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Standard User o1nk
(newbie) Sat 04-Aug-12 09:06:33
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21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[link to this post]
 
A broadstroke comparison to 'Bank of Dave', our village has simply had enough

Our exchange is here:
SamKnows - Broadband Availability - Wickwar (SSWWR) Exchange
We have had 8mb broadband (full 8mb as we sit on the exchange) for a while now and 21CN was pencilled in for Mar 2011.
However, the pencil marks were rubbed out and no upgrade is now set, ever since the announcement of FTTC
We have no cable in the area and 8mb is now the equivalent of 512kb broadband. Especially when you have teenagers in the house!
As BT had no plans for a 21CN network for our exchange, I bandied the idea about to a few of the villagers to unbundle the exchange ourselves.
A figure quoted from another question I asked put the cost at about £100,000 for the outlay
We could easily club together that amount very instantly
My question is;
How we could go about it?

Who to contact?

Prices involved?

Hardware needed?

Who manages it in the exchange?
I have a million questions, but if someone pointed me in the right direction, I could get the ball moving very very quickly. We are now sick of being held to ransom as BT hits FTTC to the population density areas and leave us in the lurch.
Any help you can give us would be greatly appreciated
Standard User camieabz
(sensei) Sat 04-Aug-12 09:44:01
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
http://www.choose.net/media/guide/features/rural-bro...

http://wraycomcom.org.uk/

I imagine 100K is far too high for a 21CN changeover, given the costs of fibre for Iwade.

See their blog:

http://www.iwadevillage.co.uk/services.aspx?subnavid=42

2009 survey:

http://iwadevillage.co.uk/broadbandsurvey2009results...

First step would be to establish the proportion of residents who are unhappy, and then see who would pay for faster broadband (rollout). The survey itself might help the community to be more aware of others being in the same situation.

~ Camieabz ~

All Connection Data ~ Some plusnet links

mod'er·a'tion n.
Synonyms: temperance, restraint, modesty.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 04-Aug-12 14:16:05
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
If you unbundle the exchange yourselfs, then who is going to provide the ISP services?

Might you not find it easier to just make it more attractive for a Sky or TalkTalk to do the work?

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.


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Standard User o1nk
(newbie) Sat 04-Aug-12 16:36:44
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Fabulous read. Thank you very much to all

So if I am reading this correctly. If we put up x (roughly £65k) amount of pounds, BT will install FTTC?
Money is not an option. We are in the "10% that won't be on Super Fast Broadband by 2015"
I have a daughter, as we speak, on YOUTUBE and my wife is screaming at me because she cannot watch iPlayer without buffering, at the same time. Which leaves me with dial-up leftovers
Not to mention, my 16 year old is not home yet! Spotify, XBOX Live etc

In today's age, 8 meg is not enough for a family
That is why our village will pay itself for FTTC

What if we do pay for all of it. Do we own the pipes etc, like we would 21CN hardware?
Is BT then like a sub-contractor?

Answers to others. No we wouldn't want to be our own ISP, although someone would manage it if asked. Talented people around here and people are giving up their time and effort for this.

Sky and BT will not do it. 900 houses only on the exchange

Edited by o1nk (Sat 04-Aug-12 16:38:54)

Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sat 04-Aug-12 16:59:11
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
How close is the Openreach FTTC network already? As you can FTTC enable cabinets on an exchange without enabling the WBC network expansion at an exchange.

On the smaller exchanges I suspect this will be the preferred method, with the eventual plan to remove the exchange completely, reducing the costs to Openreach.

if you pay for FTTC from Openreach you DO NOT own it, you have simply underwritten the capex costs, and would still need to pay the standard monthly fees, but has the advantage if hardware breaks you are not paying to replace it.

I should point out, just in case its not obvious, 21CN is generally delivered as ADSL2+ from the exchange, FTTC is a step on top of that, and for those only getting 3 to 4 Meg now ADSL2+ makes very little difference. Those who benefit will be those with a 42dB attenuation (3.5km) or shorter line.

If you are on a connection that is faster than 5 Mbps now, and struggling to buffer iPlayer, then something else is wrong. People assume FTTC is needed, but very often the problem may not be the DSL side but the ISP.

Looking at maps.thinkbroadband.com shows people getting speeds well below what you would expect for the distance from the telephone exchange.

Put it this way, with resonable house wiring, you should have a sync of 5 Meg now right out to a road distance from 3km from the exchange. The people with speedtests posted are all on ISPs who I would NOT recommend for an exchange that is not unbundled, since for these offnet connections, the providers invest very little in the backhaul, which may be the limiting factor. You might find people like BT, Plusnet, Zen, IDNet, Post Office provide better service.

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User ccxo
(experienced) Sat 04-Aug-12 17:13:40
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Chipping Sodbury is the closet exchange that will have FTTC deployed by Openreach in 2013.

The B4060 links Chipping and Wickwar with BT ducting in the road, would be the likely route for fibre backhaul to the Wickwar cabinets.

It would be worth getting in contact with your local BDUK project as the project leader/manager should be able to help your village by possibly including it in their project plans due to the investment from the village or provide details for BT regional managers.

http://www.southglos.gov.uk/NR/exeres/b8067c55-297d-...

Under the 'find out more' section the community broadband has a very interesting PDF that talks about local broadband setups- the various stages/requirements etc.

My Broadband Speed Test

Edited by ccxo (Sat 04-Aug-12 17:14:00)

Standard User o1nk
(newbie) Sat 04-Aug-12 18:23:47
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for the heads up MrSaffron.

FTTC will be in the next town exchange in spring 2013, which is 5 miles away
As for this:
As you can FTTC enable cabinets on an exchange without enabling the WBC network expansion at an exchange.

On the smaller exchanges I suspect this will be the preferred method, with the eventual plan to remove the exchange completely, reducing the costs to Openreach.

I am not quite sure what you mean.
I have to have an adjacent exchange to us with FTTC?
Or can it be enabled without having one close by?

As for our exchange, I am one of the furthest away in our village. Just 1/4 mile away
At the moment I get the full 8meg

The buffering of iplayer is due to my daughter raping youtube at the same time and my son streaming spotify all the time (as well as XBOX live). We have to stop one to give relief to the other

At the end of the day we don't care who owns what after, we just want to all be on FTTC now rather than 10 years time.
Cable won't come out here (extra 3.5 miles)
BT says it's not profitable

If just 200 people take out their broadband FTTC package at £18 pm
And 200 people take out the 76mb FTTC at £26 per month
That's 400 customers taking just broadband at an average of £22pm
That is £8800 per month
If the cost is £65000, that would be profitable in 8 months?

Edited by o1nk (Sat 04-Aug-12 18:24:33)

Standard User camieabz
(sensei) Sat 04-Aug-12 18:35:15
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by o1nk:
If just 200 people take out their broadband FTTC package at £18 pm
And 200 people take out the 76mb FTTC at £26 per month
That's 400 customers taking just broadband at an average of £22pm
That is £8800 per month
If the cost is £65000, that would be profitable in 8 months?


That's cost vs turnover. The profit margins are far less than that. The wholesale price per month might be £12 or so (I forget the exact figure).

~ Camieabz ~

All Connection Data ~ Some plusnet links

mod'er·a'tion n.
Synonyms: temperance, restraint, modesty.
Standard User b4dger
(knowledge is power) Sat 04-Aug-12 20:02:41
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
Further to @MrSaffron's reply...

You haven't said who your ISP is (sorry if I've missed it) and it's also worth saying what your current IP Profile is in case something else is going on.

I'm a few miles from my exchange (5000 IP Profile via Freeola/Entanet connection) and my family can manage to 'do' numerous iPlayer/YouTube's at the same time!

I'm also on a olde-world exchange with no options so appreciate your situation but things shouldn't be so bad for you are you are on such a short line while you are working on making things better smile

Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sun 05-Aug-12 12:08:39
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by o1nk:
I have a daughter, as we speak, on YOUTUBE and my wife is screaming at me because she cannot watch iPlayer without buffering, at the same time. Which leaves me with dial-up leftovers
This isn't surprising given that the Olympics are on. Huge numbers streaming iPlayer for events that aren't on free TV.

In the morning we watched the Andy Murray quarter-final. A couple of times we got buffering, or perhaps it was the BBC feed packed up on our connection, as we had to close and re-open the window and restart the streaming.

Nothing else being downloaded - 56065kbps FTTC connection.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - Plusnet Value Fibre FTTC 80/20 trial.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Standard User mr_mojo
(knowledge is power) Mon 06-Aug-12 06:47:59
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
BT will eventually upgrade the exchange to 21CN - they are totally phasing out 20CN.

I find it suprising that 8 meg isn't enough for you. The uses you have said (spotify, youtube and xbox live) really shouldn't add up to more than about 2meg/sec if that.

Try getting a decent router with QoS and prioritise TCP ACK packets. It's likely that the 448k upstream is causing the problems, not the downstream.

Alternatively get an office connection and get the higher 832 (or whatever it is) upstream. Will be a few more quid a month but way cheaper than upgrading a phone exchange yourself!

Finally, if all else fails, get another line put in and get a load balancing router. You'll probably get another 8meg, so 16meg in total. Should be more than adequate.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 06-Aug-12 07:51:20
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
What I mean is that your exchange does not always need to be FTTC enabled, it is your cabinet that is important, in some areas Openreach enables cabinets and connects them to a different exchange.

Short term solution for you would be to get a second line with another broadband connection.

On the costs, alas there are ongoing running costs as you need to pay the data costs for getting to the network, and your share of the multi million pound hardware that does all this interconnecting.

BT is talking of a 12 year pay back for its fibre solutions.

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 06-Aug-12 07:52:38
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: mr_mojo] [link to this post]
 
YouTube HD is 5Meg, which can hit latency, causing issues for gaming, but spotify should manage.

Joys of families where they all want to use it at once.

Fritzbox 7390 is impressing me currently with its easy to manage QoS options.

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User yarwell
(sensei) Mon 06-Aug-12 18:08:49
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
If just 200 people take out their broadband FTTC package at £18 pm
And 200 people take out the 76mb FTTC at £26 per month
That's 400 customers taking just broadband at an average of £22pm
That is £8800 per month
If the cost is £65000, that would be profitable in 8 months?

Setting aside margins etc the problem with this analysis is that all the customers will be paying something now, so a fair bit of the £8800 is not extra money to cover extra costs.

--

Phil

MaxDSL - goes as fast as it can and doesn't read the line checker first.

MaxDSL diagnostics
Standard User o1nk
(newbie) Mon 06-Aug-12 21:12:37
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: yarwell] [link to this post]
 
OK, clarify time

mr_mojo
BT Homehub 3 that has about as much tweaking as a bag FULL of non-tweakers, in non-tweakersvile, non-tweakersland

The BT line is fine and we get the full 8 meg
Problems arise with his XBOX live: downloading demos and games from Steam
Youtube is a hogger, especially when she is using Keeptube to rip the mp3 as well
iPlayer is the bandwidth grenade: You try watching iPlayer on a 50" and tell me it's good enough without being in HD

I get so much earache, saying "The internet is sooooo slowwwww" but they are all on it at once
If my daughter youtube's and I watch the football on sopcast they both cancel each other out and fight for the bandwidth

MrSaffron
Who do I ask to find out that info about the exchange?
We have engineers in our village EVERY day from openreach. I'm not kidding
I could just ask them

As for cost,
what, if any, cost is incurred after it is installed?
Once the FTTC is installed, can any ISP 'rent' that fibre (I don't know, Wholesale will be the owner?), like the ISP's rent the line from Wholesale? Will that be an option?
Or will BT just hog the gold?

This is so intriguing
I have gone from hoping for 21CN network at best, to having a glimmer of FTTC, for less money than we planned. Just in a few days

Thanks everyone, so far

One more question:
Would FTTC come as 76/38 meg?
Or the 100meg+?

Edited by o1nk (Mon 06-Aug-12 21:35:23)

Standard User ccxo
(experienced) Mon 06-Aug-12 22:11:52
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
FTTC would come as the 38/10 and 78/20 variants, the over 100Mbps is currently FTTP, their are further upgrades for FTTC to increase speed but these are a few years away.

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User camieabz
(sensei) Mon 06-Aug-12 22:37:59
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by o1nk:
I get so much earache, saying "The internet is sooooo slowwwww" but they are all on it at once
If my daughter youtube's and I watch the football on sopcast they both cancel each other out and fight for the bandwidth


Ahh, so it's less of a speed issue, and more or a kids issue. Lots of heavy food, and housework. They'll be asleep by 8pm. wink

~ Camieabz ~

All Connection Data ~ Some plusnet links

mod'er·a'tion n.
Synonyms: temperance, restraint, modesty.
Standard User o1nk
(newbie) Mon 06-Aug-12 23:33:23
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: camieabz] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by camieabz:
Ahh, so it's less of a speed issue, and more or a kids issue. Lots of heavy food, and housework. They'll be asleep by 8pm. wink


I wish!! 15 and 16 means there's not many days they are in bed before midnight .... or should I say off their phones and other internet-destroying toys

By the way, anyone know how much it would actually cost to install 21CN stuff. Just in case we get knocked back for the FTTC? (Or get told it will be done in 3 years)
Standard User camieabz
(sensei) Tue 07-Aug-12 00:11:25
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
No idea of cost, but presumably the '21CN stuff' would be ISP equipment in some cases. Your exchange is Market 1, which isn't reassuring from getting some competition into the area.

Your best bet might be to mobilise the commerce and/or industry in the area. With 77 non-residential premises, you might stuggle. My own village has a similar amount, but 3x the residential premises. It got 21CN in May, and was Market 2 until 2010.

I see there's one fairly big company in that area. Do they have 8 Meg broadband? I'll guess they have something a little better.

~ Camieabz ~

All Connection Data ~ Some plusnet links

mod'er·a'tion n.
Synonyms: temperance, restraint, modesty.
Standard User yarwell
(sensei) Tue 07-Aug-12 00:38:41
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
Rutland Telecom did FTTC at Lyddington and Essendine with their cab next to a BT PCP cab. Plenty of PR on the net and their site. Services offered are Rutland as an ISP and telephone service provider ie monopoly. Residents provided about £40k for Lyddington I think, as share capital.

You could put a router between your home hub and the client devices to manage bandwidth per device. A second line would double the capacity.

--

Phil

MaxDSL - goes as fast as it can and doesn't read the line checker first.

MaxDSL diagnostics
Standard User blueacid
(committed) Fri 10-Aug-12 20:22:54
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
I suppose there are two schools of thought here.
Either you and the other residents have established that you want significantly higher speeds & would therefore like to pay extra for some form of upgrade.
If you did that there'd largely be two component charges to this: One would be getting significant enough backhaul to the village, second would then be the cost of whatever equipment is settled upon to share this out; be it WiMAX, some FTTC kit or ADSL2+ equipment in the exchange. I would suggest that if you're dead set on upgrading things that you start by speaking to Rutland telecom. After all if you're going to spend a chunk of cash you might as well get the best for your buck; VDSL at the cabinet would almost certainly be better than ADSL2+ from the exchange. Equally you might like to investigate some sort of FTTP solution, which could offer even higher speeds.

The other thing to investigate is making the best of what you have. For arguments sake, you could consider getting a second phone line with broadband subscription for just the kids, then you and your partner could share the existing. If both lines connect at 8mbit then that should tide you over for now, certainly until any eventual upgrade to 21cn. This approach would certainly require far less capital from yourselves. If neighbours similarly did this the number of broadband lines on the exchange increasing that might make the exchange look more worthy of an upgrade! In the long term, the double line rental and double broadband subs would work out dearer than a single line & FTTC connection though. Also, whether you add a clever load-balancing router in order to link the two connections or if you just do it crudely as discussed above is down to you. Can always start crudely and get more elegant if you feel the need.

A solution you could also look into in tandem with the above would be a decent router with a capable QOS module in it. I've got a Netgear 3700v1 (~£50 off a popular auction website) which I've flashed with the Gargoyle custom firmware. The QOS settings in that are superb; for want of an hour of really considering your settings and getting it right, you could quite easily share the available bandwidth in a far wiser fashion, such that bulk transfers are slowed down and real time services get what they need. This assumes that the sum total of all the real-time requirements is below 8mbit. Certainly it's possible to slow down the bulk game downloads but keep the gaming pings low for a console. Or guarantee a minimum amount of bandwidth to a computer (to ensure Spotify remains stutter free) but provide little more extra. If you want to investigate this avenue further I'd be happy to advise you; I've got a 8-9mbit connection which has similarly heavy demands placed on it by me and my partner; since getting the QOS set nicely it's a world apart.

There's certainly a lot to consider. Hopefully I've given you some food for thought!
Standard User Seansmit17
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 18-Aug-12 18:16:47
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
I feel your pain.. Well did.

We was on 8mb with BT and had the same problem.

If my housemate was watching something on ITV Player, as he did every night, it would slow the whole connection down and i would lag like hell in online games.

There was no fault on the line or with the BB. Speedtests showed 6000+ kbps. But as soon as iplayer or Netflix or YT etc was used all the bandwidth went bye bye

And with 4 people here it was.. interesting to say the least!

But we got lucky. TalkTalk unbundlled our exchange (Pontybodkin) and now we are on 24mb ADSL2 and now someone can download, stream, use the web and i can still play online with no lag at all. A VAST improvement.

I hope you get something sorted out for you and your village.

TalkTalk 24Mb 24575/1019
BT 8Mb
Virgin 50Mb
BT 7Mb

Other ISP's used over the years: AOL Supanet Pipex Tiscali Eclipse Zen
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sun 19-Aug-12 11:15:59
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: Seansmit17] [link to this post]
 
Routers are emerging with QoS to help those on slower lines have things like this running at the same time.

That said, I've had 3 Netflix streams running and web browsing at the same time. Yes Netflix dropped to SD (only a 6 Meg line) but the streaming software does make a big difference too.

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Croftie
(member) Fri 24-Aug-12 20:18:24
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
A few people mentioned QOS.. I'd put money on you seeing a big improvement by ditching the home hub and getting a decent router with QOS. Such as an Asus RT-N16 with toastman's tomato build.

Of course if your exchange is congested this won't help but if the line is performing as expected do yourself a favour and try out a router with QOS.
Standard User trisc64
(newbie) Fri 24-Aug-12 23:08:53
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
Sounds like your connection is probably being traffic shaped due to your family's rapacious usage.
Also bear in mind that a provider like Rutland impose a 50GB cap which in your case would probably be inadequate.

Far better to go for 2x8Mb lines with the most generous usage allowances you can find. Possibly a business grade tariff would be best.
Standard User trisc64
(newbie) Sat 25-Aug-12 07:50:20
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: trisc64] [link to this post]
 
And another thing. Make the most of Sky+ or a decent PVR. Use the EPG wisely and you will hardly ever need the iPlayer. Freesat gave me 24 live Olympic streams in full HD so no need to miss a thing!

Internet bandwidth is a commodity and priced according to supply and demand. Where alternatives exist I would use 'em!
Standard User HDRW
(learned) Sat 01-Sep-12 14:02:45
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: camieabz] [link to this post]
 
I see people suggesting QOS, and getting a 2nd line, but these will not help if the problem is a congested backhaul, rather than the individual ADSL being clogged. With a small village it's entirely possible that the backhaul can't cope with the OP's family plus a couple of other heavy users.

So I think the first thing to do is establish whether the backhaul is the bottleneck - BT ought to know how heavily it's loaded, but whether they'll come clean is another matter! If it is overloaded, they should upgrade it.

Best of Luck!

-- Howard (on a Market 2 exchange, stuck with 20CN)

Using : Zyxel P660, Andrews & Arnold Max 1G service, and eComStation (OS/2 v4.5)
If Windows is the solution, I'd rather have the problem smile

Edited by HDRW (Sat 01-Sep-12 14:08:39)

Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Sat 01-Sep-12 14:29:00
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: HDRW] [link to this post]
 
QOS will still work even if the backhaul is congested, rather than your suggestion of doing nothing.


_____________________________________________________________________________________________ this is not usenet __________________
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sat 01-Sep-12 15:27:56
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: HDRW] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by HDRW:
(on a Market 2 exchange, stuck with 20CN)
How come you are stuck on 20CN on a Market 2 exchange? Which exchange is it?

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Connection - Plusnet Extra Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 56.0/13.9Mbps @ 600m.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.
Standard User HDRW
(regular) Sat 01-Sep-12 18:41:35
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
In reply to a post by HDRW:
(on a Market 2 exchange, stuck with 20CN)
How come you are stuck on 20CN on a Market 2 exchange? Which exchange is it?

I don't know - ask BT! smile I'm on Park Street exchange (LNPKS)

Cheers,
Howard

Using : Zyxel P660, Andrews & Arnold 20CN @ 8Gb, eComStation (OS/2 v4.5)
If Windows is the solution, I'd rather have the problem smile
Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Sat 01-Sep-12 18:56:42
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: HDRW] [link to this post]
 
Or ask TalkTalk and Virgin.


_____________________________________________________________________________________________ this is not usenet __________________
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sat 01-Sep-12 22:52:11
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: HDRW] [link to this post]
 
TT of course, but maybe you don't fancy them direct.

However vivaciti, uno I think, and possibly ADSL24, offer ADSL2+ using the TT exchange equipment but their own backhaul. Partial and/or full LLU, and I think they have monthly contracts as well.

Ask them smile. Or try their availability checkers.

What are your line stats though? You may not benefit from ADSL2+.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Connection - Plusnet Extra Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 56.0/13.9Mbps @ 600m.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.

Edited by RobertoS (Sat 01-Sep-12 22:54:17)

Standard User o1nk
(newbie) Tue 04-Sep-12 17:11:25
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: BatBoy] [link to this post]
 
Update alert!

I finally got through to Openreach (they frown on you not having a Duns ID) for unbundling, as FTTC is completely out of the water. Even if WE paid for it
400 already with full interest for taking up the 20meg
Openreach priced 500 ties for starters at 11k
optional 500 ties for 8k
The cabinet and space at 3k
and 3k "rental space" per year.
Server and backup server are already set to go
Bargain

All I need now is a backbone supplier (costing) and relevant info on anything else

Anyone point me in the right direction

Also, add in 5k for a Duns ID (otherwise BT won't speak to you) and ISO9001 so you can enter the exchange
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Tue 04-Sep-12 23:52:53
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
I would imagine you should talk to Entanet and Daisy about backhaul. Or even BT itself (BT Wholesale?). As I understand it, some of the Be and TT resellers use the Be/TT kit in the exchange but feed into one or other of Enta and Daisy from then on.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Connection - Plusnet Extra Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 56.0/13.9Mbps @ 600m.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.

Edited by RobertoS (Tue 04-Sep-12 23:54:48)

Standard User Toonshorty
(learned) Wed 05-Sep-12 08:54:19
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
If there is the demand for it you could try speaking to Gigaclear.

http://www.gigaclear.com/

I think you need something like 35% of the area to pre-purchase the service and they'll install it.
Standard User somerset
(committed) Wed 05-Sep-12 10:27:19
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
What are South Gloucestershire council doing? Where are the DSLAM costs in your list?
Standard User Seansmit17
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 05-Sep-12 12:55:24
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
Just a thought

But have you tried talking to an LLU provider like TalkTalk or Sky etc and see if they will install LLU in your exchange if the locals all sign up to them for service?

Maybe even offer to help pay the cost of installing LLU?

TalkTalk 24Mb 24575/1019
BT 8Mb
Virgin 50Mb
BT 7Mb

Other ISP's used over the years: AOL Supanet Pipex Tiscali Eclipse Zen
Standard User Andrue
(knowledge is power) Thu 06-Sep-12 15:24:08
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Re: 21CN / WBC: Villagers bounce back


[re: o1nk] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by o1nk:
and ISO9001 so you can enter the exchange
http://search.dilbert.com/comic/Iso%209000

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK

Just because he could. RIP.
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