BT access point help

Hi,

I made an order for BT infinity and opted for a new line to be installed. I got this message in the welcome email;

Important: You need to arrange access to your building's BT connection point
You have one of these somewhere in your building, and your engineer will need to be able to get to it to set up your new phone service.
It's likely to be on the ground floor or basement, in a communal area. It might be in a locked room with the power meters, or where other utilities come into the building. If you don't have access yourself, or you don't know where the connection point is, you'll need to contact your building's management company or landlord.

If the engineer can't get access during the visit, they won't be able to set up your service and you'll have to arrange a new appointment.
I live in a block of flats 10 storeys high with 64 individual flats and I live on the fifth floor. There are utility cupboards on each floor and on each side of the building. There are three flats on each side of the building on each floor.
I found a little grey BT box in the utility cupboard on my side of the building and my floor. Some cables come out of it and go into 3 underground tubes which feed the 3 flats including mine on our side of the building.

So can the engineer install the line from there or does he need access to something else? Is there a master box or something like that on the ground floor he needs to go too?

I have taken some pictures for you to look at.

http://tinypic.com/r/1zn4k5s/8
http://tinypic.com/r/2u9tz4x/8
http://tinypic.com/r/120mp94/8
http://tinypic.com/r/14bhzco/8

Thanks in advance for any help.

There is very likely a much larger junction or frame on the ground floor or basement where a 100 pair cable enters. That will be split into smaller 4 or 6 pair cables which feed those smaller boxes on each floor.

You will need to find where the incoming cable terminates - just in case.

Hi,

Thanks for the quick reply,

When you say the incoming cable terminates do you mean the main cable coming into the block or the existing cable coming into my property?

The utility cupboard's downstairs have padlocks on them, do BT have keys?

Sorry for the noob questions but BT customer service haven't been very helpful.

One of the cupboard's was unlocked downstairs and has a big grey box with a huge green metal thing underneath. My guess is that's for the electric. It looked like a power box but I can get pictures.

My council are not being much help either so I'm a bit stuck really.

Install on the 29th!

Info on things like this should be part of the information provided when you move in. Tried asking another resident how they got their lines connected.

If its totally brand new then more may well need doing hence access to the utilities cupboards, but if someone had an existing phone line and they moved out and you moved in it should be a fairly simple turn the line on.

I'm a council tenant and when I moved here 3 years ago they didn�t provide any information on new BT lines being installed. The block of flats is not new. The post code is E11 2HN.

I have an active FTTC line already here but would like a new line installed.

I hope you can shed some light on this.

If its a new line, then likely will need work in the utility areas, as for access to them time to talk to the council, arrangements for this may vary from council to council e.g. some may have areas that a standard BT cab key gets engineer into, others may need an engineer to stop off and get a building specific key

Local engineers probably know what to do, but if you get an out of area one, then knowing the detail will help.

Right ok, I'll get onto the council in the morning. I did speak to them already about it and they said the little grey box in the utility cupboard on my floor and side of the building was what the engineer needed to get too. I thought I would double check with BT but no joy.

Do you think the little grey box is the right one?

The 'little grey box' looks to be a 'floor DP' from here there is a cable running to the main DP. Quite often the key required is an FB2 key, which some engineers carry.

Since this is a 2nd line in to the property, they will need to pick up a spare pair on the existing internal cable in the flat, then push it through the little grey box, then on to the main DP.

Have fun.

Wow, I didn�t realise it would be so much work! I guess the main DP is in one of the ground floor utility cupboards?

One is unlocked but not on my side of the building, I took some pictures of what was inside.

http://tinypic.com/r/oarw9h/8
http://tinypic.com/r/m7z2aa/8
http://tinypic.com/r/2qaqlia/8
http://tinypic.com/r/wqx7yh/8
http://tinypic.com/r/2r4hgzr/8

I�m guessing that�s not it? The other utility cupboard on the ground floor on my side of the building in locked with a padlock.

I am guessing here, but out of all those images the 4th image could be it being a wad of X pairs of twisted cables, the rest are mains which look not that safe LOL.

Paul

Thanks, definitely looks a bit iffy!

Will get on to the council again in the morning.

As Paul says, the block on the right hand side of photo 4 is telephony of some sort It looks too small to be a main DP though.
I'm guessing the flats are 60's or 70's by the look of it.

To clarify exactly what you are trying to achieve-

1) Are you wanting to have two, separate FTTC connections to your flat, involving for example, two Line Rentals etc, thus doubling your Monthly fixed costs?

2) Are you simply trying to change from another ISP (Supplier) to BT Infinity, with a BT installed Extension Kit within your flat, for convenience, thus still having only one FTTC connection?

From a safety perspective, that cupboard should be fully locked and secured.

The first one, two separate lines with two line rentals.

Ok so I have been on to the council this morning. They put me through the asset management team who said that they think this access point is on the roof!

Told it was for Wednesday and he said either the tenant or BT have to ring when there�re on site or they will come out to unlock any doors.

How does that sound to you guys? I'm not so sure myself.

In reply to a post by Patch01:

Ok so I have been on to the council this morning. They put me through the asset management team who said that they think this access point is on the roof!

Told it was for Wednesday and he said either the tenant or BT have to ring when there�re on site or they will come out to unlock any doors.

How does that sound to you guys? I'm not so sure myself.

ROOF? I doubt it!

As for them coming out when BT are on-site, how long will they take? You may find that the BT Tech will not want to stand around for an hour waiting so they will need to attend before BT arrive.


Have a careful look, without interfering, at the BT junction box on your floor. You say there are wires going to each flat - there should also be a wire going in a different direction - can you see where it goes? UP? DOWN?

Is there a similar location on the ground floor? Can you see what the arrangement is there?

That's what I thought. The council are not making things easy..

http://tinypic.com/r/1603l36/8
http://tinypic.com/r/n4xwkp/8
http://tinypic.com/r/w8paiq/8

Some more pictures.

Hopefully you might be able to see what's going on. I have no idea!

Are those junction boxes in your home or in a cupboard on each of the floors?

There doesn't seem to be anything stopping anyone from being nasty and snipping the cable on the ground floor taking out all floors.

Paul

Given that the OP wants two separate FTTC Lines, would OR insist on a "complete installation", including both full E-side and D-Side, including normal phone-equipment installation at the Exchange; or as seems technically possible, would OR be willing to omit the E-side, beyond the FTTC to the Exchange?

The junction boxes are on my floor, there are two cupboards on each floor one on each side. Three flats on each side and in the picture you should be able to make out the three tubes that feed the flats on my side. The pictures are not great I know, sorry!

The cupboard on my side of the building on the ground floor is locked.

In reply to a post by Patch01:

The junction boxes are on my floor, there are two cupboards on each floor one on each side. Three flats on each side and in the picture you should be able to make out the three tubes that feed the flats on my side. The pictures are not great I know, sorry!

Na they are good enough to see, so it has 1 grey cable going into the junction box so that cable must be several cores, and 3 cables 2 grey and 1 white coming out.

Not really tidy bunch of cables.

Paul

In reply to a post by Patch01:

The cupboard on my side of the building on the ground floor is locked.

Ah, but what floor are you on, could be cut between floors, the way I see it, all of those should be locked and if you have a site supervisor only they should have a key to them.

Its the same with the cupboard with the mains in it, that should be checked, like I said that doesn't look safe at all, Health and Safety would through a fit if they saw that, to me it looks like a hack job, but that just me.

Paul

Definitely not tidy!

I'm on the fifth floor and the block is 10 storeys high with a total of 64 flats.

From those pictures it looks as if a bundle of maybe 6 pair cables start off on the ground floor and go up through the corner with one being terminated on each floor. Does the cable into the bottom of the BT box go through the hole in the floor to the floor below? If so, that suggests the BT main junction box is on the ground floor or possible a small basement. That is the location you need to find.

In reply to a post by Patch01:

Definitely not tidy!

I'm on the fifth floor and the block is 10 storeys high with a total of 64 flats.

Well I am not trying to be negative or paranoid or anything, but by the looks of those phone cables then are going from floor to floor and if the doors are not locked anyone that wants to be nasty could just go in there and cut them.

They would be better off putting them in a conduit making them safer.

Paul

I remember a friend who lived in a block of flats (I think also 10-12 storeys) each floor had 4 flats... it was a 6 pair cable running from ground floor (where small cabinet out front of flat)

Out of the 12 cores in that cable 3 where broken and 2 where in poor condition... he got free line rental whilst he lived there as BT (at the time) didn't want to repair them due to my friend getting an ok telephone service... but his broadband was rubbish...

was supposed to be about 4meg but ended up with 1.2meg due to very high SNR.

Not sure but I think Openreach renew all the cabling when they enabled FTTC.

In reply to a post by PaulKirby:

In reply to a post by Patch01:

Definitely not tidy!

I'm on the fifth floor and the block is 10 storeys high with a total of 64 flats.

Well I am not trying to be negative or paranoid or anything, but by the looks of those phone cables then are going from floor to floor and if the doors are not locked anyone that wants to be nasty could just go in there and cut them.

They would be better off putting them in a conduit making them safer.

Paul

Those are supposedly "locked" service cupboards and potentially have power as well as comms running through them. If the earlier pictures are anything to go by, the owners (local authority) do not seem to care.

with any look nobody will think about cutting them, most would think they would get shocked anyway.

Not sure why someone would want to cut them either

In reply to a post by mlmclaren:

Out of the 12 cores in that cable 3 where broken and 2 where in poor condition... he got free line rental whilst he lived there as BT (at the time) didn't want to repair them due to my friend getting an ok telephone service... but his broadband was rubbish...

And some of the rougher BT Techs (mostly not disposed of) would chose a "split pair" with the good leg from two different pairs. Fine for voice and dial up - useless for ADSL.

In reply to a post by MHC:

Those are supposedly "locked" service cupboards and potentially have power as well as comms running through them. If the earlier pictures are anything to go by, the owners (local authority) do not seem to care.

That's what I was trying to say, if Health and Safety saw them they have a fit.

All it takes is for some young child that is either living there or visiting somebody there to wonder off playing to go inside one of them and touch the wrong thing and that could be it for them.

Paul

unfortunately my mate was the last to get connected on that floor so other 3 flats had decent lines and his was 1 good core and 1 poor core..

He was trying to get permission from council to drill through to floor above or below to run a pair that floor but council wouldn't have it

In reply to a post by mlmclaren:

with any look nobody will think about cutting them, most would think they would get shocked anyway.

Not sure why someone would want to cut them either

True, but we live in a sad world, and some people are that stupid

Paul

Hmm this is true!

I came from a council estate and went out one day to find local youths kicking the Virgin cabinet doors that had been left open...

After a mouthful of abuse I highlight to them that their broadband and TV goes through that cabinet so it will only be them that would suffer... specially when I phone virgin and inform them that a customer is damaging their equipment...

They later came back and was kicking it again and by pure coincidence the virgin network dropped for a hours or so... ha where there faces red when I told their parents it was their fault.

Yeah I think that makes the most sense, I've taken a few more pictures. Two from within the cupboard on my floor and side of the building focusing on where the cable comes from and where it goes. The other two are of the cupboard and padlock on the ground floor which is on my side of the building and now where I am guessing the main box is?

http://tinypic.com/r/2rdkrp5/8
http://tinypic.com/r/zj9feq/8
http://tinypic.com/r/11b22bb/8
http://tinypic.com/r/2e1ekno/8

Thanks for all your help so far guys.

LOL.
Well over the last several Months coming back from medical appointments I have seen loads of cabinets, some BT and Virgin Media and a few others either with doors hanging off, tops ripped off, or just laying of their sides.

So I get home did a Google Maps lookup the locations and them phoned BTOR and VM and reported them, both providers very happy I reported them.

What gets me is why people do this, why rip off the entire top of BT's and VM's cabinets, VM I guess is to probably get free TV or BB, not too sure if that even works.

I know that if we have fibre cabinets or VM here and a youth was kicking the door off that one of the neighbours would give them a slap at the back of the head.
Brings back memories when I was a kid where I would get clipped round the ear by a police man for messing about to then get clipped round the ear again by my dad when I got home, its like your parents were psychic or maybe down to me rubbing my red ear

Not like now, cannot even give them a swift kick up the backside

Paul

You could be right ...

Looking at the padlock which has been added in place of the normal lock, there are letters punched in - do they say FB if so, as was earlier mention, by Zarjaz I believe, some BT staff have keys. However, do not count on it.

Can you get back to BT and ask them to ask the Technician to call you when he starts his previous job so you can then get the council on site rather than have to get BT to wait.

Yes the padlock has " Made in England " and " FB " Stamped into it.

In reply to a post by PaulKirby:

VM I guess is to probably get free TV or BB, not too sure if that even works.

The Virgin Media cabinets usually either end up falling apart and the engineers either don't bother reporting it or it just gets lost in translation or somebody told me that Virgin tech's sometimes end up breaking into the cabinets as keys get lost.

cabinets in my area are falling apart and open and Virgin's area manager said they just don't have the parts to fix them anymore and are yet to be given funds to replace them... some of the cabinets have had DIY jobs done on them to lock them and it looks ok but they are the ones with good hinges... many round here lock but the hinges have disintegrated..

In reply to a post by mlmclaren:

The Virgin Media cabinets usually either end up falling apart and the engineers either don't bother reporting it or it just gets lost in translation or somebody told me that Virgin tech's sometimes end up breaking into the cabinets as keys get lost.

cabinets in my area are falling apart and open and Virgin's area manager said they just don't have the parts to fix them anymore and are yet to be given funds to replace them... some of the cabinets have had DIY jobs done on them to lock them and it looks ok but they are the ones with good hinges... many round here lock but the hinges have disintegrated..

The classic ones that gives me a chuckle is the Duck Tape holding the doors shut or the pvc bin bag taped to the top to stop water getting in LOL, what a joke.

Paul

In reply to a post by PaulKirby:

The classic ones that gives me a chuckle is the Duck Tape holding the doors shut or the pvc bin bag taped to the top to stop water getting in LOL, what a joke.

Paul

Yep OOOOH so many around here.... aswell as sticks.. bits of cardboard jammed in edges of doors...

Someone about a mile away got pee'd off and weld one shut... virgin tried to find out who but I don't think they had any look...

Urm single order FTTC is not live yet, so yes will still be two phone numbers for two FTTC lines

In reply to a post by mlmclaren:

Yep OOOOH so many around here.... aswell as sticks.. bits of cardboard jammed in edges of doors...

Yep seen those.

In reply to a post by mlmclaren:

Someone about a mile away got pee'd off and weld one shut... virgin tried to find out who but I don't think they had any look...

Would be funny to open up one of the cabinets near me and insert a circuit board with a battery and speaker and when the doors are opened it plays a sample saying "Close the damn doors its cold" that would make anyone jump LOL

Paul

Finally! The council told me where it was, on the first floor cupboard on my side of the building. No padlock.

Took some pictures, looks dodgy! Cover to the box on floor and very messy but I�m happy to have found it.

http://tinypic.com/r/29p83zp/8
http://tinypic.com/r/vd1uad/8
http://tinypic.com/r/10x95hu/8

So will they be able to do this all on one day? It�s a 1-6pm appointment.

That's it.

Yes, very messy and I would guess someone has been messing with it. BT Techs would not have left the cover off.

The bunch of cables from the bottom will be one grey to each floor and the two white are possible additional ones installed later to provide extra line or sort out failed pairs.

It should not be a problem for a decent Tech to either use an existing pair - if there is a good one, or to run a new feed from your flat or floor DP back to the main DP provided he can access the cupboards on each floor to get a new cable through.

Just make sure you have tea and biccies available.

Yeah I thought as much, we do sometimes get people in the block up to no good. Hopefully the engineer can re-attach the cover and make it safe at least!

Everything makes a lot more sense now and I've learned an awful lot from you guys so thanks

I have some very nice Irish tea bags, Barry's which go very well with a nice jammy dodger!

asset management team who said that they think this access point is on the roof!

I seriously doubt that.

I have some very nice Irish tea bags, Barry's which go very well with a nice jammy dodger!

Twinings Everyday, semi-skimmed milk and one sugar please. Malted Milk, or if you really want to push the boat out, a Fig Newton, please.

Do it in one visit, yeah, I'd have thought so. You've found the 50 pair main DP, there must be a stop or a spare getting back from there, you've found the local floor DP, that's the hunting bit covered. If you want the new NTE adjacent to the existing, then the fit's a doddle too.

What you really want to see is some world weary old hand of an engineer turn up, then I'd be hugely surprised if it don't get done. Get some Johnny-come-lately type, and I'll reserve judgement.

Good luck, and keep us posted.

Hi guys,

Got my HH5 today ahead of install. Checked it and it�s a type A. I�m sure my cabinet No. 52 on the Wanstead exchange is a Huawei. On my current FTTC connection G.INP has been on for a good few weeks. I�ve read a few things on the internet about the HH5 Type A having some issue�s with G.INP.

So with this being a second line install does anyone know if there will be any issues? If so, can I do anything to help the situation? I think I have a 612 modem somewhere if that helps?

Thanks in advance.

I don't know if the HH5 has a WAN port, but if it does I would use the HG612 as the modem and connect the HH5 into that. That way you'll sidestep any compatibility problems with G.INP.

The HH5 has a WAN port which you can connect the HG612 to. The HG612 needs to be on the latest firmware to support G.INP.

Of course, your connection will still be subject to TR069 controlling the HH5

The HG612 that I have has been unplugged for at least 6 months, if I plug that in on my current FTTC line will it update it to support G.INP on the new line? I also haven�t unlocked the HG612 so should I do that?

Should I plug the HG612 in after the install?

Is TR069 something to do with remote management?

Easiest and best is to install the unlocked 30SP08 firmware on the HG612. Not the 28SP10 as that is earlier!

Then you can see what is going on if you need to.

Feel a bit stupid, I just automatically assumed I had an HG612. I looked and it�s actually an ECI B-FOCuS V-2FUb/r Rev.B

Egg on face moment!

Any recommendations what I should do? Can you do anything with the model I have to help with G.INP?

Nope.

Get an HG612 Mk 3B off eBay. Flashing the unlocked formware yourself is dead easy, so don't pay much of a premium for "unlocked". It may not even have the latest unlocked software so you'd still have to flash it.