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Wilstead exchange in Bedford has just been upgraded to Fibre and after a couple of weeks it appears my cabinet is now live (cabinet 14)
However I can only get unlimited faster broadband - clean 18mb impacted 15mb - Bt Infinity is not available -
By the crow I am 280 metres from the cabinet and by various other routes I couldn't be more than 400m - This is a brand new estate so I expect the cables to be pretty good. I get nearly 8mb on DSL from the exchange at present, the top end of the DSL estimate.
The graph regarding speed and distance suggests a speed of 40-45mb - so I cannot see why I would only be able to obtain a max of 18mb - been a big let down after all that waiting - my postcode is MK42 6AG - if anyone can explain why its so low? I have ordered it anyway as the price is no different to what I get at the moment. Any chance it will be higher than the estimate -
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If you are in peacock gardens then then based on other estimates for other postcodes in area e.g. KINGFISHER ROAD, WIXAMS, BEDFORD, MK42 6AY on Exchange WILSTEAD is served by Cabinet 14 which gives 76 Mbps as maximum then either estimate is wrong or it is possible the ducting goes down one side of the road to the end of brooklands avenue and back up the other, doubling the distance.
If the checker is wrong then it won't limit your speed, though by the sounds of it you've ordered the FTTC (not infinity) BT Retail product, so will be capped to up to 40 Mbps connection speed.
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The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
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thank you - I guess I'll find out next Friday - I wouldn't be surprised if the ducting double-backed on itself-
just checked more postcodes and addresses and it looks like I am towards the end of the loop so the speed estimate is probably accurate- oh well - maybe virgin will lay some cable
Edited by deleted (Sun 22-Feb-15 18:18:34)
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My line had a problem with the estimate like this - the top FTTC range A estimate was 46, but looking at the line length from the cabinet, of just over 200m, this didn't add up. And indeed, once I was connected I was synced at (a capped) 40Mbps with a 30dB+ noise margin, so I think there is bad data being fed into whatever generates the estimate. So it is certainly possible that you could get a better speed than predicted.
Just out of interest, what is your line attenuation and noise margin on ADSL currently? We might be able to glean something about the length of your line from that.
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I'm not at home for the moment away at work I have some old stats from 2011 that may give you an idea - I can post newer ones later this week.
Line state
Connected
Connection time
2 days, 3:41:30
Downstream
6,912 Kbps
Upstream
448 Kbps
ADSL settings
VPI/VCI
0/38
Type
PPPoA
Modulation
ITU-T G.992.1
Latency type
Interleaved
Noise margin (Down/Up)
6.4 dB / 21.0 dB
Line attenuation (Down/Up)
41.0 dB / 23.5 dB
Output power (Down/Up)
19.8 dBm / 12.4 dBm
Loss of Framing (Local)
0
Loss of Signal (Local)
0
Loss of Power (Local)
0
FEC Errors (Down/Up)
11267213 / 0
CRC Errors (Down/Up)
180 / 2147480000
HEC Errors (Down/Up)
nil / 1
Error Seconds (Local)
98
I think the figures are not too different - they maybe better as I had an external NTE which has now been bypassed so I get nearer 7-8mb download
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So an attenuation of 41 dB indicates a line length of 3km in total. If you can estimate the distance from the exchange to the cabinet (by road is the best way I think) you can subtract that to get a (very) rough idea of the line length to the cabinet. Obviously it's pretty inexact, but it might be enough to show whether or not your estimate of 400m is likely to be accurate.
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I found some more recent ones sept 2014 -
> adsl info --stats
adsl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 8000
Max: Upstream rate = 1008 Kbps, Downstream rate = 6452 Kbps
Path: 0, Upstream rate = 443 Kbps, Downstream rate = 5347 Kbps
Link Power State: L0
Mode: ADSL2
TPS-TC: ATM Mode
Trellis: U:ON /D:ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 14.4 24.7
Attn(dB): 40.0 23.6
Pwr(dBm): 0.0 12.6
ADSL2 framing
MSGc: 59 12
B: 167 13
M: 1 1
T: 1 4
R: 0 0
S: 0.9992 0.9911
L: 1345 113
D: 1 1
Counters
SF: 4423834 264921
SFErr: 137 0
RS: 0 0
RSCorr: 0 0
RSUnCorr: 0 0
HEC: 104 0
OCD: 3 0
LCD: 0 0
Total Cells: 906049027 75047036
Data Cells: 28015344 3624473
Drop Cells: 0
Bit Errors: 0 0
I had an issue with the internal wiring after these stats so there should be an improvement on this now but if you can tell line length from these then I dont expect it to give too much of a difference for newer figures.
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The attenuation is about the same, which is basically the main indicator of line length. So I'd say assume 3km. The FTTC estimate you have implies a line length to the cabinet of over 1km, so if the distance from exchange to cabinet is over, say, 2.5km then you might strongly suspect that the estimate is wrong.
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Exchange to cabinet is about 2.4km via google - so line length is about 600m by my estimate - we shall see on friday - thanks for the information .
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Your about the same sort of length from your exchange as we are, the last time I checked we was getting about 42dB attenuation for our ADSL2+ connection, we are about 3.5km from our exchange and our PCP Cabinet is about 470m from our home.
I have done a quick check for the addresses for your postcode and I have got the following:
Exchange Name: Wilstead
Exchange Code: SMWLS
Cabinet: 14
Fibre Phase: BDUK Bedfordshire and Milton Keynes 13a
Fibre Information: FTTC Planned (exchange ready 14th October 2011)
Result Count: 17
[MK42 6AG]
� Has 17 result(s) connected to Cabinet 14 with FTTC with approximate speeds around the following:
� Range A: 11.6 -> 19.7 (downstream) 0.8 -> 1.3 (upstream)
� Range B: 6.4 -> 16.5 (downstream) 0.6 -> 1.3 (upstream)
Please note that these speeds are using BT's DSL Checker and uses the lowest and highest values for that postcode and cabinet.
� Had at least 1 issue retrieving information from the BT DSL Checker. I say that's bad for a line distance of 600m from your home to the Fibre Cabinet, but what do I know.
However if its the same price that your paying for ADSL Max then it "may be" worth moving over to it, sure your only getting an extra 1Mbps up to 13Mbps more, but it mounts up.
Hopefully this information BT's DSL Checker has is wrong and will correct over time.
Paul
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I agree. I bet that the OP's original estimate of 400m will be about right.
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It will make a dramatic difference to your Upstream speed making it well worth while even if you only get downstream doubled.
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Don't assume anything on new estates. The ducting can go almost anywhere as another poster has found out recently.
In my case in London, 320 metres direct becomes a nice short 440m, in Scotland I have 200 m which becomes 270 actual. However, friends are under 1 km from te exchange as the crow flies and have a 9+km line to the exchange and around 3.5 to the cabinet.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
M H C
taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
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Right, but in this case we know that exchange -> house is around 3km (41dB attn on ADSL) and exchange -> cabinet is around 2.4km (from Google maps). So it can't be longer than 600m max, can it?
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Don't assume anything on new estates. The ducting can go almost anywhere as another poster has found out recently.
In my case in London, 320 metres direct becomes a nice short 440m, in Scotland I have 200 m which becomes 270 actual. However, friends are under 1 km from te exchange as the crow flies and have a 9+km line to the exchange and around 3.5 to the cabinet. This is true, we are about 296m from our house to our PCP cabinet (birds eye view), but wire length is either 482m, 501m, 454m depending on the possible routes.
Just checked on Google Maps our cabinet is about 1.6km (1.5km birds eye) from our exchange, following where it would possibly go, i.e. following BT's man hole covers.
I have also noticed while locating somebody's cabinet (was an EO Line) that there was a postcode very close to their exchange and ended up getting the worst speed due to their new cabinet was half a mile down the road.
So their line went from their exchange to the other side of town and then back on itself to that postcode, resulting in what was about 200m (when EO) from their exchange ended up being about 1.4km to 2km using the new PCP Cabinet, so when fibre arrives there that postcode might possibly be worse off.
So yeah, routing of the cables can go anywhere so we cannot assume it will take the shortest route.
Paul
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I'll post back after the 27th when I go live - here's hoping some new technology will give any necessary boost in the future.
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It has been enabled now and the results are as follows
this is via wifi speed test on this website
Download Speed 37.32mbps
Upload Speed 1.58mbps
ping 22ms
So much better than the estimate.
Now that its higher will BT notice that the speed is above the 15mbps threshold and show me as Infinity?
I seem to remember seeing that because I was on the superfast broadband it would be pegged to 40mbps anyway - does anyone think the speed might be pegged and I could be actually a lot higher?
This is a brand new enabled cabinet/exchange and I suspect I am one of the first few is it likely that it will eventually drop down to 18mbps (original estimate) when more people come on board and that's why my estimate was this low originally ?
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A high chance of higher speeds being possible, and upload is definitely capped, i.e. they have used the cheaper 40/2 service.
The wholesale contract is a 12 month one, so they might be reluctant to regrade you to say 80/20 to see if its faster, or 40/10 to give you some more upload.
On the crosstalk potential, a drop from 37 to 18 is very unlikely, but cannot say its impossible.
Estimates are estimates and mistakes happen when trying to profile 22 million lines.
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The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
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That suggests that you could actually achieve more than 40Mbps. However there is definitely a cap on your upstream that needs lifting. You need to speak with BT and get that removed ...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
M H C
taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
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As MrS says, it looks like they've used the 40/2 product from Openreach to provision you, and this is capping you on both upstream and downstream.
Given the speed right now, if you call, they ought to shift you to a full Infinity product, which should lift you to 40/10. They might be able to get hold of the SNRM/attenuation figures to see if it is worth going to Infinity 2, but I don't know how BT Retail's support staff work.
From the distances you mention earlier, I'd expect speeds around 70/20, after taking account of some crosstalk. However, to give you any better estimate of the speeds you could get, we need more line statistics from your modem - noise margin (or SNRM) and attenuation values would help.
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I have hooked my Archer C9 to an openreach HG612 modem so will have to have a look and see if I can get some stats sorted out - will read up on it and post back
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The speed estimates are sometimes based on something, sometimes not!
Three years ago, when I got FTTC here, the estimate was 10Mb down, 1Mb up. That was the estimate for EVERY line attached to the cabinet, even the ones 5 metres away! Clearly that was utterly wrong, but there was no way that the empty skulls at BT would accept that.
Sure enough the sync started at 39.9Mb and as the cabinet filled, dropped over the years to its current 35Mb (ish). Because of the low upstream estimate, I was unable to order the 10Mb up package. Requests to my ISP were fruitless: they were told the speed would drop and they should "manage your client's expectations"
After about 18 months or so, the estimated speed dropped to 9.7Mb. The actual speed was in the mid 30s.
Then another 6 months later, the estimate changed to 25Mb and I was able to switch from the 2Mb up package to a 10Mb up package (the up sync speed has always been about 7Mb)
So what is the point of this comment? Anyone who thinks their speed estimate looks wrong should not assume that BT knows best. They are very likely to be miles out, but you'll never get them to admit it.
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Connection Status
Mode VDSL2
Traffic type PTM
DSL synchronization status Up
DSL up time 5660
Line Status Help
Downstream Upstream
Attainable rate (kbit/s) 120376 28442
SNR margin (dB) 29.9 31
Line attenuation (dB) 0 0
Output power (dBmV) 13 -11.5
Statistics Help
Path 0
Downstream Upstream
Line rate (kbit/s) 39998 1999
CRC errors 0 0
FEC errors 8 1
HEC errors 41 0 0
These are the stats from my unlocked HG612 modem.
I was think of posting these on the BT community forum as there a BT moderators than can do things bypassing the dreaded customer services. (who I doubt would be able to understand any issues.) However my speed is good and I have a working internet and still in a state of happiness that it's not the 18mbps max they estimated - this may change -
Anybody think that my speed could be improved much above the cap I may have at 40mbps.
thanks
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The attainable figures tell you everything you need to know. The modem thinks you could get speeds of 120Mbps down and 28Mbps up.
As this is a new cabinet, it will have low take-up right now. As the number of subscribers increases, your line will see more crosstalk noise, and those figures will come down somewhat. However, if you upgrade all the way to Infinity 2, you will easily start with 80/20 speeds, and should keep that for some time. Standard Infinity speeds of 40/10 will barely tax the modem.
I suspect that your own estimate of 280-350 metres is about right for the line length.
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I put a question on the BT forums and I'll see if any of their moderators can do anything about it
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One of the MODS on BT forum has done something and my download speed is now 54/16 my bras
profile is now
The current Downstream BRAS rate is: 77.43 Mbps
The current Upstream BRAS rate is: 20 Mbps
I suspect the download speed will be a bit higher as this was a wireless test when i get the chance will get stats from the modem.
The estimate on openreach still shows 18mbps max so not sure how it will work re infinity etc as I suspect computer will still say 'NO'
have to wait and see I guess
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speed results via wireless
Speed 73 down and 16 up
much much better than the 18mbps estimate i was given
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Looks good.
As I mentioned before, my line has a similar problem - incorrectly low estimate. I don't know if it's possible to get this error corrected, or if it will eventually correct itself based on live data. I worry that the low estimate could cause problems with getting a fault fixed in future - as long as the line is performing better than the estimate the ISP (or Openreach) can simply say there's no problem.
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Not bad, eh?
As the other response suggests, be prepared in case of a future fault: if the estimate stays the same, you may have problems persuading someone to do something.
You need to have kept copies of test results to show that you did indeed once have the full speed available to you.
Include some tests on http://speedtest.btwholesale.com/ including the final "further diagnostics" stage; and keep screenshots of them over time.
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good advice will do that
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