Crowborough now accepting orders

Although not my cabinet even though it appears in the roll-out plans

I hope all those on cab 14 appreciate the backache I put into the contract of condensing the 3M verts on that cab to Quante to enable the FTTC verts.

Edited by deleted (Wed 22-Aug-12 21:25:15)

Please tell me that you will be putting lots of work into Cabinet 9 very soon?

Sadly I have not got that contract. But i would swap it for all the pair divert contracts I'm getting on 12.

Was happy to see this erected today

Cabinet

And a mere two and half months later (!) the cabinet has finally gone live.

Ordered with Zen and an installation date of 14th December.

Steve

So after a long wait I'm live finally this morning. Speed of 75mb/18mb.

Kelly Communications guy, friendly enough. Messed up the extensions, but put it right.

Good to hear you made it!

Can you tell me what happens on the day, what he did inside house etc??

My master phone socket is behind TV unit in lounge, do they put a new one it? How did he mess up extensions?

All he did was replace the faceplate with a new one that has ADSL at the top and a normal telephone socket at the bottom. Took 10 minutes. Then a wander off to the cabinet and 10 minutes later the DSL light came on and I plugged in my Asus router.

My house was wired when built for lots of internal extensions. So from the master socket there is the extension cable that goes up through the walls to one of the bedrooms that has a patch panel to then distribute to all the other extensions. Not really necessary these days of course.

Anyway, he didn't crimp the cables correctly so the extensions were all dead. Another 15 minutes looking at what he had done and we fixed it. I say 'we' as I was telling him why it probably wasn't working ...

In reply to a post by boxst:

Anyway, he didn't crimp the cables correctly so the extensions were all dead.

Crimp? are you sure?


Are you sure the faceplate has ADSL? It should say "Openreach A BT group business" ADSL ones will work but the filter design is not necessarily effective at the higher frequencies.

Believe they mean this faceplate http://www.run-it-direct.co.uk/btvdslfaceplate.html

Filtering requirements are the same for ADSL/ADSL2+ and VDSL

Have you put a typical ASDL and VDSL filter on a spectrum analyser? A colleague has and the performance of the ADSL filters above about 5 or 7 MHz was abysmal. It is not just teh requirement to keep the lower frequencies off the audio band but needs to ensure there is no significant attenuation or phase change at the higher frequencies.

I did actually post some comments on it soon after he had tested them.

http://www1.btwebworld.com/sinet/498v4p1.pdf
and this leads to
http://www.etsi.org/deliver/etsi_ts/101900_101999/10...

A lot depends on the components and values - might have to rip a few apart to see what value components are used.

Have a close look at the specs from page 41 onwards and there are different complex impedances listed. Cross talk on an ADSL filter is only defined up to 1.1MHz whereas on a VDSL2 it is 30MHz ... Above F_H the attenuation is undefined - for an ADSL filter that is 2.208MHz and thus it could be quite high which would adversely affect VDSL

Tables A4 & A5 show significant differences for the frequencies specified on ADSL/VDSL.

Edited by MHC (Fri 14-Dec-12 22:24:35)

I'm old .. so perhaps using the wrong term. He took the extension cable and the cable from the outside world and joined them together in the box. What happened is that the extension cable hadn't lost the plastic covering so wasn't making a connection.

As below, I thought that the top was 'straight through' and the bottom / extension were pre-filtered. Up until this point I had to have filters on all the extensions.

In reply to a post by boxst:

I'm old .. so perhaps using the wrong term. He took the extension cable and the cable from the outside world and joined them together in the box. What happened is that the extension cable hadn't lost the plastic covering so wasn't making a connection.

As below, I thought that the top was 'straight through' and the bottom / extension were pre-filtered. Up until this point I had to have filters on all the extensions.

Are you sure?

The cable from the outside world should be terminated on the A & B screw terminals. The extension should be on the filtered output and the plastic covering should remain in place - the IDC jaws just cut through the insulation to make contact. the should NOT be joined together inside the box!.


Can you get a picture with the lower half of the face plate removed?

Not 100% sure. I will take off the faceplate later and have a look.

If that is the case, I wonder if I will get better speeds by rewiring it. Estimate was 80/20 and getting 75/18.

In reply to a post by boxst:

getting 75/18.

That is full speed, the 80/20 is without the required overheads.

Picture here: http://www.sadandlonely.com/btfttc.JPG

Two wires from the outside world behind the main plate, then the extension attached as in the picture (with 'joins').

COWBOY ...

And why? is the wire from the extension not long enough? If so, it is one way to extend it but even then he should have used appropriate CW1308 cable and ensured the colour coding was "normal" and not used what looks to be jumper wire.


edit to add:

Just for reference, the picture shows the location of the straight through VDSL extension connection at the top left. Useful if you want to hardwire to a remote location for the modem.

Edited by MHC (Mon 17-Dec-12 12:12:58)

?
I'm not familiar with the 3-terminal NTE5A that appears to be, but is that wiring right? I assume so, as it presumably works for the phone, but to me it looks like the two blues go to an Orange/white or orange, and the yellow could be to white/orange or even white/blue?

Need to see which numbers the wires are connected to.

Looks wrong if what I can see is

Pin 2 Blue
Pin 3 Orange - ring wire
Pin 5 Blue

In which case a phone working on the extension would be a surprise

Orange ... that is Yellow ... CW1423 Jumper wire comes in various colour pairs: Blue & Yellow; Red & White; Pink & Grey; Green & Bk/Wh or in quad, Red, Black, White & Green.

One of the Blue wires goes to what appears to Or/Wh and the Yellow to Wh/Bl the second Blue is in a crimp mainly hidden - hopefully that goes to Wh/Or and that at te extension they are wired in a way that works.

That's what I thought the middle pin must be.

But possibly also a split pair on the real extension cable. Not possible to tell from the picture colour rendering on my machine.

Doesn't look healthy then. Coulkd very well be a split pair or two around.

As you say, might be working for the phone, but doesn't inspire confidence.

Edited by RobertoS (Mon 17-Dec-12 15:16:47)

Don't think there is a split pair - Or/Wh & Wh/Or used for voice and Wh/Bl for ring - just that they have used the wrong pairs and it would not be the first time either.

Could be. You can obviously see the picture better than I can . I'd forgotten this earlier post .... [chuckle]

Not quite sure if you are chuckling at the cowboy or me and my superior grasp of telephony jargon.

The extensions DO work now, but whether it is wired correctly is of course a mystery. I will look at what colour cables the extra ones are connected to.

In reply to a post by boxst:

Not quite sure if you are chuckling at the cowboy or me and my superior grasp of telephony jargon.

Basically the cowboy, (Kelly's seem to have a lot of them reported here), and your quite humourous description of events.

Start at the front plate where there are three IDCs which should be marked 2, 3 & 5

Confirm that 2 has a Blue wire, connected in the crimp to a Xxxx/Yyyy wire. Then at the other end which IDC terminal Xxxx/Yyyy connected to on the patch panel and then follow that through until you have a pin number for the phone socket.

Repeat for 3 and 5 ...

Xxxx/Yyyy is Solid/Band and could be Blue/White, White/Blue, Orange/White or White/Orange

At least he used crimps and not just a case of twisting together and some tape!

But did it wrong first time LOL.

In reply to a post by MHC:

Have you put a typical ASDL and VDSL filter on a spectrum analyser? A colleague has and the performance of the ADSL filters above about 5 or 7 MHz was abysmal. It is not just teh requirement to keep the lower frequencies off the audio band but needs to ensure there is no significant attenuation or phase change at the higher frequencies.

I did actually post some comments on it soon after he had tested them.

Earlier in the year we had Openreach out because of very slow adsl. The engineer installed what he said was a filtered junction box up in the loft,(it did'nt cure the problem with the slow speed). Ive just been up in the loft to look at it, and it has a wound copper coil in one corner .Would this type of filter have any effect on fibre speeds? i did ask the engineer when he connected us up for fibre if it would have an adverse affect,but all he said was don't know