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Standard User crule
(newbie) Thu 15-Oct-15 18:54:59
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HH4 replacement


[link to this post]
 
Hi
I am getting fed up with my home hub4 rebooting every 14 days and therefore changing my Ip address.
suprisingly depending on the ip address assigned the download speed can vary as much as 1mbit and on a connection with only 2mbit average DL that is important.
Can anyone recommend a router for adsl use on a standard copper connection for a EO line
Thjanks
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 15-Oct-15 21:14:53
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: crule] [link to this post]
 
I'd suggest getting the problem affecting your service resolved first. What line stats does the router show ?

Standard User BuckleZ
(fountain of knowledge) Fri 16-Oct-15 10:08:35
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: crule] [link to this post]
 
I;'ve always found any of the Netgear routers to be very good at holding connection, my old flashed Sky DG834GT 0 never would drop.


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Standard User crule
(newbie) Fri 16-Oct-15 11:02:03
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
Many thanks for the replies.
With an auto reboot on Monday morning the Ip address changed (as expected) The SNR remained the same at 6db but the sync speed changed by 900kbts.on the download side.
I have a long line about 5km some of which is Cu plated Al so the physics is against me but I am interested why the sync speed changes. The sync speed will now stay the same until the next auto reboot on Monday week. This has been going on now for over a year.
Standard User PaulKirby
(experienced) Fri 16-Oct-15 11:11:32
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Zarjaz:
I'd suggest getting the problem affecting your service resolved first. What line stats does the router show ?
Its BT that does a fortnightly reboot, our HH4 does it as well exactly 14 days.
Its not just a resync, its a complete reboot of the HH4.

I was told by BT on the phone that it was to free up resources and keep the HH4 stable.

If this keep happening I will be changing over to my FRITZ!Box 3390.

Paul
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Fri 16-Oct-15 11:42:50
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: crule] [link to this post]
 
Sync speed always does stay the same between reboots unless a large noise burst or manual re-sync takes place. If these auto reboots are occurring during the night, a single re-sync or reboot well inside daylight hours will almost always give a higher speed. The background external noise is higher at night and causes a lowish sync.

Have a read of this page for more detail.

The indispensable man or woman passes from the scene, and what happens next is more or less the same thing as was happening before.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. Sync 59999/14372kbps @ 600m. - BQM
Standard User MHC
(sensei) Fri 16-Oct-15 11:46:27
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: crule] [link to this post]
 
Long line, slow speeds ... It may be an old device, however look at buying a 2wire 2700HGV (not 2701). You can pick them up for around £5-10. They have an excellent reputation of holding a long line, increasing the actual sync speed (they have a lower operational SNR whilst maintaining the known 6dB SNR), and may drop to an operational 3dB SNR. Their router capabilities are not to 2015 levels however for a lot of ADSL users they can be perfectly adequate.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User crule
(newbie) Fri 16-Oct-15 11:58:51
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: MHC] [link to this post]
 
Many thanks for all the replies.
I was not aware that the reboot is triggered by BT/OR I thought it was initiated by the router itself!
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Fri 16-Oct-15 12:43:24
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: crule] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by crule:
Many thanks for all the replies.
I was not aware that the reboot is triggered by BT/OR I thought it was initiated by the router itself!

Opinions vary, but most people seem to think the Home Hub 4 is rebooted every 14 days via local trigger. Someone here left it unplugged for 14 days and still observed a reboot, I believe.

Oliver.
Standard User PaulKirby
(experienced) Sat 17-Oct-15 11:04:23
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
In reply to a post by crule:
Many thanks for all the replies.
I was not aware that the reboot is triggered by BT/OR I thought it was initiated by the router itself!

Opinions vary, but most people seem to think the Home Hub 4 is rebooted every 14 days via local trigger. Someone here left it unplugged for 14 days and still observed a reboot, I believe.
That's what I meant, I was referring to. it wasn't due to an issue with noise etc, going by my logs below you can see its being rebooted:

08:48:51, 11 Oct. ( 137.160000) CWMP: session completed successfully
08:48:50, 11 Oct. ( 136.810000) CWMP: HTTP authentication success from https://pbthdm.bt.mo
08:48:22, 11 Oct. ( 128.830000) NTP synchronization success!
08:48:17, 11 Oct. ( 123.370000) CWMP: Server URL: https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
08:48:17, 11 Oct. ( 123.360000) CWMP: Session start now. Event code(s): '1 BOOT,4 VALUE CHANGE'
08:48:16, 11 Oct. ( 121.910000) NTP synchronization start
08:48:13, 11 Oct. ( 119.320000) PPP IPCP Receive Configuration ACK
08:48:13, 11 Oct. ( 119.310000) PPP IPCP Send Configuration Request
08:48:13, 11 Oct. ( 119.300000) PPP IPCP Receive Configuration NAK
08:48:11, 11 Oct. ( 117.140000) PPP IPCP Send Configuration ACK
08:48:11, 11 Oct. ( 117.140000) PPP IPCP Receive Configuration Request
08:48:10, 11 Oct. ( 116.630000) PPP IPCP Send Configuration Request
08:48:10, 11 Oct. ( 116.630000) WAN operating mode is DSL
08:48:10, 11 Oct. ( 116.630000) Last WAN operating mode was DSL
08:48:09, 11 Oct. ( 115.160000) PPPoA is up - VPI: 0, VCI:38
08:48:09, 11 Oct. ( 115.140000) CHAP authentication successful
08:48:08, 11 Oct. ( 114.830000) CHAP Receive Challenge
08:48:08, 11 Oct. ( 114.830000) Starting CHAP authentication with peer
08:48:08, 11 Oct. ( 114.830000) PPP LCP Receive Configuration ACK
08:48:08, 11 Oct. ( 114.820000) PPP LCP Send Configuration Request
08:48:08, 11 Oct. ( 114.820000) PPP LCP Receive Configuration Reject
08:48:08, 11 Oct. ( 114.820000) PPP LCP Send Configuration ACK
08:48:08, 11 Oct. ( 114.820000) PPP LCP Receive Configuration Request
08:48:08, 11 Oct. ( 114.680000) PPP LCP Send Configuration Request
08:48:05, 11 Oct. ( 111.540000) ETHoA is up - VPI: 0, VCI:35
08:48:05, 11 Oct. ( 111.540000) DSL is up
08:48:04, 11 Oct. ( 110.470000) DSL noise margin: 5.90 dB upstream, 6.00 dB downstream
08:48:03, 11 Oct. ( 109.460000) DSL line rate: 1108 Kbps upstream, 6453 Kbps downstream
08:47:47, 11 Oct. ( 93.320000) CWMP: session closed due to error: No response
08:47:47, 11 Oct. ( 93.310000) CWMP: Initializing transaction for event code 4 VALUE CHANGE
08:47:47, 11 Oct. ( 93.300000) CWMP: Server URL: https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
08:47:47, 11 Oct. ( 93.290000) CWMP: Session start now. Event code(s): '1 BOOT,4 VALUE CHANGE'
08:47:16, 11 Oct. ( 62.810000) CWMP: session closed due to error: No response
08:47:09, 11 Oct. ( 55.650000) CWMP: Server URL: https://pbthdm.bt.mo; Connecting as user: ACS username
08:47:09, 11 Oct. ( 55.650000) CWMP: Session start now. Event code(s): '1 BOOT,4 VALUE CHANGE'
08:47:08, 11 Oct. ( 54.840000) CWMP: Initializing transaction for event code 1 BOOT
08:47:06, 11 Oct. ( 52.010000) Wire Lan Port 1 up
08:47:04, 11 Oct. ( 50.530000) WAN Auto-sensing running.
08:47:01, 11 Oct. ( 47.690000) System up, firmware version: 4.7.5.1.83.8.130.1.26.1.1 (Type A)
08:46:35, 11 Oct. ( 21.670000) System start 
08:46:12, 11 Oct. (1273027.310000) PPP LCP Send Termination Request [User request]
08:46:10, 11 Oct. (1273025.360000) The system is going DOWN for reboot.
08:46:10, 11 Oct. (1273025.360000) OpenRG is going for reboot by IPC command
08:46:05, 11 Oct. (1273020.360000) OpenRG will go down for reboot in 5 seconds

It doesn't even check if the connection is being used or not before it starts the reboot process.

Basically its an internal procedure call (IPC) that gets called every 14 days to reboot the HomeHub, so maybe what BT told me was correct in a way, where it is to keep the HH stable.

Very frustrating.

Like I said I am very tempted to use my FRITZ!Box, shows loads more stats and seem to have more control over the connection, but most due to the more info tongue.

Paul
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 17-Oct-15 13:02:38
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by PaulKirby:
Basically its an internal procedure call (IPC) that gets called every 14 days to reboot the HomeHub, so maybe what BT told me was correct in a way, where it is to keep the HH stable.

Pretty poor if that is the case, since I don't know of any other router that force reboots itself every x days to "clean up". It's almost like the firmware developers put it in there just in case there was a memory leak bug in their programming, no confidence in their skills.

Oliver.
Standard User keith969
(regular) Sat 17-Oct-15 13:25:23
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
No worse than Windows and its frequent updates (which also require a reboot) to fix security issues.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 17-Oct-15 13:35:19
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
So they are saying:-

To maintain your router's stability, we have made it automatically reboot without checking whether or not you are passing data through it.

Very sensible indeed. Not.

At least Windows doesn't reboot without warning to finish applying updates.

The indispensable man or woman passes from the scene, and what happens next is more or less the same thing as was happening before.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. Sync 59999/14372kbps @ 600m. - BQM
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 17-Oct-15 13:40:06
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: keith969] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by keith969:
No worse than Windows and its frequent updates (which also require a reboot) to fix security issues.

It's not the same because the HH4 is not applying updates when it reboots

Oliver.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 17-Oct-15 13:45:22
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
I know. That point was referring to Keith's reply to you smile. I was pointing out that at least Windows lets you decide when it reboots.

The indispensable man or woman passes from the scene, and what happens next is more or less the same thing as was happening before.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. Sync 59999/14372kbps @ 600m. - BQM
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 17-Oct-15 13:51:05
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
I know. That point was referring to Keith's reply to you smile.

Yes, and I clicked reply on keith's post, not yours. smile

Oliver.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 17-Oct-15 13:53:52
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
I got confused smile.

The indispensable man or woman passes from the scene, and what happens next is more or less the same thing as was happening before.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. Sync 59999/14372kbps @ 600m. - BQM
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 17-Oct-15 13:55:17
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
I got confused smile.

Fair enough smile

In reply to a post by RobertoS:
I was pointing out that at least Windows lets you decide when it reboots.

And more importantly Windows requires a reboot because system files cannot be updated while they are in use. The HH4 reboots for no reason. Even if the HH4 let you choose when it rebooted it would stll be unacceptable because there is no good reason for it to do these 14 day reboots.

Oliver.
Standard User keith969
(regular) Sat 17-Oct-15 13:55:36
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Agreed Windows lets you decide if it's going to reboot, although the AV gets annoyed if I don't. However my HH5 seems to only reboot at night, so I don't really care. If it did, I would be mightily fed up as I work from home and have frequent webex / skype calls during the day.
Standard User PaulKirby
(experienced) Sat 17-Oct-15 14:23:08
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
So they are saying:-

To maintain your router's stability, we have made it automatically reboot without checking whether or not you are passing data through it.

Very sensible indeed. Not.

At least Windows doesn't reboot without warning to finish applying updates.
You say windows doesn't do that, have you used windows 10, it gets an update in the background and if you tell it to tell you that it needs to reboot it tells you squat and just kills the display with a black screen resulting in you having to press reset.

Maybe that's a bug, but don't M$ say that's a feature LOL.

Paul
Standard User PaulKirby
(experienced) Sat 17-Oct-15 14:25:39
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
I know. That point was referring to Keith's reply to you smile. I was pointing out that at least Windows lets you decide when it reboots.
lol, no it doesn't Windows 10 locks up your PC after updates have been installed that requires a reboot, or maybe a broken OS.

Don't get me wrong I like Windows 10, but its just soo buggy atm.

Paul
Standard User PaulKirby
(experienced) Sat 17-Oct-15 14:26:24
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: keith969] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by keith969:
Agreed Windows lets you decide if it's going to reboot, although the AV gets annoyed if I don't. However my HH5 seems to only reboot at night, so I don't really care. If it did, I would be mightily fed up as I work from home and have frequent webex / skype calls during the day.
I have had my HH4 reboot midday.

Paul
Standard User PaulKirby
(experienced) Sat 17-Oct-15 14:30:10
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
I got confused smile.
Just like the Home Hubs LOL

Maybe you need a reboot tongue

Paul
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 17-Oct-15 15:58:43
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Re: HH4 replacement


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by PaulKirby:
Maybe you need a reboot tongue
I certainly feel like it at times smile.

I don't think the bugs in Win 10 really count for this discussion though.

The indispensable man or woman passes from the scene, and what happens next is more or less the same thing as was happening before.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. Sync 59999/14372kbps @ 600m. - BQM

Edited by RobertoS (Sat 17-Oct-15 16:00:04)

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