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Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Thu 29-Aug-13 08:54:23
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Re: DLM is driving me crazy!!!


[re: billford] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by billford:
In reply to a post by timl:
DLM on FTTC punishes good lines that are ok apart from a bit of occasional noise or crosstalk.
We need an option to have it turned off.
Not really. An option to reset it after a one-off exceptionally noisy episode might be useful though.
On ADSLx the ISPs have the ability to reset DLM to initial connection defaults, in other words re-run the 10-day "training" period. First-line and even second-line seem generally unaware of this.

But this particular case is FTTC and a different DLM where they cannot.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk | Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet UnLim Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 51.8/16.8Mbps @ 600m. - BQM

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.

Edited by RobertoS (Thu 29-Aug-13 08:56:25)

Standard User billford
(elder) Thu 29-Aug-13 08:56:09
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Re: DLM is driving me crazy!!!


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
But this particular case is FTTC and a different DLM where they cannot.
But that's the fault of BTO, not the DLM...

Bill
A level playing field is level in both directions._________________Planes and Boats and ... ______________BQMs: IPv4 IPv6

Edited by billford (Thu 29-Aug-13 09:01:53)

Standard User RobertoS
(sensei) Thu 29-Aug-13 08:57:47
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Re: DLM is driving me crazy!!!


[re: billford] [link to this post]
 
I've just done an edit Bill. This isn't applicable to FTTC. I forgot the forum.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk | Domains,website and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet UnLim Fibre (FTTC). Sync ~ 51.8/16.8Mbps @ 600m. - BQM

"Where talent is a dwarf, self-esteem is a giant." - Jean-Antoine Petit-Senn.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Allergy information: This post was manufactured in an environment where nuts are present. It may include traces of understatement, litotes and humour.


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Standard User billford
(elder) Thu 29-Aug-13 09:02:39
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Re: DLM is driving me crazy!!!


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
I've just done an edit Bill.
Thanks, so have I wink

Bill
A level playing field is level in both directions._________________Planes and Boats and ... ______________BQMs: IPv4 IPv6
Standard User timl
(member) Thu 29-Aug-13 09:45:19
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Re: DLM is driving me crazy!!!


[re: billford] [link to this post]
 
I can, of course, only speak about my experience. Crosstalk is surely and slowly killing my FTTC connection. DLM doesn't seem to handle this well at all.

So if I can't have DLM off can I have vectoring smile

Plusnet unlimited FTTC
Standard User billford
(elder) Thu 29-Aug-13 10:24:58
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Re: DLM is driving me crazy!!!


[re: timl] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by timl:
So if I can't have DLM off can I have vectoring smile
Probably yes... but don't hold your breath tongue

Bill
A level playing field is level in both directions._________________Planes and Boats and ... ______________BQMs: IPv4 IPv6
Standard User Andrue
(knowledge is power) Thu 29-Aug-13 11:15:09
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Re: DLM is driving me crazy!!!


[re: timl] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by timl:
In my opinion DLM is used by BT mostly to avoid having to fix minor faults with their old copper lines which ultimately saves them money.
Which ultimately saves us money and/or ensures they have enough funds to continue investing in the network wink

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK
Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Thu 29-Aug-13 19:50:26
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Re: DLM is driving me crazy!!!


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
like it fixed (not) robertos current fault? and reacted too late to stop my short term intterment fault (which occured only for 2 hours or so) and even then my fault sitll affected my connection.

DLM in my view is been used to cover up issues with lines, can see also with ignition's recent posts plusnet's reply is to suggest a bump in snrm.

I have seen some posts on the internet where people have lost extreme amounts of sync speed to stability settings, around 50% or more due to very high FEC configured by DLM, I assume in such a situation BT still see it as acceptable as long as the user doesnt complain or the loss of speed occured in a short time period.

I can understand why DLM is there, ultimately it saves BT a ton of cash on fixing local loop issues and reduced calls to tech support. As it does successfully hide various faults albeit after delay (doesnt react right away). But thats all it does it hides.

Where it seems more better is hiding crosstalk errors. A more potent source of errors is too much for DLM to deal with.

For me I would like to see 2 things.

DLM polls the line every hour not every 24 hours, so if something happens, the user doesnt wait until 5am the next morning for DLM to "do something about it" but instead it reacts faster.

When DLM makes a change thats stability related an alert is sent out to engineers when a engineer is auto booked to fix the fault causing DLM, in other words DLM is used as a temporary workaround whilst the fault is been fixed and never used as a long term fix.

BT Infinity 2 Since Dec 2012 - BQM

Edited by Chrysalis (Thu 29-Aug-13 19:55:38)

Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Thu 29-Aug-13 19:52:27
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Re: DLM is driving me crazy!!!


[re: billford] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by billford:
In reply to a post by timl:
DLM on FTTC punishes good lines that are ok apart from a bit of occasional noise or crosstalk.
If it's occasional then in my experience the DLM ignores it.
We need an option to have it turned off.
Not really. An option to reset it after a one-off exceptionally noisy episode might be useful though.


what happens if you get a burst of noise for 2 hours say once every weeks?

The user of their own free will can choose to disable DLM, have fast path and good line for most of the week and then just put up with the issue for those 2 hours.

Or instead DLM keeps the line perm interleaved as the issue is regular enough to prevent recovery.

BT Infinity 2 Since Dec 2012 - BQM
Standard User billford
(elder) Thu 29-Aug-13 20:07:46
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Re: DLM is driving me crazy!!!


[re: Chrysalis] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Chrysalis:
then just put up with the issue for those 2 hours.
A speed hungry fibre user tolerating, without complaint, a noisy line for two hours every week?

You jest.

Bill
A level playing field is level in both directions._________________Planes and Boats and ... ______________BQMs: IPv4 IPv6
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