From pillar to post?

Another call for advice...

With the admirable support from TBB, I've finally got FTTP fibre run into our block of 4 flats ( http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/t/4386835-fib... ), and am now contemplating how to get from the CSP to the network cabinet in my flat. It's looking like a fairly tortuous route and my concern is the amount of exposed ducting and ethernet cable needed, plus the not very satisfactory appearance thereof, ie, the ever-present domestic acceptability factor.

While I don't know where the telephone extension lead (bear with me) from the master socket to the network cabinet runs, I'm wondering whether it is possible to route the ethernet signal from the ONT via this to the router. If it is feasible, I realise that there would at best be a significant hit on performance. The lead appears to be CW1308 (two twisted pairs) and I reckon it would be between 20 and 10 metres long.

Any chance this might work?

It isn't an ethernet cable from the CSP to the ONTE, it's a ruggedised fibre.

Hi Zarjaz,

Sure, but I'm talking about the ethernet output from the ONT and onwards to the router. Any chance?

Sorry, I had clearly mis-read your post. Is there no way to have the feed to the ONTE run directly to the comms cabinet type thing ?

It may work but you'd be lucky to see 100Mbps and then you'd have no phone.
I suppose you could send VDSL up it

I'm sure white ethernet cable along the wall/ceiling angles or up behind the bannister would be better if the phone cable couldn't be replaced.

Hi BatBoy,

Certainly it would mean sacrificing the phone, but then VOIP ought to be a possibility. Is it possible to get a VDSL signal from an ONT? after all that is the route VDSL from FTTC would take...

White ethernet is definitely feasible - it really comes down to the afore-mentioned domestic acceptibility factor...

It's the routeing thats the problem. The initial easybend run could be into the flat and then the ONT: this is the visually obvious bit as the entrance area is fairly bare and any ducting is going to be very obvious. Once inside the flat, ethernet cable could well be less intrusive.

The advantage of the telephone extension cable is that it's all out of sight.

No VDSL output from the ONT as standard is NOT available, you would have to use a pair VDSL bridging modems, which can be purchased.

It isn't good enough to be used as network cable I'm afraid. There will be no ducting provided by the installer, unless you provide it first.

The telephone cable which might be decent CW1308 or could be cheapo copper coated aluminium might if lucky manage 100 Mbps, but I'd more expect 10 Mbps. Alas there is no in-between with Ethernet.

White CAT5e is available, just avoid boxes of cable with CCA

Considered a new false wall perhaps just 2 cm proud of existing wall, so that trunking can run inside this i.e. presents a flat visual side, but inside the jumble of trunking exists.

This claims to do back-to-back connectivity http://www.billion.com/product/vdsl2/BiPAC8200M-VDSL...

Hi Andrew

Just grabbed a quick look at the more recent posts. I have to divert to another matter - I'll respond asap to the various contributions, all of which are appreciated.

Mike

The electrician who did the original installation is very conscientious and his work is exemplary. I'd be very surprised if he used CCA cable but I'll see if I can find out.

A false wall is an interesting suggestion - it will need some thinking about though to see if it's viable.

VDSL to VDSL is also well worth further consideration and I'm taking a look at BatBoy's link.

Edited by Mygri (Thu 19-Mar-15 22:00:10)

Very interesting - I'll be taking a closer look. Thanks.

Hmm...

When the OR guy was here a couple of weeks ago, prior to getting the CSP sorted out, he indicated that they would use ducting as there is very little available in the entrance stairwell to attach a cable to. If the routeing has to go that way, and ducting is required, then I may have to provide it as you suggest. A bridge I can probably cross if we get to it, but it's unlikely to be pretty...

I've been mulling over the various suggestions. The back-to-back BiPAC 8200 VDSL2 modems certainly look feasible, but I only found one supplier not listing it 'as out of stock', GameSeek asking £107.72 per unit. Amazon is also listing the ZyXEL P-871M which appears to offer the same feature, but is quoting £128.19. So with two units needed, that's a fair old financial hit!

Price aside, there is power available adjacent to the POTS master sockets, and there would be room for the ONT plus modem, plus power sockets and switchery, which could be boxed-in without being too obvious. However, if the other flat owners wanted to go the same way (admittedly, rather unlikely), there is nowhere near enough room, so for the time being I'm putting this one on the reserve list, but not ruling it out just yet.

The false wall has the disadvantage of taking width out of the stairwell where every centimetre counts during removals so I have to rule that out. At the moment, that seems to leave me searching for some innocuous-looking ducting...

Thanks again for your comments, one learns something every day!

May I plead the case for plain cable without ducting? Personally, provided it is done neatly with straight cable and clips at regular intervals (I use one hammers length) and there is only one cable I think it looks less obtrusive than trunking, especially if you can confine it to corners and give it a coat of emulsion.

John

Hi JHo1,

I like the idea of plain cable and I agree it can look much better than ducting. However, in this case it is run of EZ-Bend fibre and I have no idea whether it will sag between clips and two parallel runs may be needed. So at the moment there doesn't seem to be much alternative to ducting, unless anyone out there thinks otherwise...

Thanks

Mike

Channel the wall?

It is issues like this - aesthetics for SWMBO in an MDU, or digging the drive/garden in a house - that favours copper as the final drop in existing buildings. G.fast has a natural market in those who place value in such things over raw broadband speed.

Hi Wombat,

Couldn't agree more!

Mike

In reply to a post by BatBoy:

Channel the wall?

Bit drastic, and the internal doors on the stairwell are all fire-resistant, so would have be very careful not to compromise any fire/ smoke proofing. There's also the domestic acceptability of disrupting a recently refurbished building...

Are the walls just plastered and painted?

Sounds like trunking is the simplest solution however.

In reply to a post by BatBoy:

Are the walls just plastered and painted?

On one side of the stairwell there is some exposed granite. The rest is plaster over blockwork or granite.

Sounds like trunking is the simplest solution however.

I'm coming to that conclusion as well...

TBF the fibre lead in is smaller in diameter than cat5, and with a little care and attention can be installed very neat and tidily.

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

TBF the fibre lead in is smaller in diameter than cat5, and with a little care and attention can be installed very neat and tidily.

The smallest duct I can find is 12 x 8mm cross-section, although a D-section at 16 x 8mm may be more visually acceptable. The details for EZ-bend that I found on-line gave diameters of 3mm and 4.8mm for the rugged versions, and I assume that the OR version is the same or comparable. At those sizes it should be possible to accommodate several feeds.

Words of encouragement are always gratefully received!