Lines sync is 71.4Mbps/ 20.0Mbps fastpath (eci cab) open profile.

My Broadband Speed Test

John and the network team implemented a remote change on the ZyXEL equipment in the local exchange, which provided a temporary fix. The issue is reappearing again.

Could this be a traffic policer (shaper) issue or somthing like a virtual switch issue, that talktalk wholesale were recently struggling with?

Edited by Nigel_FL (Thu 05-Oct-17 20:04:18)

Standard User Ixel
(member) Thu 05-Oct-17 20:34:45
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Nigel_FL] [link to this post]
 
I see. Yeah you could be right. It does feel like traffic's being shaped at times, whether by accident or intentionally I don't know.

My Broadband Speed Test

Just did this a moment ago, nobody in the house is using a lot of the potential throughput either.

Edited by Ixel (Thu 05-Oct-17 20:35:11)

Standard User craig1410
(member) Thu 05-Oct-17 20:56:36
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Just been noticing terrible performance on my Zen FTTC connection and having rebooted all my equipment, I found this thread after doing the following speed test.

My Broadband Speed Test

It's the upload speeds that are killing me as I make a lot of use of cloud storage. Normally I see a solid 20Mbps uploads and 60+Mbps downloads regardless of time of day. My line sync is 74.69/20Mbps (down/up).

I'll report this to Zen support in the morning because this is completely unacceptable. I would appreciate any help Zen staffers can offer to get this resolved.

Just to add, I notice from the Zen Portal line data page that my line is using "Talk Talk Business" line technology. Is this a recent thing because I'm pretty sure I was using BT Open Reach not so long ago. Do TTB only handle the back haul and BT handling the copper or what? Can someone explain who does what briefly? I'm an electronics eng and computer consultant so I promise I won't take much explanation. smile

ZeN Zen Unlimited Fibre 2 up to 76Mbps (Typ. 56Mbps dn / 20 Mbps up)
Apple Airport Express + Time Capsule
Apple Macbook Pro Retina/ iPad Air / iPhone 5

Edited by craig1410 (Fri 06-Oct-17 01:07:07)

Standard User Ixel
(member) Fri 06-Oct-17 09:29:40
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craig1410] [link to this post]
 
Interesting, yeah my connection used to be on BT back-haul but is now on Zen's own back-haul (GEA FTTC, has been for a while). Basically yes, Openreach are responsible for maintaining the copper and equipment in the exchange but the back-haul beyond that is then TalkTalk Business (in your case). When 'data' reaches the exchange then it ends up going via TalkTalk Business's equipment (LLU) in the exchange and subsequently via their own back-haul. At least that's my understanding.
Standard User craig1410
(member) Fri 06-Oct-17 14:28:10
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Anyone got any good 'humble pie' recipes? smile

Before I called Zen support I decided to do all the usual steps of connecting to test socket with a different microfilter and turning everything off and on etc. I also isolated my network by disconnecting all equipment (wired and wireless) except for the laptop connected directly to the main router via ethernet. Lo and behold I started to see 70/18Mbps (down/up) and it was very stable. So, piece by piece I built everything back up starting with the faceplate microfilter and then router wifi and then finally the upstairs feed which is an ethernet cable which connects to an 8 port HP switch which in turn feeds a couple of other routers and some other bits and bobs. Suddenly I'm getting poor speeds again, but only when connecting to ethernet upstairs or wifi from upstairs. Hmm...

After a bit of diagnostics including a temporary 15 meter cable from downstairs to upstairs I find it's the ethernet cable which is bad and when I took the faceplates off to check the connections I find it only has 2 pairs of conductors hooked up (orange, green) and looks like a telephony cable not a Cat 5/6 cable. In fact the cable only has 3 pairs of conductors in total so is definitely not suitable for gigabit ethernet! To make matters worse the cable was doing double duty with the 3rd pair of conductors feeding a telephone extension point. Not ideal!

Sure enough, when I checked my HP switch, the connection was only running at 100Mbps full duplex which in theory shouldn't restrict a 70Mbps VDSL connection but when combined with the fact it's not at least Cat 5 and has a pair of telephony wires running alongside then all bets are off I'd say!

So, looks like I'll be pulling a new Cat 6 cable through the walls tomorrow and hopefully that should sort out my issues. So, apologies to Zen for jumping to conclusions, and to Talk Talk Business for suggesting their back-haul was to blame!

ZeN Zen Unlimited Fibre 2 up to 76Mbps (Typ. 56Mbps dn / 20 Mbps up)
Apple Airport Express + Time Capsule
Apple Macbook Pro Retina/ iPad Air / iPhone 5

Edited by craig1410 (Fri 06-Oct-17 14:30:14)

Standard User Nigel_FL
(newbie) Fri 06-Oct-17 20:41:13
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: craig1410] [link to this post]
 
As peak approaches the single thread issue appears again....

Sync 71.4Mbps / 20Mbps

My Broadband Speed Test

Its a shame because John and the network team though they had got on top of this with the config change to the ZyXEL exchange pop.

Not all Zen's POP are ZyXEL others I believe are Huawei part of project Plexus,which might explain why some users have no issues on LLU?

Edited by Nigel_FL (Fri 06-Oct-17 20:52:50)

Standard User melevittfl
(newbie) Fri 06-Oct-17 20:51:35
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Nigel_FL] [link to this post]
 
Modem is syncing at about 64 so it's even worse for me:

My Broadband Speed Test

And that was actually slightly better than Zen's own speed tester:
https://imgur.com/a/BATMR
Standard User Ixel
(member) Fri 06-Oct-17 21:28:04
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: melevittfl] [link to this post]
 
Mine is hit and miss this evening too, 49/13 sync.

My Broadband Speed Test

Zen's result compared against my EdgeRouter's usage chart: https://imgur.com/a/KCACu

Edited by Ixel (Fri 06-Oct-17 21:31:45)

Standard User melevittfl
(newbie) Sun 08-Oct-17 18:36:24
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
My speed seems to be consistently slow, regardless of the time of day. Best I've seen since joining in mid-September was around 20Mpbs (on a line that syncs at 66).
Standard User marjohn56
(newbie) Sun 08-Oct-17 22:22:07
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: melevittfl] [link to this post]
 
Is that on TBB Speed test?

Need some more info on that. What modem/router are you using?

Sync rate only gives half the picture.

Congestion is bad tonight, guess it must be half term and the kids are all playing! smile

Billion 8800nl (Bridge) -> pfSense 2.4B

--------------------------------------------------------
Artificial Intelligence is no match for Natural Stupidity.
--------------------------------------------------------

Edited by marjohn56 (Sun 08-Oct-17 22:23:44)

Standard User melevittfl
(newbie) Mon 09-Oct-17 17:51:18
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: marjohn56] [link to this post]
 
Hi,

Yes. The TBB speed test and Zen's own speed test show similar results. I.e., getting around 15Mpbs speed regardless of the time of day.

This is testing with a wired ethernet connection as well. Zen support have told me their network operations team are looking into the issue. Last I heard from Zen support was on the 5th of October just to say they haven't heard anything more from their network team.
ISP Representative jongreen84
(isp) Mon 09-Oct-17 19:53:38
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: melevittfl] [link to this post]
 
Hi all,

As I've said in a previous thread I've not been around for a while, but my colleagues do keep an eye on this forum. I just wanted to pop in and reiterate that the best thing to do if anyone is experiencing issues is to contact Tech Support, who can raise to the Network Operations team to resolve, if that is the best way to get the problem resolved.

If any configuration changes need to be made by the Network Ops team, this could take some time to arrange, as it will need to be agreed with the business as part of our change control process, to manage the risk around making any changes.

Cheers,

Jon
The above post has been made by an ISP REPRESENTATIVE (although not necessarily the ISP being discussed in the post).
Standard User craski
(committed) Wed 25-Oct-17 21:20:02
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Spudgun] [link to this post]
 
My 80/20 Zen connection has been OK for a while, as in I've not noticed streaming content in poor quality or buffering. But I noticed buffering with Sky on demand tonight and did a speed test to check. Single thread speed test is struggling to hold 3Mb. I've been super patient with Zen in the past, dont need another week of jumping through hoops to prove this isnt a problem with my kit but a problem with the back haul network!

https://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/15089616781...

Zen Business FTTC BQM
Talk Talk Business FTTC BQM
IDNET ADSL BQM
Standard User jbuk__
(newbie) Thu 02-Nov-17 16:43:58
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: Spudgun] [link to this post]
 
Just adding my voice to this one -- I had been noticing this issue on and off for a while. Reported the issue to Zen customer support on Sunday -- and also notified Jon and Andy of the issue on here. The issue was resolved overnight on the Tuesday and all was back to normal by Wednesday.
Standard User melevittfl
(newbie) Fri 03-Nov-17 09:14:08
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jbuk__] [link to this post]
 
Hmm. Whatever is causing my problem must be more complicated as it's going on a couple of months for me.
Standard User melevittfl
(newbie) Fri 03-Nov-17 10:36:54
Print Post

Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: melevittfl] [link to this post]
 
Ah! Looks like I spoke too soon. Noticed a software update going faster than I've seen in a while and retested:

My Broadband Speed Test

Seems Zen have fixed the problem for me.
Standard User jbuk__
(newbie) Fri 03-Nov-17 11:38:12
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Re: Poor single thread performance problems return?


[re: jbuk__] [link to this post]
 
Maybe I also spoke too soon -- I just had a call today acknowledging the issue as contention somewhere in the network and that it would be fixed eventually but without a specific ETA. I was also told to ignore the single thread results from the Zen/TBB speedtester and only focus on HTTPx6 burst (!) as the others 'aren't relevant'. Not happy that people are potentially being fobbed off like that.

I mentioned to the CS employee that something had been done on Tuesday night who seemed quite bemused but did check the ticket history and conceded that apparently I had been 'moved to a different exchange' which I am guessing is routing my packets to avoid a congested link or faulty piece of equipment somewhere.
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