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Standard User ionic
(fountain of knowledge) Wed 04-Jul-18 10:01:22
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G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[link to this post]
 
Does anyone have an knowledge / experience of how quickly Openreach are expanding G.Fast coverage in areas they have announced?

e.g. Southampton is now advertised as having availability but it appears to be confined to one small district, possibly just one or two cabinets.
Standard User AndyPandy
(fountain of knowledge) Wed 04-Jul-18 12:31:42
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ionic] [link to this post]
 
The pods appear very quickly around the areas in my experience, but don't get too excited if you don't live within a stone's throw of it.

My cab is enabled, but only properties within 100m as the crow flies can get it. Not the 300m that's often thrown around.


ZeN Unlimited Fibre 2
Fritz!Box 3390
Standard User candlerb
(regular) Wed 04-Jul-18 12:40:26
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: AndyPandy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by AndyPandy:
The pods appear very quickly around the areas in my experience, but don't get too excited if you don't live within a stone's throw of it.

My cab is enabled, but only properties within 100m as the crow flies can get it. Not the 300m that's often thrown around.


It would be 300m of copper line. The length of the copper loop can be much longer than the radial distance (as the crow flies).


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Standard User j0hn83
(experienced) Wed 04-Jul-18 14:18:45
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: AndyPandy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by AndyPandy:
My cab is enabled, but only properties within 100m as the crow flies can get it. Not the 300m that's often thrown around.


I don't know anyone who's been claiming 300m as the crow flies though.
Line lengths can be much longer than that.
Neighbouring properties line lengths can also vary quite a bit too as they go in opposite directions to different DP's.

Line lengths of about 250-300m have been getting pretty good results.

I think it's totally the wrong tech and they should have ripped up the ECI cabinets, replaced them with Huawei and rolled out VDSL2 Profile 35b.

Isle of Man using this perfectly.
Just seen a VDSL2 Profile 17a (as used by OpenReach in UK) with working vectoring get upgraded at the flick of a switch to profile 35b with working vectoring.

https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,20343.msg37...

It roughly doubles the speed and reach of profile 17a and vectoring works across both. It would help everyone on the cabinet not just those already getting full sync.

Why OpenReach picked G.Farce I'll never know.
It does seem to be wiring ok and reaching the small pool they targeted though.

Edited by j0hn83 (Wed 04-Jul-18 14:19:55)

Standard User camieabz
(sensei) Wed 04-Jul-18 15:55:27
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
Easier for suppliers and governments to push up average speeds than deal with specific problems.
Standard User Ignitionnet
(knowledge is power) Wed 04-Jul-18 17:20:12
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: camieabz] [link to this post]
 
I'm not sure how G.fast pushes up average speeds over a widespread 35b program. Vectoring alone would help a ton relative to G.fast.

As far as I can tell G.fast went in to increase maximum speeds to compete with VM, not increase averages.
Standard User Andrue
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 04-Jul-18 18:39:20
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: Ignitionnet] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Ignitionnet:
I'm not sure how G.fast pushes up average speeds over a widespread 35b program. Vectoring alone would help a ton relative to G.fast.

As far as I can tell G.fast went in to increase maximum speeds to compete with VM, not increase averages.
That's what it looks like to me as well. It's a marketing trick rather than a serious attempt to improve the service. For all their proclamations it suggests that BT are still not really interested in upgrading the network. I'm not surprised because the RoI has always looked awful but that doesn't stop it annoying me to see the apparently playing a game just so they can be seen to be 'competing'.

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 04-Jul-18 18:44:50
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: Andrue] [link to this post]
 
Just maybe if FTTP take-up in areas with access to superfast via VDSL2 is a lot better than G.fast take-up you might see a big change in the next year or two, rather than in 7 years

G.fast with FTTP in other areas gives them chance to other 100 Mbps and faster to some 13 million homes by end of 2021 (10m gfast + 3 m fttp)

Brain may be too hot, but I thought some of the 35b benefits also needed ADSL/ADSL2+ turning off and with at least one MPF provider still planning to offer MPF from 2025 onwards it seems market not ready for that switch off en-masse

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User ansam
(member) Wed 04-Jul-18 23:48:03
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ionic] [link to this post]
 
Iím in Glasgow and noticed a number of pods appeared around various places including my street, my cabinet has had a pod fitted for a month or so but not yet showing live.

Connection - BT Infinity 2.
My Broadband Ping
Standard User xMaShx
(newbie) Thu 05-Jul-18 08:33:42
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ionic] [link to this post]
 
Kingston has had some pods installed for a couple of months now and BT are now selling it where available. The Thinkbroadband availability checker didnít show it although Openreach availability checker has been indicating availability for a month or so.

I have signed up for the A&A trial announced last week and have an engineer appointment scheduled for next week.
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 05-Jul-18 09:08:42
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: xMaShx] [link to this post]
 
Can you see the cab from your front window ? wink

Standard User Nightglow
(member) Thu 05-Jul-18 10:01:13
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
I'm in a trial area, G Fast pod installed last year, still not active.
But, on Roadworks.org, some signs of progress, final connections to cabinet were due 2nd July, & 27th-29th new fibre cables being laid along High Street.

Just had a look a Roadworks.org & both listings have now dissappeared.frown

Edited by Nightglow (Thu 05-Jul-18 10:11:29)

Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Thu 05-Jul-18 10:10:22
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: xMaShx] [link to this post]
 
Around 10 pods should appear in our checker later today

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Ignitionnet
(knowledge is power) Thu 05-Jul-18 10:21:29
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by j0hn83:
I think it's totally the wrong tech and they should have ripped up the ECI cabinets, replaced them with Huawei and rolled out VDSL2 Profile 35b.

Isle of Man using this perfectly.
Just seen a VDSL2 Profile 17a (as used by OpenReach in UK) with working vectoring get upgraded at the flick of a switch to profile 35b with working vectoring.


Well, the flick of a switch and swapping out every line card. To get vectoring working to begin with requiring an additional card as well.

The Isle of Man has a population of less than 83,000 and considerably less than 60,000 fixed lines so a very different scale carrying out this task there relative to Openreach replacing 6 figures line cards, replacing 5 figures cabinets and installing 5 figures vectoring engines. Don't believe it has the same wholesale market that BT contends with either.

I find G.fast bemusing but then I'm very much over copper now unless with shortened loops.
Standard User Ignitionnet
(knowledge is power) Thu 05-Jul-18 10:23:32
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
Brain may be too hot, but I thought some of the 35b benefits also needed ADSL/ADSL2+ turning off and with at least one MPF provider still planning to offer MPF from 2025 onwards it seems market not ready for that switch off en-masse


It will perform no better on lines too long to max out vectored 17a. Laws of physics and all that. Using the ADSL spectrum improves both.
Standard User ansam
(member) Thu 05-Jul-18 10:35:39
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Zarjaz:
Can you see the cab from your front window ? wink


Funny you should ask because I can. I have been in contact with OR "Infrastructure Solutions Customer Service" who has ben liaising with the "delivery manager" which I assume is for this area but they don't seem to have a date or an estimate between them lol

My contract with BT is coming to an end. Not sure if I should hold off and wait to see if G.Fast gets activated or just move on an get it later (when possible) as I am not sure how long the roll out and activation is going to take. There where quite a few OR visits to the cabinets the last few weeks but that seems to have stopped now.

Connection - BT Infinity 2.
My Broadband Ping
Standard User Taras
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 05-Jul-18 10:47:13
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ansam] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ansam:
In reply to a post by Zarjaz:
Can you see the cab from your front window ? wink


Funny you should ask because I can. I have been in contact with OR "Infrastructure Solutions Customer Service" who has ben liaising with the "delivery manager" which I assume is for this area but they don't seem to have a date or an estimate between them lol

My contract with BT is coming to an end. Not sure if I should hold off and wait to see if G.Fast gets activated or just move on an get it later (when possible) as I am not sure how long the roll out and activation is going to take. There where quite a few OR visits to the cabinets the last few weeks but that seems to have stopped now.


Activation of the pods seems to be quite fast now, (only taking brockenhurst roll out into account). You'd only need a new modem as its still dsl based..

I guess the question is - how long do you want to wait and if your existing provider sells g.fast products ..
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 05-Jul-18 11:03:12
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: Taras] [link to this post]
 
You'd only need a new modem as its still dsl based..

I 'believe' it's all engineer installed at present,*

Openreach would seem to want to ensure that those precious few who do take the product don't besmirch its name by naffing up a self install. (as these boards show, this still happens all the time, even with ADSL/VDSL)






*as happened with ADSL and VDSL to start with.

Standard User Nightglow
(member) Thu 05-Jul-18 11:12:13
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ansam] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ansam:
In reply to a post by Zarjaz:
Can you see the cab from your front window ? wink



My contract with BT is coming to an end. Not sure if I should hold off and wait to see if G.Fast gets activated or just move on an get it later (when possible) as I am not sure how long the roll out and activation is going to take.


I'm in the same position, as whether stay or jump to another ISP, but where to I don't know.
Standard User Taras
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 05-Jul-18 13:19:58
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
Ha, true. I had forum blindness and didn't see the OP was with BT (who have g.fast products)
Standard User AndyPandy
(fountain of knowledge) Fri 06-Jul-18 14:47:05
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by candlerb:
In reply to a post by AndyPandy:
The pods appear very quickly around the areas in my experience, but don't get too excited if you don't live within a stone's throw of it.

My cab is enabled, but only properties within 100m as the crow flies can get it. Not the 300m that's often thrown around.


It would be 300m of copper line. The length of the copper loop can be much longer than the radial distance (as the crow flies).


Yeah, I know. Zen tested the line and apparently it's about 500m, which is crazy, as it's 200m further than following the cables back (unless they route off somewhere other than the poles and manholes back to the cab (it's a straight road))..


ZeN Unlimited Fibre 2
Fritz!Box 3390
Standard User ansam
(member) Sat 07-Jul-18 08:28:40
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: AndyPandy] [link to this post]
 
Be aware the line test is the range (estimated) from the exchange not the cabinet. At least that is what both BT and OR told me.

Connection - BT Infinity 2.
My Broadband Ping
Standard User AndyPandy
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 07-Jul-18 08:54:17
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ansam] [link to this post]
 
That can't be right, as I'm many km's from the exchange.

Look at these impressive ADSL figures!

WBC ADSL 2+ Up to 1 -- 1 to 3.5 Available -- --
ADSL Max Up to 1 -- 0.75 to 2.5 Available -- --


ZeN Unlimited Fibre 2
Fritz!Box 3390
Standard User ansam
(member) Sat 07-Jul-18 09:01:44
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: AndyPandy] [link to this post]
 
Maybe yours is right as I had to query the number they gave me 1520m is what they said but I can see the cabinet from my window and I am getting around 71mbps on my line.

When I queried is they said that the line test only shows m from the exchange and even that is estimate.

I am about 973m straight line distance from the exchange.

Connection - BT Infinity 2.
My Broadband Ping
Standard User robertcrowther
(committed) Sat 07-Jul-18 10:16:02
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ansam] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ansam:
Maybe yours is right as I had to query the number they gave me 1520m is what they said but I can see the cabinet from my window and I am getting around 71mbps on my line.

When I queried is they said that the line test only shows m from the exchange and even that is estimate.

I am about 973m straight line distance from the exchange.


If you had a line test done because of a fault or query then they may do a full line test which would take into account the distance from the exchange. This of course does not effect the distance used when the calculations are made in regards to either G.Fast or FTTC
Standard User TheInstaller
(newbie) Sat 07-Jul-18 10:19:00
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ansam] [link to this post]
 
If you are on FTTC then the distance to the exchange is meaning less, as the only distance you are interested in, is the distance from the pole you are connected to (DP) to the cabinet (PCP).

The distance from the PCP to exchange is irrelevant while on FTTC or G.fast. Yes you might have been given a line length of 1500 odd meters, but you've not told us what length this is for. I would expect this is for the distance from the exchange to DP, so again irrelevant for G.fast too.
Standard User robertcrowther
(committed) Sat 07-Jul-18 11:57:27
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: TheInstaller] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by TheInstaller:
If you are on FTTC then the distance to the exchange is meaning less, as the only distance you are interested in, is the distance from the pole you are connected to (DP) to the cabinet (PCP).

The distance from the PCP to exchange is irrelevant while on FTTC or G.fast. Yes you might have been given a line length of 1500 odd meters, but you've not told us what length this is for. I would expect this is for the distance from the exchange to DP, so again irrelevant for G.fast too.


It only becomes irrelevant once FTTC and G.fast are available without having a normal voice pots line.
Standard User ansam
(member) Sat 07-Jul-18 12:18:32
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: TheInstaller] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by TheInstaller:
If you are on FTTC then the distance to the exchange is meaning less, as the only distance you are interested in, is the distance from the pole you are connected to (DP) to the cabinet (PCP).

The distance from the PCP to exchange is irrelevant while on FTTC or G.fast. Yes you might have been given a line length of 1500 odd meters, but you've not told us what length this is for. I would expect this is for the distance from the exchange to DP, so again irrelevant for G.fast too.


It looks like it was from the exchange to the DP.

"Our records show the line length to your nearest Distribution Point (usually a cabinet, underground junction box or cabinet) is 1513m"

So as I Said need to watch out what line length they are actually talking about when you ask. BT Said they couldn't give the length between the cabinet and my line as that is not information they have access to.

Connection - BT Infinity 2.
My Broadband Ping
Standard User j0hn83
(experienced) Sat 07-Jul-18 12:19:27
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ansam] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ansam:
Maybe yours is right as I had to query the number they gave me 1520m is what they said but I can see the cabinet from my window and I am getting around 71mbps on my line.

When I queried is they said that the line test only shows m from the exchange and even that is estimate.

I am about 973m straight line distance from the exchange.

There are different types of line test.
Some tests will check the entire line from the exchange (pstn tests) but the GEA service tests indicate line length from the cabinet.

G.Fast and FTTC estimates are based on the distance to the cabinet.
Standard User derekdel
(committed) Mon 09-Jul-18 22:20:27
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ionic] [link to this post]
 
Well I am on a line about 780m -ish from the cabinet and its ECI so double whammy for moi.
Standard User ansam
(member) Tue 10-Jul-18 14:14:43
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: xMaShx] [link to this post]
 
I've been in contact with OR about the cabinet in my street and the issue was raised up to their "Infrastructure Solutions Customer Service" and twice they have said the build is complete and I can order now, despite the wholesale checker saying different and I have tried MANY postcodes in my street to make sure its not just me!

The grammar in the e-mails is shocking and the absolute quickness of wanting to close the case.
https://imgur.com/a/4FAxU0k

They don't quite seem to know whats going on themselves.

Connection - BT Infinity 2.
My Broadband Ping
Standard User ansam
(member) Tue 10-Jul-18 14:27:59
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ansam] [link to this post]
 
This was the last reply I had:

When you place the order with the service provider , they will arrange for the cable link to the G fast cabinet to be completed, this will then reflect on the availability checker. All the internal systems which the Service provide has access to shows the GFAST is available.

Connection - BT Infinity 2.
My Broadband Ping
Standard User j0hn83
(experienced) Tue 10-Jul-18 16:57:01
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ansam] [link to this post]
 
Perhaps OpenReach have completed their work. Certainly sounds like they've done their bit.
It's now up to their customer, BT Wholesale, to do what they need to do at the exchange to make it available to SP's.

As they are completely separate companies OpenReach won't be in a position to tell you what BT Wholesale are doing any more than they can tell you what TalkTalk business are doing.

Try contacting BT Wholesale? Clive Selley can't help you there.
Standard User Blmcg
(learned) Wed 11-Jul-18 12:53:41
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ansam] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ansam:
I've been in contact with OR about the cabinet in my street and the issue was raised up to their "Infrastructure Solutions Customer Service" and twice they have said the build is complete and I can order now, despite the wholesale checker saying different and I have tried MANY postcodes in my street to make sure its not just me!


Wholesale might not have connected to the Handover node serving that pod yet, or your estimate may fall below the speed threshold (in which case Wholesale filters it out)

You're outside of our on-net footprint else we could help pre-wholesale, but if you PM me your address I can let you know if it's the threshold or just the cablelink.

Blair McGregor
Network Architect - Syscomm
Standard User ansam
(member) Wed 11-Jul-18 12:56:31
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: Blmcg] [link to this post]
 
PM sent.

Connection - BT Infinity 2.
My Broadband Ping
Standard User Cruncher
(member) Thu 12-Jul-18 22:12:32
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: ansam] [link to this post]
 
My G.fast availability is now showing as 'Amber' - What does that mean please?

Cheers.


VDSL Range A (Clean) 80 60 20 19 52.7 Available -- --
VDSL Range B (Impacted) 75.7 50.2 20 16.7 39.8 Available -- --
G.fast Range A (Clean) 189.9 164.6 26 10.2 135 Amber -- --
G.fast Range B (Impacted) 151.2 97.8 17.2 7.9 88.8 Amber -- --

Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Wed 18-Jul-18 05:09:50
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: Ignitionnet] [link to this post]
 
yeah thats what it is, to push up marketing speeds.

35b + vectoring would help existing users more, but it has less of a business case in terms of marketing potential.

Sky Fibre Pro BQM - IPv4 BQM - IPv6
Standard User WilliamGrimsley
(experienced) Wed 18-Jul-18 15:34:27
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Re: G.Fast rollout in announced locations


[re: Cruncher] [link to this post]
 
I think that means that you may not be able to receive it due to distance (e.g. OR may need to do a survey).

William Grimsley.
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