New Fibre connection, wondering about the stats.

Hey guys. I'm on day 1 of my new Fibre connection and so have been pouring over related stats to check how my line is doing. However, as you guys are way more knowledgeable at this than me, how is it doing, what can I expect out of it over the coming days? Coming from 8Mb ADSL so obsessed over this is not the word!

(The UAS was from me moving the modem since I'm aware of the 48hr period before DLM start kicking in for that kind of stuff, powered it off before removing the cable so it could do the whole 'dying gasp' thing if that makes a difference)

Threw up a speedtest as well to see 'real world' values, as it were: Here

xdslcmd info --stats
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 22235 Kbps, Downstream rate = 76444 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 78650 Kbps

Link Power State: L0
Mode: VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile: Profile 17a
TPS-TC: PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis: U:ON /D:ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 5.7 7.3
Attn(dB): 19.3 0.0
Pwr(dBm): 13.7 7.5
VDSL2 framing
Bearer 0
MSGc: 18 26
B: 239 237
M: 1 1
T: 23 42
R: 0 16
S: 0.0971 0.3781
L: 19768 5374
D: 1 1
I: 240 127
N: 240 254
Counters
Bearer 0
OHF: 15462136 2324618
OHFErr: 527 8
RS: 0 182303
RSCorr: 0 324
RSUnCorr: 0 0

Bearer 0
HEC: 3202 0
OCD: 96 0
LCD: 96 0
Total Cells: 3931720266 0
Data Cells: 75489296 0
Drop Cells: 0
Bit Errors: 0 0

ES: 289 8
SES: 0 0
UAS: 41 41
AS: 26005

Bearer 0
INP: 0.00 0.00
INPRein: 0.00 0.00
delay: 0 0
PER: 1.68 3.98
OR: 114.15 64.22
AgR: 78764.32 20063.54

Bitswap: 21206/21206 10/10

Total time = 7 hours 14 min 6 sec
FEC: 0 324
CRC: 527 8
ES: 289 8
SES: 0 0
UAS: 41 41
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Latest 15 minutes time = 14 min 6 sec
FEC: 0 9
CRC: 12 3
ES: 8 3
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 sec
FEC: 0 0
CRC: 12 0
ES: 9 0
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Latest 1 day time = 7 hours 14 min 6 sec
FEC: 0 324
CRC: 527 8
ES: 289 8
SES: 0 0
UAS: 41 41
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Previous 1 day time = 0 sec
FEC: 0 0
CRC: 0 0
ES: 0 0
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Since Link time = 7 hours 13 min 23 sec
FEC: 0 324
CRC: 527 8
ES: 289 8
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
#

xdslcmd info --pbParams
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 22216 Kbps, Downstream rate = 76444 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 78650 Kbps

Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (7,32) (871,1205) (1972,2782)
DS: (33,859) (1216,1961) (2793,3959)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (7,32) (871,1205) (1972,2782)
DS: (33,859) (1216,1961) (2793,3959)
VDSL Port Details Upstream Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate: 22216 kbps 76444 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power: 7.5 dBm 13.7 dBm
====================================================================================
VDSL Band Status U0 U1 U2 U3 U4 D1 D2 D3
Line Attenuation(dB): 4.9 28.6 43.3 N/A N/A 14.2 36.8 55.4
Signal Attenuation(dB): 4.9 27.9 42.2 N/A N/A 16.0 36.5 55.4
SNR Margin(dB): 6.8 7.3 7.3 N/A N/A 5.6 5.6 5.6
TX Power(dBm): 0.4 -13.4 6.5 N/A N/A 10.8 8.3 6.8
#

Edited by deleted (Wed 15-Jul-15 19:09:36)

As those stats only show bearer 0, you haven't had G.INP activated on your line. I think you are on an ECI cabinet, in which case this won't happen for a while yet.

As things stand, your line is running OK, at a hair under the 6 dB target SNR margin.
An ES rate of 289 in 7 hours is low enough to not worry DLM yet - but you will need to make sure that rate is kept over 24 hours, and then kept over many days.

I had a line that kept an ES rate of 600-800 per day without worry (that was with PN, using the "speed" settings, which would allow 2880 ES's per day). That ES rate happened with a CRC rate around 10x as high.

It is, however, a high enough rate for you to want to keep monitoring - if your SNR drops a little, and the error rate increases a little, you will be well advised to re-synchronise. You'll get a small drop in speed (and, hopefully, a drop in the error rate) - but that is much easier to swallow than a DLM intervention.

In reply to a post by WWWombat:

As those stats only show bearer 0, you haven't had G.INP activated on your line. I think you are on an ECI cabinet, in which case this won't happen for a while yet.

As things stand, your line is running OK, at a hair under the 6 dB target SNR margin.
An ES rate of 289 in 7 hours is low enough to not worry DLM yet - but you will need to make sure that rate is kept over 24 hours, and then kept over many days.

I had a line that kept an ES rate of 600-800 per day without worry (that was with PN, using the "speed" settings, which would allow 2880 ES's per day). That ES rate happened with a CRC rate around 10x as high.

It is, however, a high enough rate for you to want to keep monitoring - if your SNR drops a little, and the error rate increases a little, you will be well advised to re-synchronise. You'll get a small drop in speed (and, hopefully, a drop in the error rate) - but that is much easier to swallow than a DLM intervention.

Hi. Nope, It's the other cab, checked this before I got infinity. Afaik, G.INP is a different form of interleaving, and since I don't have that activated (yet, or at all), it stands to reason that it wouldn't be active?

As for now,

Still monitoring the lines, for some reason after 8PM the CRC errors got much higher (spikes of 100 or so every few minutes). DSL Uptime of 12 hours and 11,364 total CRC errors (most of them coming from 8PM onwards since earlier in the day it was only a few per every few mins).

Guessing it's to do with interference outside the house, like perhaps even the weather changing with the time of day since VDSL is supposedly so sensitive. Not liking it though, considering it might trigger interleaving which will make my pings [censored] vs ADSL.

However, that being said, LOS alarm errors are still strictly 0. CRCs have never been high enough to actually hurt the connection. Downlink is still 70+ so within margins of what I posted earlier.

Updated Stats:

xdslcmd info --stats
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 22497 Kbps, Downstream rate = 76684 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 78650 Kbps

Link Power State: L0
Mode: VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile: Profile 17a
TPS-TC: PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis: U:ON /D:ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 5.8 7.4
Attn(dB): 19.3 0.0
Pwr(dBm): 13.7 7.5
VDSL2 framing
Bearer 0
MSGc: 18 26
B: 239 237
M: 1 1
T: 23 42
R: 0 16
S: 0.0971 0.3781
L: 19768 5374
D: 1 1
I: 240 127
N: 240 254
Counters
Bearer 0
OHF: 26021122 2572788
OHFErr: 11548 9
RS: 0 3386626
RSCorr: 0 330
RSUnCorr: 0 0

Bearer 0
HEC: 5777 0
OCD: 189 0
LCD: 189 0
Total Cells: 2321724754 0
Data Cells: 121377580 0
Drop Cells: 0
Bit Errors: 0 0

xdslcmd info --pbParams
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 22494 Kbps, Downstream rate = 76684 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 78650 Kbps

Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (7,32) (871,1205) (1972,2782)
DS: (33,859) (1216,1961) (2793,3959)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (7,32) (871,1205) (1972,2782)
DS: (33,859) (1216,1961) (2793,3959)
VDSL Port Details Upstream Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate: 22494 kbps 76684 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power: 7.5 dBm 13.7 dBm
====================================================================================
VDSL Band Status U0 U1 U2 U3 U4 D1 D2 D3
Line Attenuation(dB): 4.9 28.6 43.3 N/A N/A 14.2 36.8 55.4
Signal Attenuation(dB): 4.9 27.9 42.1 N/A N/A 16.0 36.5 55.4
SNR Margin(dB): 7.3 7.5 7.4 N/A N/A 5.5 5.6 5.6
TX Power(dBm): 0.4 -13.4 6.5 N/A N/A 10.8 8.3 6.8
#

In reply to a post by nostos156:

what can I expect out of it over the coming days?

I should add that, longer term, you should probably expect crosstalk to have a gradual effect over time, and speeds to drop somewhat.

From attenuation, your line looks to be around 500m long.

Over 2 years, the "attainable" speed on my 400m line went from 88Mbps to 78Mbps, which was all from crosstalk. DLM intervened on a couple of occasions, taking another 6Mbps, but that was restored each time.

Hi,

Accidentally didn't post all of the actual updated stats:

xdslcmd info --stats
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 22451 Kbps, Downstream rate = 76480 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 78650 Kbps

Link Power State: L0
Mode: VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile: Profile 17a
TPS-TC: PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis: U:ON /D:ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 5.7 7.4
Attn(dB): 19.3 0.0
Pwr(dBm): 13.7 7.5
VDSL2 framing
Bearer 0
MSGc: 18 26
B: 239 237
M: 1 1
T: 23 42
R: 0 16
S: 0.0971 0.3781
L: 19768 5374
D: 1 1
I: 240 127
N: 240 254
Counters
Bearer 0
OHF: 26128138 2618152
OHFErr: 11571 9
RS: 0 996122
RSCorr: 0 330
RSUnCorr: 0 0

Bearer 0
HEC: 5799 0
OCD: 190 0
LCD: 190 0
Total Cells: 2348937311 0
Data Cells: 122018645 0
Drop Cells: 0
Bit Errors: 0 0

ES: 797 9
SES: 21 0
UAS: 41 41
AS: 43945

Bearer 0
INP: 0.00 0.00
INPRein: 0.00 0.00
delay: 0 0
PER: 1.68 3.98
OR: 114.15 64.22
AgR: 78764.32 20063.54

Bitswap: 35629/35630 39/39

Total time = 12 hours 13 min 6 sec
FEC: 0 330
CRC: 11571 9
ES: 797 9
SES: 21 0
UAS: 41 41
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Latest 15 minutes time = 13 min 6 sec
FEC: 0 0
CRC: 216 0
ES: 32 0
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 sec
FEC: 0 0
CRC: 403 0
ES: 63 0
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Latest 1 day time = 12 hours 13 min 6 sec
FEC: 0 330
CRC: 11571 9
ES: 797 9
SES: 21 0
UAS: 41 41
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Previous 1 day time = 0 sec
FEC: 0 0
CRC: 0 0
ES: 0 0
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Since Link time = 12 hours 12 min 25 sec
FEC: 0 330
CRC: 11571 9
ES: 797 9
SES: 21 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
#

My main concern is the level of errors and if they are acceptable because the line can handle them without breaking or losing speed.

As I hear, LOS errors are the serious ones that DLM will hammer you for, but I don't know what is a 'good' CRC error rate for VDSL, since on ADSL I was a solid 0 forever, lol.

Also, from a quick calculation, if I did it right, currently for the packets I received, 0.28% need to be retransmitted due to CRC errors.

Acceptable or unusually noisy line?

In reply to a post by nostos156:

Hi. Nope, It's the other cab, checked this before I got infinity. Afaik, G.INP is a different form of interleaving, and since I don't have that activated (yet, or at all), it stands to reason that it wouldn't be active?

OK. That would be the Huawei, then.

G.INP is a re-transmission mechanism, used in place of the severe FEC+interleaving put in place by a full, old-style, DLM intervention.

When G.INP is active, it *also* makes use of some amount of both FEC and interleaving ... but where the old-style settings would steal 8ms latency and 10-15% of bandwidth, the new-style (alongside G.INP) only steals around 0.2ms latency and 5% of bandwidth.

BT's current intention appears to be that G.INP starts out inactive on a new line, or after a DLM reset. After 2 days, it is likely to be turned on downstream - because, by default, it is only helpful.

However, BT's cock-up when rolling out G.INP originally means they have subsequently halted the rollout, and re-thought their plans. Your line might not go through G.INP activation for a while.

Still monitoring the lines, for some reason after 8PM the CRC errors got much higher (spikes of 100 or so every few minutes). DSL Uptime of 12 hours and 11,364 total CRC errors (most of them coming from 8PM onwards since earlier in the day it was only a few per every few mins).

The ES figure is much more important than CRC, as far as DLM is concerned. If you are getting spikes of CRC, then hopefully the ES rate isn't affected as badly.

Guessing it's to do with interference outside the house, like perhaps even the weather changing with the time of day since VDSL is supposedly so sensitive. Not liking it though, considering it might trigger interleaving which will make my pings [censored] vs ADSL.

If your cabinet/line is eligible for a G.INP setting, then crossing an error threshold is more likely to just turn on G.INP as a first step. You probably wouldn't notice that...

However, that being said, LOS alarm errors are still strictly 0. CRCs have never been high enough to actually hurt the connection.

DLM is more sensitive (to ES's, though). It is really configured under the assumption that you want broadcast quality to streamed video - which is hurt by bursts of CRC errors.

Updated Stats:

ES rate is by far the most interesting thing.

Hrm, as for what you said about G.INP, I'll see what happens on day 3 then, when its likely to turn on a DRM starts inspecting the line.

I remember reading about that cock-up of a rollout, but I heard they'd fixed the issues back in April or so. The cab was only recently constructed afaik. It's all new - I'm probably the only customer using it at the moment! (sweet bliss)

As you can see the comparison from before the CRC started spiking and after, can you tell me what is interesting about the ES rate? Good, bad?

Edited by deleted (Thu 16-Jul-15 00:25:45)

Forgot to mention as well, my line used to be EO, and they built the cab to fix that. Afaik, only Hauwei cabs are involved in that type, so definitely is that model.

In reply to a post by nostos156:

Also, from a quick calculation, if I did it right, currently for the packets I received, 0.28% need to be retransmitted due to CRC errors.

CRC checks are made on all blocks transferred, even if there is no user data. Unless you keep the link 100% utilised, you're probably running at a much lower packet loss rate.

Acceptable or unusually noisy line?

My line ran happily at 600-800 ES/day, with 6,000-8,000 CRC per day. DLM intervened twice, on two occasions of spikes, one of which was a faulty line.

That kind of level was acceptable under the old DLM regime. If G.INP was applied instead of old-style FEC+interleaving, I'd almost certainly find it perfectly acceptable.

Your line is now running at around twice that rate, which would worry me slightly. However, G.INP intervention would probably make it OK.

I should say that it would worry me *only* because of the risk of DLM intervention. BT wouldn't consider it to be too noisy ... because DLM intervention would likely fix things.

In reply to a post by WWWombat:

In reply to a post by nostos156:

Also, from a quick calculation, if I did it right, currently for the packets I received, 0.28% need to be retransmitted due to CRC errors.

CRC checks are made on all blocks transferred, even if there is no user data. Unless you keep the link 100% utilised, you're probably running at a much lower packet loss rate.

Acceptable or unusually noisy line?

My line ran happily at 600-800 ES/day, with 6,000-8,000 CRC per day. DLM intervened twice, on two occasions of spikes, one of which was a faulty line.

That kind of level was acceptable under the old DLM regime. If G.INP was applied instead of old-style FEC+interleaving, I'd almost certainly find it perfectly acceptable.

Your line is now running at around twice that rate, which would worry me slightly. However, G.INP intervention would probably make it OK.

I should say that it would worry me *only* because of the risk of DLM intervention. BT wouldn't consider it to be too noisy ... because DLM intervention would likely fix things.

Well, I can report that the spikes seem to have gone down again since midnight. Don't know why but 8-12 seems to be a particularly noisy time, guessing it must be outside related and out of my control there. SNR Margin is back to skipping between 5.8/9 instead of lower.

My ES per hour in DSLstats as of right now is about 38. Too scared to look at the daily averages since they'll be massively skewed by that spike right now.

If ES means errored seconds then here is a graph I pulled from the website stats too:

http://i.imgur.com/oEUudcl.png

Edited by deleted (Thu 16-Jul-15 00:34:58)

In reply to a post by nostos156:

I remember reading about that cock-up of a rollout, but I heard they'd fixed the issues back in April or so. The cab was only recently constructed afaik.

There was a 3 month rollout before they noticed the problem. At that point, they halted testing on ECI cabinets, and stopped any new G.INP profile changes on Huawei cabinets, including new lines and new cabinets.

Once they figured a fix, they spent a month testing with a trial group. Then they started a new rollout, likely to take 2-3 months to go through all lines.

IIRC, they're about half way through rolling out the fix. So it might still take a while to happen on your line.

It's all new - I'm probably the only customer using it at the moment! (sweet bliss)

That's great for now. But don't obsess about changes caused by new customers. It *will* happen, and there likely isn't a thing you can do about it, unless your speed drops 25-30% in a week, or you get real, testable, line faults.

As you can see the comparison from before the CRC started spiking and after, can you tell me what is interesting about the ES rate? Good, bad?

Edging towards a worry - but it depends whether your ISP has ES thresholds set at 1440 per day, or 2880 per day.

Fingers crossed that the worst that happens is activation of G.INP anyway.

ISP is BT, so depends what they consider acceptable.

In reply to a post by nostos156:

Well, I can report that the spikes seem to have gone down again since midnight. Don't know why but 8-12 seems to be a particularly noisy time, guessing it must be outside related and out of my control there. SNR Margin is back to skipping between 5.8/9 instead of lower.

Any fluorescent tubes? Including the cheap "low power" ones?

My ES per hour in DSLstats as of right now is about 38. Too scared to look at the daily averages since they'll be massively skewed by that spike right now.

If ES means errored seconds then here is a graph I pulled from the website stats too:

http://i.imgur.com/oEUudcl.png

That kind of rate is manageable.

That graph has a tick-box that lets you see the value accumulating over a 24-hour period. When viewing multiple days, it helps build a good picture.

In reply to a post by nostos156:

Hrm, as for what you said about G.INP, I'll see what happens on day 3 then, when its likely to turn on a DRM starts inspecting the line.

Uh uh . The actual position is:-

DLM constantly manages lines to maintain a target link quality (speed and stability). It does this for as long as the product exists.
At provision, the line is put on �wide open� VDSL2 line profiles allowing the upstream and downstream line speeds to run at the upper limit of the product option selected.
On the first day of operation, DLM will intervene if severe instability is detected. Otherwise, DLM will wait until the day after provision before deciding if it must intervene, provided that the line has been trained up for at least 15 minutes during the preceding day.

In reply to a post by nostos156:

ISP is BT, so depends what they consider acceptable.

According to Kitz, BT may be using the "speed" profile, like Plusnet.

http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/DLM.htm#dlm_stability_level

There are actually fluorescent tubes used down in the basement. They were on for a while after 8 though, after the errors started. However I'll test tomorrow when the line is normally 'good' and see what happens.

Thanks for that, hopefully the rate stays like that, then.

As for DLM, ah. I went by what a PlusNet support employee mentioned (two day period in which DLM won't take action so you can reroute cables if need be). Ah well.

If BT are using the speed profile, then what is their ES error limit, 2880?

That's what it would be under old-style rules.

It might take something different to trigger G.INP activation now - the problem is in trying to gather evidence about how an undocumented (and changing) system works.

Right, I see.

So basically, if the stats (and error spike times) stay relatively stable, I should be fine with my current estimated 1914 ES?

If G.INP turns on because of that, I shouldn't notice it at all, and under the old rules DLM would let it slide?

So, so far, so good? Don't freak yet?

Definitely don't freak.

In reply to a post by nostos156:

So basically, if the stats (and error spike times) stay relatively stable, I should be fine with my current estimated 1914 ES?

Yup.

If that was going to turn into a day-in, day-out value, I'd be seeking improvements. 1900 ES doesn't leave much leeway for those off-days with a few extra spikes.

If G.INP turns on because of that, I shouldn't notice it at all, and under the old rules DLM would let it slide?

Yup.

So, so far, so good? Don't freak yet?

No freaking, but watchfulness.

And, truth be told, you probably only need to worry about old-style DLM if you are a gamer, and desperately need every bit of latency. Intervention with a 60Mbps line isn't exactly a problem, otherwise.

Edited by deleted (Thu 16-Jul-15 01:02:37)

Yeah, I'm a gamer. BT routing up where I am (Aberdeen) is already a complete pain. Anything to not make the pings worse is welcomed!

And yeah, I'm expecting it to be a spike every 8-12. However, as nothing in the house (except those lights I'll test tomorrow afternoon) was turning on and off between those times I can't think of it being anything else except outside interference on the lines which I can't do diddly squat about. So I don't know how I'd be able to seek improvements there, to be honest.

Also as I typed that, CRCs spiked again at 1am, not as bad as before but god dammit.

Your stats are almost identical to mine and my speeds have settled at:

Attenuation (dB) 19.4 0.0
Output Power (dBm) 12.7 7.5
Attainable Rate (Kbps) 61263 16495
Rate (Kbps) 61263 16603

In reply to a post by WelshWArrior:

Your stats are almost identical to mine and my speeds have settled at:

Attenuation (dB) 19.4 0.0
Output Power (dBm) 12.7 7.5
Attainable Rate (Kbps) 61263 16495
Rate (Kbps) 61263 16603

Seems a bit weird then, if I'm at the point where DLM won't even do anything to me right now. That, or you've got a massive amount of crosstalk.

Without posting stats again for now, the line was very quiet all night/now and the ES average for 24 hours has gone back down to 1402 - just a nose hair under the 'standard' DLM limt which BT thankfully doesn't seem to have until 2880.

Edited by deleted (Thu 16-Jul-15 13:56:48)

hahaha my neighbours either side of me are both on 72-76Mbps but mine is low and BT won't do anything about it as it is within the estimate for the line

In reply to a post by WelshWArrior:

hahaha my neighbours either side of me are both on 72-76Mbps but mine is low and BT won't do anything about it as it is within the estimate for the line

That seems strange, their line attenuations should roughly be about the same and I think I ruled out internal wiring being the cause of my errors (apart from those lights which I'll need to see about)

That's what I initially thought but my estate was built in 3 stages over several years and I've been told that, even though we're on the same cab, our lines may go different routes before they get to our houses. This is highly unlikely in my opinion as the 3 houses were built in the same year!

BT basically said there's nothing we can do as the initial line noise has mysteriously disappeared so they'll do nothing.

In reply to a post by WelshWArrior:

That's what I initially thought but my estate was built in 3 stages over several years and I've been told that, even though we're on the same cab, our lines may go different routes before they get to our houses. This is highly unlikely in my opinion as the 3 houses were built in the same year!

BT basically said there's nothing we can do as the initial line noise has mysteriously disappeared so they'll do nothing.

Yeah, something seems off there, especially if your ES errors and so on are within limits - DLM is supposed to turn off if your line stabilizes again if it did turn on initially.

DLM has never had to kick in as errors have always been low. I last did a restart 3 days ago and have only had 945 errored seconds up til now.

Unfortunately, I think it's one of those things I'll have to live with.

In reply to a post by WelshWArrior:

DLM has never had to kick in as errors have always been low. I last did a restart 3 days ago and have only had 945 errored seconds up til now.

Unfortunately, I think it's one of those things I'll have to live with.

Looks like it, seeing as my per day errors are more than that and it doesn't look like DLM will be kicking in if it stays this way. All very strange, as I thought it was DLM that would lower your profile - unless your speeds were never quite as high as your neighbours to begin with.

Edited by deleted (Thu 16-Jul-15 15:14:40)

Went down into the basement and turned in the fluorescent lights, being there for about 10 minutes.

CRC spike of about 110 for about 3-4 mins before it settled down, so it seems turning those lights on (second test of a minute spiked it to 20) spikes it initially and then it stabilizes. Interesting.

Don't think it's the cause completely but worth nothing. Modem uptime ES error average is sitting at 1266 right now.

1 day time ended up at 1353. If BT is on the 2880 limit then it seems I'm pretty clear for now, then?

Without reading every post in the thread, I will make one comment.

You have a VERY quiet line with very little noise and hence 76Mbps on 19 dB attenuation. Just be prepared for that to drop a little as others are connected.

Good to know! I did some DIY rewiring to hopefully prevent noise before I got infinity - glad to see it is paying off! Waiting to see if the errors at 9pm come back and if so then I'll see if I can find the source, if its anything internal.

A speed test done before I went to bed last night (so around 6am, whoops) gave me this: So far, so good.


Updated stats as its been over 30 hours now:

xdslcmd info --stats
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 22228 Kbps, Downstream rate = 77096 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 78650 Kbps

Link Power State: L0
Mode: VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile: Profile 17a
TPS-TC: PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis: U:ON /D:ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 5.9 7.3
Attn(dB): 19.3 0.0
Pwr(dBm): 13.7 7.5
VDSL2 framing
Bearer 0
MSGc: 18 26
B: 239 237
M: 1 1
T: 23 42
R: 0 16
S: 0.0971 0.3781
L: 19768 5374
D: 1 1
I: 240 127
N: 240 254
Counters
Bearer 0
OHF: 66110190 2653168
OHFErr: 16732 24
RS: 0 3674116
RSCorr: 0 371
RSUnCorr: 0 0

Bearer 0
HEC: 13158 0
OCD: 447 0
LCD: 447 0
Total Cells: 3925764415 0
Data Cells: 181685239 0
Drop Cells: 0
Bit Errors: 0 0

ES: 1626 19
SES: 27 0
UAS: 41 41
AS: 111195

Bearer 0
INP: 0.00 0.00
INPRein: 0.00 0.00
delay: 0 0
PER: 1.68 3.98
OR: 114.15 64.22
AgR: 78764.32 20063.54

Bitswap: 90327/90327 85/85

Total time = 1 days 6 hours 53 min 56 sec
FEC: 0 371
CRC: 16732 24
ES: 1626 19
SES: 27 0
UAS: 41 41
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Latest 15 minutes time = 8 min 56 sec
FEC: 0 0
CRC: 9 0
ES: 4 0
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 sec
FEC: 0 0
CRC: 7 0
ES: 6 0
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Latest 1 day time = 6 hours 53 min 56 sec
FEC: 0 18
CRC: 665 5
ES: 273 5
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Previous 1 day time = 24 hours 0 sec
FEC: 0 353
CRC: 16067 19
ES: 1353 14
SES: 27 0
UAS: 41 41
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Since Link time = 1 days 6 hours 53 min 13 sec
FEC: 0 371
CRC: 16732 24
ES: 1626 19
SES: 27 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
#

xdslcmd info --pbParams
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 22216 Kbps, Downstream rate = 77096 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 78650 Kbps

Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (7,32) (871,1205) (1972,2782)
DS: (33,859) (1216,1961) (2793,3959)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (7,32) (871,1205) (1972,2782)
DS: (33,859) (1216,1961) (2793,3959)
VDSL Port Details Upstream Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate: 22216 kbps 77096 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power: 7.5 dBm 13.7 dBm
====================================================================================
VDSL Band Status U0 U1 U2 U3 U4 D1 D2 D3
Line Attenuation(dB): 4.9 28.6 43.3 N/A N/A 14.2 36.8 55.4
Signal Attenuation(dB): 4.9 28.1 42.3 N/A N/A 16.0 36.5 55.4
SNR Margin(dB): 7.6 7.3 7.3 N/A N/A 5.7 5.6 5.7
TX Power(dBm): 0.4 -13.4 6.5 N/A N/A 10.8 8.3 6.8
#

The above poster is correct.

For a comparison, we're on a 23dB attenuation and getting around 35Mbps. We were the first line on the cabinet and this is a very quiet semi-rural area so I would be very happy if I was you

An update:

at 20:45 right on cue, errors started spiking again. Storage heating is off, water immersion heating is off, no lights either.

Looks like one of the neighbours must have some noisy ass equipment that is timed to run from 9ish-midnight. Can't figure out anything else that would be so 'on time' like that.
What a pain!

Welp, [censored] it.

Every day since the errors have been steadily increasing (or lasting slightly longer, from 9-12 to 1am to 2am to 3) and then today (max was still 1800 ES per day) at about 7pm it just went crazy and shot out 1400 ES in that single hour.

Currently sitting at 2800... yeah I'm screwed. Gonna have to have a moan at BT about this now, it is far too inconsistent and I've completely eliminated everything internal that could cause it - they've all been on when the line is dead silent during the day.

If DLM is going to kick in within 5 days then I don't have hope of DLM being forgiving over time, that's for sure - and with no G.INP I'm not going to take a big hit in latency because of it.

Fun graph picture of the past few days

xdslcmd info --stats
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 21966 Kbps, Downstream rate = 76208 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 78650 Kbps

Link Power State: L0
Mode: VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile: Profile 17a
TPS-TC: PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis: U:ON /D:ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 5.6 7.1
Attn(dB): 19.3 0.0
Pwr(dBm): 13.7 7.5
VDSL2 framing
Bearer 0
MSGc: 18 26
B: 239 237
M: 1 1
T: 23 42
R: 0 16
S: 0.0971 0.3781
L: 19768 5374
D: 1 1
I: 240 127
N: 240 254
Counters
Bearer 0
OHF: 283537901 1799306
OHFErr: 118101 84
RS: 0 2388804
RSCorr: 0 577
RSUnCorr: 0 0

Bearer 0
HEC: 72051 0
OCD: 2303 0
LCD: 2303 0
Total Cells: 3379371268 0
Data Cells: 519710420 0
Drop Cells: 0
Bit Errors: 0 0

ES: 11167 74
SES: 168 0
UAS: 41 41
AS: 476904

Bearer 0
INP: 0.00 0.00
INPRein: 0.00 0.00
delay: 0 0
PER: 1.68 3.98
OR: 114.15 64.22
AgR: 78764.32 20063.54

Bitswap: 390606/390617 575/575

Total time = 1 days 12 hours 29 min 5 sec
FEC: 0 577
CRC: 118101 84
ES: 11167 74
SES: 168 0
UAS: 41 41
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Latest 15 minutes time = 14 min 5 sec
FEC: 0 0
CRC: 1068 0
ES: 18 0
SES: 2 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 sec
FEC: 0 0
CRC: 1988 0
ES: 140 0
SES: 3 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Latest 1 day time = 12 hours 29 min 5 sec
FEC: 0 80
CRC: 30055 7
ES: 2834 6
SES: 34 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Previous 1 day time = 24 hours 0 sec
FEC: 0 12
CRC: 19503 13
ES: 1839 12
SES: 29 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Since Link time = 5 days 12 hours 28 min 23 sec
FEC: 0 577
CRC: 118101 84
ES: 11167 74
SES: 168 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
#

xdslcmd info --pbParams
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 21966 Kbps, Downstream rate = 76208 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 78650 Kbps

Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (7,32) (871,1205) (1972,2782)
DS: (33,859) (1216,1961) (2793,3959)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (7,32) (871,1205) (1972,2782)
DS: (33,859) (1216,1961) (2793,3959)
VDSL Port Details Upstream Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate: 21966 kbps 76208 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power: 7.5 dBm 13.7 dBm
====================================================================================
VDSL Band Status U0 U1 U2 U3 U4 D1 D2 D3
Line Attenuation(dB): 4.9 28.6 43.3 N/A N/A 14.2 36.8 55.4
Signal Attenuation(dB): 4.9 28.2 42.4 N/A N/A 16.0 36.5 55.4
SNR Margin(dB): 7.0 7.1 7.1 N/A N/A 5.4 5.4 5.4
TX Power(dBm): 0.4 -13.4 6.5 N/A N/A 10.8 8.3 6.8
#