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Standard User truex360
(learned) Tue 12-Jun-12 17:06:37
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Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818 / 19


[link to this post]
 
My attainable sync has droped from 88916 / 30000 to 46818 / 19407 ???? my noise margin is also lower this was the response from isp :

The circuit has been tested and the results are as follows :

Problem Explanation: [EPP508] No performance issues have been identified in the BTW network.
Resolution/Recommendation: Please follow your diagnostic procedures to resolve the fault.

GEA Test - 30M-60M Downstream, Interleaving Off - 10M-20M Upstream, Interleaving Off

The GEA test passed indicating no issues however the circuit appears to be banded. As no fault has been found on the circuit, it is advised to power cycle all the equipment connected to the line including the VDSL modem for a period of 15-20 minutes and retest.

Nothing has changed my end so what gives ?

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Edited by truex360 (Tue 12-Jun-12 17:27:19)

Standard User MHC
(legend) Tue 12-Jun-12 17:29:55
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 20000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
A significant noise event occurred which has resulted in certain tones being identified as unusable and they remain marked in that way. If te noise source has disappeared, the 30 minutes downtime will let the equipment reset any flags and start from fresh.

Do as suggested - turn off for 30 minutes whilst also disconnecting modem from line, and removing modem to router connection. Then bring all items up and wait for two minutes to allow them to settle. Connect modem to line and wait for 1 minute to ensure sync, then connect modem and router.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User truex360
(learned) Tue 12-Jun-12 19:19:06
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 20000 to 46818


[re: MHC] [link to this post]
 
i have tried this for more than 30 mins does not reset

before

[IMG]http://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww132/truex360/mo...[/IMG]

after

[IMG]http://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww132/truex360/12...[/IMG]

.

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
My Broadband Speed Test
Upload is 16 smile

Edited by truex360 (Tue 12-Jun-12 19:38:25)


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Standard User MHC
(legend) Tue 12-Jun-12 19:38:23
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 20000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
So what do the tone loading plots look like?


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User truex360
(learned) Tue 12-Jun-12 19:43:05
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: MHC] [link to this post]
 
how do i gather these

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
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Edited by truex360 (Tue 12-Jun-12 22:47:49)

Standard User MHC
(legend) Tue 12-Jun-12 20:34:18
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 20000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
In the instruction set for gaining access to teh modem by reflashing there are further instructions on how to get full stats and line data from the device.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User truex360
(learned) Tue 12-Jun-12 22:41:27
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: MHC] [link to this post]
 
[IMG]http://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww132/truex360/tx...[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww132/truex360/pr...[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww132/truex360/al...[/IMG]

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
My Broadband Speed Test
Upload is 16 smile

Edited by truex360 (Tue 12-Jun-12 22:47:26)

Standard User MHC
(legend) Tue 12-Jun-12 23:05:43
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
You need another users data to compare it with (my hacked modem is on loan) but I feel that the bit loading is low in D1 ... and there is a horrible notch at the low frequency end of D1.

It suggests that there may still be noise causing a problem on the line ... but you need a comparison.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User truex360
(learned) Tue 12-Jun-12 23:16:25
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: MHC] [link to this post]
 
but wouldnt the gea test failed if there was constent noise on the line ? is it just stuck an i need an engineer vist to reset the my profile back to what it was or do i just wait it out ?

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Standard User Bald_Eagle1
(committed) Wed 13-Jun-12 07:22:14
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by truex360:
The circuit has been tested and the results are as follows :

Problem Explanation: [EPP508] No performance issues have been identified in the BTW network.
Resolution/Recommendation: Please follow your diagnostic procedures to resolve the fault.

GEA Test - 30M-60M Downstream, Interleaving Off - 10M-20M Upstream, Interleaving Off

The GEA test passed indicating no issues however the circuit appears to be banded. As no fault has been found on the circuit, it is advised to power cycle all the equipment connected to the line including the VDSL modem for a period of 15-20 minutes and retest.


That looks very much like Plusnet's terminology.

If you are indeed you are with Plusnet, I can confirm they do NOT see all the modem's resyncs in their own logs.

Does your modem resync "on the fly" regularly?
The built in modem log should confirm that (may need to be enabled first though).

Attenuation etc. suggests a higher speed should be possible, but SNRM doesn't, thus indicating quite a noisy line. Possibly cross-talk issues?

How long have you had FTTC & how long was it before sync & attainable rates dropped?

If you are with Plusnet, the 80/20 service is still a "trial" & as you are achieving over 50% of available speeds I doubt they could/would pursue this unless you are able to prove "faults" - maybe via setting up the ongoing stats logging/graphing.

I have seen many issues on my connection with GEA tests all O.K. sort of comments & it has taken around 11 months to finally get it sorted - & that is even with extremely well documented "proof".

If you haven't already done so, disconnecting & reconnecting via the router (not modem) sometimes frees up a "stuck" low IP Profile.

Your ISP would also definitely see that in their logs as it initiates a new PPP session.

Good luck smile

Edited by Bald_Eagle1 (Wed 13-Jun-12 07:26:30)

Standard User philippercival
(experienced) Wed 13-Jun-12 09:40:53
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
What time of day are you testing?

I am also on the Entanet 80/20 product and when complaining of speeds was rather horrified to find that to get the maximum my setup was capable of I had to test between about 8:30pm and midnight. Before 8 Business has priority and after 12 it is a free for all. Home users have priority from 8:00 to 12:00. It certainly makes a huge difference particularly to download speed on my line. In fact hardly worth paying the little extra for the 80/20 service as during the day I rarely get more than 40.

Edited by philippercival (Wed 13-Jun-12 09:42:06)

Anonymous
(Unregistered)Wed 13-Jun-12 09:47:10
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: Bald_Eagle1] [link to this post]
 
this happened 2 days ago nothing has changed at my house . i just noticed that my speeds had dropped i have had fttc for over 1.5 years and been on 80/20 for over a month with max sync then this !
Anonymous
(Unregistered)Wed 13-Jun-12 09:51:30
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: philippercival] [link to this post]
 
Its not my sync rate thats the issue is the attaianble sync rate its gone from 79999/30000 to 46407/19403 and has not increased since i have run my retests at 06:00am / 5pm / 12pm make no difference the line throughput has veen cut in half. i have posted what my lines stats were a month ago and what they have dropped to now .
Standard User Bald_Eagle1
(committed) Wed 13-Jun-12 10:06:55
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: Anonymous] [link to this post]
 
Do you happen to have pbParams data from when your attainable rates were at the maximum - for a "before & after" comparison (especially attenuation).

If attenuation has actually increased by a lot, it would definitely indicate a physical line and/or filtered faceplate fault (IMO).

If you don't have that data, maybe someone could compare stats with you who is a similar distance from the cabinet as you.
Did you mention line length earlier?
Standard User MHC
(legend) Wed 13-Jun-12 10:31:58
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
There is always noise on the line - across the full spectrum. It will continuously vary in amplitude at different frequencies - not always by very much but something can happen - and suddenly a band of noise see a large increase.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User truex360
(learned) Wed 13-Jun-12 18:31:53
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: MHC] [link to this post]
 
My attainable upstream has risen to 52888 tonight so not sure if it's resyncing or not ?

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
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Standard User Bald_Eagle1
(committed) Wed 13-Jun-12 19:34:25
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by truex360:
My attainable upstream has risen to 52888 tonight so not sure if it's resyncing or not ?



??? Should that have read attainable downstream?

Attainable rates ususually fluctuate up/down roughly in line with SNRM i.e. if SNRM increases, Attainable Rate usually also increases.

It does NOT necessarily mean the connection has resynced.


EDIT:

Just to ask again:-

Do you happen to have pbParams data from when your attainable rates were at the maximum - for a "before & after" comparison (especially attenuation).

If attenuation has actually increased by a lot, it would definitely indicate a physical line and/or filtered faceplate fault (IMO).

Edited by Bald_Eagle1 (Wed 13-Jun-12 19:38:26)

Standard User truex360
(learned) Wed 13-Jun-12 20:40:23
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: Bald_Eagle1] [link to this post]
 
not sure how to read these stats but it says retrain reason : 2 was 0 before ? notice power has increased as well anyone welcome to point out the key stats or differences from my last posted stats

[IMG]http://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww132/truex360/pb...[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww132/truex360/pr...[/IMG]

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
My Broadband Speed Test
Upload is 16 smile
Standard User Bald_Eagle1
(committed) Wed 13-Jun-12 22:03:13
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
Retrain Reason 0 = forced resync e.g. a reboot/power cycle
Retrain Reason 2 = unforced resync e.g. DLM initiated resync
Standard User truex360
(regular) Fri 15-Jun-12 16:07:19
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: Bald_Eagle1] [link to this post]
 
i have got an engineer visit tomorrow so i will update.

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
My Broadband Speed Test
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Edited by truex360 (Fri 15-Jun-12 16:16:30)

Standard User truex360
(regular) Sun 24-Jun-12 10:20:36
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
engineer has been this morning. Not faults on the line or noise !. they have done a profile reset in the cab to 80/20 but he said i would have to wait 10 days for line training if this does not fix a swap around in the cab would be needed. am i right in thinking that the attainable rate should not of moved from 88/30 its now currently 46/19 and this is this issue not the sync speed

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
My Broadband Speed Test
Upload is 16 smile
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sun 24-Jun-12 10:43:59
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
Did your modem re-sync when he did that?

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - Plusnet Value Fibre 80/20 trial.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Standard User truex360
(regular) Sun 24-Jun-12 10:56:26
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
they did two resyncs on the line but the attainable rate has not moved which makes me think its the cab. does the attainable rate need to retrain as well or should that be a given on the line ? no the modem and line are still operating around 45/19 just like when the issue first occured

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
My Broadband Speed Test
Upload is 16 smile
Standard User Bald_Eagle1
(committed) Sun 24-Jun-12 11:14:57
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
What are your current SNRM levels?

If they are not much higher than 6dB, they would be way too low for any higher speed (sync or attainable), suggesting a physical line problem (or a speed "cap" has been implemented for some reason).

Also, from xdslcmd info --pbParams, has there been any change in attenuation levels per DS & US band plan? (assuming you have been noting them).

Edited by Bald_Eagle1 (Sun 24-Jun-12 11:18:40)

Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sun 24-Jun-12 11:15:31
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
I believe the attainable rate is just a calculation made by the modem based on the attenuations/noise levels/noise margin and currrent sync. Did the sync speeds change significantly?

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - Plusnet Value Fibre 80/20 trial.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Standard User truex360
(regular) Sun 24-Jun-12 11:38:43
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: Bald_Eagle1] [link to this post]
 
[IMG]http://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww132/truex360/li...[/IMG]

just run now after engineer visit he did test the line for all faults but they passed e.g. noise etc

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
My Broadband Speed Test
Upload is 16 smile
Standard User truex360
(regular) Sun 24-Jun-12 11:42:00
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
before issue

[IMG]http://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww132/truex360/mo...[/IMG]

just after engineer visit today

[IMG]http://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww132/truex360/23...[/IMG]

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
My Broadband Speed Test
Upload is 16 smile
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Sun 24-Jun-12 12:58:46
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
I meant did the modem resync when the engineer fixed the profile. If it didn't, then you need to resync it yourself.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - Plusnet Value Fibre 80/20 trial.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Standard User Bald_Eagle1
(committed) Sun 24-Jun-12 14:59:41
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
Your SNR graph seems to have really low values compared to your Hlog (attenuation) which looks really good.

Low SNR graph values seem to suggest a noisy connection.

Even my poor connection has higher values in the SNR graph than yours.

Do you have an older SNR graph for comparison?

It COULD just be a massive change in crosstalk ???

Edited by Bald_Eagle1 (Sun 24-Jun-12 15:00:45)

Standard User truex360
(regular) Sun 24-Jun-12 16:54:15
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: Bald_Eagle1] [link to this post]
 
i haven't got my graphs from when i first went onto 80/20 only the modem page (above) showing full sync. The engineer was in agreement that something was wrong as the cab is just around corner he had profile reset but he did say something about a move within the cab if this did not work. the only thing i can see that has change is my neighbors had a new line installed . but would cross talk half a line ??? as my predicted speed on btw website was 67.5

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
My Broadband Speed Test
Upload is 16 smile
Standard User Bald_Eagle1
(committed) Sun 24-Jun-12 17:08:33
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by truex360:
the only thing i can see that has change is my neighbors had a new line installed . but would cross talk half a line ??? as my predicted speed on btw website was 67.5


Hmmm, I wonder if something was "disturbed" whilst connecting your neighbour's new line.

I had that a few months ago. It took 3 months to fix a dodgy joint at the pole top DP, despite reporting immediate disconnections to the engineers up the pole on 2 occasions & also to my ISP.
The engineers just denied touching my connection.

It does seem too much of a drop for it to be just crosstalk, but SOMETHING seems to be hitting your SNR values.
If it's now 80/20 at the cab, it does suggest a problem between the cab & your house.

It really is a shame you don't have any "before" stats from when your connection was performing well frown
Standard User truex360
(regular) Fri 29-Jun-12 11:12:40
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: Bald_Eagle1] [link to this post]
 
Good News ,
Engineer came back for second visit, he did

A New Cable from box to modem
New Modem
and a move within cab

Line was still only showing 50mb attainable on his last check in the duct on the pavement he found 2 issues

1. black joint Box was full of water where the line meets the main cable in the duct but his equip showed no errors
2. the cabling was split in the duct basically halving the lines attainable rate. Not sure if this was done by another engineer or an old issue which only got highlighted on 80/20

he fixed these and i am now getting full sync again so a big thanks to Steve the engineer

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
My Broadband Speed Test
Upload is 16 smile
Standard User Stoo
(regular) Fri 29-Jun-12 14:49:01
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
That's great news!

Encouraging to see good engineer service for the FTTC product smile
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Fri 29-Jun-12 16:30:12
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
smile

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk
My domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost. Internet connection - Plusnet Value Fibre 80/20 trial.

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Standard User truex360
(regular) Fri 29-Jun-12 16:57:09
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: Stoo] [link to this post]
 
attainable ate is now 94/30 which means i might be able to squeeze a bit more if they go to a 3rd profile so in all excellent job by engineer and v happy customer smile

Aquiss 80/20 FTTC
My Broadband Speed Test
Upload is 16 smile
Standard User philippercival
(experienced) Fri 29-Jun-12 21:17:09
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
Excellent outcome and excellent service.
<cynic on>
What a pity that this is not always the case. Sad that under FTTC that they have chosen to lock down the modems to keep customers in the dark and the standard way of operating still tends towards "well you are getting at least our minimum service" (set by us) so we are not interested, despite the fact that you have paid for a much faster product. This was true under ADSL max and is just as true under FTTC. unfortunately if you can obtain the minimum it is often the case that they do not examine your case fully. Sadly, which makes it worse, I suspect that the vast majority of users actually have no idea of whether or not they areontaining what they are paying for.
<cynic off>

Standard User StephenTodd
(member) Fri 29-Jun-12 21:22:44
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: philippercival] [link to this post]
 
I am afraid your broadband missed the <cynic off> part of the last transmission; your are now in an infinite contract for <cynic on>.

--
Moved (with trepidation) to BT Infinity 2 for upload speed. Happy BE user for several years.
Standard User philippercival
(experienced) Fri 29-Jun-12 21:35:00
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: StephenTodd] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by StephenTodd:
I am afraid your broadband missed the <cynic off> part of the last transmission; your are now in an infinite contract for <cynic on>.


Probably true anyway, now about those typos can I blame that on Openreach as well.

Standard User D_an_W
(committed) Fri 29-Jun-12 21:35:37
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Re: Attainable rate has dropped from 88999 / 30000 to 46818


[re: truex360] [link to this post]
 
Glad you got it all sorted, would be nice to get those checks done without jumping through all those hoops though!

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