Get PlusNet now, then get on trial when moved to FTTP house?

Hi,

I don't really want to pay BT for a phoneline when I move to my new house in Janaury, but as it's FTTP only there are a fairly limited number of suppliers who will be available to me... So, I was thinking of switching to PlusNet FTTC only now (cheaper than my current non-fibre Sky too), so that when I move I can access their FTTP trial.

Is this likely to work out? Am I missing any obvious pitfalls? Don't want to sign myself up for a 18 month contract and £50 installation fee if it's likely to bite me in my ass later!

Edited by deleted (Wed 18-Nov-15 12:49:47)

If you were without any broadband for a few weeks while Plusnet got their act together would that be critical? If it is, going with Plusnet for something non-standard would be a huge risk given the current state of their support and the extremely limited number of staff who know about FTTP.

In your shoes I would probably take the easy route and just go straight to BT who have fully launched FTTP products. Might be a few quid more but given the issues that PlusNet have had over the last 12 months it might avoid you tearing your hair out.

I can bump up my phone data and use that for a bit after moving in if it takes a while. Should be simple though as all the FTTP equipment will be installed before I move in, so just a case of getting the right person on the phone/Plusnet forum to turn it on overnight.

In reply to a post by libf:

I can bump up my phone data and use that for a bit after moving in if it takes a while. Should be simple though as all the FTTP equipment will be installed before I move in, so just a case of getting the right person on the phone/Plusnet forum to turn it on overnight.

The plusnet FTTP trial is only 80/20 as far as im aware, So pointless really

I'm not after anything more than 38/2. Get by on 5/0.5 from Sky atm!

In reply to a post by libf:

I'm not after anything more than 38/2. Get by on 5/0.5 from Sky atm!

then you will be wasting your money on FTTP if you aren't interested in the benefits of having FTTP may as well stick with ADSL and save your money

And as far as know plusnet don't do voice on FTTP , So you may have to pay line rental for an analogue line (copper pair) as well or the price will be increased to the same price as if you rented the copper pair

Edited by tommy45 (Wed 18-Nov-15 14:42:33)

So a potential jump in speed from what might be a couple of meg to 40 meg is not worth it? If the choice is slow ADSL or FTTP at the same price as FTTC then it doesn't seem like a bad option to me. Telling the OP isn't worth it is assuming a lot.

FTTP line rental I believe normally includes the delivery of the PSTN circuit, the same as it does for FTTC. In essence a place that is FTTP delivered is no different from one that is FTTC (from the cost and service perspective). It just happens to be delivered over a more stable technology that can go much higher.

I'm buying a new build which only has FTTP, so I don't have a choice!

Part of the reason for choosing Plusnet is not having to pay to have a phoneline that I don't use.

Edited by deleted (Wed 18-Nov-15 16:01:36)

He's just jealous.

Do PlusNet not charge any form of "line rental" for FTTP then? My understanding was the costs at wholesale level were no different between FTTC and FTTP and that both required a wholesale line rental payment to someone.

They have an option for just broadband and no phone with a £2.50 charge instead of the phoneline, FTTC or FTTP.

You may have read that wrong? The site seems to say:

Line Rental for Broadband only

You'll need to pay line rental to Plusnet or another BT based landline provider to get our broadband. If you opt to switch your phone service to Plusnet, we'll reduce your monthly broadband price by £2.50 for as long as you keep your phone line with us.

So, the price would reduce by £2.50 meaning your line rental would still be costing you about £15 on top of normal broadband price.

Hmm. Maybe it is only on FTTP that you can get the phoneline turned off on then...

https://community.plus.net/forum/index.php/topic,136...

Still, only two more months of having to pay the line rental!

Edited by deleted (Wed 18-Nov-15 17:10:58)

In reply to a post by libf:

Hmm. Maybe it is only on FTTP that you can get the phoneline turned off on then...

https://community.plus.net/forum/index.php/topic,136...

Still, only two more months of having to pay the line rental!

FTTP apparently you can have without line rental on plusnet, but the FTTP voice part of the service is not available through plusnet, so no voice service,(FVA is unavailable on plusnet) unless you use voip , and that's where why i said it ain't worth the expense if you only ordering 40/2 as the 2mbps is not fit for purpose on FTTC /H you would too easily saturate the upstream causing high latency, not good for voip and other latency sensitive apps and for the sake of a few £££'s more imo you would be better off going for the 80/20 option

Thinking about the BT /plusnet differences , if plusnet started to offer the full rate 330/30 and or other above 80/20 speeds and also the voice part of it, they would do as their brethren charge you the same for FTTH only as they do for FTTH with line rental , If i had the option of FTTH i would make the most of it,and 2mbps doesn't cut it

Edited by tommy45 (Wed 18-Nov-15 18:16:06)

In reply to a post by libf:

Still, only two more months of having to pay the line rental!

As the others have said, current FTTP services are usually specified to need you to pay line rental for a voice service - which can then be delivered over a copper pair, or as an extra service over fibre. The choice of delivery method isn't yours - it is whatever BT are doing in the area.

Right now, that probably means you have to find out what kind of voice service BT would want to make use of, and then check the ISP can handle it.

One reason is because all of BT's internal systems are written in a way where broadband is perceived as an add-on to a voice-circuit. Another reason is because the line rental (real monthly charge for maintenance of the line) charged by Openreach is identical for fibre used solely for broadband and for fibre for both broadband and voice.

However, an end is in sight...

BT are starting to trial a product known as WBC SOGEA, which is their code for broadband on a line that doesn't come with a voice service. It'll take a while for them to re-write all those back-office systems to remove the dependency, so trials will gradually expand as the various system updates happen. Don't expect it to hit your average ISP too soon.

In reply to a post by libf:

So, I was thinking of switching to PlusNet FTTC only now ... so that when I move I can access their FTTP trial.

Am I missing any obvious pitfalls?

In reply to a post by libf:

I'm buying a new build which only has FTTP,

For most people, the recognised path (without a house move) would be to start on ADSL on copper, and then start the FTTP trial. Voice would stay on copper. The FTTP team will understand this form of migration.

You'll need the switchover to go direct to FTTP in the new house with no intervening ADSL or copper service. This might prove to be a pitfall in the way Plusnet expect to behave. I guess they key issue will be that you either need the house-move team to understand FTTP issues, or the FTTP team to understand house-move issues.

Using a BT line no one gets a choice. If you can get fibre through a BT line then it is either FTTC or FTTP. 80 / 20 on either is at the same price from BT. So there is no waste of money. I have 80 / 20 FTTP from BT. The waste of money would be paying for 200 or 300 if I don't need it.

In reply to a post by brightd:

Using a BT line no one gets a choice. If you can get fibre through a BT line then it is either FTTC or FTTP. 80 / 20 on either is at the same price from BT. So there is no waste of money. I have 80 / 20 FTTP from BT. The waste of money would be paying for 200 or 300 if I don't need it.

FTTP (Fibre) doesn't need a copper pair ,It's the FTTC that needs the copper pair from the PCP to premises AKA D'side
Typical, there's people who would love the opportunity to have a true fibre connection ,that would make full use of the faster speeds, yet some of those who do have that opportunity don't take full advantage of it ,crazy as is BT not offering a symmetrical product on FTTP,

Edited by tommy45 (Wed 18-Nov-15 23:49:21)

I don't want VoIP either. I just want broadband that is good enough for one person who downloads the odd Sky TV show and my mobile for calls, so 38/2 is fine for me.

I'm not buying the house because of the FTTP, it just happens to come with that. And as there is no copper at all, there is no reason to continue to have a phone line which I don't use.

So my choice is £20/month broadband + £17.99/month line rental with BT, or £17.49/month broadband with Plusnet, but you need to be an existing customer. I want to go with the option that costs me £20/month less.

Edited by deleted (Thu 19-Nov-15 07:58:13)

Thanks for this. I did a little forum searching and it seems to be possible... https://community.plus.net/forum/index.php?topic=141...

In reply to a post by tommy45:

Typical, there's people who would love the opportunity to have a true fibre connection ,that would make full use of the faster speeds, yet some of those who do have that opportunity don't take full advantage of it

You seem to think everyone uses the Internet the same way you do and you pillory anyone who doesn't calling them "crazy".

My brother is in a new build. Before FTTP was installed he had 2Mb/s ADSL. He had the choice of all the FTTP packages and chose the 40/10. The reason he chose it was that he is happy with that as a speed - it allows them to stream films, download games, etc at a speed that is enough for what they want. He sees no point in paying more for higher speeds that he doesn't need. That is not crazy.

I am different - if I had the choice of FTTP I would most likely go for the top package and I have considered moving to their estate to get it. However, I believe I could very easily be called crazy for moving to get that and for getting the top package which I wouldn't actually get that much more out of than my current FTTC connection.

I understand the technology. I am one of the lucky ones who has FTTP.

I work from home and am constantly connected to the office via VPN. All work calls are through an IP phone connection from my laptop. I backup my work laptop to a cloud server in real time. I often stream iPlayer for sport while I am working. I have never found the need for faster than an 80/20 connection although a symmetric connection would be nice. So paying for a faster connection in my case would be a waste of money. I do however appreciate the capability to switch to a faster connection in the future if the need arises.

People moan at those choosing 40/10 on FTTP but remember the connection speed is nailed to that figure, so in my case would triple my FTTC download speeds and double the upload.

Some recent data (not sure if its 1 user or an average) from Gigaclear shows people downloading 4x as much as they upload and that is on a symmetric service. Openreach reach is it an 8:1 ratio across the userbase.

Downloading xbox one upgrade to the Windows 10 UI (1GB file) and the download did not even saturate my slow 15 Mbps line and the install took as long as it took to download, so even if I had 1000 Mbps would have been no faster it seems.

Update: Requested the switch from Sky to Plusnet not long after creating this thread, and the switch was done on Dec 3rd without any trouble. Now getting about 20/25Mbps down instead of the 6/7Mbps before.

Hopefully the move in January will be as smooth!