Thinking of moving to PN on the John Lewis Brand

Hi there

I see PN provide the JL phone and broadband service.

At the moment i am with the post office for both phone and bb (20cn connection, market 1 exchange)

If a place an order can phone and broadband be moved at the same time ?

The migration tool on here says it should be possible. many thanks

Pretty sure that's a straight forward process.

I was on the JL (Greenbee) phone & BB package but changed to PN as the price was more competitive.

Aren't they still waiting for confirmation Plusnet will supply JL's new model. According to el reg it's not concrete yet.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/04/21/john_lewis_b...

Hi -

If you phone their technical support, they confirm they are plus.net employees.

As far as i can tell, section of the JL site are the same asPN, the signup journey is the same, the same status updates are posted on the JL that are on the PN site by the same people. also the contact address is the same.

i spoke to them on the phone (JL, which in reality is PN sales ) and the told me its PN providing the service

In reference to www.plus.net/business/about.shtml:

About Plusnet Business

We have a wealth of experience delivering services to over 25,000 direct business customers, ranging from teleworkers to large SMBs. We also provide wholesale services to major UK and International brands such as the John Lewis Partnership (Greenbee & Waitrose) and BT Global Services, to name but a few.

Why not go directly to Plusnet? It's cheaper and since the support must ultimately be provided by Plusnet rather than John Lewis that's going to be pretty much the same either way.

The only significant differences are in the data allowances. 20GB and Unlimited for JL, 10GB and 60GB for PN. If you really need the unlimited data allowance there may be better ISPs for you. notably Be if it's available in your area.

Just remembered, Ithink you said you were in a Market 1 area. That closes the price gap between JL and PN, though check carefully that JL won't charge more too.

John Lewis BB is 12 month contract but PN has no annual contract.

In reply to a post by ppppenguin99:

Why not go directly to Plusnet?

Because JL unlimited is £ 5 per month cheaper than Extra (market 1 area as i am) as you would need to buy the pro add on at £5 per month to enable extra to have full line speed like the Unlimited package has.

Also as you have said extra has a only 60gb limit which is not enough

This is what the JL sites say about its unlimited bb

JL website says they charge the same price regardless of where you live.

Unlimited usage
Simply put, there are no restrictions on how much you can download, allowing you to enjoy all the internet has to offer. Download as much or as little as you like, whenever you like.

Can a PN rep kindly answer my query in my first post. thank you

In reply to a post by bob12345:

Unlimited usage
Simply put, there are no restrictions on how much you can download, allowing you to enjoy all the internet has to offer. Download as much or as little as you like, whenever you like.

Does it anywhere rule out traffic management? It is impossible to provide unlimited, unthrottled internet access at the JL price. I hardly think JL are introducing this as a loss-making service.

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

Does it anywhere rule out traffic management?

Why do we manage traffic?

So a not very enlightening FAQ, except that is clearly where the snag lies.

At least the Plusnet ones are clearly specified. Whether the JL ones are directly related to those I'm too tired to consider, but the PN system that will be doing the management is highly configurable, so there is no need for them to be.

Oh Good Lord!

I just got to that FAQ from one of the main pages. Talk about inconsistent and incorrect!

It seems to have been written by someone reading some more complex description, possibly from a number of documents, with no previous knowledge of the subject, and therefore little understanding. Then trying to simplify it, and failing abjectly.

A simple example. How can something be simultaneously allowed to run at "Line speed" and also be "Managed"? It also takes a little thought to understand how something can be both restricted speed and prioritised, though I did get there on that one within a minute, when I went back to try to work it out. Their target market will just move on in confusion, assuming that it's JL so must be OK.

How about

Why might my speed be lower for the first 10 days of service?

Once your broadband is activated, tests will be run on your phone line. These find out the lowest broadband speed you've received in the last 10 days. From this, you'll receive the fastest stable speed that your phone line can support ....

immediately followed by

Although the connection speed will be set during the 10-day testing period ....

How about

What speed can I expect from my broadband service?

We believe that you should be aware of the broadband speed experience you can expect from our products, so in the following table we show the maximum downstream speeds we aim to provide for all broadband traffic at all times.

If I were thinking of joining, I'd be more interested in the minimum, not the maximum.

Better proof-reading needed there perhaps .

There must be more, but that's enough for now.

In reply to a post by bob12345:

Can a PN rep kindly answer my query in my first post. thank you

Have highlighted your request here

In reply to a post by ppppenguin99:

Why not go directly to Plusnet? It's cheaper and since the support must ultimately be provided by Plusnet rather than John Lewis that's going to be pretty much the same either way.

The only significant differences are in the data allowances. 20GB and Unlimited for JL, 10GB and 60GB for PN. If you really need the unlimited data allowance there may be better ISPs for you. notably Be if it's available in your area.

This comment is only applicable to LLU areas. I wish BE would offer their unlimited product over 21CN, but it's not going to happen.

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

A simple example. How can something be simultaneously allowed to run at "Line speed" and also be "Managed"? It also takes a little thought to understand how something can be both restricted speed and prioritised, though I did get there on that one within a minute, when I went back to try to work it out. Their target market will just move on in confusion, assuming that it's JL so must be OK.

After reading the above post this morning i decided to query the above.( thanks for pointing that out RobertoS)

They told me it is a mistake (the website will be changed) and there is no traffic management on the ul package.

And that on the " how does it work table", internet activity for the ul package should be three star ( at the moment most are two star) meaning all traffic is prioritised on the network.

Can some one from PN please confirm ? , many thanks

Edited by deleted (Tue 24-Apr-12 09:39:56)

The table is the same as the table for the Pro add-on, anything that isn't in the highest queue (titanium) is therefore classed as managed even if there are no rate-limits in place. The table was designed by the broadband stakeholder group and was intended to bring clarity to traffic managment. http://www.broadbanduk.org/content/view/479/7/

Thanks for that Chris , so i assume what the sale agent told me was wrong?

Can you kindly let me know about my first query please

Hi there

I see PN provide the JL phone and broadband service.

At the moment i am with the post office for both phone and bb (20cn connection, market 1 exchange)

If a place an order can phone and broadband be moved at the same time ?

The migration tool on here says it should be possible. many thanks

You should be able to do that, I'd suggest speaking to the sales team on the phone rather than signing up online though.

Long tie-in is the way things are going PN included. They have already followed BT with the 12 month line rental up front wheeze

In reply to a post by m0aur:

Long tie-in is the way things are going PN included. They have already followed BT with the 12 month line rental up front wheeze

And don't forget Sky.

For those that can afford it far better value than having the money sitting in an account getting minimal interest. Nice touch I notice is that the deal can go with you if you move house.

Like the car insurance scams of cheaper for a year (aka more expensive monthly), it forces the less well off consumers to pay a lot now or pay more over the year, rather than the positive point of view you give it.

When employers start paying out 12 months ahead of work completed, I'll start paying my bills 12 months ahead of service provided.

I agree, and I've said before that I'm surprised consumer groups aren't making more noise about the fact that people who are better off (i.e. those who can pay a whole year in one go) are able to get cheaper deals than those who aren't.

I don't have a problem with incentives for signing a one-year contract, but asking for all the money up front is going too far. And for some smaller companies like Primus there is also the risk of losing your money if they cease trading.

As line rental has to my knowledge been traditionally a monthly affair I do look at the yearly up front cost in a positive light.

I have little doubt that it is competition that has made this an option....nothing is for nothing, they want a guaranteed customer for twelve months and I want the savings, you pays your money and takes your choice.

When employers start paying out 12 months ahead of work completed, I'll start paying my bills 12 months ahead of service provided.

If you offer a big enough incentive, a discount such as offered by PN, say 34% less in take home pay, they may view it as in their financial interest to do just that....as I mentioned, far better value than in a bank account.

In reply to a post by Sadoldman:

they want a guaranteed customer for twelve months and I want the savings

So what's wrong with making it a pay-monthly 12 month contract?

There's a fair chance that ISPs offering such deals have working capital financed by debt. Annual advance payment by customers reduces that debt immediately the payment is received, and the interest saving over the ensuing 12 months will exceed by far the discount given to the customer.

Win-Win for the ISP and the customer. Bad news for the financer. That in itself has side effects, so this isn't the full story, but could be the explanation.

I imagine that it can also help for capacity planning/management.

In reply to a post by Oliver341:

So what's wrong with making it a pay-monthly 12 month contract?

Any offer made by a company is made on the basis that they see it in their interest to make that offer....their big picture strategy is to increase profits/build the company.....they are not there for your benefit. You could argue that "loyal" customers should get the "new customer" deals.......but they don't most often.

The customer should make decisions based on what is in their interest, the only loyalty I have to any company is honouring my contract. This only works well when there* is genuine competition. I cannot recall BT offering substantial discounts for up front payment when it was a monopoly.

Edit typo, there* for their.

Edited by Sadoldman (Thu 26-Apr-12 06:53:52)

My friend has told me to hold of for the moment moving to JL as PN are about to do a product refresh? if this is the case, when is it likely to happen ?, many thanks

There are lots of guesses but nobody knows if or when - and yes I am waiting as well