attenuation differences help

Hi all been recommended to post here from acpsd775 as you’ve helped him loads

On ADSL you could kind of guess how long you line was with attenuation and guess a rough speed and if a friend had the same/similar attenuation as you, you would both have similar speeds give or take a little,

Now dose the same apply with VDSL my friends attenuation is 22 he’s currently on 70/24 when he was on the 40/10 product he synced at 48/12 but it was capped at 40/10 i suppose this was for the through put to be as max as possible well anyway to the point
My connection has a 24 attenuation but on the 40/10 packages my router is syncing at 27/3.5 now TBH I don’t see how the difference of 22 to 24 will cause a 21 meg difference in speed.

My friend’s current DSL stats (ACPSD775)
70288/24304 kbps
Noise margin upstream: 5 db
Output power downstream: 0 db
Attenuation upstream: 0 db
Noise margin downstream: 6 db
Output power upstream: 10 db
Attenuation downstream: 22 db

My current stats

27056/3684 kbps
Noise margin upstream: 6 db
Output power downstream: 2 db
Attenuation upstream: 0 db
Noise margin downstream: 6 db
Output power upstream: 10 db
Attenuation downstream: 24 db

PS i know his stats are for the higher packages but the attenuation was the same on the 40/10

so can anyone help as to why ive got such a slow speed in comparison

I was thinking about upgrading to the super fast products (max line can go) on the off change I gets similar speeds to my friend but with the poor performance of the 40/10 i don't want to risk it because littlebigone have a 1 way street on upgrades if you still don't get over 40meg its tough you stuck paying the extra tenner

Little info
Im with littlebigone broadband fttc
My speed estimate on their website is 40/10 & 67.5/20 (standard and uncapped service respectively)
His speed estimate on their website is 40/10 & 69.5/20

If you need any more info just ask.

Thanks for any help Harry

What does littlebigone say about the discrepancy between estimate and live?

Have you ensured that no wiring inside your property is the issue by using the master socket test socket?
Also little is known of how Digital Region run their systems, i.e. is it the same with Openreach VDSL2 in that going for the faster products is only worthwhile if you know you are hitting the speed caps.

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

What does littlebigone say about the discrepancy between estimate and live?

Have you ensured that no wiring inside your property is the issue by using the master socket test socket?
Also little is known of how Digital Region run their systems, i.e. is it the same with Openreach VDSL2 in that going for the faster products is only worthwhile if you know you are hitting the speed caps.

Hi im not sure if its the wiring or not its never caused problems with my old ADSL that maxed out as much as i could go, When i first connected to LBO it was at full speed then it dropped to about 34/8 for a few month then it dropped to current speeds this last week. LBO claim that’s what im stuck at and don’t seam to acknowledge that i ever had faster speeds and say there not much they can do that’s all i can handle, all they keep saying is can you run a speedtest on there speedtest server (links to speedtest.net mini test),
But as ive told them its syncing at 27meg and when i download anything it runs at that then they repeat then what’s the problem and i have to start all over again that the sync speed its self i want raising because i know it 1 point ive maxed out. My friend ash (ACPSD775) has had to go on the phone a few times coz he knows how to word tings a bit better and can get through to them more but even still there insisting they can’t improve me.

Thanks Harry

Edited by haz1000 (Sat 13-Oct-12 16:06:33)

In reply to a post by haz1000:

Now dose the same apply with VDSL my friends attenuation is 22 he’s currently on 70/24 when he was on the 40/10 product he synced at 48/12 but it was capped at 40/10 i suppose this was for the through put to be as max as possible well anyway to the point

That doesn't actually make sense, you can't sync at 48/12 on a 40/10 product.

I spotted that all of the syncs seem high. I wonder if the quoted product speeds are throughput, not sync?

Edited by RobertoS (Sat 13-Oct-12 16:15:43)

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

I spotted that all of the syncs seem high. I wonder if the quoted product speeds are throughput, not sync?

Hi as i understand LBO / DRN will if you line can handle it sync you higher than 40/10 to make sure you get full 40/10 and not 37/9 or w/e it used to be on infinity. Hence why when he had 40/10 it was about 48/12 but hard capped at 40/10 mine also used to be similar to this for the first few weeks can’t remember the exact figures though, But as said LBO now claim its impossible there even saying its impossible that I had the 34 for so many months I think it ultimately depends who you get on the phone because they all say one thing and another say a different one I also understand it that they don’t have any access to changing things themselves and have to get DRN to do it unlike with OR were the ISP has some sort of control so getting LBO to tweak things can be a lengthy process to start with. I wouldn’t mind as much if they at least could get me back to 34 as at least I know I was on that for months. But ideally I’d like to get the faster product but until they can sort the current speeds out I don’t want to risk been tied to paying an extra tenner and still getting under 40 lol,
This is the main reason im asking about attenuation how can it be that we both have very similar attenuation and close speed estimates but have such very different sync speeds would it be worth mentioning to little big one about us having similar attenuations etc. or would they claim it’s just irrelevant

Thanks Harry

Wiring that was perfectly fine for ADSL is often not for VDSL.

VDSL runs at up to 17 MHz rather than the up to 2 MHz of ADSL2+ so effects of things like extensions and bridge taps can be massive

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

Wiring that was perfectly fine for ADSL is often not for VDSL.

VDSL runs at up to 17 MHz rather than the up to 2 MHz of ADSL2+ so effects of things like extensions and bridge taps can be massive

Ahh right urm well we do have an extension but it’s an official BT one put in over 20 years ago the line from the pole got to the house to a little box outside then 2 cables come out of that, 1 to the kitchen & 1 the my dad’s bedroom. the one in the kitchen go’s to a box like this and the one in his bedroom is identical but the BT flute logo instead of a T (none are NTE5s) They both share the same phone number so there defo the same line also the ring wire has been removed out of both and filters have been replaced to make sure it was not a faulty filter,
I’ll try get some pics taken when i get home, On a side not the router is in his bedroom we’ve no clue which the master is but I’m presuming it’s the one in the kitchen (both sockets there before we moved in 20 years ago) but also if I plug the router in the kitchen even after 20 minutes it does not sync hence why its in his bedroom,

Thanks Harry

The ideal situation is the master socket and modem as close to where the line enters the property and any extensions wired off that.

Star wiring which is what you've described is not good for VDSL, and if one extension is working for the phone and not the VDSL modem (and you have no master socket ADSL filter faceplates) then this goes a long way to explaining your speed issues - probably

Chances are you have the two top left here, where the 1A is the master (with the capacitor at the top), and the 3A is the extension, (no capacitor).

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

The ideal situation is the master socket and modem as close to where the line enters the property and any extensions wired off that.

Star wiring which is what you've described is not good for VDSL, and if one extension is working for the phone and not the VDSL modem (and you have no master socket ADSL filter faceplates) then this goes a long way to explaining your speed issues - probably

Ah right well as said all i know about the situation is the BT fitted the second line and did it that way over 20 years ago so i don’t think they had internet in mind lol, i was thinking about replacing both faceplates with some of those ADSL nation ones but i did not want to risk it after reading what BT could do to you if you mess with their sockets lol. I should be home in the next 45 mins so ill get some pics took upload them to show you the set up just to confirm things.

If this is the case though what are my options and will they cost an arm and a leg.

Thanks again harry

PS thanks for the link RobertoS as said ill double confirm when i get home off the top of my head i cant remember what the insides like

Edited by haz1000 (Sat 13-Oct-12 17:46:44)

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

Chances are you have the two top left here, where the 1A is the master (with the capacitor at the top), and the 3A is the extension, (no capacitor).

Now have a few pics not the best and i still dont have the one in my dads bedroom as hes not been well so been in bed. will upload that when hes out of bed

link to pics

Ive actually found out the extention to his bedroom dose not come out of the box outside it actually dose come into the kitchen some were but i can seam to find the other end of it and as far as i can tell it dose not go into the back of the socket in the kitchen.

Harry

Edited by haz1000 (Sun 14-Oct-12 18:44:52)