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Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 09-Jun-16 11:24:07
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Max Upload Dropping


[link to this post]
 
My max up used to be over 34000 and its slowly dropped as the cab has filled up but my HH5 Type B just rebooted and its dropped like a brick, thing is the up noise margin was at nearly 10db before the drop

7. Maximum Data Rate: 22140 / 109757
8. Noise Margin: 6.6 / 14.0
9. Line Attenuation: 5.3 / 6.4

As it stands clearly this doesn't effect my actual speeds but one more drop and it will.
Standard User lee111s
(committed) Fri 10-Jun-16 13:46:33
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: Alnath] [link to this post]
 
Possibly crosstalk.

It's irrelevant anyway.
Standard User thomaswarne01
(member) Fri 10-Jun-16 15:51:08
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: lee111s] [link to this post]
 
are you stil getting up to 10-20Mbps upload even though that's the max possible?

BT FTTP Installed June 2016, 74Mbps down, 20Mbps up.
Speedtest Result


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Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 11-Jun-16 10:49:28
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: lee111s] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lee111s:
Possibly crosstalk.

It's irrelevant anyway.


It would have to be the universe's biggest case of crosstalk ever known to man and alien.
Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 11-Jun-16 10:56:57
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: thomaswarne01] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by thomaswarne01:
are you stil getting up to 10-20Mbps upload even though that's the max possible?


My speeds are bang on (over wireless http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html... ) so its not a problem as such but 22Mbit with a line attenuation of 5db is curious. My main worry is if it happens again it will then impact on my speeds.

However i have received a possible explanation elsewhere which made perfect sense.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 11-Jun-16 11:32:52
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: Alnath] [link to this post]
 
We need the connection speeds down and up as well as the maxima. They cannot be assessed in isolation, as changes of certain DLM settings affect the relationship between them.

When we can see the before and after of both we can often deduce what has happened. Given just the maxima we can't.

Kindness isn't going to cure the world of all its awfulness but it's a good place to begin. Daisy Ridley.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. Sync 59500/14989kbps @ 600m. - BQM

Edited by RobertoS (Sat 11-Jun-16 11:34:35)

Standard User mlmclaren
(knowledge is power) Sat 11-Jun-16 12:07:37
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: Alnath] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Alnath:
In reply to a post by lee111s:
Possibly crosstalk.

It's irrelevant anyway.


It would have to be the universe's biggest case of crosstalk ever known to man and alien.


I went from 116/31 to 78/22 due to crosstalk, it was much worse up until 2 weeks ago, I was down at 53/21 for a while but seems that might of been a REIN issue or possibly a vacating neighbour may have given my connection a temporary lease of life.

I'm still awaiting the results of the 183 apartments next door to come online though I suspect Virgin Media may be doing 'some sort' of rollout in the building.... I doubt its cable, or atleast coax from the street anyway, maybe a FTTB/P development... maybe nothing at all.

As gelous as I would be I would rather Virgin rolled out in there, might give the 96 port BDUK funded cab a fighting chance against crosstalk.

BTInfinity - 79999/19999kbps - Quality Monitor - Quality Monitor 2
VirginMedia - 77000/5250kbps - Quality Monitor - Quality Monitor 2
SkyFibre - ComingSoon
Standard User epyon
(experienced) Sun 12-Jun-16 09:52:31
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: mlmclaren] [link to this post]
 
That is quite a fluctuation

i think i've only went from

120/40 to 97/29

in just over 3 years

and it hasn't moved from 97/29 for around 6 months i assume my cab is full or nearly full.

BT Infinity 2 - 80/20
BT Infinity 2 Speedtest *Huawei HG635*
BT Mobile - 4G
BT Mobile 4G Speedtest *Huawei PLK-L01*

Edited by epyon (Sun 12-Jun-16 09:52:58)

Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 12-Jun-16 10:28:32
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: mlmclaren] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by mlmclaren:
In reply to a post by Alnath:
In reply to a post by lee111s:
Possibly crosstalk.

It's irrelevant anyway.


It would have to be the universe's biggest case of crosstalk ever known to man and alien.


I went from 116/31 to 78/22 due to crosstalk, it was much worse up until 2 weeks ago, I was down at 53/21 for a while but seems that might of been a REIN issue or possibly a vacating neighbour may have given my connection a temporary lease of life.

I'm still awaiting the results of the 183 apartments next door to come online though I suspect Virgin Media may be doing 'some sort' of rollout in the building.... I doubt its cable, or atleast coax from the street anyway, maybe a FTTB/P development... maybe nothing at all.

As gelous as I would be I would rather Virgin rolled out in there, might give the 96 port BDUK funded cab a fighting chance against crosstalk.


Which is great but this was a single drop on the upstream only. On the reboot that caused the drop in max upload the max download actually increased by 5Mbit.

5 years ago my speeds were 135/35 and over that 5 years it had dropped to 103/29, you'd assume that was all down to crosstalk.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sun 12-Jun-16 11:01:18
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: Alnath] [link to this post]
 
For the second time, max figures and actual figures are related. With some DLM adjustments of the download they frequently move dramatically in opposite directions on a re-sync. I know you are bothered about the upload, but if that has happened it gives a strong indication of the type of change the DLM has made, or whether it has made no change at all.

That in turn gives a clue to what has happened to the upload. If you know the make of FTTC cabinet that can be useful as well.

Kindness isn't going to cure the world of all its awfulness but it's a good place to begin. Daisy Ridley.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. Sync 59500/14989kbps @ 600m. - BQM

Edited by RobertoS (Sun 12-Jun-16 11:01:50)

Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Mon 13-Jun-16 10:11:47
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
For the second time, max figures and actual figures are related. With some DLM adjustments of the download they frequently move dramatically in opposite directions on a re-sync. I know you are bothered about the upload, but if that has happened it gives a strong indication of the type of change the DLM has made, or whether it has made no change at all.

That in turn gives a clue to what has happened to the upload. If you know the make of FTTC cabinet that can be useful as well.


ECI Cab with a HH5 Type B, i have a Type A but don't really want to put it back on. Switching between a MKIII and a MKII filter didn't do owt and i have run a quiet line test and the line is quiet so i am assuming everything is fine with the physical condition of the line and i reiterate actual my speeds are spot on http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/5399684714

6. Data Rate: 19993 / 79999
7. Maximum Data Rate: 21942 / 110149
8. Noise Margin: 6.6 / 14.2
9. Line Attenuation: 5.1 / 6.4
Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 19-Jun-16 09:41:01
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
no idea then?
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sun 19-Jun-16 10:59:03
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: Alnath] [link to this post]
 
Sorry, I missed your previous post.

I think the drop in attainable could be just more of the same, more crosstalk. Your actual in both directions is still the maximum for your product.

Re your two speed tests, I hadn't looked at your early one using thinkbroadband. That Avg TBB single thread line suggests throttling or congestion somewhere. It should be very close to the multi-thread one. Speedtest.net and BT Wholesale tests only use multi-thread, and speedtest.net drops some of the slower periods in the test as well.

Real life speed can be affected by poor single-thread throughput, though whether most people would notice it is another matter.

I suggest you see if the tbb test is still doing the same, and if so start a new thread about that. Include in it your current actual stats and the test you give above, as well as whatever the new one shows.

Kindness isn't going to cure the world of all its awfulness but it's a good place to begin. Daisy Ridley.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. Sync 59500/14989kbps @ 600m. - BQM
Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 21-Jun-16 10:32:12
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Thank you for your reply, although if the dropping upload attainable was down to crosstalk wouldn't the max download attainable have dropped as well and not increased by 8Mbit?

As i have pointed out a couple of times i cannot moan about the speeds, but if the upload takes another dip on the next reboot i have problems.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Tue 21-Jun-16 10:58:49
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: Alnath] [link to this post]
 
If interleaving gets turned on, on higher attenuation lines the downstream sync drops by several Mbps, 10Mbps fall being typical, and the downstream max attainable rises by a similar amount. Now I have to guess that with your very low attenuation interleaving has been turned on but 79999 actual is still possible.

Has your base latency gone up by 8ms? First step interleaving causes that, higher levels 16ms or more addition.

It's not easy to be sure what is going on, as we don't often see interleaving on upstream and we need full stats to know if that is also in place. From what I remember this opposite movement of actual and attainable doesn't happen on upstream, but I could easily be wrong.

Kindness isn't going to cure the world of all its awfulness but it's a good place to begin. Daisy Ridley.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - AAISP Home::1 80/20. Sync 59500/14989kbps @ 600m. - BQM
Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 21-Jun-16 13:26:33
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
If interleaving gets turned on, on higher attenuation lines the downstream sync drops by several Mbps, 10Mbps fall being typical, and the downstream max attainable rises by a similar amount. Now I have to guess that with your very low attenuation interleaving has been turned on but 79999 actual is still possible.

Has your base latency gone up by 8ms? First step interleaving causes that, higher levels 16ms or more addition.

It's not easy to be sure what is going on, as we don't often see interleaving on upstream and we need full stats to know if that is also in place. From what I remember this opposite movement of actual and attainable doesn't happen on upstream, but I could easily be wrong.


When i got infinity in 2011 the fastest ping i got on speedtest was 15ms, 5 years later it is still 15ms so i don't know.

It was suggested on another forum that one possible cause is the upstream power may have been reduced, i am not very technical but that seemed as plausible as owt else i have heard.

This all happened shortly after a 14 day BT resync or whatever it does every 2 weeks. Less than 24 hours in to the next 14 day period and the router resyned between 2 and 3 in the morning and the speeds are what i have posted.

I am tempted to put my Type A back on seeing as i am on an ECI cab just to see if it makes a difference.
Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 21-Jun-16 14:58:06
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: Alnath] [link to this post]
 
I put the Type A on and not a lot happened

Type A

6. Data rate: 19993 / 79906
7. Maximum data rate: 22158 / 112876
8. Noise margin: 6.4 / 14.5
9. Line attenuation: 5.2 / 5.3
10. Signal attenuation: 5.1 / 5.3

Type B

6. Data Rate: 19993 / 79999
7. Maximum Data Rate: 21986 / 110114
8. Noise Margin: 6.7 / 14.1
9. Line Attenuation: 5.1 / 6.4
Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 21-Jun-16 15:44:07
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
the alternative TBB speedtest gives a different picture regarding the speed if i have read it right

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14665...
Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Wed 22-Jun-16 12:14:06
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: Alnath] [link to this post]
 
Put the Type B back on, the 5GHz side has better range than my Type A.

Dunno if this helps at all

current linestatus
state: UP
mode: VDSL2
mod type: Profile 17a
snr margin down: 141
snr margin up: 66
latn down: 64
latn up: 51
satn down: 0
satn up: 0
output power down: %2D107
output power up: 134
rate down: 79999
rate up: 19998
attainable rate down: 110091000
attainable rate up: 22014480
chantype: fast
Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 23-Jun-16 10:04:50
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: Alnath] [link to this post]
 
Well god knows what that was all about, it did a resync at 05:20:55 and its all ok again

6. Data Rate: 20000 / 79999
7. Maximum Data Rate: 34192 / 109675
8. Noise Margin: 15.6 / 14.0
9. Line Attenuation: 5.2 / 6.4
Standard User Alnath
(fountain of knowledge) Mon 04-Jul-16 12:13:33
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Re: Max Upload Dropping


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
Re your two speed tests, I hadn't looked at your early one using thinkbroadband. That Avg TBB single thread line suggests throttling or congestion somewhere. It should be very close to the multi-thread one.


The single thread speed has also recovered now

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/14676...
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