Panic Stations because of House Move

So, I will be moving house soon, to a small village.

I've had Sky fibre where I am for over a year now, and it would be a real shame to go backwards.

The exchange I am moving to is WSJOP, Joppa in South Ayrshire. According to Sam Knows, I can get FTTC at my new postcode (29 KA6 6NZ, don't know the phone number yet)

However Samknows also says the exchange is at the end of my road, which if true I would have thought I would be an exchange only line.

To make matters worse, 21CN isn't enabled, does this mean I don't get ADSL2+ if it's an exchange only line?

I've done a recce, and I can't see anything resembling an exchange at the marker Samknows says, so is this information always accurate?

I've also found a fibre cabinet nearby, at this location https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@55.444413,-4.517619,3... although I can't find the old cabinet next to it. It doesn't show on streetview, it's too new

The BT where and when checker says this:
Exchange name: Joppa

We're keen to bring Superfast Fibre to your area and are exploring how best to achieve that. We may deliver it as part of our commercial programme, or by working in partnership with your local authority. At the moment you can't order Superfast Fibre.

So what gives? Who's right?

Are exchanges at small villages like this buildings, or can they be small enough to fit in a cabinet?

Thanks for any replies

According to the bt wholesale checker, you are EO, and you're right, no ADSL2+

http://i.imgur.com/GxTtuMH.png

You're looking at 8mbit ADSL1. Samknows says "some areas" as most/all the cabinets are FTTC enabled, but EO lines not dealt with. There is no LLU there either, so no chance of ADSL2+ from an LLU provider.

Sorry!

Edited by nemeth782 (Fri 10-Jul-15 21:36:42)

Your unlucky.

https://www.telecom-tariffs.co.uk/codelook.htm

http://www.digitalscotland.org/whereandwhen

Edited by Nightglow (Fri 10-Jul-15 21:52:25)

Couple of points.

I assume that to find the exchange at the Samknows location you walked to the main road and turned right?

If you turn left instead you will see the exchange to the side of the health centre.

The Samknows location is about the correct distance from the Garvin Road junction, it's just on the wrong side.

Unfortunately the latitude and longitude you give in the Google URL points to someones back garden! Google has a habit of putting the point you are 'hovering' over as the first Lat/Long and then where you are looking as a second one.

Yeah, I did.

I did look at that building and think it might be the exchange but wasn't sure.

The Google URL is where there is a new fibre cabinet, it just isn't shown in streetview, because it's too new. So that cabinet is pretty close to the exchange.

And my new house is about equidistant from the fibre cabinet and the exchange.

Another point, I have fibre at my current address, (KA8 9HD), and the postcode checker doesn't say there's fibre here, so it can be wrong. I have to clutch at straws.

So if I'm stuck with ADSL1, are there any plans for exchanges to be upgraded to ADSL2+ after fibre rollout, when it would mostly only benefit EO lines? I'm guessing that would be a no.

I'm not saying SamKnows is wrong about the location of your exchange, but it is wrong about at least three exchanges (two of which I forget now because I've not used Samknows in a while) even within my local area. One is EABFD if anyone wants evidence, it says's it's in central Colchester, when I know (and so does every other checker) that it's firmly in Boxford, Suffolk, where it should be. I wrote to them 3 times politely pointing this out and never got any response, and since that (something like a year) they've not corrected it either. So sometimes, Sam doesn't know, or even want to know.

Apologies if this doesn't help your situation, it was semi-on-topic though - i.e. don't trust Samknows implicitly.

OK, some points and questions.

On the digital scotland FAQ page, it has this to say about EO lines:

"Exchange Only lines are connected directly to the local telephone exchange rather than passing through a street cabinet that can be upgraded with a fibre broadband connection. There are cases where some EO lines can be fibre enabled, for example by building an additional cabinet close to the exchange. Where exchange only lines cannot be enabled for fibre, alternative technologies such as wireless or satellite may be needed to boost speeds."

How close does this additional cabinet need to be? There is a large fibre cabinet about 250 metres down the road (measured on google maps), and I can't see any old street cabinets nearby, which could suggest this is to provide fibre to EO lines.

According to this https://www.telecom-tariffs.co.uk/codelook.htm?xid=1...

3% of addresses in my postcode are connected to the P1 cabinet, and can get fibre.

Some other postcodes nearby are 100% connected to the P1 cabinet, and it seems to cover every postcode in the village, including a couple 17km away (is this even possible?)

Could this mean that my postcode was 100% EO, but 3% have now ordered fibre and been moved to the new cabinet serving EO lines?

That theory falls down when you see how many postcodes are 100% on this cabinet, and I don't imagine there are many postcodes that are 100% fibre.

Although, I have to call the accuracy into question when it's saying addresses 15-17km away are on it.

Another thing, I don't think the BT postcode checker is a very good indicator of fibre availability, since I have fibre at my postcode now (KA8 9HD) and the BT postcode checker doesn't say it's available.

Is it certain the large cabinet isn't Virgin Media?

An FTTC cabinet to serve EO lines usually has a new PCP twin, though Openreach do have some combo ones these days. Does this cabinet have air vents?

Another thing, I don't think the BT postcode checker is a very good indicator of fibre availability

Never use the BT post code checker, Either use the phone number or if there is no phone currently or the phone number is not recognised, perhaps because it is with Sky, use the full address checker - enter the post code and then select the address from the drop down list.

Looks like the cabinets for the local area (but not your street) are at the corner of Hole Rd and the A70.
Problem is that cabinet covers a fairly large percentage of the area near you so there may not be enough EO lines to make a new cabinet worthwhile.

Douglas Rd behind you has 100% FTTC - time to visit your neigbours and see if one would agree to having a new phoneline fitted in their garage ?

Deffo not Virgin Media in this area. It was green, had a sticker saying fibre had arrived in the area, and it may have been my imagination but it seemed a bit wider than the cabinet I am currently on.

Whats a PCP twin?

A PCP is a normal phone cabinet. Any one of the many we are used to.

Edited by RobertoS (Sat 11-Jul-15 10:11:25)

On your cab 1 theory that is wrong.

EO changes work by you suddenly gaining a cab number and fttc availability at same time or some time later

Away from my usual place so hopefully others have done the is eo upgrade on the way for you

Sorry, but I'm not parsing this.

Does this mean you think that the EO lines are in the process of getting moved to the fibre cabinet close to the exchange?

Wouldn't they only do that if you ordered fibre?

There must be lots of lines near me that were EO, and some can now get fibre, and some can't according to the checker. This doesn't seem very fair, since there can't be much difference at the exchange end between the lines.

I went back up for a nosy and took a picture of the cabinet, and what I think is the exchange.

Cabinet [IMG]http://i61.tinypic.com/yceir.jpg[/IMG]

Exchange? [IMG]http://i60.tinypic.com/5vssc3.jpg[/IMG]

My current cabinet [IMG]http://i58.tinypic.com/2v198id.jpg[/IMG], which isn't as wide as the one I hope to connect to in Coylton/Joppa

If a decision is made to deploy a cabinet for EO lines then everyone is moved to that cabinet irrespective of whether they order FTTC or not. This move can even happen some months ahead of the FTTC cabinet going live.

The picture you post as your current cabinet, that is a FTTC cab, how do you know its your cabinet? Has checker changed to include a cabinet number, if not then probably someone else.

When areas get EO upgrades there is no guarantee that 100% of lines are rearranged, and it can happen in stages. Not in a position to look at what codelook etc are saying for addresses in the area at this time.

The current cabinet pic is what I am connected to at my current address, I did some checking and found that out around the time I got fibre, about a year ago.

I am moving to a village about 5 miles away, and it looks like I'll be on an EO line, but the other cabinet pic I posted is of a fibre cabinet about 250m from the exchange, with no PCP twin nearby, so my assumption was that this was for upgrading EO lines.

There are many addresses nearby my new address that surely would have been EO lines, but are now showing as FTTC available.

I'm hoping it is a phased approach, and FTTC will be available at my new address sometime in the near future.

This is a cracking house for me, and I hoped it would be my final move, it would be real bummer if I was stuck on 7.5Mb for the rest of my life.

That cabinet looks like it is on Hole Rd just south of Milton Park. If so it is the fibre cabinet for the two cabinets at the corner of Hole Rd and the A70 - see my previous post.

Looks like the streets nearest the junction are older houses and wired from that junction then Garvine Rd was developed and wired from the exchange.

Oh dear.

I didn't see these cabinets when I was doing my recce, so maybe they have been removed?

What could that mean?

Doubt they have been removed - they are not as tall as the fibre cabinets.

Just went back up to check, and they are still there! Raging!

So where does this leave me? Are there concrete plans to upgrade EO lines in future?

It seems a bit rubbish that they would leave EO lines on ADSL 1, ADSL2+ wouldn't be so bad.

Why can't they just deploy the hardware from fibre cabinets inside the exchanges?

II dont think there are concrete plans for particular blocks of EO lines at the moment - Digital Scotland via BT are still completing cabinet upgrades and I suspect wont do much EO until that first stage is completed - but you can ask them digitalscotland.org - expect a fairly non-comittal answer. Andrew may know better.

No VDSL is not allowed inside exchanges because of interfernce issues with existing ADSL.

Your exchange may yet get upgraded to ADSL2+.

In your position I would be testing the waters with neighbours over the back.

Edited by jphilip (Sat 11-Jul-15 19:58:13)

Large numbers of scottish EO are being upgraded just that there is no guarantee of 100% coverage in any particular area.

Codelook is saying that cabinet P3 has FTTP planned. I didn't think you needed to go via a cabinet for FTTP?

FTTP is planned in "Phase BDUK Scot Government 15a".

Could they be planning FTTP for EO lines?

The fttp will not touch the existing cabinet but fttp tends to be rolled out matching a cabinet area or a specific eo cluster

Codelook is a snapshot of the plans at any one specific point and plans can change

You are right that FTTP doesn't go via cabinets, but Openreach planning is by cabinet area. Except of course for EO lines.

In broad terms, because distance and other factors also come into the decision, all the phone lines supplied from any particular cabinet will get FTTC, or all FTTP, or no fibre.

Then the BDUK schemes step in, where Openreach have said they can't fund it because it wouldn't be commercially viable for them. Again, FTTC or FTTP may be the solution, though other methods such as satellite broadband can be used.

Wrt EO lines I don't know. Many do get cabinets sited near to the exchange, then FTTC, but I don't know about FTTP.

Sorry to resurrect this thread, but this is bugging me!

I can see that FTTP is planned for my exchange, though there is no date, and no number of properties passed listed

https://www.telecom-tariffs.co.uk/codelook.htm?xid=1...

It is planned for P3 (or the footprint of P3!).

P3 seems to cover just 3 postcodes as it stands, comprising 97 properties.

I found another user on this forum (maccoylton) who claims that there are 400 properties on EO lines in my community.

So, could the planned FTTP be to cover the 3 postcodes on P3 + the 400 EO lines?

The FTTP is planned for Phase "BDUK Scot Government 15a". Anyone have any info on this, e.g. scope or dates?

Just had a thought as well, though it's a long shot.

If I was to order a second line, what are the chances that it would also have to be an EO line?

100%

They just use a spare pair on your existing drop cable I expect.