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Standard User lelboy
(regular) Sun 01-Jan-12 12:53:30
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BT Infinity


[link to this post]
 
Hmmm, perhaps I've completely misread a few posts on here regarding how good Infinity is.
Some regular posters appear to be saying "awful": that's not been my experience.
No noticeable throttling - if any - and no loss of service other than two six hour periods when maintenance was being undertaken - this during the last nine months.
Even though BT CS is still pretty poor in my experience, the product itself is fine, and I'd happily recommend it to others - on all counts.
Cheers, Les.
Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Sun 01-Jan-12 13:20:35
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lelboy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lelboy:
Hmmm, perhaps I've completely misread a few posts on here regarding how good Infinity is.
Some regular posters appear to be saying "awful": that's not been my experience.
No noticeable throttling - if any - and no loss of service other than two six hour periods when maintenance was being undertaken - this during the last nine months.
Even though BT CS is still pretty poor in my experience, the product itself is fine, and I'd happily recommend it to others - on all counts.
Cheers, Les.
You will find the ones complaining are not actually using the service. You can see the extremes of that in the TalkTalk forum.



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Standard User lg56xbp
(newbie) Sun 01-Jan-12 13:34:01
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lelboy] [link to this post]
 
So torrents usually download at maximum speed at any time of the day or night?


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Standard User lelboy
(regular) Sun 01-Jan-12 13:34:18
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: BatBoy] [link to this post]
 
Yes, you're probably right. i notice on quite a few forums that people seem to have very little to do, other than complain about things they have no experience of - just joining whichever bandwagon suits. Ah well, Happy New Year to everyone in TBB land. Cheers, Les.
Standard User lelboy
(regular) Sun 01-Jan-12 13:38:04
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
Hi, Not a major torrent user at all, but for my purposes there is little or no problem at all. It seems that maybe others don't suffer either. You'll just have to figure out the pro's & con's and see if Infinity is likely to suit you. It suits me very well, but a couple of bob cheaper would be better!
Cheers, Les.
Standard User sel
(member) Sun 01-Jan-12 13:40:20
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
I agree torrents are badly throttled - even legit ones! But as I don't use them then it isn't a problem to me. But as was said I have not noticed any significant problems with anything else. Speeds do drop a bit at certain peek times, but compared to even the max speeds I used to get there is no comparison.

I dreaded coming to BT (mainly for their CS), but so far the service has been very reliable and I don't have any regrets.
Standard User lg56xbp
(newbie) Sun 01-Jan-12 14:00:42
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: sel] [link to this post]
 
It's the throttling bit that irks me. I'm not a torrent user - never have been. But if Be and numerous other companies can offer a truly unlimited service then why should anyone accept an inferior (and more expensive) offering from BT.

If the network can't cope with the traffic there are two sensible options:

i.) Upgrade it;
ii.) Stop overselling the existing capacity.
Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Sun 01-Jan-12 14:09:40
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lg56xbp:
It's the throttling bit that irks me. I'm not a torrent user - never have been.
Then torrents being throttled won't adversely affect you. Why do you care?



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Standard User lg56xbp
(newbie) Sun 01-Jan-12 14:13:36
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: BatBoy] [link to this post]
 
I care because I don't appreciate my ISP dictating what I should and should not be allowed to do. That's for lawmakers, not private corporations.

Moreover, if they start with torrents it's only a matter of time before other protocols are treated likewise.

Wait until Infinity becomes seriously populated ... I bet you'll see serious shaping then. frown
Standard User zyborg47
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 01-Jan-12 14:36:06
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lelboy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lelboy:
Hmmm, perhaps I've completely misread a few posts on here regarding how good Infinity is.
Some regular posters appear to be saying "awful": that's not been my experience.
No noticeable throttling - if any - and no loss of service other than two six hour periods when maintenance was being undertaken - this during the last nine months.
Even though BT CS is still pretty poor in my experience, the product itself is fine, and I'd happily recommend it to others - on all counts.
Cheers, Les.


i am staying as far away from BT as I can. Had enough of Bt network on their ADSL network.

Adrian

Desktop machine now powered by windows 7 pro 64bit , laptop by ubuntu

On ADSL24 using C&W network.
Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Sun 01-Jan-12 14:37:20
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lg56xbp:
I care because I don't appreciate my ISP dictating what I should and should not be allowed to do. That's for lawmakers, not private corporations.

Moreover, if they start with torrents it's only a matter of time before other protocols are treated likewise.

Wait until Infinity becomes seriously populated ... I bet you'll see serious shaping then. frown
I haven't seen anyone complaining...
In reply to a post by BatBoy:
You will find the ones complaining are not actually using the service. You can see the extremes of that in the TalkTalk forum.




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Standard User Zarjaz
(knowledge is power) Sun 01-Jan-12 15:14:52
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
It's the throttling bit that irks me. I'm not a torrent user - never have been. But if Be and numerous other companies can offer a truly unlimited service then why should anyone accept an inferior (and more expensive) offering from BT.

Perhaps the punters feel happier using a product, which due to it's advertised throttling, dissuades the folk who would use it to download terabytes a month ? Maybe the bandwidth they have earmarked for themselves looks feasible in business terms, if those who choose a 'truly unlimited' product, and all that entails, are not tempted to join ?

If 'Be and numerous other companies' can offer a superior and cheaper service, why doesn't everyone use them ? People like choice, it's human nature. If BT Infinity isn't your cup of tea, then don't use it, simple.

Standard User lg56xbp
(newbie) Sun 01-Jan-12 15:53:43
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
The Be comment was in reference to ADSL2. Be don't offer FTTP/FTTC .. yet.

ISPs should not be allowed to use the terms 'unlimited', 'unrestricted' or 'no limits' unless it really is the case, but that is another story.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not criticising BT Infinity. First, I don't have the service so can't comment on performance. Second, if my exchange did offer Infinity I'd order it today. My comments are based largely on having used BT's ADSL2 offering.

There is always a simple method to circumvent any form of throttling anyway, so that isn't a major issue if you know what you're doing.

I agree with your comments on the whole though smile
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sun 01-Jan-12 16:29:49
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lelboy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lelboy:
Hmmm, perhaps I've completely misread a few posts on here regarding how good Infinity is.
Some regular posters appear to be saying "awful": that's not been my experience.
If this was triggered by this thread, you have indeed completely misread some posts smile.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - IDNet Home Starter Fibre. Live BQM.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
Standard User GMAN98
(experienced) Sun 01-Jan-12 16:41:32
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
Is it about coping tho?

Yeah they could throw more bandwidth centrally so they don't have to throttle but that would mean higher priced products, bandwidth isn't free.

Would you rather that is the case, a higher priced product for people whether they use torrents or not?

It is very competitively priced at the moment, I'd rather it stay that way personally, who cares about torrents fast or slow?

For legit reasons torrents probably makes up 0.000001% of a customer base.
Standard User lelboy
(member) Sun 01-Jan-12 17:25:21
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Hi Bob, I think it was this thread!
I thought MHC gave a link to a very poor speedtest.net result - <10 - and said "Awful".
Well, Happy New year anyway.
Cheers, Les.
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sun 01-Jan-12 17:31:41
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lelboy] [link to this post]
 
Happy New Year to you too, but that thread wasn't specifically Infinity, the OP can't even get it, and read my post there about people (sensibly) tending to discourage multiple TBpm downloaders from joining their service smile

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - IDNet Home Starter Fibre. Live BQM.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
Standard User lg56xbp
(newbie) Sun 01-Jan-12 17:44:12
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: GMAN98] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by GMAN98:
Would you rather that is the case, a higher priced product for people whether they use torrents or not?

It is very competitively priced at the moment, I'd rather it stay that way personally, who cares about torrents fast or slow?



I agree with you 100%.

BUT

Wouldn't it be better if ISPs were simply upfront about what they are providing, what it can be used for and when, and what the real limits are?

I for one would gladly pay anywhere from £50 - £100 monthly for a truly unlimited 100MBit pipe.

BT (and other ISPs) should offer a product which really is 'Unlimited' - and charge accordingly.
Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Sun 01-Jan-12 17:54:38
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lg56xbp:
Wouldn't it be better if ISPs were simply upfront about what they are providing, what it can be used for and when, and what the real limits are?

I for one would gladly pay anywhere from £50 - £100 monthly for a truly unlimited 100MBit pipe.

BT (and other ISPs) should offer a product which really is 'Unlimited' - and charge accordingly.
They are up front. The throttling of torrents is stated explicitly.



______________________________________________________________________________. __________________
Standard User MHC
(legend) Sun 01-Jan-12 18:11:32
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lelboy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lelboy:
Hi Bob, I think it was this thread!
I thought MHC gave a link to a very poor speedtest.net result - <10 - and said "Awful".
Well, Happy New year anyway.
Cheers, Les.



I certainly did ... but it was slightly TIC tongue

I find it near excellent - even though I have a very odd issue at present which can be replicated - or even removed by along with BT Tech Support, Engineering Support, second line support and tech visits we cannot find the source and permanent resolution.





~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User GMAN98
(experienced) Sun 01-Jan-12 18:19:52
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
Looks up front to me though


You go here:- http://www.productsandservices.bt.com/consumerProduc...

Click legal stuff

it states "†Network management policy applies to unlimited options. See www.bt.com/broadbandusagepolicy for details. "

Which takes you here:-

http://www.productsandservices.bt.com/consumerProduc...

Its not really tucked away or hidden its easy enough to see in my opinion
Standard User lg56xbp
(newbie) Sun 01-Jan-12 18:24:24
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: BatBoy] [link to this post]
 
]They are up front. The throttling of torrents is stated explicitly.



Where does it state how much you are actually able to download before shaping is applied?

Where does it state how much you will be throttled - and at which point of usage throttling will be applied?


Christ, it's worse than I thought:

downstream restrictions will typically be in place 4pm - midnight on weekdays and 9am - midnight on the weekend. Upstream restrictions may be in place at other times.



In other words, they only 'manage' traffic when 99.9% of folks will actually be using the service.

Edited by lg56xbp (Sun 01-Jan-12 18:27:46)

Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sun 01-Jan-12 18:31:43
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lg56xbp:
]They are up front. The throttling of torrents is stated explicitly.
Where does it state how much you are actually able to download before shaping is applied?
A red herring introduced by earlier posters stating that the 300GB FUP still applies.
Where does it state how much you will be throttled - and at which point of usage throttling will be applied?
Purely dependent on the current load on the (BT Retail) system as a whole, so any individual user can be affected in a different way on different days and at different times, depending on how many others are caning it at that time.

Wait for the Olympics! There'll be very few ISPs ride those out without big trouble. Particularly during office hours, which is counter-intuitive but obvious once you think about it.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - IDNet Home Starter Fibre. Live BQM.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Sun 01-Jan-12 18:35:40
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
It says:

Is traffic management used during peak hours? Yes
When are typical peak hours? Weekdays: 4pm-12pm Weekends: 9am-12pm
What type of traffic is managed during these periods? Slowed down Peer-to-Peer (P2P)



______________________________________________________________________________. __________________
Standard User lelboy
(member) Sun 01-Jan-12 18:42:25
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: MHC] [link to this post]
 
I think my TIC modulator needs replacing!
Yes, even though BT are [censored] useless at general CS, I have to say that Infinity is fine. I'm wondering whether my area (east London) will be selected for the upgrade trials in the New year. I can live in hope! Cheers, Les.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 02-Jan-12 17:40:33
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
I suggest you visit aa.nu and look at their ethernet products and get an estimate for 100Mbps and sit back and prepare to be shocked, as to the cost of providing this

On the network Infinity is running over, every 1Mbps of traffic costs around £50 to £60 per month, i.e. the BT Wholesale WBC platform.

Be uses a different backhaul network, that has lower costs per Mbps

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 02-Jan-12 17:42:47
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: lg56xbp] [link to this post]
 
Most traffic management cannot be described precisely, because it will vary from day to day, depending on what all the other users are doing.

e.g. if you try and use torrents when millions others are then it will be slower, than if only a few 1000 are.

Andrew Ferguson, and[email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User blueacid
(committed) Mon 02-Jan-12 23:03:15
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Would you therefore suspect that the current reports from users that BT Infinity is always fast are not long for this world?

I had been wondering whether BT Retail had arranged a high amount of backhaul for their marketing drive & they're slowly filling it up and aren't done yet.. this is of course complete speculation, I don't intend to scaremonger, more just simply enquire!

Cheers,
Blueacid
=================================
Was on Xilo C&W LLU on MRCEN, Now Be* on MRARD.
Standard User RobFlet
(committed) Tue 03-Jan-12 15:47:35
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: blueacid] [link to this post]
 
I suspect that our initial stable and very fast BT Infinity connections may well slow down as more customers are brought on-line. However, my engineer told me that there were only 128 connections available in the FTTC cabinet to corss connect to the main green cab. So, for my area at least, there is already a physical limitation as to how many customers can actually be connected.

I wonder how many other new green cabs are in fact not able to fulfiul all the connections in the old box? I suspect most, and that BT will probably want a reasonably full order book before sending out people to install extra kit into the cabs....

Anyone else know what %age of old cab connections can actually be re-routed to the new cabs?

Rob

1999 Freeserve Dial up --> Freeserve Anytime ---> 2005 Wanadoo 512k BB ---> Jul 2009 Orange up 8 Megs(hah!) --> Nov 2009 O2 LLU -> Nov 2011 BT Infinity( getting 37.5 megs now on ethernet)

Yamaha AW16G user
Red5Audio Microphones
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Tue 03-Jan-12 16:16:04
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: RobFlet] [link to this post]
 
The original standard size FTTC cabinet has space for 288 connections. Then there is the question of how many ports are installed in it, and, as you say, the number of pairs in the linking cable.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - IDNet Home Starter Fibre. Live BQM.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
Standard User RobFlet
(committed) Tue 03-Jan-12 17:12:08
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
So, without more investment in hardware and time to install, there is a bit of self limiting going on here for the fiurst round of FTTC ...

So, for those of us in on the ground, we should be getting a good service then for some time to come ...

Unless you know different, that is!

Very very pleased with my Infinity - even when there was a glitch, I phoned support and got India - immediately escalated, and all was right again pretty quickly and even got a follow-up call to check the next day. Whether anything was actually done, who knows? But whatever ... one small glitch with d/l's down to a few megs - and then back up again to the full whack -

It'll start to get interesting once other players start to hit the market in a bigger way I suspect.

Cheers, and Happy New Year all ... at 37.5 megs down!

Rob

1999 Freeserve Dial up --> Freeserve Anytime ---> 2005 Wanadoo 512k BB ---> Jul 2009 Orange up 8 Megs(hah!) --> Nov 2009 O2 LLU -> Nov 2011 BT Infinity( getting 37.5 megs now on ethernet)

Yamaha AW16G user
Red5Audio Microphones
Standard User nomadd11
(member) Sat 07-Jan-12 13:01:15
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Re: BT Infinity


[re: RobFlet] [link to this post]
 
My Infinity was fine for the first month. Then last week, it fell from 36Mb to just 4Mb. Had 4 engineer visits over 2 days in order to get it all sorted. They replaced everything - sockets, cable to the local telephone pole, "rewired and fixed" the cabinet - twice in two days - and still it was bad.

In the end, they'd run out of options. One "expert" they called then suggested a faulty port in the cabinet was to blame. Port switched over, and immediately back up to speed again. Getting 37.5Mb down and 7Mb up now, so pleased overall. Let's just hope it stays fixed. smile

Nomadd
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