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Standard User leonroy
(newbie) Fri 01-Nov-19 21:33:27
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Acceptable packet loss on WAN


[link to this post]
 
I have two separate pfSense site deployments - one with ADSL2 (76Mb) and the other with FTTC (300Mb).

After setting up BQM on them I've noticed that dropped packets hit as high as 20% when the lines are fully saturated with traffic.

ADSL2:
https://imgur.com/weC7DFi.png

FTTC:
https://imgur.com/1y0XgRk.png

Both lines are with Zen. How normal is this?

btw. thanks for BQM - it's such a great tool 👍
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Fri 01-Nov-19 21:52:41
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Re: Acceptable packet loss on WAN


[re: leonroy] [link to this post]
 
dropping ICMP when link is saturated is normal. ICMP is fragile deliberately.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9(Sep/17),54/6(Jan/19),46/7(Sep/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Fri 01-Nov-19 23:58:21
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Re: Acceptable packet loss on WAN


[re: leonroy] [link to this post]
 
The dropped packets counted and graphed are all ping packets, containing nothing else.

If you are saturating your line with data, which would you prefer to be dropped by your router? A ping packet or a data packet?

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
==================================================
"Democracy means simply the bludgeoning of the people by the people for the people." Oscar Wilde


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Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 02-Nov-19 07:02:35
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Re: Acceptable packet loss on WAN


[re: leonroy] [link to this post]
 
As an aside ...
I have two separate pfSense site deployments - one with ADSL2 (76Mb) and the other with FTTC (300Mb).

The 76Mb will be FTTC, the 300Mb one FTTP.

Itís just pedantry, but worth pointing out to save any confusion for other readers, and possibly yourself.

Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 02-Nov-19 11:34:58
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Re: Acceptable packet loss on WAN


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
LOL

As a frequent pedant myself, I completely missed that. Reading only the numbers.

Díoh!

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
==================================================
"Democracy means simply the bludgeoning of the people by the people for the people." Oscar Wilde
Standard User leonroy
(newbie) Sat 02-Nov-19 20:07:39
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Re: Acceptable packet loss on WAN


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
Oops, thanks should clarify my 300Mbps line is G.Fast not fibre optic so that'd make it FTTdp (Fibre To The distribution point) it seems. https://www.increasebroadbandspeed.co.uk/2015/what-i...
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 02-Nov-19 20:33:35
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Re: Acceptable packet loss on WAN


[re: leonroy] [link to this post]
 
The link you give defines something that was considered and ruled out. Openreach are not deploying FTTdp. This is what it is doing, (from your link):-
More recently, it is understood that there is increasing interest in deploying G.fast in existing fibre street cabinets, to minimise investment costs.
By "in existing street cabinets", which cannot be done as there is insufficient room or cooling, it is done by bolting a G.Fast cabinet to the side of the phone cabinet (PCP).

Your line is on G.Fast.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
==================================================
"Democracy means simply the bludgeoning of the people by the people for the people." Oscar Wilde

Edited by RobertoS (Sat 02-Nov-19 20:34:55)

Standard User leonroy
(newbie) Mon 04-Nov-19 09:40:16
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Re: Acceptable packet loss on WAN


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Thanks, so a VDSL connection is FTTC? My G.Fast connection is over the existing BT copper line. What would it be considered? Not FTTP surely?

Edited by leonroy (Mon 04-Nov-19 09:41:31)

Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Mon 04-Nov-19 11:32:22
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Re: Acceptable packet loss on WAN


[re: leonroy] [link to this post]
 
You are thinking of it, or maybe I should say comparing things, in a slightly incorrect way. Thatís an easy mistake to make smile.

Think of the types of DSL we talk about most. ADSL used certain frequencies and gives up to 8Mbps, depending on distance. ADSL2+ uses different and more frequencies and gives up to 24Mbps.

VDSL2 which is what we get from an FTTC cabinet, (the DSLAM in the cabinet converts fibre optic signals to and from VDSL2), goes even further with more frequencies, giving us up to 80Mbps. The technology can give more but this is what Openreach provide using it.

G.Fast is simply an even higher level than VDSL2. Giving far higher speeds but degrading dramatically over distance. Which is why Openreach only offer in on lines that get nearly the full 80Mbps sync speed on VDSL2.

Itís still delivered as fibre to the cabinet, except this is a small cabinet bolted onto the phone cabinet which because of that layout is called a pod. It isnít a standalone cabinet. The signal from it still comes over your copper telephone line.

FTTP is Fibre To The Premises. At no point does it use your copper phone line. It is a direct fibre optic line between you and the exchange, via a load of intermediate connectors. There are no cabinets involved.

For administrative reasons cabinet areas are still sometimes used to describe where FTTP is available, but that is discouraged as a fibre distribution point can cover parts of several cab areas, and a cab area can be supplied from several such fibre DPs outside its copper area.

Does that help smile?

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
==================================================
"Democracy means simply the bludgeoning of the people by the people for the people." Oscar Wilde

Edited by RobertoS (Mon 04-Nov-19 11:34:14)

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