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Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Fri 05-Oct-12 18:12:07
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Re: Interleaving on FTTC lines


[re: simon194] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by simon194:
In reply to a post by BatBoy:
What certification?
I was wondering that. I remember the green sticker things years ago but I though that was dropped. None of my phones have any mention of BT certification anywhere on the phone, base station or documentation.
I've got a nasty feeling about that as well. The Telecomms Act 2003 repealed a whole load of stuff.

I'm not sure that BABT certification isn't what is needed now. Possibly it isn't, and I'm just out of date on the point.

More importantly, and in my opinion the clincher, are the opening four paragraphs of Section 2.4, of the SIN linked to earlier. If OR find equipment connected that they deem not to be compliant with their requirements for network connection, they reserve the right to withhold service.

We can be sure that equipment supplied by ISPs will have been through the OR testing. It is probable that externally obtained examples of the same products will also comply, but at this point in time that is hypothetical. It cannot be guaranteed that CP-modified firmware will not be needed.

We have no idea about the compliance of the kit currently being used by some people. We do know that all (both, or are there three modem/routers being used?) of them seem to have advantages and disadvantages. At this point in time they are not known to be compliant so should be considered illegitimate.

That being my statement the questioning of which by BatBoy is the basis of this sub-discussion.

I'm off to Homebase!

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk | Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet Extra Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 56.0/13.9Mbps @ 600m. - BQM

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
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Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.
Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Fri 05-Oct-12 18:46:51
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Re: Interleaving on FTTC lines


[re: panda] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by panda:
The SIN is simplistically a technical description. The contractual T&C's of the service can be different.

The BTW contract says:
A VDSL2 modem will be supplied and connected to the data port of the service specific front plate. [...] The active NTE must be within reach of a power supply, and must remain connected to the power and data port of the service specific front plate at all times.
and
The Openreach physical network demarcation point within the End Userís premises is the NTE5 although Openreach will also install and maintain the active NTE.

How strictly it is enforced or whether the ISP passes this requirement on to the End User is another matter, but the contractual obligation exists.
There's nothing about that in my contract for BT Infinity.


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Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Fri 05-Oct-12 19:10:08
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Re: Interleaving on FTTC lines


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
If you can show that the equipment currently in use by some here, to replace the OR modem, has OR certification, then I agree with you it should be OK to attach.
There you go, I think they all have the CE mark.


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Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Fri 05-Oct-12 19:35:18
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Re: Interleaving on FTTC lines


[re: BatBoy] [link to this post]
 
Nope!

The CE mark means it is approved for use in Europe. Agreed.

However, I was led astray by your "What certification" into half-remembering the now defunct BABT stuff applicable when the forerunner of the current BT was a nationalised company.

The BT network is now privately owned, and the owners have every right to specify what is or is not compliant with or connected to their network, subject to their network and its requirements being CE compatible. To this end, they will be providing a certification service to CPs.

Back to the SIN. If they don't like your kit they can tell you to disconnect it from their NTE. The fact it has a CE mark is nothing to do with it. If it doesn't have a CE mark, then obviously it shouldn't be in use here anyway.

As I said earlier in another post, the fact that ISPs are not communicating any restrictions to their customers does not mean the restrictions do not exist. In the (also previously stated) unlikely event that a user gets service withdrawn by Openreach, this becomes a civil matter between the user and the ISP.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk | Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet Extra Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 56.0/13.9Mbps @ 600m. - BQM

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.
Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Fri 05-Oct-12 19:42:52
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Re: Interleaving on FTTC lines


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
In reply to a post by BatBoy:
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
If you can show that the equipment currently in use by some here, to replace the OR modem, has OR certification, then I agree with you it should be OK to attach.
There you go, I think they all have the CE mark.

Nope!
So, I'll ask again - what certification?


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Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Fri 05-Oct-12 19:57:37
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Re: Interleaving on FTTC lines


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
Basically yes, but the acceptability of user-purchased VDSL2 routers being connected does not automatically follow. See my reply a few seconds ago to BatBoy.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk | Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet Extra Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 56.0/13.9Mbps @ 600m. - BQM

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.
Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Fri 05-Oct-12 20:22:29
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Re: Interleaving on FTTC lines


[re: BatBoy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by BatBoy:
So, I'll ask again - what certification?
The near synonym, to wit the resultant documentation to the CP(s) in some normally accepted form, of the successful "compliance verification" of a particular model of VDSL2 modem or modem/router. One or more of said CPs having submitted such a model for such verification.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk | Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet Extra Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 56.0/13.9Mbps @ 600m. - BQM

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.
Standard User BatBoy
(legend) Fri 05-Oct-12 21:04:47
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Re: Interleaving on FTTC lines


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Oh you mean this
2.4 CP provided modem Product Variant

Openreach intend to introduce a GEA-FTTC product variant that allows the CP to provide and be responsible for the users VDSL2 modem. Typically, this modem will be integrated with IP gateway functionality within a single device and connected to a single mains power source. CPs or their EUs will be responsible for maintaining the firmware of their modems and monitoring their connectivity and performance, typically via a TR-69[20] interface using CPE WAN Management Protocol (CWMP).

The CP provided modem and filtering devices must meet the requirements of this specification in order to provide reliable operation and to avoid harm to other VDSL2 lines sharing the same cable binder. Openreach reserves the right to withhold or limit service where potential violation of the Access Network Frequency Plan (ANFP)[10] or impact to another customerís service is detected.

In support of the technical requirements of CPE specified in this section, a test plan is in preparation to be used for compliance verification. Details of the test plan and supporting facilities are expected to be available Q4 2012.
So it doesn't currently exist
smile


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Standard User Chrysalis
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 13-Dec-12 17:35:14
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Re: Interleaving on FTTC lines


[re: Ignitionnet] [link to this post]
 
just seen this post sorry, I would probably be ok if interleaving was at a low level and as you say only a few extra ms.

But if my base latency was say doubled to over 30ms then I would consider that a problem.

Indeed I noticed that it seems I have 2 different gateways/routes available when I connect to ppp and one has a lower base latency but has visibly more jitter (not extremely high but is noticeable when running pings), the other much more stable but higher base latency and I did choose the latter. So in principle I agree with you as long as the base latency jump isnt large.
Standard User twds
(newbie) Thu 28-Aug-14 20:14:18
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Re: Interleaving on FTTC lines


[re: Anonymous] [link to this post]
 
My VDSL2 line suffered from noise, and after about ten disconnection interleaving was switch on.

It eventually stabilised, and then as written elsewhere, the DLM system resynched the line at around 0430, and it was removed.

The DLM system does seem very on the ball.

I am just waiting now for the max speed to reprofile at higher rate.
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