Which router for 1gbps fibre?

So, I have hyperoptic going in tomorrow and I want to take that as a cue to upgrade my aging Asus N66U router for something AC.

House consists of a fair few devices - Gaming PC, iMac, Macbook, MBP, 2xiPhone, iPad, Apple TV, Chromecast, Xbox One, Smart TV and a few I've probably not thought of.

I believe the iMac and laptops being 2015 models support 4x4 AC?

Due to the location of the Hyperoptic socket, it's possible I may not be able to have a wired connection anymore, so I want to make sure I do it right.

The best I've come up with is the RT-AC87U which does things like OpenVPN server and traffic shaping which are essential to me.

But I really have no idea of what else I should be considering, if anything?

Hyperoptic provide a router already with the service, is that you are wanting to add something faster for handling the wireless side only.

Adding another router after the Hyperoptic router creates a double NAT scenario which is not ideal, but would work, ideally you want to ensure any wireless add-ons are able to operate in an access point mode (the Asus N66U can do this)

One big issue if Ethernet is totally ruled out is that the fastest Wi-Fi may not penetrate modern insulated doors and walls very well.

The Netgear Nighthawk X6 at over £200 is one of the fastest ones out at the moment, but not sure if it has a direct access point mode built in, or whether you need to rig it up (which is possible with any router)

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

Hyperoptic provide a router already with the service, is that you are wanting to add something faster for handling the wireless side only.

Adding another router after the Hyperoptic router creates a double NAT scenario which is not ideal, but would work, ideally you want to ensure any wireless add-ons are able to operate in an access point mode (the Asus N66U can do this)

One big issue if Ethernet is totally ruled out is that the fastest Wi-Fi may not penetrate modern insulated doors and walls very well.

The Netgear Nighthawk X6 at over £200 is one of the fastest ones out at the moment, but not sure if it has a direct access point mode built in, or whether you need to rig it up (which is possible with any router)

I intend to replace the Hyperoptic router, which their knowledge base suggests is absolutely fine.

Fortunately there's not a big distance between my hallway where the installation guide suggests they'll want to install the faceplate and my living room where the majority of devices reside.

Do not buy the RT-AC87U you will not enjoy the experience.

I had 4 one after the other , all of which failed to work properly, they have well documented issues.

The Quantenna WiFi drivers are dire.

Look at the AC3200 , I got a refund on the 87U ( the supplier I used has now stopped shipping them) and upgraded to the AC3200 , it is awesome and has worked flawlessly.

-1 for the Asus RT-AC87R

I had one and yes the Quantenna chipset is pants, random disconnections on 5ghz, router overheats and generally not had a great experience. That said, you should definitely buy a Mu-Mimo router for best wifi speeds, just not the AC87R. If your router MUST be an Asus then wait for a bit as the Asus AC88 should be released shortly, this is a Mu-Mimo router and uses twin broadcom chipsets which should be fine. Otherwise i'd highly recommend the Linksys EA8500 (AC2600) this is a brilliant Mu-Mimo router, gives me 75/18 meg on all our pc's/laptops anywhere in the house on wifi.

Edited by deleted (Thu 05-Nov-15 09:14:42)

99% sure both the 2015 iMac and MBP are 802.11ac 3x3, the iPhone 6S is 2x2. Not aware of any 4x4 devices, the aim of 4x4 is more MU-MIMO, which there is not yet wide support for anyway.

No router you buy is going to give you an actual gigabit of throughput over wifi in anything but laboratory conditions, so you will be losing some speed from the maximum hyperoptic can provide you if you do not use ethernet.

Especially as even if some of your devices are 3x3 and support MU-MIMO, a single old device with 802.11ac 1x1 and no MU-MIMO support will kill your throughput (as even the theoretical maximum speed for that device using the whole channel is 433mbps).

Broadband World Forum was interesting, as kit manufacturers saying that even for apartments to get the best Wi-Fi speeds then yes additional access points needed

Time for builders to put in as standard some basic Ethernet from utility cupboards to at least behind the TV

Thanks for the heads up, guys.

It doesn't have to be Asus, I just need something that is feature complete in terms of traffic monitoring and VPN server.

I chose Asus because I have an N66U now, and I know it does what I need - that said, the Wireless has been less than reliable on that, too.

I did originally look at the AC3200 but most reviews suggested that a 4x4 router would give me higher speeds across fewer devices as opposed to slightly lower speeds across more devices.

Perhaps I'll wait for the install and see what happens. If it turns out I can wire my PC, iMac and server, I'll be a whole lot less fussy about outright speeds.

Everything else would be fine with <100mbps.

Edited by mikehiow (Thu 05-Nov-15 09:50:41)

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

Broadband World Forum was interesting, as kit manufacturers saying that even for apartments to get the best Wi-Fi speeds then yes additional access points needed

Time for builders to put in as standard some basic Ethernet from utility cupboards to at least behind the TV

I wonder what they might use? Alarm wire is not quite up to modern Ethernet standard although it has one advantage over "normal" telephone cable in that it has 8 cores compared to 4 or 6!


Try persuading domestic architects and builders to put any type of future proofing in, even if just 16mm plastic conduit for users to add their own wires, or risers between floors. It is near on impossible!

I did all my own and kept getting the questions - what do you need that for, why all the sockets, what ... , why ... , and so on.

And if you use 80mhz channels for the best 802.11ac throughput, there are only 2 non-overlapping 5ghz channels allowed for use indoors, and one of these is DFS and can be killed if radar or other use is detected.

Using 40mhz channels suddenly means 1x1 antenna devices are down to 216mbits theoretical maximum, and 2x2 down to 433mbit theoretical maximum. In terms of real world throughput you'd be having a good day if you got half of this.

If there is any overlap with neighbours, it's going to be worse.

If we were talking a 100mbit connection, yeah, you can probably with a decent wireless setup make full utilisation of it.

A gigabit connection? Go ethernet or you will never ever use it to it's potential.

Fastest phone in October 2015 on our tester was iPhone6 http://tbb.st/1444408438129891155
Fastest tablet in October 2015 was an iPad http://tbb.st/1443867500291819555

Of course cannot tell what routers they are using unfortunately

So I had the socket installed today, given the entry point to the flat, it was quite easy to get the socket to where my existing ADSL router is connected and the installer was happy to oblige, so that's a bonus - all the usual stuff can remain wired!

I've ordered an AC3200 - a bit of a sting paying £200 for a router, but I figure that half of my life (work and personal) revolves around my internet connection so it pays to get something that'll keep up!

In reply to a post by mikehiow:

I've ordered an AC3200 - a bit of a sting paying £200 for a router, but I figure that half of my life (work and personal) revolves around my internet connection so it pays to get something that'll keep up!

Since you've already ordered and you need a device in the near future this isn't much help, but i'm looking at the Turris Omnia for my next router.

It out-classes the AC3200 (and pretty much everything that isn't an x86 PC running something like pfSense) in every way. It's being created by the non-profit in charge of the Czech domain and several open-source projects (and is described here in a talk they recently gave at the OpenWrt summit).

That's very cool!

I always used to use pfSense as a router running in an ESXi VM on my home server, I'm not sure why I stopped running that, but I haven't missed it to be honest.

These days, I just want to be able to see what's using what and be able to VPN into home, the rest should "just work"

So, my service finally went live today and the AC3200 arrived.

First things first - Wired, I max out at around 250mbps on my N66U (What the hell?!) and around 750mbps on the Hyperoptic router.

The Asus AC3200 has seen a max of well over 900mbps up and down, here's the last TBB test I did:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Wireless, I'm getting around 400mbps on my Macbook a few metres away and around 200mbps on my mobile devices.

What truly is impressive is the Wireless speeds I've been seeing on my iMac (2015 retina) 500-600mbps up and down.
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Edited by mikehiow (Sat 07-Nov-15 00:59:48)

In reply to a post by mikehiow:

So, my service finally went live today and the AC3200 arrived.

First things first - Wired, I max out at around 250mbps on my N66U (What the hell?!) and around 750mbps on the Hyperoptic router.

The Asus AC3200 has seen a max of well over 900mbps up and down, here's the last TBB test I did:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Wireless, I'm getting around 400mbps on my Macbook a few metres away and around 200mbps on my mobile devices.

What truly is impressive is the Wireless speeds I've been seeing on my iMac (2015 retina) 500-600mbps up and down.
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...

Sounds about right to me. Only the very top-end routers are going to cope with Gigabit speeds and not with stuff like VPNs, QoS enabled or even using the WiFi. All those things steal CPU cycles from the routing side.

Looking over the pfSense forums, people are building Intel i3 PCs to handle Gigabit routing with those sorts of services.

As for 802.11ac speeds. I have seen real-world speeds of 305Mbit using on a 1x1 Intel card 80Mhz channel width (433Mbit link rate) when copying files form my NAS to my laptop. So I would not be surprised to see close to 900Mbit in close range at 3x3.

Unfortunately, there are very few 3x3 devices out there. But then the point of Gigabit would be more to not ever slow any individual device below "holy [censored]" speeds, not really to achieve a Gigabit on a single device, especially not over WiFi.

I really wouldn't run VPN or QoS on a consumer router at all though, those things will drag the routing speed right down.

Have you tried using the AC3200 JUST for WiFi and the Hyperoptic router JUST for routing? You may get better speeds. If you can't get Gigabit at least wired using their router, I would be rather annoyed.

Edited by alexatkin (Sat 07-Nov-15 08:13:34)