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Standard User Fido
(committed) Fri 21-Jun-19 16:05:20
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To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[link to this post]
 
Next week I am moving to Zen and have received a Fritzbox 7530 router from them which I plan to try to see how it performs as it may suit mostly suit my needs. - (I am not sure as I don't know much about this particular Fritzbox Router). - That said: it has a Lantiq chipset and when there is a choice of routers I usually choose a router with a Broadcom chipset and a fast processor; also, yesterday in order to try the Wifi, I put the Fritzbox 7530 into bridge mode, (using my present router to control the DCHP), and when I tried the WiFi in various places inside the room it was in it was OK but outside the room it was in it was mostly down to two bars or even one bar so the signal strength may not be great..

If the Fritzbox 7530 does not work out I am considering two alternatives and I am not sure which would be better or if I should choose a lesser router and a Wifi Mesh System..

The routers that I am considering are;

(1). The Billion 8900ax 2400. - (Cheapest Price £241)

(2). The Asus DSL AC88U. - (Cheapest Price £199)


Some years ago I used an Asus DSL AC68U router and for the most part that was very good but when I changed ISP from BT to Sky it did not work well with the Sky MER System so I sold it and recently with Sky I was using the TP-Link AC2800 which was a great router but the AC2800 developed intermittent lost Wifi issues, (I checked the channels that it was on and they were clear), so I managed to get a refund for that and although I did like the AC2800 I would not get another.

Therefore, if the fritzbox 7530 is reasonable do I get a Wifi Mesh System to ensure good wifi. - (possibly via another Fritz Device/s or via one of the three part stand alone Wifi Mesh Systems).

Alternatively, would I be better off buying a Billion 8900ax 2400.or an Asus DSL AC88U. - How good is the Wifi on these? - Some reviews seem to conflict.

Do we know which of these has the better wifi ?

Sky Fibre

Edited by Fido (Fri 21-Jun-19 16:24:16)

Standard User baby_frogmella
(knowledge is power) Fri 21-Jun-19 16:57:52
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Fido:
Alternatively, would I be better off buying a Billion 8900ax 2400.or an Asus DSL AC88U. - How good is the Wifi on these? - Some reviews seem to conflict.
Do we know which of these has the better wifi ?


Both of these are 4x4 stream wifi routers, so both should be decent. I would go for the Billion 8900AX mainly due to having better firmware. Also worth considering TP Link VR2800 and Netgear D7800 which are also 4x4 stream routers.

Only consider a mesh system if a single router/AP doesn't cut it.

FluidOne FTTPoD 330/30 Mbps
Linksys EA9500v2
Standard User Fido
(committed) Fri 21-Jun-19 19:43:37
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:
Both of these are 4x4 stream wifi routers, so both should be decent. I would go for the Billion 8900AX mainly due to having better firmware. Also worth considering TP Link VR2800 and Netgear D7800 which are also 4x4 stream routers.


Thank you for the other alternatives that you mentioned; as indicated I did have a TP Link VR2800 but it developed intermittent poor Wifi issues, so I contacted technical support and I obtained a refund, therefore, although I liked the VR2800 I have crossed it off the list.

I am unsure about the Netgear D7800:


I too was leaning towards the Billion 8900AX 2400, (even though I have never had a billion router I know that there appear to be a lot of happy Billion users), but some uses of billion Routers on a Billion User Website refer poor cosmetic finish, (when it arrived brand new), and to poor Wifi which they said was an issue with both this and the earlier model;

http://forum.billion.uk.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=836...

At present the Netgear D7800 costs almost the same as the Asus DSL AC88U which costs about £42 less, (ie.about 20% less), than the Billion 8900AX 2400 but is the Billion Firmware and performance worth 20% more?

My eyes are starting to bounce together when I look up technical reviews and customer feedback comparisons for each model which is not helped when, (on some sites eg Amazon), the customer reviews for other models are included with the reviews for other models from the same manufacturer).

From what I can tell the Billion 8900ax 2400 is stable but does it suffer from inferior Wifi to some of the others?

Sky Fibre


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Standard User deezel
(regular) Fri 21-Jun-19 21:01:35
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
I'm using the billion 8900AX-2400 and it's excellent , only use the 5 GHZ wi-fi part and no problems at all

you can get a bit more range using the 2.4 GHZ , my neighbour 2 doors ago can pick my wireless up

imop great modem / router

Billion 8900 AX 2400
AAISP Home 1
Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Fri 21-Jun-19 21:37:56
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
Why don't you keep the Fritzbox to establish connection with Zen and get something such as the Google WiFi or BT Whole Home WiFi for the wireless side of things?

This would give you better wireless coverage than one main access point such as the Billion listed.

Edited by ukhardy07 (Fri 21-Jun-19 21:39:07)

Standard User Fido
(committed) Fri 21-Jun-19 23:11:38
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: deezel] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by deezel:
I'm using the billion 8900AX-2400 and it's excellent , only use the 5 GHZ wi-fi part and no problems at all


Thanks for that feedback; it does allay my concerns that the Wifi may not be good.

Sky Fibre
Standard User Fido
(committed) Fri 21-Jun-19 23:50:56
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: ukhardy07] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ukhardy07:
Why don't you keep the Fritzbox to establish connection with Zen and get something such as the Google WiFi or BT Whole Home WiFi for the wireless side of things?

This would give you better wireless coverage than one main access point such as the Billion listed.


I agree that a mesh may be a good option but some able people consider that it is inferior and I am open minded. - I do intend to try the Fritzbox 7530 as it does seem to be quite a good router and it may be really good other than the Wifi coverage.

It is possible that just supporting the Fritzbox Wifi with a wifi Mesh, (possibly via other Fritzbox Devices or via one of the three part stand alone Wifi Mesh Systems), may be a good answer as it should certainly deal with the potential Wifi coverage issues.

However, I am not yet sure that setup would be fully viable due to the processor speed/capacity of the processor in the router. - I presently use four home plugs, (each with three ports), to distribute the signal throughout the house and various devices are connected to all of these and with better Wifi coverage it may be that I need a router with a faster processor. - Maybe not.

I suspect that one day mesh systems will be standard.

Right now I don't yet know if a mesh system is the best option but at the present time a faster router with better wifi , possibly with the Fritzbox in bridge mode, should definitely work and my reason for asking now is that I had seen that the Asus DSL AC88U available at £199 which is £60 less than the Amazon Price and I had also hoped to find good/bad opinions on the Asus DSL AC88U.

That said; I am presently favouring the Billion 8900ax 2400

Sky Fibre
Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Sat 22-Jun-19 00:12:23
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
To act as a modem the standard router is plenty fine. You donít need a better processor.

The vast majority use the ISP supplied kit and get full speeds. ISPs are not in the business of supplying a router which cannot manage speeds over Ethernet.
Standard User baby_frogmella
(knowledge is power) Sat 22-Jun-19 09:00:04
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
You may find a mesh system is overkill for your environment, try a decent single access point/router first and see how you get on. ISP supplied routers usually aren't the best for wifi as they use lower spec radios to save pennies. So give the Billion 8900AX a try first, ignore the negative reviews on Amazon as pretty much every router there usually has negative reviews- often due to incorrect router setup.

The other option I would suggest is use your fritzbox in modem only mode (aka bridge mode) and buy the Netgear R7800 - the R7800 is rated by Tim Higgins as the # 1 router for wifi range/speeds as tested on smallnetbuilder.com. Usually the R7800 retails for £150+ on Amazon but its currently on sale at £130, which is almost a bargain for a high end router. With the money saved you could buy an el cheapo (£10-£20) HG612 vdsl2 modem on ebay if you wanted a smaller modem footprint and keep the Fritzbox as a spare.

FluidOne FTTPoD 330/30 Mbps
Linksys EA9500v2

Edited by baby_frogmella (Sat 22-Jun-19 11:26:45)

Standard User lexden16
(committed) Sat 22-Jun-19 12:36:31
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
I have used Fritz!Boxes since the days of ADSL. I currently have a Fritz!Box 7590 with a meshed 1750 repeater on a 74/20 FTTC connection, and I am seeing wifi speeds around the house in the high 60s. I particularly like the fact that I get a very low DSL error rate (which is easily monitored on the Fritz!Box), and a connection that remains stable between firmware updates. I also have VOIP connections to the Fritz!Box (more precisely a single VOIP connection with 3 VOIP-enabled DECT phones) and the quality of the calls is excellent. Personally, I would give the 7530 as try, you might be surprised how good it is.
Standard User baby_frogmella
(knowledge is power) Sat 22-Jun-19 13:24:21
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: lexden16] [link to this post]
 
The fritzbox 7530 is only a 2x2 wifi stream router whilst the OP is thinking of buying a 4x4 stream router such as the Billion 8900AX. The 7530 isn't bad for an ISP supplied router, however there are far better routers out there for wifi coverage. Even the mid-range TP Link VR900 (3x3) is better than the 7530. Also AFAIK Fritzboxes normally use a Lantiq dsl chipset which often doesn't give the best sync rate, especially if connected to a Huawei/Broadcom FTTC cabinet.

FluidOne FTTPoD 330/30 Mbps
Linksys EA9500v2

Edited by baby_frogmella (Sat 22-Jun-19 13:29:39)

Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 22-Jun-19 13:38:52
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:
Also AFAIK Fritzboxes normally use a Lantiq dsl chipset which often doesn't give the best sync rate, especially if connected to a Huawei/Broadcom FTTC cabinet.
The same applies to the HG612 these days, re sync on most lines. Even if it isn't on its last legs and being on sale because of that.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.

Edited by RobertoS (Sat 22-Jun-19 13:39:24)

Standard User Fido
(committed) Sat 22-Jun-19 14:54:18
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: lexden16] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by lexden16:
I have used Fritz!Boxes since the days of ADSL. I currently have a Fritz!Box 7590 with a meshed 1750 repeater on a 74/20 FTTC connection, and I am seeing wifi speeds around the house in the high 60s. I particularly like the fact that I get a very low DSL error rate (which is easily monitored on the Fritz!Box), and a connection that remains stable between firmware updates. I also have VOIP connections to the Fritz!Box (more precisely a single VOIP connection with 3 VOIP-enabled DECT phones) and the quality of the calls is excellent. Personally, I would give the 7530 as try, you might be surprised how good it is.


Thank you for that. It is helpful.

Some years ago I was using Fritzbox Routers; I had a Fritzbox 7390 which did not have great Wifi but was generally OK, however, it did not have wireless AC and when I updated to the newer, (at that time), Fritzbox 7490 I found that the Wifi on Fritzbox 7490 I that received was very poor and I sent it back for a refund. - (I never used the phone system on either of them because when I tried it; both routers suffered from ghost calls and background line hiss/noise.- At that time I was with BT and when I changed to the Asus DSL AC68U router it was a much better router and it cost less than the Fritzbox 7490.

That said: I do plan to give the Fritzbox 7530 a fair chance and a good try.

When I wrote about a mesh using Fritzbox Devices I had in mind a system similar to the one that you are using. - ie. A Fritzbox 7590 and a 1759E Repeater and I had also considered incorporating the supplied Fritzbox 7530 within the Fritzbox Mesh with everything being connected to the present homeplugs to try to reduce any Wifi backhaul between them.

The Fritzbox 7590 and a 1759E Repeater pack is available from Amazon UK for about £294 and the Fritzbox 7590 supports extra features such as Supervectoring 35b, (not available in the UK) and 4x4 Multi-User MIMO so it the supplied Fritzbox 7530 works well on the line that could be a viable option.

The combined pack available on Amazon UK is apparently the locked to the German Language Version which is a potentially good and bad thing. - Good because the Fritzbox German Versions get all the updates about a year before the International Versions and bad because my own knowledge of Technical German terms may not be good enough so I would need to buy the International Versions.

Sky Fibre
Standard User lexden16
(committed) Sat 22-Jun-19 15:02:58
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
I purchased my 7590 international version from Fritz.NL. The German version will not work on a UK FTTC Line. Yes, it comes with a Euro Plug which isnít a problem.

My 1750 is the German version. It makes no difference and it is cheaper than the international version. Establishing the mesh is a button press on the Fritz!Box and one on the repeater.
Standard User Fido
(committed) Sat 22-Jun-19 15:30:13
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:
You may find a mesh system is overkill for your environment, try a decent single access point/router first and see how you get on. ISP supplied routers usually aren't the best for wifi as they use lower spec radios to save pennies. So give the Billion 8900AX a try first, ignore the negative reviews on Amazon as pretty much every router there usually has negative reviews- often due to incorrect router setup.

The other option I would suggest is use your fritzbox in modem only mode (aka bridge mode) and buy the Netgear R7800 - the R7800 is rated by Tim Higgins as the # 1 router for wifi range/speeds as tested on smallnetbuilder.com. Usually the R7800 retails for £150+ on Amazon but its currently on sale at £130, which is almost a bargain for a high end router. With the money saved you could buy an el cheapo (£10-£20) HG612 vdsl2 modem on ebay if you wanted a smaller modem footprint and keep the Fritzbox as a spare.


Thank you for your assistance.

Some of the WiFi Mesh Systems that I have been looking at appear to want to take over the DCHP functions of the router and I am not really comfortable with that.

Since I would not want a Mesh System to take over all of the DCHP functions of the router I suspect that they would end up as access points and since all of the Mesh systems cannot be connected via the homeplugs and some can I suspect that the ones that can be connected via the homeplugs may be better as they would not have to use a separate Wifi network for their own backhaul. - Perhaps, that is incorrect.

A Fritzbox Mesh system based on the Fritzbox 7590 seems viable since the Fritzbox 7590 uses its own version of 4x4 and MUMIMO and the router and other items would all be included in the mesh controlled by the router but I too am somewhat concerned that the Fritzbox does not use a Broadcom Chipset and I suspect that the Billion 8900ax 2400 would be a better choice but I remain open minded to this and other solutions.

Strong cases have been made for a mesh system and it may be the way forward but at present the Billion 8900ax 2400, (probably supplemented, (if necessary), with the supplied Fritzbox 7530 as an Access Point at the farthest location; is still in pole position.

Sky Fibre
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 22-Jun-19 16:11:45
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Fido:
Some of the WiFi Mesh Systems that I have been looking at appear to want to take over the DCHP functions of the router and I am not really comfortable with that.

My parents use a BT Whole Home mesh system, with their ASUS RT-AC87U router, and a HG612 modem. The BT system was needed as the router is located in a corner of the building, so WiFi coverage was problematic. Moving the router was non-trivial. The BT system is very good.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m - Sync history highest: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User steve25
(newbie) Mon 24-Jun-19 12:46:37
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
I am using a FB7530 together with a FB4040 acting as a mesh repeater (fed via 5Ghz) and very happy with DSL and WiFi performance. Like a previous poster I am also using DECT handsets and a VOIP line (sipgate).
The FB supports IPSec VPN which works well with my iPad for remote access.
Standard User boxst
(fountain of knowledge) Mon 24-Jun-19 21:11:14
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
I am with Zen for FTTP and decided that a mesh network was the best to get WiFi around the house. I bought a FritzBox 7590 and used the 7530 (actually three of them as I had two to hand from Zen and then bought another on eBay) to get WiFi everywhere.

They are connected by Ethernet and we get seamless WiFi throughout the house. Perhaps more importantly the handoff is excellent so you would never know (and no-one does apart from me) that you are being swapped between routers.
Standard User lexden16
(committed) Tue 25-Jun-19 11:31:16
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: boxst] [link to this post]
 
Another option:

https://frixtender.de/frixtender-fritzbox-wifi-erwei...

Use Google translate.
Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Tue 25-Jun-19 14:37:51
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
You do not want to connect a mesh system such as the BT Whole Home WiFi over your powerline.

I still strongly disagree one main AP is the best approach, businesses, hotels, airports, large homes all have several APs. If you want good wireless performance either:
1) Run actual ethernet (not powerline) to the APs and run several throughout the home
2) Invest in a Mesh System e.g. BT Whole Home WiFi.

One access point is not the best approach to fix wireless deadspots. You may get marginally better signal with a different AP, but the signal strength will never be that great. It wont go from 0 to 100, more 0 to 20. Having a physical AP closer e.g mesh/individual ethernet APs will take you from 0 to 100 pretty quickly, with a mesh losing a little bit of speed for home transfers e.g. NAS internal transfers, but solid at giving you full ISP provided speeds.
Standard User baby_frogmella
(knowledge is power) Tue 25-Jun-19 16:24:15
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: ukhardy07] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ukhardy07:
I still strongly disagree one main AP is the best approach, businesses, hotels, airports, large homes all have several APs. If you want good wireless performance either:
1) Run actual ethernet (not powerline) to the APs and run several throughout the home
2) Invest in a Mesh System e.g. BT Whole Home WiFi.


I don't think anyone has suggested to the OP that a single AP is guaranteed to give him 100% wifi coverage in the home. However - unless the OP has a huge home - the sensible approach would be to try a single router/AP first and see how he gets on before spending more money on a mesh system or multiple APs. He may find 1 router/AP easily covers the full home (especially if it has thin walls) or he may not. A single router (Linksys EA9500) easily covers my 4 bedroom, 2 floor home with wifi such that nothing is wired. Every wifi device gets > 250 Mbps on my 300 Mbps Line - even our 2 VOIP sip lines run over wifi. That doesn't mean everyone else can get away with using the same router without additional APs but equally, some may find the same AP works well on its own. Every home is unique, what may work in one environment won't necessarily work in another.

FluidOne FTTPoD 330/30 Mbps
Linksys EA9500v2

Edited by baby_frogmella (Tue 25-Jun-19 16:26:16)

Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Tue 25-Jun-19 18:26:35
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
Iím a 4 bedroom flat and one AP barely gets through the first wall. Either way I donít see why a single AP at a costing similar to a mesh network would be preferential... Yes technically the mesh network might be an overkill but itíll fix the wireless issue. A single AP becomes a try it and see solution, which could end up being a decent chunk of money spent and a mesh network or extra APs still required.

If indeed the normal routers functionality wasnít good enough eg they wanted advanced features then itís a different scenario.

Iíd go for the overkill mesh anyday given the similar costing overall when trying to fix a WiFi issue.
Standard User baby_frogmella
(knowledge is power) Tue 25-Jun-19 19:00:40
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: ukhardy07] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ukhardy07:
Either way I donít see why a single AP at a costing similar to a mesh network would be preferential...

1) A half decent router such as a TP Link VR900 can cost significantly less (~ £100) than a half decent wifi mesh system such as BT wifi disks (> £150). That's assuming you get the same wifi performance on both.
2) By having a single AP, you save ££s on the electric bills (no matter how small), less units to plug in, less wiring, less equipment for the pets/kids to knock over etc and perhaps most importantly, its far easier to troubleshoot if things go wrong.

In reply to a post by ukhardy07:
A single AP becomes a try it and see solution, which could end up being a decent chunk of money spent and a mesh network or extra APs still required.

Indeed its a bit of trial & error thing but considering the likes of Amazon offer free 30 days hassle free returns on everything they sell directly, its a 100% risk free purchase should you decide to return Amazon purchased hardware.

My advice to folks is if they don't live in a huge home and/or have thick walls, then a half decent single AP/router may do the trick wrt wifi coverage. As an example & from my own experience, new build type homes - which often have wafer thin walls - are very wifi friendly and usually 1 router will easily cover the whole house (unless its huge).

FluidOne FTTPoD 330/30 Mbps
Linksys EA9500v2

Edited by baby_frogmella (Tue 25-Jun-19 19:22:15)

Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 25-Jun-19 20:13:18
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
Amazon do indeed offer their 30 day money back guarantee on fulfilled by Amazon items but similar protections apply for any online purchase.

The distance selling regulations allow you to return new items within 14 days of receiving them no matter who the retailer is.

I'm entirely in agreement that you should try a single wireless AP solution before buying multiple wireless AP's or a wireless mesh system.
For many homes and for the average consumer a single wireless AP/router will be more than enough to provide coverage across the entire house.

Buying additional kit that might be completely unnecessary simply because a single AP might not cover every square inch of your property is potentially wasting money.

Try a single wireless AP and see how it goes. There are many mobile apps available that you can walk around the home and check the wireless signal strength at various points and decide if coverage is adequate.

A single wireless AP gives great coverage throughout my new build 3 bedroom property over 2 floors. I even get decent 2.4GHz coverage at the bottom of my garden.
Another wireless AP or mesh system would be overkill.
Standard User gary333
(regular) Tue 25-Jun-19 20:28:30
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
I was quite surprised to see that my 4 bedroom detached house has excellent to very good signal from the Virgin Media Superhub 3 in all rooms. Especially as Iíve ripped it to bits to install network cable everywhere and sound proofed using metal resilient bars and the thickest rock wool I could buy in ceilings and upstairs non brick walls.

No furniture or appliances in yet, so might get worse, but surprised me as expected to use extra equipment.
Standard User jabuzzard
(member) Tue 25-Jun-19 22:15:33
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:
My advice to folks is if they don't live in a huge home and/or have thick walls, then a half decent single AP/router may do the trick wrt wifi coverage. As an example & from my own experience, new build type homes - which often have wafer thin walls - are very wifi friendly and usually 1 router will easily cover the whole house (unless its huge).


I would add to this an optimally placed access point can often achieve good coverage of the whole house. However in this context an optimally placed access point is frequently a ceiling mounted one feed with an ethernet cable and invariably powered using power over ethernet. Concluding that a single access point won't work by moving a cheap router about will invariably lead to erroneous conclusions.

It's certainly the case in my house that by doing that I achieve excellent coverage though out the house, but then like I said my access point is slap bang in the middle of the house literally. Using a standard access point and there was always somewhere in the house where the WiFi was a bit rubbish. It's certainly preferable to a mesh solution if it will work. It's simpler, cheaper, lower powered and avoids the need for roaming which does not work well on all devices. A ceiling mounted AP also wins hands down in the neatness stakes, as you can relegate the router to a cupboard, which may or may not be near the modem.

For my brother and sister I have had to deploy a mesh system to get decent coverage of the house, simply down to the size and construction. Ideally it's needed in my mother's house too, but she is not going to pay extra for the coverage over a well placed access point (not much call for WiFi in the utility room).

The one thing I would say is if you are getting a "mesh system" is to raise heaven and earth to get the access points linked via ethernet if you can. The result is wildly better than using wireless backhaul.
Standard User Fido
(committed) Tue 25-Jun-19 22:33:10
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by j0hn83:
Amazon do indeed offer their 30 day money back guarantee on fulfilled by Amazon items but similar protections apply for any online purchase.

The distance selling regulations allow you to return new items within 14 days of receiving them no matter who the retailer is.


Amazon have always been great to deal with and they still are, (irrespective of the current legislation), and previously while the Distance Selling regulations were in force it was clear cut for all online retailers.

Unfortunately, not all retailers are as easy to deal as Amazon are especially since the current UK Conservative Government Cancelled the Distance Selling Regulations and they brought in the Consumer Rights Act 2015.

The Distance Selling Regulations was effectively a copy of the EU legislation. - (as usual, all of the good legislation tended to come out of the EU and all of the [censored] came out of Westminster).

The new legislation is similar regarding online sales but a potential problem with the new legislation could be a clause called "Excessive Handling" which some smaller retailers may try to use to negate a persons statutory rights.

I mention this because a couple of days ago my finger was hovering over the buy button for a Billion 8900ax 2400 that was in the basket for a company called Broadbandbuyer.com, (who do seem to be a reasonable company), but who had a very unreasonable Terms and Condition that I was quite uncomfortable with in that they take the view that if you open the router box you are considered to have, (in their view), to have excessively handled the router and you will not be given and full refund if you find that its performance is inadequate and you return the router to them. - (It's ridiculous it is like buying clothing online and trying it on to see if it fits to discover that taking out of the bag is excessive handing and would not pass scrutiny as T&C cannot be used to negate a persons statutory right but who want the potential hassle).

I am presently checking how the Fritzbox 7530 performs on my line and up to now it has been a bit of a disappointment with regard to line speed but the DLM reset has not yet been properly carried out. - (It is presently much worse than the Sky Q Router regarding speed but time will tell when things settle down). - That said; right now the internet speed is certainly not impressive.

If the Fritzbox 7530 does eventually come good I am considering adding a Fritzbox Mesh System, (based on a Fritzbox 7590), as I like the idea of the main router controlling it all but that is unlikely if the internet speed is down the toilet.

I have looked at a number of mesh systems, (including the Linksys Velop Tri-Band Whole Home Mesh System), that fulfils my wife's criterion of neat items and could be used with another router if it only operates as somewhat expensive access points.

I am also considering an older model of router with a fast Broadcom Chipset to handle the line and home plugs and mesh system to hand the wireless but I am not sure what older routers would fit the bill.

Amazon do not presently sell the Billion 8900ax 2400, if they did I would get one from them as it would probably be OK..

I suspect that the Asus DSL AC88U would also be reasonable and since another large retailer does have the Asus DSL AC88U, in stock, for £199 that may be a way to go.

It is difficult to decide what to choose; especially with the presents Fritzbox line speed being so poor.

Zen

Edited by Fido (Tue 25-Jun-19 23:50:40)

Standard User baby_frogmella
(knowledge is power) Wed 26-Jun-19 02:24:01
Print Post

Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Fido:
Amazon do not presently sell the Billion 8900ax 2400, if they did I would get one from them as it would probably be OK..

Amazon showing stock here
https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Network-Routers/Billion-M...

Edit: now out of stock

FluidOne FTTPoD 330/30 Mbps
Linksys EA9500v2

Edited by baby_frogmella (Wed 26-Jun-19 07:28:20)

Standard User Fido
(committed) Wed 26-Jun-19 12:39:22
Print Post

Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:
In reply to a post by Fido:
Amazon do not presently sell the Billion 8900ax 2400, if they did I would get one from them as it would probably be OK..

Amazon showing stock here
https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Network-Routers/Billion-M...

Edit: now out of stock


Hi baby_frogmella,

Please accept my sincere thanks for your helpfulness in letting me know of the Amazon availability.

Luckily, in the early hours of the morning, I was faffing about checking the speed and performance of the internet connection myself, (which is still presently down the toilet), when I noticed that one was available direct from Amazon and I managed to buy it.

At present; I will see how the Fritzbox 7530 goes as I want to give the line a chance to reset and settle with the supplied router but right now both the speed and the sync speeds are abysmal.

In between times I will see how the Billion 8900ax 2400 Wifi signal.compares.

Regards,
Fido

Zen Internet
Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Wed 26-Jun-19 16:24:21
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
Given the £249 pricetag, are you sure you will get enough use of the extra functionality?

In my personal view, this is very much an overkill for the majority of users, and I haven't seen much in your posts to-date that indicate you need this sort of device. Your usage seems fairly straight forward.

It is a great device nontheless.

To put things into perspective, I have over 30 devices connected to my setup with 80/20 sync, and my equipment is nowhere near this level of spec.
Standard User Fido
(committed) Wed 26-Jun-19 17:16:06
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: ukhardy07] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ukhardy07:
Given the £249 pricetag, are you sure you will get enough use of the extra functionality?


The truthful answer is, (without doubt), definitely no

That said; from what I can tell the Billion 8900ax 2400 should be a good basis to build upon and it should be able to distribute the connection effectively and it may even have enough WiFi range..

I do tend to over engineer things to create spare capacity that may never be needed and I fully accept that it may be a sledge hammer to crack a walnut approach.

If my line was presently running well with the Fritzbox 7530; I may have gone down the Fritzbox Product Mesh or another Mesh System route but at present time my line is running very badly at about half of what it was with Sky with at least 25% a higher attenuation than there was with the Sky Q Router and/or with my previous TP Link VR2800 before the switch over. - (The present speeds are much lower with very erratic speeds and performance).

There is a lot that I do like about the Fritzbox 7530 and I have not completely ruled it out but some of the performance and the speed drop could be the change of router and a Billion 8900ax 2400 will rule that possibility out.

The ISP that I have just joined has a great reputation and I am reasonably confident/hopeful that they will sort it out these much worse than ever speed issues for me but if there is a slight chance that part of the problem is the Fritzbox 7530 Router\Chipset the Broadcom chipset in the Billion 8900ax 2400 should rule that possibility out.

Zen FTTC
Standard User lexden16
(committed) Wed 26-Jun-19 17:57:05
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
I am not sure that I would necessarily blame the F!B. My 7590 with OS 7.10 has been rock solid for the past 5 weeks with a very low error rate.
Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Wed 26-Jun-19 22:00:05
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
Hard to say for sure, when I switched TalkTalk to Sky, I went from 80/20 with TalkTalk, and first day of sync with Sky was 56/20. After approx 3 days of no reboots G.INP was enabled, speeds shot to around 65/20. Then over the course of around 10 days, with no reboots and/or disconnections the SNR went to 5db after approx 3 days, 2 days or there abouts later it went to 4db, 2 days or there abouts later it went to 3db and I'm now back to a 80/20 sync. It is very important to do no reboots/resets/config changes that might drop the sync to get the best speeds as quickly as possible.

Have you been rebooting the router provided or power cycling it?
Standard User Fido
(committed) Thu 27-Jun-19 00:28:26
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: ukhardy07] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ukhardy07:
Have you been rebooting the router provided or power cycling it?


No reboots or recycles.

At present; I only have the supplied Fritzbox 7530 and the old Sky Q Router, (due to be sent back), and since the connection became useable I have not changed or rebooted the Fritzbox 7530.

The new Billion 8900ax 2400, (that I have ordered), will not arrive until this weekend and I may not install it for a 10 day period to give the connection time to settle as I may just try it, (via one of the Ethernet Ports), as a wireless access point to see how its Wfifi performs.

Zen FTTC

Edited by Fido (Thu 27-Jun-19 11:36:57)

Standard User CrimsonOne
(newbie) Fri 05-Jul-19 22:57:38
Print Post

Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: lexden16] [link to this post]
 
On the subject of the Asus DSL-88U I've had two here for testing because their owner could not get the 5GHz WiFi to perform. They both exhibited the same issue here, being unable to maintain a connection above 172Mbps!

This contrasts with the Asus RT-AC86U Mesh Master and RT-AC68U Slave connected via a powerline connection which give us 866Mbps on 5GHz and 72Mbps (min) on 2.4GHz throughout the house. Those speeds being limited more by the networked devices than the router(s).
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 06-Jul-19 00:33:13
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: CrimsonOne] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by CrimsonOne:
This contrasts with the Asus RT-AC86U Mesh Master and RT-AC68U Slave connected via a powerline connection which give us 866Mbps on 5GHz and 72Mbps (min) on 2.4GHz throughout the house. Those speeds being limited more by the networked devices than the router(s).
A powerline connection?

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User Fido
(committed) Sat 03-Aug-19 16:27:16
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Re: To Mesh or Not to Mesh; that is the question?


[re: Fido] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Fido:
The new Billion 8900ax 2400, (that I have ordered), will not arrive until this weekend.


I thought that an update may be useful and that is as follows:

Firstly; Sincere thanks to all for the helpful information.

Regarding the Billion 8900AC 2400 router.- It had very poor wifi Range. (Its wifi speeds were OK in the same room but its range was terrible so buying that was an error. - It quickly went back to Amazon).

The modem part of the Billion 8900AC 2400 router was good but the wifi range was absolutely terrible. - (I am not sure why it is considered to have good wifi because the wifi range is far worse than most ISP supplied routers and definitely worse than the supplied Fritzbox 7530).

I eventually bought a new Fritzbox 7590 from fritzshop.nl and I used the supplied Fritzbox 7530 together with another Fritzbox 7530, (that I bought from eBay), as two separate wireless access points via my Homeplug LAN. - This works quite well but it means that I have two more distinct wifi signals but I have separated them from the main router wifi channels.

I did try to mesh the two Fritzbox 7530 up with the main Fritzbox 7590 and it did work to a fashion but the wifi was slower with the wifi meshed but I may try this again and I would also consider a Fritzbox 1750e repeater or two instead of the two Fritzbox 7530 but I am not sure that a dedicated wifi repeater would be any better.

Regards,
Fido

Zen FTTC
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