Nightmare with Sky

Hi all, it's been a while since I posted in here! I am now with Sky and have had a nightmare of a time with the gaming side of it.

I have sent countless emails to their "tech support" and each one has had a different reply to the last. The problem I'm having is what feels like constant lag and asked to be put on the "gaming profile". I used to be on the free service and was told that I could only be on that if I was on the Sky unlimited package, which I changed to, then asked for the gaming profile and was told it was on.

Well, it didn't improve it at all. I got a higher download speed and that was about it. Many more emails later they have fiddled with the line and said that it was all fine.

It used to start at around 3mb download then over the days (the line had finished training) to around 700kb. Email later, it was back up only to deteriorate again a few days later. They kept telling me there were errors developing on the line, no idea how or why and it got to the point were they would say everyday I needed to unplug the router and leave it and plug it back in to clear the errors. It got to the point where I didn't bother and told them I had for them to say "ah yes, the errors have cleared!". Miraculous!

Another email, and the line has supposedly been tested by them and they can find no problem. I also asked about the gaming profile and they now tell me I can't be on it as you need to be on Sky's telephone and BB deal to have it.

I am very disappointed and currently appalled at the service provided by Sky, I feel like I've been lied to all the way along to just get me to change products.

Here's my details:

ADSL Link 	Downstream 	Upstream
Connection Speed 	2048 kbps 	608 kbps
Line Attenuation 	57 db 	31 db
Noise Margin 	14 db 	12 db

In reply to a post by IguanaMeenie:

Hi all, it's been a while since I posted in here! I am now with Sky and have had a nightmare of a time with the gaming side of it.

I have sent countless emails to their "tech support" and each one has had a different reply to the last. The problem I'm having is what feels like constant lag and asked to be put on the "gaming profile". I used to be on the free service and was told that I could only be on that if I was on the Sky unlimited package, which I changed to, then asked for the gaming profile and was told it was on.

Well, it didn't improve it at all. I got a higher download speed and that was about it. Many more emails later they have fiddled with the line and said that it was all fine.

It used to start at around 3mb download then over the days (the line had finished training) to around 700kb. Email later, it was back up only to deteriorate again a few days later. They kept telling me there were errors developing on the line, no idea how or why and it got to the point were they would say everyday I needed to unplug the router and leave it and plug it back in to clear the errors. It got to the point where I didn't bother and told them I had for them to say "ah yes, the errors have cleared!". Miraculous!

Another email, and the line has supposedly been tested by them and they can find no problem. I also asked about the gaming profile and they now tell me I can't be on it as you need to be on Sky's telephone and BB deal to have it.

I am very disappointed and currently appalled at the service provided by Sky, I feel like I've been lied to all the way along to just get me to change products.

Here's my details:

ADSL Link 	Downstream 	Upstream
Connection Speed 	2048 kbps 	608 kbps
Line Attenuation 	57 db 	31 db
Noise Margin 	14 db 	12 db

Well from your line stats i can see that the SNR margins are nearly double sky's normal profile of 7-db that will most likely be a result of their DLM if they did not use dlm then you would still be syncing the max the line will support, the interleave depth and delay will make the difference whether you see lag or not whilst online gaming, fastpath is the best for such subject to line quality but sky will not provide fastpath,

You could get them to manually reset the target margins to 7db then you would see better speeds, but if the dlm started running again you could end up where you are now

Well, this is part of the problem, it seems every week or two I'm contacting them to reset it back to where it was before so another time won't matter.

No matter what they say they do, it just goes back after a while, infuriating to say the least!

No harm in asking them to disable DLM on your connection, seeing as it keeps doing the same thing, would also save on their support too, but if they will do this for you remains to be seen

A 2Meg line should manage gaming with no undue lag, it sounds less like a line problem, and congestion in the Sky network or elsewhere.

You need to look at pings/tracerts to investigate gaming lag.

seems you are not on the gaming profile, looking and your snr - should be around 7.
On the gaming profile:

Tracing route to www.bbc.net.uk [212.58.246.92]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms 192.168.0.1
2 30 ms 28 ms 29 ms cr3.ndtwe.uk.easynet.net [87.87.225.43]
3 28 ms 26 ms 27 ms ip-87-87-160-193.easynet.co.uk [87.87.160.193]
4 29 ms 28 ms 28 ms te0-7-0-2.er11.thlon.ov.easynet.net [89.200.134.
173]
5 27 ms 28 ms 28 ms 212.58.238.189
6 27 ms 29 ms 29 ms 212.58.238.129
7 28 ms 28 ms 29 ms te12-1.hsw0.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk [212.58.239.222]
8 28 ms 28 ms 29 ms 212.58.255.12
9 28 ms 28 ms 29 ms bbc-vip013.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk [212.58.246.92]

Trace complete.

Sorry if you've already tried this but it will tell if the fault is with the external line or with the internal wiring of the house/ flat.

I assume that you are connected to your BT master socket and don't use any extenstion leads if not try that first, if that give the same results try removing the front plate of the socket and connecting just the router to the test socket behind it, if you could post your router stats from this it's easier to find the fault.

Also as a side note do you use wired or wireless connections in the home? If wireless it might be a channel conflict, you can sort that by downloading Inssider and running it as it will show all visable wireless connections nearby and the channels they use.

In reply to a post by J_Walsh:

seems you are not on the gaming profile, looking and your snr - should be around 7.

I know I'm not on the gaming profile, they won't/can't put me on it unless I have phone AND broadband through them because of their equipment. However, I have emails from them that said I was on it before! I am hesitant to take up their phone offer as I do not want to be tied to a 12 month contract if it makes no difference!

In reply to a post by F022Y:

Sorry if you've already tried this but it will tell if the fault is with the external line or with the internal wiring of the house/ flat.

I assume that you are connected to your BT master socket and don't use any extenstion leads if not try that first, if that give the same results try removing the front plate of the socket and connecting just the router to the test socket behind it, if you could post your router stats from this it's easier to find the fault.

Also as a side note do you use wired or wireless connections in the home? If wireless it might be a channel conflict, you can sort that by downloading Inssider and running it as it will show all visable wireless connections nearby and the channels they use.

I don't have an NTE5 socket, just an old (matchbox sized) junction box on the wall which drops a line down to what looks like an extension socket (though I know it is a master as it has a big yellow capacitor in it and there are no other sockets). I would like to change it but know that legally I am not allowed to as it's BT's property. I do not have any other extension leads in the flat, all were disconnected and wiring removed when I was trying to improve my connection. I have also removed the "ring" wire.

The Xbox360 is connected with a cable as I know that wireless can cause problems with gaming. I have done a tracert from a wireless computer and included below.

Tracing route to bbc.co.uk [212.58.241.131]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1     3 ms     1 ms     1 ms  www.routerlogin.com [192.168.0.1]
  2    30 ms    26 ms    26 ms  cr0.ealow.uk.easynet.net [87.87.253.47]
  3    25 ms    23 ms    24 ms  ip-87-87-171-129.easynet.co.uk [87.87.171.129]
  4    37 ms    35 ms    34 ms  89.200.131.175
  5    36 ms    35 ms    35 ms  212.58.238.189
  6    39 ms    35 ms    34 ms  212.58.238.153
  7    37 ms    36 ms    34 ms  virtual-vip-231.thdo.bbc.co.uk [212.58.241.131]

They have said I am on DLM again which I didnt want as the last time that happened was when I had problems. I was told last time that my line was set manually but even then after a period of time it went "off". I'm probably a little odd to them as massive speed on download is not really what I am after but a stable line is what I want. Currently the router is showing

Connection Speed 	3036 kbps 	714 kbps
Line Attenuation 	61 db 		38 db
Noise Margin		7 db 		9 db

This looks good but that 7db keeps dropping to 4-5db and so making it unstable (or feels like it anyway!)

If the drop to 4-5dB is after sunset then it is to be expected, i.e. a drop of 2 or 3 dB is pretty normal. Hence most go for a 6dB margin as the default, i.e. gives some spare.

Not much Sky can do about the noise, other than say fix you to a 2048 connection speed, giving you lots of spare margin, around the 11dB mark I'd guess.

Might be worth running routerstats lite for 24 - 48 hours, that will tell you times that the SNR bounces, because with the DLM system if it notices to great a change it will kick in to compensate. At my old house i had overhead lines and my SNR bounced between 2db and 11db between 7PM and 6AM turned out to be a street light causing it!!!