Openreach laying cable between cabinets

Hi,

I have been patiently waiting for FTTC to be rolled out in my area, but have been unable to find any timescales, but my exchange has been enabled for some time now, and have noticed a new FTTC cabinet appear about a few miles away.

On Monday I noticed openreach running a large cable between the various cabinets on my estate, and was wondering if this could be anything to do with FTTC being installed on my estate?

I wish I pulled over and asked them now!!

"On your estate"? Probably somewhere, but on your particular line? Who knows. You need to find out which cabinet (your PCP, i.e. the old telephone cabinet) your line is on, and whether that cabinet has got, or is getting an FTTC twin cabinet. An FTTC cabinet a few miles away certainly won't be serving your line with FTTC, even if it is unfortunately linked to your PCP (because the line from cabinet > your house will be too long).

http://www.coolwebhome.co.uk/fibre/checker.php

Putting your postcode into there is probably the easiest way. If there is incomplete or confusing information then post it here, there are other ways (and more up-to-date information) to check.

Edited by deleted (Wed 20-Mar-13 14:00:57)

Hi,

As you will see below, I may be unlucky enough to not be connected via a cabinet

MK429FZ BEDFORD TOWN This postcode has some Exchange Only lines
This means there is currently no cabinet to run FTTC from.
Openreach may deploy FTTC/P in the future to this area. 30% M_D

MK429FZ BEDFORD TOWN FTTC, but not available yet 70% P37T

Also, when I type my phone number into the BT Wholesale availability checker, it doesn't come up with a cabinet number.

That pretty much shows it is an Exchange Only line, so probably will need to wait and see whether the BDUK project for your area helps

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

That pretty much shows it is an Exchange Only line, so probably will need to wait and see whether the BDUK project for your area helps

That's what I was worried about, but I thought that exchange only lines were normally only found where you are really close to the exchange, where in fact I am really far away from it hence only getting about 2.5mbps.

I wonder if its anything to do with the copper overlay that was done as originally this estate was on TPON!

They can be at any distance, more likely for those next to exchange and clusters of properties built some years after most of the other properties in an area

TPON yes probably does not help.

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

They can be at any distance, more likely for those next to exchange and clusters of properties built some years after most of the other properties in an area

TPON yes probably does not help.

AFAIK all the houses were built at the same time, I suppose the only way I can find out for sure is to try and contact openreach themselves?

you probly find all the lines on your estate are EO lines or your Block of houses that was made

i seen some messed up installs before
5 Openreach small cabs on one estate all within less then 300m of each other and 7 houses off an cab that was 1 mile away on the same estate as well, madness why Openreach allow that to happen, there should of been one main cab that served all the houses, and then charge them as Openreach would of made more money that way as it seems they was asking for the phone lines in blocks of 5 or 10s at an time instead of building the houses and doing them all at once as its normally done.

and around where i am one large estate runs off 2 exchanges 60% of it runs of one that is more then 3 miles away and the other one less then 1-2miles away (you can see how happy the 60% are with 0.3-1mb connections)

when they Should of paid Openreach to install One cab for the hole estate

Edited by leexgx (Sat 23-Mar-13 22:16:24)

In reply to a post by leexgx:

you probly find all the lines on your estate are EO lines or your Block of houses that was made

i seen some messed up installs before
5 Openreach small cabs on one estate all within less then 300m of each other and 7 houses off an cab that was 1 mile away on the same estate as well, madness why Openreach allow that to happen, there should of been one main cab that served all the houses, and then charge them as Openreach would of made more money that way as it seems they was asking for the phone lines in blocks of 5 or 10s at an time instead of building the houses and doing them all at once as its normally done.

That's generally what happens with new developments. They build in phases and sell the houses in blocks which is why the phone lines get installed in blocks. I don't think many people who buy houses in the early phases would be happy to wait for the whole development to be completed before they could have a phone line installed.

still the phone lines should be sorted out at the start so multi cabs do not get used or EO lines do not get used (quite sure they stopped doing the EO lines now on long lines unless your really close to the exchange)

I guess there's a fragile relationship between Openreach & developers, over the infrastructure provided. To the developer, it is a cost that they are trying to minimise. To Openreach it is national infrastructure that needs to survive a century or more... so they pay the developer *something*... but also want to minimise costs.

However, the physical location (and number) of cabinets, and the routing of cables back to an exchange has (almost) never been governed by a desire to minimise the E-side length. It is all about getting lines back to a nearby duct that has capacity, that leads to a cabinet that has capacity, that leads to an exchange that has capacity.

The economic and political choices about cables, ducts & poles have changed over the years, but those capacity questions have always been the foremost concern, not the length.

However, it is only the last 15 years that has seen any focus on total line length for broadband, and less than 5 years for the line length of the D-side for FTTC.

But whose focus? Certainly we (the technical geeks) focus on it, but the developers don't... they focus on their profit.

Frankly, it is the developers who could have been working to ensure that their houses had the best infrastructure for broadband - whether copper or fibre - and they could have been doing this (and using it as a selling point) for a decade. However, they have barely bothered doing that, and still don't today.

Why? Because there isn't enough demand from the people buying from the developer. The buyers want something cheap, not something of quality. The same people who prefer to get a [censored] £3 from talk-talk *also* don't care that it is slow.

I got some coax ethernet cable installed in my last house as it was being built (18 years ago), and retro-fitted cat-5 cable myself later. You'd think more developers, by now, would be installing structured wiring by default now, but it still doesn't happen even from the more luxurious builders.

So the thing missing is the demand from the (new) house buyers themselves.

Hi carlos_uk,
I live on the same estate as you. About 4 weeks ago there were 4 openreach engineers walking around looking at all the boxes etc.. I asked if they were going to put infinity(weel superfast as openreach all it) and they said yes we were going to get it.
Just today there has been some work going to create a new manhole and laying in the fibre cable, I asked the guys doing the work. My number comes up with FTTC and speed of 77.5 as I'm probably the closet to local cabinet. I'm not sure if they are going to reuse/replace the tpon cabinets.

Satpal

In reply to a post by carlos_uk:

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

That pretty much shows it is an Exchange Only line, so probably will need to wait and see whether the BDUK project for your area helps

That's what I was worried about, but I thought that exchange only lines were normally only found where you are really close to the exchange, where in fact I am really far away from it hence only getting about 2.5mbps.

I wonder if its anything to do with the copper overlay that was done as originally this estate was on TPON!

Hi Schander,

At least its coming, hopefully it turns out that I am connected via a cabinet, but am not very hopeful as we had an openreach engineer out at work a few weeks ago and I spoke to him about it and he said that it sounds like I have an exchange only line .

I have e-mailed openreach and so am now awaiting their response!

In reply to a post by schander:

Hi carlos_uk,
I live on the same estate as you. About 4 weeks ago there were 4 openreach engineers walking around looking at all the boxes etc.. I asked if they were going to put infinity(weel superfast as openreach all it) and they said yes we were going to get it.
Just today there has been some work going to create a new manhole and laying in the fibre cable, I asked the guys doing the work. My number comes up with FTTC and speed of 77.5 as I'm probably the closet to local cabinet. I'm not sure if they are going to reuse/replace the tpon cabinets.

Satpal

In reply to a post by carlos_uk:

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

That pretty much shows it is an Exchange Only line, so probably will need to wait and see whether the BDUK project for your area helps

That's what I was worried about, but I thought that exchange only lines were normally only found where you are really close to the exchange, where in fact I am really far away from it hence only getting about 2.5mbps.

I wonder if its anything to do with the copper overlay that was done as originally this estate was on TPON!

carlos_uk
I think everyone on our estate is connected directly to the exchange, as the tpon cabinets, which is what everyone was on before they were decommission.
Most likely openreach will replace them with the standard FTTC/FTTH ones.
The new mini estate that was built near the medical centre has FTTC, so i guess they will pull the fibre from there to tweaksbury, which is the main/central cabinet for the estate, at least according to the openreach engineer that came out 3-4 weeks ago.

Satpal

In reply to a post by carlos_uk:

Hi Schander,

At least its coming, hopefully it turns out that I am connected via a cabinet, but am not very hopeful as we had an openreach engineer out at work a few weeks ago and I spoke to him about it and he said that it sounds like I have an exchange only line .

I have e-mailed openreach and so am now awaiting their response!

Hi carlos_uk,
Came back from work today to find that there is now new green cabinet at the opposite end of the street to the old tpon one.

Other strange thing is that over the last week I have been getting a lot of bt whoesale circuit down messages.

Satpal

In reply to a post by carlos_uk:

Hi Schander,

At least its coming, hopefully it turns out that I am connected via a cabinet, but am not very hopeful as we had an openreach engineer out at work a few weeks ago and I spoke to him about it and he said that it sounds like I have an exchange only line .

I have e-mailed openreach and so am now awaiting their response!

In reply to a post by schander:

... there is now new green cabinet at the opposite end of the street ....

Which of these?

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

In reply to a post by schander:

... there is now new green cabinet at the opposite end of the street ....

Which of these?

It looks like a Huawei FTTC cab - 288 max, I will confirm when i get home.

The checker on BT's infinity site, is saying that fttc will be active October 2013-March 2014.
Strange thing is that no other streets are getting cabinets, maybe they are starting from the end and working back, or could it be that they will only do our part of the estate as it doesn't have Virgin...

Thanks
satpal

Edited by deleted (Mon 15-Apr-13 09:17:51)

Hi,

I received the below e-mail from Openreach today

Thank you for your enquiry about fibre broadband. Unfortunately, I can confirm that you are connected directly to the telephone exchange and therefore, are unable to get fibre broadband.

We are working on a solution to overcome this problem, however, I do not know when this may be commercially available.

This would be the only fibre broadband service available, we do not have plans to deploy FTTP in your area.

Bad news on the commercial front.

You now need to rely on the BDUK process somewhat - and in particular you need to let your council's BDUK department know that your postcode has a mixture of properties - where some will get service from a cabinet, and some will not get service because they don't go through a cabinet at all.

Council page appears to be:
Bedford Council

You can confirm whether your postcode is being judged to be NGA "black, grey or white" using this Milton Keynes page. I suspect, because you said previously that a portion were supplied via a cabinet, that your postcode will be grey or black for NGA.

If I'm right, it is important to let them know that your postcode isn't being classified correctly.

Carlos_uk,

This is really strange as we do have a box at the end of the road, however driving round the estate i find that no other new boxes have popped up and the email you got kind of confirms this.
My feeling is that they are doing the bits of the estate that are not covered by Virgin.


Thanks
Satpal

Hi,
This is cabinet they have installed

Thanks
Satpal

Definitely a Huawei 288.

Carlos-uk welcome to the forum and our rubbish estate for Internet Service. Shander has been doing an absolutely brilliant job engaging with the council and openreach trying to get them to sort out the issue. I've tried with virgin in the past but they just were not interested in extending their service, really annoying thing is that they stop halfway up Croyland Drive.

Edited by deleted (Tue 23-Apr-13 13:22:57)

Just looked at the Bedfordshire BDUK proposals and after a little research looks like our estate is a mix of white/grey for nga access and white/grey for basic broadband.

Defenitions:
The Next Generation Access State Aid layer shows postcodes as black, grey or white based on the following definitions:
A postcode is turned black if access line speeds in excess of 24Mbps from two or more NGA infrastructure providers are currently available or planned in the next three years;
A postcode is turned grey if access line speeds in excess of 24Mbps from one NGA infrastructure provider is currently available or planned in the next three years;
All other postcodes remain white.

The Basic Broadband State Aid layer shows postcodes as black, grey or white based on the following definitions:
A postcode is turned black if Basic Broadband services at a minimum access line speed of 2Mbps are currently available or planned in the next three years from two or more providers;
A postcode is turned grey if Basic Broadband services at a minimum access line speed of 2Mbps are currently available or planned in the next three years from one provider;
All other postcodes remain white.

You can check your postcode at this site http://bbpc.atkinsgeospatial.com/Default.htm

I know the only reason I can occasionally get over 2 meg is due to the very expensive router, cable and faceplate I've fitted and the tinkering with everything to get the maximum speed I can. So most people will get a lot less than I do.

So considering that our end of the estate are on EO lines, no virgin, less than 2meg shouldn't we be white? Unless BT are planning on filling that cabinet up and taking us off EO lines within the next 3 years.

Edited by deleted (Tue 23-Apr-13 13:44:44)

So the assumption is that there is some form of commercial rollout - have you got any wireless providers around that might be moving into the area?

Not that I'm aware of, don't know any wireless providers in the area. BT have installed a DSLAM round the corner a few weeks ago, but people talking to them they say EO lines and no immediate plans to support this. Sounds like at times BT don't know their [censored] from their elbow.

Your answer might be this:

In reply to a post by leejhamilton:

no immediate plans to support this

If BT do intend to support EO lines at some point in the next 3 years, then you'd be validly coloured grey or black.

EO lines look to be more of a "middle burner" project for them, with them distinctly trying things out in places where they have to trial EO lines earlier than the rest of the country.

Essentially, it seems you're waiting for BT to learn the technical, financial and planning lessons from the Cornish guinea pigs. And they nature of those lessons means they can't put together a complete plan for EO lines elsewhere.

Hiya,

I've actually been a member of this site for about 5 years, but hardly ever post, but thanks for the welcome all the same!

I can get Virgin Media, but don't really want it, but I'm thinking I might have to if something more solid doesn't happen with BT!

In reply to a post by leejhamilton:

Carlos-uk welcome to the forum and our rubbish estate for Internet Service. Shander has been doing an absolutely brilliant job engaging with the council and openreach trying to get them to sort out the issue. I've tried with virgin in the past but they just were not interested in extending their service, really annoying thing is that they stop halfway up Croyland Drive.

If you already have Virgin cable then BDUK will definitely not help you - the funding cannot be used where a "superfast" service is already available. So, you either go Virgin or hope that BT at some point enable you.