Phorm caught editing Wikipedia article

the article on the front page here says it all about how trustworthy Phorm are trying to edit out bits they didn't like ! this is a nail in the coffin as to how they intend to operate - underhand -sneaky and untrustworthy.

i have sent a email to the CEO of BT pointing this out today.

Given the amount of energy they have expended trying to put a positive spin on this intrusion into peoples privacy, Im not surprised by anything they do - maybe its a show of how desperate they are to get this launched here. I dont think it would stand a prayer in the USA where Phorms predecessor - 121 media/people on page - were originally from.

I wouldnt put much hope in getting a positive response from BT, they are only too happy to rake in the cash from selling YOUR data to this marketing parasite, you are merely a means to an end... an increased margin to please the shareholders. The privacy of customers comes a long way behind profit margins it seems for some ISP's.

In reply to:

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intrusion into peoples privacy

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What part of my privacy is being intruded upon?

My name, address, phone number, ip address, BT Username etc?

When I use Google Mail, for example, my emails are being read by Google and adverts inserted relating to the contents of the emails. Is Phorm similar in that it tracks me and pins my searches to a user account?

Random Jointer

But nice to see the ICO's amended report now stating that implementation should be by "opt in" only.
As in when you contract for G. mail you accept the EULA
BT's offering can hardly be classed as a value added service IMO

Phorm doesn't add any value for the customer, I agree.

However it is not invading anyone's privacy either. It's just another way of making a few bob for the isps.

The biggest invasion of privacy seen around this parish, in my view, was when Entanet Referrer adsl24 pulled data off of his website, dslzone, and published it on Think Broadband in order to discredit someone who gave him a bad review. That's something you would never see BT doing.

So my view is Phorm is nothing to worry about but also gives no benefit to customers and has generated a lot of hot air from tin foil hat wearers.

So I wouldn't be surprised to see it quietly dropped after the forthcoming trial as the revenue figures involved are not great in the grand scheme of things.

Not that I'm bothered either way

You have a clear choice to use Gmail or not. Until today it was expected that Most ISP traffic would be routed by default through Phorms servers unless you had an "opt out" cookie stored, and given how often people clear cookies for security it was easy to see that this was a way of getting many more opted in by default - happily the ICO has ruled that Phorm has to be Opt out by default so this nasty little loophole has been closed off.

There is a strange silence about what happens to traffic from customers who DONT want to be profiled, personally I have no trust in a company that is descended from those behind the "people on page" rootkit and I wouldnt want ANY of my traffic going near a server that they have any access to data from. The Anti phishing protection is nothing that isnt already available in any up to date browser software - even the much vaunted Internet explorer! So Phorm are giving back pretty much nothing in return for you allowing them to see all your browsing (and any webmail you have). The question should also be asked about what value are particpating ISPs giving back to the customers who are having their data sold to a third party?

Look at it. Phorm make money from advertisers for serving the ads (and possibly revealing to other family members what you have been browsing for so dont try to plan a surprise on line). Your ISP gets paid by Phorm for YOUR click traffic... so.. whats in it for you... without whom there is no "business model. You probably pay a fair market price for a BT connection... this isnt Tiscali offering "moon on a stick for �1.99". Why do they feel the need to further profit from your custom in this way? Are they admitting their business model is failing? are their prices unsustainable? I doubt that.. so... WHY?

There is also the question of the secret trials conducted on "live data" that many believe amounted to illegal inteception of data under the RIPA. Hopeful;ly now the ICO has gotten off of his hands, others will have a look at what these 2 companies were really doing with its customers data.

I fully realise that many people fall in to the "I have nothing to hide" category, and thats fine for them, if they are ghappy to surrender to ever increasing levels of snooping into every aspect of their lives, but not all of us are quite so passive - in fact EU law gives us a right to privacy in communications - we are just trying to fight for our right to CHOOSE how much imfo we surrender.

Thats reasonable... isnt it?

Interesting Article mentioning Upcoming Phorm trials here . Also looks at the legality of the previous trials conducted in secret on live data and previously discussed elsewhere on this forum

So, in short. What part of my privacy is being invaded by Phorm ?

For example, websites that use Google Analytics, such as Think Broadband, can see my IP address, track my journey through their site and plot my location on a handy little map. I don't remember opting into anything that gave permission to webmasters to track my journey through their site but they do it. Quick, pass me the tinfoil

Does Phorm see my IP address or plot my location on a map?

As far as I can see, Phorm serves me an advert on a webpage unless I opt out of Phorm in which case I will be served, er, a different advert on the same webpage.

Edited by deleted (Wed 09-Apr-08 17:43:29)

Post deleted by warweezil

Until early this afternoon when the ICO finally creaked into action, this was "OPT OUT" which meant that if someone followed the oft repeated advice to regularly clear cookies (also quoted as a cure for low speeds IIRC) they were likely to be opted in without Informed consent, however the ICO has ensured that a positive action will be required by a customer, hopefully they will see straight through the Phishing protection scam and realise that up to date browsers already have it and that Phorm is just a get rich quick scheme benfitting the former spyware company and BT shareholders only - all take no give.

You have your view... I have mine, fact is I many find it objectionable for an ISP leeching my data and selling it off to a third party especially when the customer has already paid the going rate for his/her connection. I also object to Phorm using any webpage content I provide to help form a "profile" of my visitors intersts, I object to Phrom having any Profiling access to emails I send to a webmail address that may be accessed from a "Phorm infested" ISP. I have a clear choice to send to Gmail or not, but i dont expect mails sent to yahoo or hotmail to be caught up in any profiling.

As far as IP address Goes, they have no yet proven that the UID cannot be linked to an IP, interseting to note that shortly they will know that some people are in Croydon or Ealing as users from those areas are set to be used in the next trials to take place.

This company has been busy spinning, wiki fiddling and outright lying in its attempt to sanitise this (Virgin are not in fact signed up) what they propose is no bette than the post office opening your mail and using the contents of that to decide what junk mail to put through your door. I think their actions speak louder than any words I have, to display the desperation they have leads me to think that they are getting more and more desperate to get this accepted.
Just My Opinion.... YMMV