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Standard User wannabemedic
(newbie) Sat 05-Nov-11 23:54:28
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Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[link to this post]
 
Hello,

I have a Netgear DG834G v3 which was provided by AOL Broadband a few years ago.

I note that a "boost" is now available "up to 24Mbps" (BT installed fibre cabinets in the area a few months ago) but I was wondering whether anyone knows whether this router will be compatible?

It is running the latest firmware (V4.01.40).

I emailed AOL Broadband last week to ask but they've not replied... I just want to make sure there won't be any issues as a result of going ahead with the speed upgrade.

Any help would be appreciated, cheers smile

P.S: Router stats in case they are relevant:

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 5184 kbps 448 kbps
Line Attenuation 42 db 14 db
Noise Margin 7 db 25 db

Samknows states we are 680 metres from the exchange as the crow flies.

Edited by wannabemedic (Sun 06-Nov-11 00:00:51)

Standard User uno
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 06-Nov-11 00:03:51
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Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by wannabemedic:
ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 5184 kbps 448 kbps
Line Attenuation 42 db 14 db
Noise Margin 7 db 25 db

Samknows states we are 680 metres from the exchange as the crow flies.


The v3 will work on ADSL2+ but might not be as well as the v4, or some newer routers.

Your line is much longer. Either Samknows is wrong, the routing from your house to the exchange isn't anywhere near how a crow might fly, or there are internal wiring issues to investigate.

Matt

-
uno Broadband
t: 0808 221 8642
Official Maidenhead, Milton Keynes & Manchester Speedtest.net Host
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sun 06-Nov-11 00:16:04
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Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
Alas the phone line is about 2 miles (3km long), so not taking a direct route to you.

The BT Fibre cabinets are for a up to 40Meg product, not ADSL2+ - which is probably down to TalkTalk (who own AOL) switching you onto ADSL2+

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.


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Anonymous
(Unregistered)Sun 06-Nov-11 00:33:23
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: uno] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for the quick responses and confirming that the fibre cabinets are for a different product. smile

I've now plugged the router into the master socket and also the test socket. Just so you know, the router is normally situated at the end of an extension line.

In master socket:

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 4608 kbps 448 kbps
Line Attenuation 42 db 14 db
Noise Margin 8 db 25 db

My Broadband Speed Test


In test socket (front plate removed):


ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 5760 kbps 448 kbps
Line Attenuation 43 db 13.5 db
Noise Margin 9 db 25 db

My Broadband Speed Test

Do the noise margins/attenuations suggest a problem with internal/other wiring?

When you say it may not work as well as a newer version of the router, does that mean drops in sync or a lower speed?
Standard User uno
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 06-Nov-11 00:35:32
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Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: Anonymous] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Anonymous:
Do the noise margins/attenuations suggest a problem with internal/other wiring?

When you say it may not work as well as a newer version of the router, does that mean drops in sync or a lower speed?


If you are in the test socket, all internal wiring should be removed from the line, so that does not play a part.

Your line just appears to be longer than you'd expect/like. Are you in/around London by any chance?

The v3 may be more unstable and may give a lower sync than something with a better/newer chipset such as the Billion 7800N.

Matt

-
uno Broadband
t: 0808 221 8642
Official Maidenhead, Milton Keynes & Manchester Speedtest.net Host
Standard User wannabemedic
(newbie) Sun 06-Nov-11 00:46:13
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Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: uno] [link to this post]
 
Thanks Matt, I'm in the Midlands.

I have a Thomson Speedtouch ST585 (not sure which version, but it looks exactly like this one). Is there a chance that may be better at handling ADSL2?

I know it's difficult to say definitively but is there any chance I'll get a lower up/down speed after the upgrade than I do currently?

An increase in upload speed is what I'm more interested in really...
Standard User uno
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 06-Nov-11 00:51:01
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Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
Ahh. I've seen many lines in London be very very close to the exchange but routed far differently, oddly higher than anywhere else that we seem to come across.

The 585 should work OK and will have a broadcom chipset. Might sync a little lower than other broadcom-based routers.

You'll probably see a small increase in the downstream and likely a bigger jump in your upstream.

Matt

-
uno Broadband
t: 0808 221 8642
Official Maidenhead, Milton Keynes & Manchester Speedtest.net Host
Standard User wannabemedic
(newbie) Sun 06-Nov-11 00:57:31
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Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: uno] [link to this post]
 
Thanks Matt. I've just submitted the "up to 24Mbps boost" so we'll see what happens.

Really wasn't expecting to have such quick responses to my questions at this time of night so my thanks again to you and Andrew smile
Standard User XRaySpeX
(knowledge is power) Sun 06-Nov-11 01:45:14
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Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
You should be getting over 6,5 Meg Sync now on ADSL Max, which you are on. Have you removed ring wire?

On ADSL2+, "the boost", you should get about 9 Meg.

The Netgear DG834G v4 with a Broadcom chipset is the most reliable of the DG834Gs.

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sun 06-Nov-11 08:25:53
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Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: Anonymous] [link to this post]
 
The huge difference between the Master and Test sockets imply you have the ring wire connected, as asked by XRaySpeX.

You need to remove that, see this page.

When you say "at the end of an extension line", do you mean a plug-in one, or one wired into the back of the master socket? If a plug-in, then you need to either stop using it somehow, or "doctor it" to stop the ring wire in it making a connection.

If a wired-in extension, do you know if the extensions were installed by the builder, which they could have been if it is a relatively new house? We could do with a decent picture of the wires attached to the master faceplate when you remove it if that is the case. (You can't post pics here, it would need to be uploaded somewhere and post a link).

You will probably find a day-time connection is faster than a night-time one as well, so room for more improvment there.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - IDNet Home Starter Fibre. Live BQM.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.

Edited by RobertoS (Sun 06-Nov-11 08:26:51)

Standard User wannabemedic
(newbie) Sun 06-Nov-11 13:02:57
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
I've attached photos of the master socket. It looks like the ring wire has already been disconnected.

As for the extensions (there are two in the house), they are both wired into the back of the master socket.

The extension I'm using was fitted probably when the house was built in the mid 1980s.

http://i52.tinypic.com/345czfo.jpg

http://i56.tinypic.com/91i3cy.jpg

As of this morning the router stats are as follows:

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 6578 kbps 440 kbps
Line Attenuation 42 db 13 db
Noise Margin 9 db 19 db

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User XRaySpeX
(knowledge is power) Sun 06-Nov-11 13:18:19
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by wannabemedic:
Connection Speed 6578 kbps 440 kbps
That's more like it! You could probably get over 7 Meg if your NM was reduced to 6 dB.

What socket was that from?

Did you re-sync/reboot router this AM?

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
Standard User wannabemedic
(newbie) Sun 06-Nov-11 13:24:49
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
That's from the extension socket (wired via back of master socket) - I should say I ordered the 24Mbps "boost" last night so the increase in sync speed may be due to that... still waiting for an increase to upload speeds to happen.

The router was rebooted this AM. I actually tend to switch it off at night if nobody else is using it. Perhaps I should leave it switched on 24/7 for the next 10 days in case there's a stabilisation period?

Over the past years the sync has never been this high and I've not changed anything in terms of hardware setup.

Edited by wannabemedic (Sun 06-Nov-11 13:25:40)

Standard User XRaySpeX
(knowledge is power) Sun 06-Nov-11 13:33:43
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
You haven't been "boosted" yet. The Up Sync tells us that. Also you will see a rise in your attn. by about 3 dB.

There's no reason not to switch router off overnight, despite what ISP says, as long as you don't keep re-syncing it.

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 17 Meg Untweaked 19 Meg Tweaked WBC
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sun 06-Nov-11 15:27:11
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
WIring is fine, looks like the correct stuff is there. Builders often use bell-wire which is bad for broadband, but that isn't.

It might be worth checking both extensions to make sure the White/Blue goes to T5 in the same way as on the master. If there is a swap-over that is not good.

From what I can see of the master socket I don't think the ring wire would have mattered, as I think it is filtered anyway. But no contact cannot fail, a filter can.

Which ISP and package is it? "Boost" sounds like Plusnet or TalkTalk, but it may be some other one. Other factors can be affected by the ISP, such as the noise margin settings, mentioned by XRaySpeX, so we can't really advise on that without knowing.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - IDNet Home Starter Fibre. Live BQM.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
Standard User wannabemedic
(newbie) Mon 07-Nov-11 12:42:35
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
The ISP is AOL (now part of TalkTalk of course). I will check the extensions.

Just out of interest how long would you expect it to take for the upload speed to increase (i.e. the boost to take effect)?
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Mon 07-Nov-11 15:01:49
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Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
Depends how efficient AOL support is. I would expect 2-3 days. The change should be instant once they get round to it.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - IDNet Home Starter Fibre. Live BQM.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
Standard User wannabemedic
(newbie) Tue 08-Nov-11 13:48:38
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
I've spotted this discussion in the AOL part of the forum:

http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/aol/f/4040084-got-a...

Still no change to the upload speed, it's just the download speed that has increased. I wonder whether there is going to be an increase in upload as surely it would have happened at the same time as the download speed increased...
ISP Representative TALKTALK_SUPPORT
(isp) Wed 09-Nov-11 15:41:52
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Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
HI All,


Although you may not be aware we can also support AOL queries via the TalkTalk Members forum

feel free to register and we will be able to provide account and service support as necessary.

Regards

Mark
TalkTalk online community department

TalkTalk, Online Community
www.talktalkmembers.co.uk/forums
"The information contained within these posts is provided by TalkTalk
to assist in the resolution of any queries our customers may have. Should you
have a specific request for information please do not hesitate to contact me."
The above post has been made by an ISP REPRESENTATIVE (although not necessarily the ISP being discussed in the post).
Standard User wannabemedic
(learned) Thu 10-Nov-11 17:13:30
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: TALKTALK_SUPPORT] [link to this post]
 
Thanks Mark, I've had a look at the forums but it seems you can't do very much for AOL customers yet - there was a thread with a similar query to mine regarding upload speeds and it looks like it had to be escalated to the CEO's office for resolution as your forum staff couldn't "see" the details of the connection due to the customer being with AOL.

I contacted AOL via email support a couple of days ago and hopefully they will respond soon.
Standard User wannabemedic
(learned) Fri 11-Nov-11 17:57:28
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
Response from AOL:

Please note that the upgrade is being done by batches, about 2000 subscribers at a time. I was unable to provide you the exact date when your line will be upgraded as we have not received an update yet. Rest assured that you will notice the change once this has been rolled out.


(sync speed downstream has today dropped to 5673kbps)
Standard User wannabemedic
(learned) Wed 23-Nov-11 20:02:40
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
Current line stats:

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 6516 kbps 440 kbps
Line Attenuation 42 db 13 db
Noise Margin 5 db 20 db

I called AOL Tech Support to ask about the upload speed, I was told that whilst we have AOL Talk and AOL Broadband, because our line is provided by BT, I have to contact them about the upload speed. AOL say they are only responsible for the downsteam speed.

I expressed surprise and was told that it was because AOL were providing broadband over BT's line.

I was also told that the "assigned speed" for the line was 3000kbps down and 500kbps up. Clearly the downstream speed is wrong because I'm getting more than double that.

Anyone know what to do now? Download speed isn't an issue, it's upload speed which is painfully slow and needs to be improved.
Standard User john2007
(legend) Wed 23-Nov-11 20:31:54
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
Could you log into your router and display the ADSL settings?

What does it say for DSL mode?
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Wed 23-Nov-11 21:34:20
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by wannabemedic:
I called AOL Tech Support to ask about the upload speed, I was told that whilst we have AOL Talk and AOL Broadband, because our line is provided by BT, I have to contact them about the upload speed. AOL say they are only responsible for the downsteam speed.

I expressed surprise and was told that it was because AOL were providing broadband over BT's line.
Tripe!

For starters, there are two settings available to AOL, "up to 448kbps" and "up to 832kbps" on ADSL. The old Max and Max Premium. Not all ISPs supplied the higher one, and AOL may be one of those, but they are certainly responsible for everything to do with the broadband.

440kbps is a common one for Plusnet customers on the up to 448 option.

On ADSL2+ you should get well over 1000kbps.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - IDNet Home Starter Fibre. Live BQM.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.

Edited by RobertoS (Wed 23-Nov-11 21:39:00)

Standard User wannabemedic
(learned) Thu 24-Nov-11 00:45:26
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: john2007] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by john2007:
Could you log into your router and display the ADSL settings?

What does it say for DSL mode?


Multiplexing Method: LLC-BASED
VPI: 0
VCI: 38
DSL Mode: Auto (Multi-mode)

Options available for DSL mode:

ADSL (G.DMT)
ADSL2+
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 24-Nov-11 02:58:48
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by wannabemedic:
DSL Mode: Auto (Multi-mode)
That's your DSL Mode setting but not its current status which was what was wanted.

You can't get this from a Netgear's Web interface; you need to do this via TELNET as instructed here: http://www.kitz.co.uk/routers/netgeardg834_interleav...

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
Standard User wannabemedic
(learned) Thu 24-Nov-11 07:07:07
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2? *DELETED*


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
Post deleted by wannabemedic

(Replied to say it didn't work, then found Telnet Client was not switched on under Vista's features)

Edited by wannabemedic (Thu 24-Nov-11 07:26:51)

Standard User wannabemedic
(learned) Thu 24-Nov-11 07:36:52
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
AR7 DSL Modem Statistics:
--------------------------------
[DSL Modem Stats]
US Connection Rate: 440 DS Connection Rate: 5881
DS Line Attenuation: 42 DS Margin: 10
US Line Attenuation: 26 US Margin: 20
US Payload : 18045696 DS Payload: 33934396
8
US Superframe Cnt : 613117 DS Superframe Cnt: 613117
US Transmit Power : 0 DS Transmit Power: 0
LOS errors: 0 SEF errors: 0
Errored Seconds: 36 Severely Err Secs: 0
Frame mode: 0 Max Frame mode: 0
Trained Path: 1 US Peak Cell Rate: 1037
Trained Mode: 16 Selected Mode: 1
ATUC Vendor Code: 54535443 ATUC Revision: 3
Hybrid Selected: 3 Trellis: 1
Showtime Count: 1 DS Max Attainable Bit Rate: 6064 kbps
BitSwap: 1 US Max Attainable Bit Rate: 1109222 bps
Annex: AnxA psd_mask_qualifier: 0x0000
Power Management Status: L0 DS HLINSC: 0
US ACTPSD: -345 DS ACTPSD: -366
Total init. errors: 0 Total init. timeouts: 0
Showtime init. errors: 0 Showtime init. timeouts: 0
Last showtime init. errors: 0 Last showtime init. timeouts: 0
ATUC ghsVid: b5 00 54 53 54 43 05 00
T1413Vid: 00 00 T1413Rev: 00 VendorRev: 00
ATUR ghsVid: b5 00 54 53 54 43 00 00
T1413Vid: 00 00 T1413Rev: 00 VendorRev: 00

[Upstream (TX) Interleave path]
CRC: 0 FEC: 0 NCD: 0
LCD: 0 HEC: 0

[Downstream (RX) Interleave path]
CRC: 49 FEC: 17398 NCD: 0
LCD: 0 HEC: 0

[Upstream (TX) Fast path]
CRC: 0 FEC: 0 NCD: 0
LCD: 0 HEC: 0

[Downstream (RX) Fast path]
CRC: 0 FEC: 0 NCD: 0
LCD: 0 HEC: 0

[ATM Stats]
[Upstream/TX]
Good Cell Cnt: 375952
Idle Cell Cnt: 10440357

Tx Packets Dropped Count: 0
Tx Bad Packets Count: 0

[Downstream/RX)]
Good Cell Cnt: 7069666
Idle Cell Cnt: 137519826
Bad Hec Cell Cnt: 318
Overflow Dropped Cell Cnt: 0
Rx Packets Dropped Count: 0
Rx Bad Packets Count: 0

[SAR AAL5 Stats]
Tx PDU's: 145109
Rx PDU's: 247805
Tx Total Bytes: 14679126
Rx Total Bytes: 333263306
Tx Total Error Counts: 0
Rx Total Error Counts: 0

[OAM Stats]
Near End F5 Loop Back Count: 0
Near End F4 Loop Back Count: 0
Far End F5 Loop Back Count: 0
Far End F4 Loop Back Count: 0
SAR OAM Ping Response Drop Count=0
Standard User john2007
(legend) Thu 24-Nov-11 09:39:11
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
I was wondering if it was set to g.dmt rather than multi-mode or adsl2+.

Could you try setting adsl2+ in that box and applying. If you can't get a sync I'd guess you have not being switched to ADSL2+ kit.
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 24-Nov-11 12:40:09
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
Duh! V3 doesn't even show DSL Mode Status.

Anyway, I forgot we already knew you were still running on G.DMT.

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
Standard User wannabemedic
(learned) Thu 24-Nov-11 13:05:33
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: john2007] [link to this post]
 
Changed to ADSL2+ and rebooted.

Current stats now as follows:

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 6492 kbps 440 kbps
Line Attenuation 42 db 13 db
Noise Margin 9 db 19 db

My Broadband Speed Test

Presumably this means I am definitely on ADSL2+ kit and therefore AOL should be able to put our line on a higher upload profile?
Standard User john2007
(legend) Thu 24-Nov-11 13:32:33
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
An indirect way may be by looking at the bit allocation table.

# cat /proc/avalanche/avsar_bit_allocation_table

AR7 DSL Modem US Bit Allocation:
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 07 0a 0b 0b 0c 0c 0c 0c 0c 
0d 0d 0d 0d 0d 0d 0d 0c 0d 0d 0c 0c 0b 0b 0a 09 

AR7 DSL Modem DS Bit Allocation:
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 
00 00 00 02 02 04 03 04 04 05 05 05 06 06 07 07 
07 07 08 08 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 0a 0a 0a 0a 
0a 0a 0a 0a 0a 0a 0a 0a 0a 0a 0a 0a 09 0a 09 09 
09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 
09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 02 09 
09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 
09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 08 08 08 08 08 08 
08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 
08 08 08 07 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 08 
08 07 08 08 08 08 08 08 07 07 08 08 08 07 07 07 
07 07 07 07 07 07 07 07 06 06 06 06 06 06 05 05 
04 02 00 00 02 04 04 05 05 06 06 06 06 06 06 06 
06 06 06 06 07 07 07 07 06 06 06 06 06 06 06 06 
06 06 06 06 05 05 05 04 04 04 02 02 00 00 02 02 
03 04 04 05 05 05 05 05 06 06 06 05 06 05 06 06 
06 06 06 06 05 05 05 04 03 01 00 02 04 05 05 06 
06 06 05 06 06 06 06 06 06 06 06 07 06 06 06 06 
06 06 07 06 07 06 07 06 06 07 06 06 07 06 06 05 
06 06 06 06 06 06 05 06 05 06 06 05 05 04 00 04 
04 03 00 03 00 05 05 05 05 05 05 05 05 05 05 05 
05 05 05 04 04 00 04 00 05 00 05 05 05 05 05 05 
04 04 05 05 05 05 05 05 04 04 04 04 05 05 05 04 
05 05 05 05 05 05 04 05 05 05 05 05 05 04 05 05 
05 05 05 05 04 05 05 05 05 05 05 05 05 04 04 04 
04 04 02 02 02 02 04 05 04 04 04 04 05 04 04 04 
04 04 04 04 04 04 04 04 04 04 04 04 04 04 04 04 
04 04 04 04 04 02 02 03 02 02 02 02 02 01 00 00 
00 02 02 02 02 02 02 02 02 00 02 00 00 00 00 00 
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 01 01 00 00 
#

Mine shows 32 (by 16) lines of downstream bins which indicates ADSL2+.
Standard User john2007
(legend) Thu 24-Nov-11 13:39:00
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
I'm afraid it sounds like it. Could you try

cat /proc/avalanche/avsar_bit_allocation_table

and paste what it reports?

p.s. you'll need to enable debugs again.
Standard User wannabemedic
(learned) Thu 24-Nov-11 14:27:49
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: john2007] [link to this post]
 
Done:

AR7 DSL Modem US Bit Allocation:
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 04 05 06 06 07 07 07 07
07 07 07 08 08 07 07 07 06 06 06 07 05 03 00 00

AR7 DSL Modem DS Bit Allocation:
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
00 07 09 09 0b 0b 0c 0c 0c 0c 0c 0b 0b 09 02 09
0b 0b 0c 0c 0c 0b 0c 0b 0c 0c 0b 0b 0c 0c 0c 0c
0c 0c 0c 0c 0c 0c 0c 0c 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b
0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b
0b 0b 02 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b 0b
0b 0a 0b 0b 0a 0a 0a 0b 0b 0b 09 0b 0b 0a 0a 0b
0a 0a 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09
09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 09 08 07 04
00 00 00 05 07 07 07 07 07 07 07 05 07 08 08 08
08 07 07 05 05 07 07 07 07 07 07 07 07 07 07 07
05 07 05 07 07 05 02 05 05 06 07 07 06 05 05 05
05 05 02 00 05 04 07 06 05 05 07 06 06 06 06 07
06 05 05 05 04 00 00 00 00 02 02 04 04 04 04 02
02 04 04 00 00 00 02 04 04 05 05 04 04 03 05 04
00 40 00 c0 00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 40 00 c0 00 c0
00 40 00 40 00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 40 00 40
00 40 00 c0 00 40 00 40 00 c0 00 40 00 c0 00 40
00 c0 00 40 00 40 00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 40 00 c0
00 c0 00 40 00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0
00 40 00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 40 00 40
00 40 00 c0 00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 40 00 c0 00 c0
00 c0 00 40 00 40 00 c0 00 40 00 c0 00 40 00 40
00 c0 00 40 00 40 00 40 00 40 00 40 00 c0 00 40
00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 40 00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0
00 40 00 c0 00 40 00 40 00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0
00 c0 00 c0 00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 40
00 40 00 40 00 40 00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0
00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 40 00 40 00 40
00 40 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 c0 00 40 00 c0 00 c0
00 c0 00 40 00 40 00 40 00 40 00 c0 00 40 00 c0
#
#
Standard User john2007
(legend) Thu 24-Nov-11 14:44:51
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
OK.

I'm stumped. If all the downstream lines above the 16th were zero I'd have thought ADSL1. If they had similarly random figures to the first 16 lines I'd have thought ADSL2+. However they have a sort of pattern of 00, 40, and C0, as if they are left over values of a start up RAM test.

If you compare my upstream figures to yours though I'm afraid I can't see your upstream improving much.

Bear with me. I'll see if I can correlate your bin figures with your sync rates. I may be some time though.

Hopefully someone with a better understanding will post.
Standard User wannabemedic
(learned) Thu 24-Nov-11 15:55:12
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: john2007] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by john2007:
OK.

I'm stumped. If all the downstream lines above the 16th were zero I'd have thought ADSL1. If they had similarly random figures to the first 16 lines I'd have thought ADSL2+. However they have a sort of pattern of 00, 40, and C0, as if they are left over values of a start up RAM test.

If you compare my upstream figures to yours though I'm afraid I can't see your upstream improving much.

Bear with me. I'll see if I can correlate your bin figures with your sync rates. I may be some time though.

Hopefully someone with a better understanding will post.


No problem, I really appreciate the help from everyone on here.

I've sent a complaint to AOL for the tripe they churned out on the phone yesterday, about BT being responsible for the upload speed and AOL being responsible for download. Makes me wonder how someone could make it into public-facing tech support with that level of knowledge!
Standard User john2007
(legend) Thu 24-Nov-11 16:41:30
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
Didn't help much. E&OE!

Upstream I have 293 bins, downstream 2591.

Each bin should realise 4000 bits per second giving 1172 kbps up and 10364 down.

In general terms 1Mbps up and 10Mbps down.

I stopped there as I know my line will reach 17Mbps down. To me this indicates that the bit allocation table is used to show the tones in use, not the tones which could be used. Which makes sense.

No further forward I'm afraid.

Sorry, a bit of a red herring.
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 24-Nov-11 17:50:27
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by wannabemedic:
Presumably this means I am definitely on ADSL2+ kit
I'm pretty sure you are still on G.DMT from the upload sync and that your attn. not increased.

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 14-Dec-11 15:44:51
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by wannabemedic:
I called AOL Tech Support to ask about the upload speed, I was told that whilst we have AOL Talk and AOL Broadband, because our line is provided by BT, I have to contact them about the upload speed. AOL say they are only responsible for the downstream speed.

I expressed surprise and was told that it was because AOL were providing broadband over BT's line.
Are you aware that to take the AOL 24 Meg product (the "boost" presumably) you have to move your line and line rental to AOL and away from BT? It's Full LLU. Or is the "boost" a special for existing customers on AOL's 8 Meg Partial LLU product?

Have you been "boosted" yet?

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 14-Dec-11 16:28:15
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Eureka! I've discovered some useful info about the Netgear DG834v3 's ADSL Mode (it's something you've seen before a year ago but have forgotten) while I was looking into another AOL LLU speed query.
In reply to a post by wannabemedic:
Trained Mode: 16 Selected Mode: 1
16 means ADSL2+; it would have been 3 for G.DMT.

AOL basically offers 2 BB products: 24 Meg Full LLU (a la TT) or 8 Meg Partial LLU. All the stats I could find here on TBB for the 8 Meg product have Upstream Speed = 448 kbps. So, I'd been thinking that AOL was running G.DMT on their 8 Meg LLU, but now I suspect that they are running 8 Meg capped ADSL2+ with a sort of ADSL Max profile.

The OP's various reported stats all show the same Upstream Speed of 448 kbps, no real change of Attenuations and just a bit of variation in Downstream Speed as he plugs into different sockets. So I deduce that he has been on ADSL2+ throughout and that the "boost" consists of just removing the 8 Meg cap and we will not see any increase in Attn. that we had expected.

It is said that AOL & TT share the same network, but we can see that they package their products differently. I suppose that AOL can install a diff DLM in their exchange kit to achieve this?

Does that make sense?

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 19 Meg WBC
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Wed 14-Dec-11 17:12:10
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by wannabemedic:
I've sent a complaint to AOL for the tripe they churned out on the phone yesterday, about BT being responsible for the upload speed and AOL being responsible for download. Makes me wonder how someone could make it into public-facing tech support with that level of knowledge!
Seeing as the thread has resurfaced, did you ever get any sense back?

Can you give us a link to what samknows says about the exchange, there could be a clue there to what you are actually on.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - IDNet Home Starter Fibre. Live BQM.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
Standard User wannabemedic
(learned) Wed 27-Jun-12 15:34:22
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
Seeing as the thread has resurfaced, did you ever get any sense back?

Can you give us a link to what samknows says about the exchange, there could be a clue there to what you are actually on.


This is the exchange in question: http://www.samknows.com/broadband/exchange/WMSTP

Never received a response from AOL. Have recently contacted again regarding speed as TalkTalk are offering an estaimated 12Mbps and 1Mbps upstream. Currently getting 4.5Mb down and 0.3Mb up.

I've put a Home Hub 2 on the line (unlocked) which works but hasn't given an improvement. I spoke with TalkTalk's network team (I guess the AOL brand won't be around much longer) who said if router is not ADSL2+ compatible that could be a problem.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 27-Jun-12 18:00:53
Print Post

Re: Netgear DG834G v3 - compatible with ADSL2?


[re: wannabemedic] [link to this post]
 
Bung your router stats into http://www.coolwebhome.co.uk/calc/calculator.php

42dB off top of head is around the 9 to 10 Meg mark, so TalkTalk is over estimating a little.

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
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