|
|
|
Hi there, i posted here a few days ago for when i'd get fibre, i then had it hit me that when i do get fibre i will not have access to the gold it offers so my question is, does anyone know of any new technology being tested for those on long lines? i know of a new video compression company named vnova have created a new technology that allows better compression of video so that those with poor internet speed can watch hd content with ease but have no clue when they will roll out this tech. Anyone heard or seen anything of new tech going or if they may know if companies like bt/openreach are even looking into long line solutions.
Thanks
|
|
|
yes looking into long line situations and the question is usually how much do you want to spend.
http://blog.thinkbroadband.com/2014/10/g-fast-shows-... G.Fast is one option, as are smaller fibre cabinets using VDSL2 that can be deployed remotely.
Though at the end of the day the problem is not technical because FTTP will work for any line, the only issue is the cost of getting fibre all the way to the premises.
As the pressure is on value for money, fast roll-out etc etc then for now the main bulk of work is FTTC as deploys fast and a relatively sensible price.
|
|
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
|
|
|
g.fast for long lines means more fibre so means costs more money, I would guess g.fast will be targeted at high density short line areas for maximum value for money.
In BDUK areas it seems vectoring will be used to improve coverage although I expect the gains from that wont be big since vectoring is best used on short lines.
|
|
Register (or login) on our website and you will not see this ad.
|
|
|
Yeap it all comes down to money, if we adopted South Korean tower blocks for 75% of population broadband would be easier.
|
|
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
|
|
|
|
Quite an interesting read, if you know of others please send links my way, ive tried googling these things myself but i most likely over complicate the search and comes back with random pages, If one could afford FTTP on a 3km line, would openreach allow it? if so any idea of a price range, ive tried googling that also but cant seem to find prices for how much fibre cable would cost to install
|
|
|
For SME and consumer there was a product called Fibre on Demand that could be ordered if your cabinet provided FTTC - but looking at £4000+ for 3km line. Orders are on hold while new cheaper ways to run the fibre, e.g. plug connectors rather than fusion splicing joints.
Leased lines or Ethernet usually for business are available practically anywhere but carry a large fee more than FoD and higher monthly fees.
Another option is http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/6773-fibre-to-the...
|
|
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
|
|
|
It sounds from the Openreach email in your previous thread that your cabinet is getting FTTC.
That would mean a tiny chance of getting something called FTTPoD, which I believe is still temporarily closed for new orders. At 1.8km from the cabinet, so probably similar from what is called an "aggregation point", you would be looking at over £7,000 installation and over £100pm rental. Though you would get 330/30Mbps - if you find an ISP selling FTTPoD. Probably only BT.
All subject to a feasibility survey and resultant estimate if it can be done.
I expect that's not a lot of good to you.
|
|
|
I think you are looking at a pre-May 2014 price list Andrew. Previous + Current.
Edited by RobertoS (Sat 20-Jun-15 15:43:30)
|
|
|
Actually was a off the top of the head figure rather than off price list.
|
|
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
|
|
|
|
Thats isn't expensive as i thought it would be, i know a lot of people living around me at the moment are getting terrible broadband speeds, i may look into that and wonder if people might pitch in to get fast broadband for our area, i don't know how that would work as openreach was most likely have to put another cabinet closer to those outside lochmaben and have no clue how much one of those would cost and dont think gfast would do as us rural folk are spread around a 2km area if my house was the centre. most of us have bought our houses so its not easy just up and moving, ive been here 11 years and broadband wasn't that big back then, just very slow dial up, if i'd known i wouldn't have purchased the house.
|
|
|
|
Yes openreach responded back after asking when my exchange would be upgraded to FTTC and said it would happen in November
|
|
|
Enabling your exchange isn't the same thing as enabling your cabinet.
The price I gave is correct for what Openreach charge BT Wholesale. Then there is no doubt a markup by them and BT. Then I forgot to add the Vat, sorry, as those are ex-Vat - see the link I gave.
That would be a single feed to your premises. Not a closer cabinet installation to speed up the whole area. That would be a different ball game altogether, but some communities have clubbed together and done it. IIRC it's £40k+
|
|
|
|
Yes i'll certainly do some research on it and then speak to my neighbours and those close to me, there is about 300 of us so 40k spread between those households might not be to bad for everyone to pitch in , i think before i commit to anything i'll wait for the cabinet im on to be upgraded to FTTC and i'll see what kind of speeds i get after its enabled,
Thanks for all your info
|
|
|
IIRC it's £40k+ In our case we've paid c£19K for an all-in-one cab to serve 75+ EO lines. Fibre is available fairly close which helped keep the cost down as did the use of an all-in-one cabinet. Installation however is still some months off.
|
|
|
|
Can't give any sources but I heard talk recently of a premium option involving G.fast,
Standard G.fast will be one pair only, so I interpreted the premium option to involve pair bonding. I could be completely wrong and the person might have actually been talking about FTTP but he did say "premium option for ultrafast copper".
If they are exploring bonding then this could definitely be used for long lines. In fact I don't know why Openreach don't have a solution involving two or more pairs for long lines.
|
|
|
|
Interesting. Are these 75+ residents close to each other? as my problem is is that those living outside lochmaben are split all over the place, if bt where to put a new cabinet down i'd have an idea of where they'd put it as there is a centralised spot which would put people within the 1km range(the copper line also follows this centralized spot) I know it doesn't quite work like that but even bringing a cabinet closer to those outside of lochmaben will increase speed exponentially for those getting 1 meg or slower, im quite lucky really getting 6 megs but still isn't enough these days unfortunately
|
|
|
|
There is no technology to help you out, G.Fast and such like only works on short lines, the only hope is that at some time fibre will be laid closer to your house, I'm in the same situation, at a meeting last year openreach made all sorts of 'hints' that FTTrn and such like would be employed on the second phase of BDUK, now we've found out this was just to shut us up and no such thing was ever intended.
|
|
|
|
Yes i thought so, guess my only hope will be 4g, currently getting 6 megs over 3g just now so im getting my hopes up for 4g and mobile broadband, think that may be our only option for us rural folk.
|
|
|
Assuming they power cut back the vdsl2 frequencies then it still will be useless for longer lines.
|
|
|
Are these 75+ residents close to each other? Yes. Our situations aren't really comparable. We're a late 80s development in central London over 2Km from the exchange. Being in London there is currently no BDUK funding to help so after considering various possibilities, not just BT, we signed for BT to provide us with FTTC.
A driving force was both property rentals and values were falling behind those of similar properties in the area most of them having access to not only FTTC but also VM. BTW we are not in an affluent part of London (Lambeth) but the amount each of us has paid is small relative to the loss of value and rents.
I would have hoped that phase 2 of BDUK, in your case Digital Scotland, might address your problem once the easier and cheaper targets have been provisioned.
|
|
|
|
Woodmass
You need to talk to the Scottish body running the BDUK equivelent in Scotland. Not quite sure where you fit (HIE or what the other is called?)
With 300 premises talking to BT and the funding body may help to get a new cabinet in the correct place to reach you all. It needs to be a locality you can get a mains power feed to, on the copper route with safe space for a cabinet.
If there are no plans an offer to help fund something may change the decision BUT it can be hard going finding the correct people to talk to.
Within BT you need to try the Scottish Director but I do not know the name ( it should be available from the main BT office in Edinburgh).
£50 each for 300 makes £15000 which could swing it your way!
|
|
|
|
its getting people to agree to it if its possible, 20 percent of those 300 are most likely elderly folks who most likely just have there simple landline plugged in, i'll wait till november to see if fibre does anything for me, who knows i might get a nice surprise if not i'll do my research online and see who i have to talk to, to do all what you just said. and if openreach/bt allow it i guess i'll go post letters or something for those on the lochmaben exchange/cabinet
|
|
|
The premium is fttp as with classic g.fast the fibre is at the last pole or hole before your home
|
|
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
|
|
|
Leased lines or Ethernet usually for business are available practically anywhere but carry a large fee more than FoD and higher monthly fees.
Get one put in somewhere that has good Line of sight on the surrounding buildings and the use P2P or P2MP wireless.
Or if you're really sneaky do a bit of fibre to the press release and hope that the thought of a competitor in the area persuades BT to spend the money upgrading it. (Seems to happen whenever an alt.net goes and deploys an area BT suddenly decide it's worth putting FTTC there)
|
|
|
yeah sorry I meant those a long way from the pole.
|
|
|
|
Andrew, yes that's what I thought the premium option would be (FTTP) but have they actually officially told us that or are we assuming?
|
|
|
What I was told, the three trial areas and then whether things become products after that - so wait and see time.
|
|
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
|
|
|
|
that might work if it was sitting on a 100ft pole, to many of mother natures obstacles for that i think, not sure how p2p works but im guessing it needs LOS, however i can see lochmaben from my house but only a couple of them on the outskirts if i was to go on the roof but i'd need to read on distances it can handle and price
|
|
|
that might work if it was sitting on a 100ft pole, to many of mother natures obstacles for that i think, not sure how p2p works but im guessing it needs LOS, however i can see lochmaben from my house but only a couple of them on the outskirts if i was to go on the roof but i'd need to read on distances it can handle and price
Depends on the distance, ideally it should be line of sight although at short distances near line of sight is probably good enough.
Depends on the required bandwidth but the kit can be cheaper than most people think, it depends on how much interference there is but with LOS and good radio conditions a lot of the point2point stuff can go for miles.
Look at UBNT or Mikrotik for the radio kit, both are pretty cheap and seem to work reasonably well, It's what quite a lot of the providers using Wi-Fi based solutions use.
Also nothing to stop you doing multiple Hops 
Edited by dragon2611 (Sun 21-Jun-15 14:15:35)
|
|
|
do you know of any providers that install equipment like that? im guessing someone in town would have to source the internet connection. right? or would i be able to go through a provider instead of going to a random house and ask if i can install equipment on there house. i know a little about how tech works but still a big bit of stupid in there aswell so please forgive me lol the reason i came here for help 
|
|
|
|
There are wireless ISPs around Dumfries & Galloway - e.g. in the Solway Firth area and in South Ayrshire - who are willing to develop/extend wireless networks if they know that they are guaranteed a sufficient number of customers. The usual threshold is 40-50, only about 15% of the 300 that you mention. It may not be a long term solution but it will get you a much better service until Digital Scotland get around to implementing Phase 2 or whatever of their program.
I have no connection with any of them so you will need to contact them yourself if you are interested in pursuing this. Use a Google search for "wireless ISP solway" or similar. Also don't expect prices that compete with large operators. Small wireless ISPs don't have the economies of scale that support the pricing policies of the mass market operators.
|
|
|
|
thanks for the names, i'll look into it to see if its possible in my area first.
|
|
|
. In fact I don't know why Openreach don't have a solution involving two or more pairs for long lines.
If my location is typical of a rural Market1 exchange, the copper infrastructure has not been looked after, there are few or zero spare pairs left to use for bonding to start with!
PlusNet BBYW1
Edited by godsell4 (Mon 22-Jun-15 11:39:22)
|
|
|
. In fact I don't know why Openreach don't have a solution involving two or more pairs for long lines.
If my location is typical of a rural Market1 exchange, the copper infrastructure has not been looked after, there are few or zero spare pairs left to use for bonding to start with!
Well yes that's a very valid point!
|
Pages in this thread: 
Print Thread
