Fiber from a different cabinet

Hi,

This week a new FTTC cabinet has been installed along Broad Oak Road Canterbury, opposite what I believe may be PCP1, the exact location is here. What I'm wondering is whether it would be possible to some how order FTTC via this cabinet instead of my current one, when the cabinet actual goes live.

Currently I'm on PCP73, which is on Stonebridge Road in a new housing development in Canterbury. From what I have been told by broadband@Kent and nga.enquiries my PCP73 will not be receiving fiber, however it does fall into Kent's BDUK funding and MAY receive fiber after a review, however this looks to be months away from what they are suggesting.

Now when I check the distance from this new FTTC cabinet along Broad Oak Road to my house on Stonebridge Road the distance is about 300m, which I believe would allow me to get almost if not the full 80Mbps down speed FTTC offers. (I may be wrong on this?) Would it be possible to somehow order FTTC but from this new cabinet or maybe change cabinet? Though I'm not completely sure on this, it would appear that the phone lines running to PCP73 run past PCP1 on Broad Oak Road.

Also wondering if anyone can help me with the following: BT surveyed the estate in 2010, when it had just started, and there were only about 10 properties on the development. currently the development has just been completed and comprises of about 330 - 350 properties (Houses & Apartments). Also BT cabinets on this side of Canterbury have only NOW started to be installed. When asking nga.enquiries why the development was not included in BT's own roll-out they state it is simply not economically viable. But what does "economically viable" mean as the development does not appear to be not economically viable at all, just how many properties does an area served by a single cabinet require for BT to consider it economically viable to install an FTTC cabinet? And also considering that all phone lines are underground in brand new ducting and the apartment blocks are high density would there be any way to suggest BT seriously consider doing a full FTTP installation rather than FTTC, currently I've heard of almost no FTTP in or around canterbury, this seems like a pretty good place to start.

Thanks for any assistance

In reply to a post by Fugitive_Legacy:

This week a new FTTC cabinet has been installed along Broad Oak Road Canterbury, opposite what I believe may be PCP1, the exact location is here. What I'm wondering is whether it would be possible to some how order FTTC via this cabinet instead of my current one, when the cabinet actual goes live.

No, sorry.

To expand on the no, if you are willing to spend many thousands on a custom build you might connect to the other cabinet.

As for FTTP why should they do this estate, when many others have not? Even where ducting is in place, the sub ducting, splitters and fibres themselves for the GPON would need to be installed.

As for why not do the cabs before? A lot of the commercial planning is pretty old, so they would have picked the cabinets where they knew the most, so new estates would have been skipped as they were a big unknown, particularly given the state of the housing market.

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

As for why not do the cabs before? A lot of the commercial planning is pretty old, so they would have picked the cabinets where they knew the most, so new estates would have been skipped as they were a big unknown, particularly given the state of the housing market.

This I can confirm from experience, and sadly it's almost certainly too late to try and persuade them to change their mind and add it to their commercial programme now.

A cabinet added to the commercial programme now would be delivered around July of 2014 - after the commercial programme is scheduled to complete.

But surely BT will not simply stop upgrading cab's, they may well wait until all the BDUK projects complete before doing any more, as that would make financial sense. As cabinets may become viable for whatever reasons in the meantime, surely they will eventually look at these?

The bduk projects will chase the low hanging fruit to try and hit coverage target quick. So the final 5% will be the most expensive ones left to do

Expanding even more on the 'no', I live in a pretty well populated area with loads of houses all around. The cab our BT line used to be connected to (we've been on cable for years) is 1.2km away yet there are at least 4 BT cabs closer. As such we get a low-ish estimate of speeds for FTTC.
It's not a new build, these are 1930's terraced houses. What I was told was that the original multi-pair line that comes all that way to the telegraph pole round the back of the houses here would have been installed many years ago, long before any talk of the Internet, let alone fibre.
All Openreach do is to connect a pair at the cab on their master list and that's you - even if there are other cabs nearer, as that is what you are down for on the database. To route a new bit of wire from another cab would cost them a lot of money, planning, installing and changing all those master tables to show the new cab.
It could well affect your neighbours lines too - they wouldn't just pull one pair through to your nearest pole or distribution point (DP boxes).
Our line would actually run past 2 newer cabs, installed to serve houses built in the 40s and 50s. Looking back to those times, not many people had a phone at home, let alone computers that were hungry for data. They are having to work with antiquated systems and overloaded cabinets that were simply not designed for the traffic they now take.
Better planning and (lots) more money might have seen FTTP being a more popular option, but that wasn't a consideration when the main roll-out started.
I'm not an engineer or anything, just passing on what was explained to me.

From there it would be too far to connect PCP73 to that fibre cabinet. I think the fibre cabinet is in that location as there is a cabinet at the roundabout (very old one here:- https://www.google.co.uk/maps?ll=51.287017,1.082379&... and another just down the road towards the new development (here:- https://www.google.co.uk/maps?ll=51.287259,1.08284&s... They will connect both to the same fibre cabinet (to save money). This has been done on Tower Way Canterbury also as there were two cabinets very close.

For the cabinet you connect to (PCP73) they will need another fibre cabinet. BT seem to be very slow with new developments. I live in The Old Tannery and we're still waiting for the cabinet to go in even though it's been over half a year since location was accepted by the council...

Have you checked if there has been notification to the council? Probably won't have to if it isn't conservation area though. Good luck finding the planning site though, it's really hard to find things since they 'up'dated the site.

Cabinets that are closest to being 'viable' under the formulae will be the first ones targeted by BT.

The contracts for the installs of cabinets have to run their course at some point. Going by the models in other countries BT simply stopping install of new cabinets is exactly what will happen. There will be targeted deployment of cabinets and FTTP, for example in new build areas, but given the planning going into BDUK the value to BT of doing another survey of many thousands of cabinets on the off-chance some have suddenly grown in population doesn't seem large.

Could be wrong of course!

After emailing nga.enquiries again to possibly find out a little more regarding exactly what is happening with our Cabinet PCP73. I received the following:

The exchange that your line is fed from Canterbury is enabled and accepting orders for cabinets that have already been deployed.

However the cabinet feeding your line PCP 73 is not due for deployment until Phase 12a BDUK Which is Q3 2013/14, (Dec 2013) the cabinet in question is current planned as FTTC.

Hopefully this means we'll see FTTC early next year, if all goes well. Checking the BT Wholesale checker still does not show any information regarding a date for FTTC on my phone line. However, the email does refer to Phase 12a BDUK and maybe the checker is outdated, not sure.

I expect that the cabinet being installed on Broad Oak Rd is also part of 12a roll-out and it is usually some time before they go live even after being installed. You could find they move on to yours very soon. Wishful thinking I know!

Looking at www.roadworks.org there's one scheduled to be installed on Sturry Rd., also NGA related works elsewhere, so keep an eye open on there for work relating to your cabinet, don't forget to tick the option to show planned road works as well.

How far away from you is PCP73, and what's the likely route from it to you?

Thanks for the Roadworks.org sugestion I had taken a look but did not notice the planned tick-box.

I would say less than 100 meters, it is very close. Though depends on exactly where they eventually plan on installing the Fibre twin, hopefully it will be close.

Does anyone know how close to a cabinet ur required to be to receive the full 80Mb/s download speed?

Obviously it's the exact length of the route which your line takes, and not just where the cabinet is in relation to your house; but if you were aware of that, you can't hope to have a line length to your cabinet of much less than 100m, so...

Other factors like number of joints, physical quality of your copper line to the cab, etc., will also affect things if you're hoping to get the absolute maximum FTTC speed. I wouldn't really panic if you can only get 70Mb or whatever, though!

Edited by deleted (Tue 27-Aug-13 23:28:03)

"Does anyone know how close to a cabinet ur required to be to receive the full 80Mb/s download speed? "

well i am about 480m from my cab and get the speed below

when i did check it with my exfo ( a bt tester ) i get the full speed.

Well I'm 450 meters from the cab and I only get 42Mbps, could you come and fix it please

In reply to a post by R0NSKI:

Well I'm 450 meters from the cab and I only get 42Mbps, could you come and fix it please

Likewise, somewhere between 450 and 500m and I get 46 meg..

Edited by jchamier (Wed 28-Aug-13 19:29:37)

Yay! The fibre cabinet is going in for The Old Tannery (PCP71)

Hopefully they will do yours soon.

Just me being a bit picky, I know, but.......
In England we have "fibre" unless someone rearranged the language without telling me!
We also have "aluminium" and not "aluminum", along with "laboratories" rather than "labratories". Nuclear power is ours, too, and not the "nukular" stuff they have in America!
It may seem trivial but, along with "typed" text talk (emails etc), it just says that many of us are quite happy to see "our" language adulterated by the American influence.
Call me a moaner if you like, but it DOES matter
Cheers, Les.

Go back to bed Les, and get out the right side, he makes one spelling mistake and you go into a rant! I'm very surprised you didn't pull him up on the fact that he didn't capitalise Canterbury!

Language evolves, it always has and it always will do, if you actually understood our language then I think you'll find many words are taken from other languages!

Edited by R0NSKI (Sat 07-Sep-13 10:42:46)

In reply to a post by lelboy:

It may seem trivial but, along with "typed" text talk (emails etc), it just says that many of us are quite happy to see "our" language adulterated by the American influence.

Strangely enough its the UK english that has changed (often by french influence), the American english uses a lot of spellings that we used to use

In reply to a post by jchamier:

Strangely enough its the UK english that has changed (often by french influence), the American english uses a lot of spellings that we used to use

Many American English spellings were used in UK English as far back as the 14th Century.

So, why did you use english rather the English and french rather than French? You did spell American with a capitalised initial letter though.

Edited by MHC (Sat 07-Sep-13 16:53:13)

Ha!
I didn't notice the canterbury error...
Well, what I actually mean is that I did, but that had very little to do with my comments, and was most likely a typo, so I didn't bother to comment: typo's are easily forgiven - we're all guilty at some time or other. It's not a point-scoring exercise - as, I would have thought, been shown by my humorous .
The use of the spelling "fiber" was not a mistake - it was a choice, along with center, meter (when they mean length), cookie when they mean biscuit, chip when they mean crisp and god knows what else.
What it IS is quite serious is the fact that we ARE taking to using Americanisms and other sloppy language styles. I'm sure it's the pedant in me (grammar school educated, don'tcha know - but no "uni") that makes this irritate.
As a school governor I see, on a daily basis almost, children writing sentences which so often use things like "ur" for "you are/you're" & "wnt" for "went" plus many other types of corruption, on proper English Language exercises.
Would you think that would be acceptable, on the start to grown-up life and hopefully employment? Were I to be, perhaps, a potential employer, then I'd give short shrift to anyone who could not be bothered to use the language properly - either through lack of knowledge or laziness.
The issue isn't me being picky, but despairing at how easily even grown-ups (I assume) develop nonsensical, sheep like behaviour. Take a two second look at FaceBook to see what a nation of seeming illiterates we are.
Regarding how the Americans behave with speech issues - particularly the likes of George Bush Junior (nukular) - I have no real interest but, I hope they'll improve with time: they are, after all, a developing young country, so have a little excuse.........
No wrong side of the bed, just fed up with sloppiness - from wherever. Cheers, Les

Totally agree with you Les, I too was dragged up in a Grammar though I left before taking any exams, and therefore no Uni as well, but at least we were taught the three R's in a proper fashion, and I also have the spelling Bee, I hate that 'Aluminium' advert where he doesn't know the difference between an 'i' and a 'u', and was one of the people that complained about the advert, yet they still show it years later.

I also think it does make a difference when these people go looking for work and get knocked back, and most of it is just down to laziness, they cannot be bothered to look up to see how words are spelt correctly, if I'm not sure, I always check first, I've nearly made the same mistake with Fibre but checked first.

I do agree with Les in principle, but I think his rant was OTT for this forum and the one spelling error, had it been on Facebook or some other post with some of the terrible language you do see then I would have totally agreed.

I didn't make it to a grammar school, but both my daughters have, and I always try and make sure my spelling and grammar is correct, and often rely on spell checkers, which sometimes spell check in American Although I try and use English spellings, I don't see too much of a problem with using an American spelling, but I do dislike text speech and other weird words used any place other than a text.

It wasn't a rant, Ron............
You don't finish a rant with a smiley, surely?
No, my point was just that in these competitive times we find ourselves in now, we need to present ourselves in the best light - for our own good.
Purposely or lazily doing contrary things, making yourselves look childish or illiterate and adopting silly affectations, when you should know better, all go to your disadvantage. Well that's my Sunday rant over!

Cheers Bob.
Same here - financial issues prevented me continuing with my education. I try to understand more as I grow older, and that's partly why I get miffed at silliness.
Les (aka V Meldrew)

Just so.........

With me it was eyesight, no one back then realised my sight was deteriorating, they just thought I was messing about, but really I was straining to see the blackboard, this was 45 years ago, and I just got fed up with the system at the time so when asked to leave, I did. It wasn't until a couple of years later when someone realised what the problem was, and I was tested they said I could have gone on to get a few 'O' levels and maybe more, but by that time i had moved south and was working and earning a living, now I am at the stage where memory is going awry and I am just enjoying my retirement.

I don't object to text speech if it has come from a phone, and sometimes use it myself when using SMS or FB on my BB Hope the daughters get/got good grades.

Some about right, Bob. I started EHGS in 1962 and now I'm a decrepit old loon - trying to keep up with technology!
Cheers, Les.

Ha! I started in 1963, although we were probably born in the same year '51

I expect that the cabinet being installed on Broad Oak Rd is also part of 12a roll-out and it is usually some time before they go live even after being installed. You could find they move on to yours very soon. Wishful thinking I know!

The grammar schools have a lot to answer for! I went to one and hated it. I had to learn all the correct grammar and spellings and anyone who got it wrong was physically (and often mentally!) beaten up by the teachers. Scarred me for life. Kids today don't know they're born...

...and just look at the state of the country, no discipline, no respect and kids who shoot each other.

I think I'd rather have the teacher who gave out the slipper and cane any day...

In reply to a post by rjh321:

I had to learn all the correct grammar and spellings

You complain about having to learn the English language?

The Grammar Schools may have much to answer for (I was there so do have experience) but the teaching of pupils how to use their own language is surely not one of them.

Spot on, Bob - 3rd August '51
Cheers, Les

No complaint about that at all, just the way the discipline was inflicted.