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Standard User inmcdonalds
(newbie) Mon 29-Jun-20 21:52:39
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FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[link to this post]
 
Hi.

Due to being on the end of a very long copper line off a fibre cabinet, I`ve been stuck on 3-4Mbps download ADSL for years. On the openreach checker I noticed a few months ago that `FTTC is coming soon`. Great I thought, although oddly my neighbour across the road had `still looking for solutions` as his result. We are a small hamlet in scotland and all the other 5 neighbours had FTTC so figured my neighbour just hadn`t had his records updated. However, BT were up putting their white markings on the road the other day, so I figured I would check the openreach fibre checker again. We still show `FTTC coming soon` but my neighbour now shows `FTTP coming soon`!

So i`m happy for my neighbour but equally wondering why his shows up as `FTTP coming soon` whereas everyone else is still `FTTC coming soon`. We are all pretty close to each other on the same road. I`m about 50 metres off the road, and my FTTP neighbour is 50m off the other side of the road directly opposite. All other houses are around 300metres further down the road.

Could it just be the database not updated, or would they really give FTTP to one and FTTC to everyone else?

We are in Scotland, so I`m not sure whether this is R100 stuff or just standard BT deployment.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 29-Jun-20 23:11:58
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
The coming soon messaging is not 100% reliable, so until its all live hard to say more.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User inmcdonalds
(newbie) Mon 29-Jun-20 23:14:57
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
AHH so cruel are openreachsmile I'm hoping for the best but expecting the worse.


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Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 29-Jun-20 23:17:01
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
There are some rural VDS2 cabinets that appear where a good chunk of the premises also have FTTP made available. A lot hinges on where the cabinet is going and what speeds people are expected to get.

In a few cases even those getting VDSL2 speeds well into the superfast area also end up with FTTP

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User MHC
(sensei) Mon 29-Jun-20 23:26:30
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
Are your neighbours Campbells or McKenzies by any chance? wink


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

M H C


taurus excreta cerebrum vincit
Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Mon 29-Jun-20 23:29:57
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
They are at that LOL

They have had an area round the corner from me down for FTTP, to have all the Legacy FTTP hardware (DP, Manifold) installed to end up sit dormant for several years, to then have a FTTC installed along with its power to then have it all removed due to planning issues, which was strange due to planning is normally issued first.

And now they are down for FTTP once again.

So you cannot trust what is stated is being installed until it becomes available to order and its installed and live.

Basically they are always changing things all the time due to loads of things like fibre routing, power issues, planning issues, complaints about looks (for FTTC only) etc.

The phone lines for my road and side roads are split up onto 2 phone cabinets, the upper half and lower half, all had FTTP installed years ago, but only upper half went live.
After many years complaining to BT's CEO and Chairman's Office on nearly a daily basis they made the FTTP hardware at our phone pole live and installed FTTC for the rest of the lower parts of our road and side roads.

So they have made FTTP available for a max of 12 to 14 lines, sure its more than the one you said, but I have also seen that too, the thing to look at is the cabinet numbers for the people that cannot get FTTP and the one address that can, in most cases you "might" see that they are on a different phone cabinet number.

So you might still be lucky.

Paul

Standard User inmcdonalds
(newbie) Tue 30-Jun-20 08:23:21
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
Yeah I appreciate plans may change once they look at the technical issues. Our copper disappears underground for a good 50 metres as it goes past our property so id imagine that complicates things. Would be nice to have a bit of community engagement though at a hyperlocal level. Even if the engineers just chapped on the door for a quick chat although I guess that could lead to a lot of heated discussions for some and they may just want to keep their head down!
Standard User Taras
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 30-Jun-20 09:35:08
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
Are your neighbours on a different post code?

But as Paul said, wait for the fttp to go live and then check. Also what is your exchange? We might be able to see if there a vdsl cab coming this year.

My local fttp build is like this, into the years mark. The original pole that had fibre has now got more fibre. Others have got cbts but aren't connected, and i've been told theres a "3rd party delay" ... I'm not sure if my copper dp/joint and cbt is connected either.
Standard User Spuriousfish
(regular) Tue 30-Jun-20 09:37:42
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
I'm in rural Scotland as well. All our surrounding villages had FTTC installed a long while back but they couldn't go the extra 4 miles and do us so we suffered the slow ADSL. Then wonder of wonders over the last few months they've been installing the fibre for FTTP to us. Most of us would be happy with the FTTC solution because the install would have been less complicated and most of us dont need superfast.

No notification from BT/Openreach that it was available despite signing up for their newsletter. I found out by accident that it was available when a friend told me. Checking the BT.com website for availability did in fact show that I could have it but it was not available to some of my neighbours.

The data base was obviously being updated frequently as more houses became added. What was equally amusing was that the price also varied depending on house number you put in.

I ordered the FTTP service and was given a date of install and up and running just over 2 weeks from the order. Yeah right. Engineer did come around very quickly to do survey and shortly after we got a notification from our current supplier that we were leaving but it only mentioned landline.

Checked order status on BT.com and sure enough my landline was due for July 1st but broadband was now end of September. Quite a mess. A call to BT got me the usual run around between BT and Openreach before finally getting someone in Dundee or might have been Aberdeen who acknowledged the problem and changed things to happen at the same time. It was a long call which I wont go into but just reinforced the fact which we knew - BT Sales and Openreach do not talk to each other.

I got an email from my old supplier welcoming me back.

Neighbours are having the same problem with one who was due for an install on June 23rd and is now scheduled for December.

Admittedly the complication is in running the last bit of fibre to the houses which is why in some ways FTTC would have been better but it doesn't tick the boxes for BT.
Standard User inmcdonalds
(newbie) Tue 30-Jun-20 09:38:31
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: Taras] [link to this post]
 
It's the same postcode ph2 7ll .

Perth exchange.
Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Tue 30-Jun-20 09:59:55
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by inmcdonalds:
It's the same postcode ph2 7ll .

Perth exchange.

That postcode cannot get FTTP only FTTP on Demand, they are different products with completely different prices.

Paul

Standard User inmcdonalds
(newbie) Tue 30-Jun-20 10:08:43
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
Yes I know that is the situation currently. However as per my original post there has been some openreach activity recently along my road and the openreach fibre checker now says 'fttp coming soon' for my neighbour on other side of road, and 'fttc coming soon' for everyone else's property.

The btwholesale checker or whatever it is called has said fttpod available for several years now but that is a separate issue to my current one.
Standard User Taras
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 30-Jun-20 10:25:09
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
That looks to be a database error, keep on checking your neighbour's phone number here - once its live, check yours
https://www.broadbandchecker.btwholesale.com
Standard User candlerb
(experienced) Tue 30-Jun-20 13:29:07
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by inmcdonalds:
The btwholesale checker or whatever it is called has said fttpod available for several years now but that is a separate issue to my current one.


It'll say that for pretty much anyone in FTTC cabinet footprint.
Standard User chrisdev
(learned) Tue 30-Jun-20 17:26:36
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
Are you and your neighbour served from the same pole currently (for copper)?

If you are, there's a good chance that will be the location of any future fibre CBT.

I had a similar experience when FTTP went live in my rural Scottish location. The checker said FTTP was coming, but I only found out by accident when it came to be signed off, that me and my 3 immediate neighbours had wayleave issues despite being served from the same CBT. Another 3 properties went live no problem. It needed me to prove to OR that I was served from the same pole and that the underground ducting was already in place (including uncovering their own chamber), before they changed the DB and I could order. In my experience, it's useful to have an unhealthy obsession about where your telephone/fibre cable comes from/goes to!
Standard User inmcdonalds
(newbie) Tue 30-Jun-20 17:43:06
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: chrisdev] [link to this post]
 
I believe that the situation is that there is a pole and his line comes off that by overhead wire to his (the fttp neighbour) house. The copper goes under ground from that pole for about 100m (basically along the length of my property) then it re-emerges and goes back to a pole (and another neighbour who is predicted by checker to get fttc then gets his wire off that pole via overhead cable) I imagine that somewhere along the 100m underground duct there is a branch and another underground duct comes into my property. Certainly there is no overhead line to my property as we are about 50 metres from the roadside.
Standard User dect
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 30-Jun-20 18:04:03
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by inmcdonalds:
The copper goes under ground from that pole for about 100m (basically along the length of my property) then it re-emerges and goes back to a pole
What makes you believe this is the case.
In reply to a post by inmcdonalds:
I imagine that somewhere along the 100m underground duct there is a branch and another underground duct comes into my property.
Have you found the duct entrance at you property? Have you found any BT footway boxes near the poles or on the pavement outside your property? Are you sure its not directly buried cable to your property?

Edit Sorry for so many questions but the network topology isn't always how people think.

Edited by dect (Tue 30-Jun-20 18:05:08)

Standard User inmcdonalds
(newbie) Tue 30-Jun-20 18:07:06
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
My neighbour told me that a 10+ years ago the copper was all pole mounted along the length of my property. But for some reason they decided to put it below ground.

It is possible that there is not a duct to my property branching off this one though and instead it is just a buried cable. I will take a closer look at the infrastructure tonight.
Standard User dect
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 30-Jun-20 21:42:37
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by inmcdonalds:
My neighbour told me that a 10+ years ago the copper was all pole mounted along the length of my property. But for some reason they decided to put it below ground.
BT must have needed a reason to underground 150m of telephone cable, did you ask the neighbour why they thought it happened?
Standard User inmcdonalds
(newbie) Tue 30-Jun-20 22:26:37
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
Apparently they were checking the posts to see if any looked dodgy and these did but why they didn't just replace the post is beyond me. I'm not sure how reliable by neighbours account is.

Any way, if the ducting after my neighbours connection is an issue for fttp, then the pole that supplies my neighbour is next to my land and I could probably take a fibre connection off of that maybe. Like an overhead line. Although the distance from the pole across my field/garden to my house is fairly long so I'd have to put a telegraph pole in possibly somewjere in my garden ?!? Anyway, probably getting a bit head of myself here !
Standard User Taras
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 30-Jun-20 22:47:55
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
Probably the poles were not high enough and thus, the owner was given a choice.

Edited by Taras (Tue 30-Jun-20 22:48:20)

Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Wed 01-Jul-20 20:44:10
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me? *DELETED*


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
Post deleted by RobertoS
Standard User inmcdonalds
(newbie) Wed 01-Jul-20 22:08:44
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me? *DELETED*


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
I'm on a long line, so the cabinet is enabled for fttc but I am too far away to benefit. Thus I remain on ADSL.
Standard User dect
(fountain of knowledge) Wed 01-Jul-20 23:24:17
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: inmcdonalds] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by inmcdonalds:
Apparently they were checking the posts to see if any looked dodgy and these did but why they didn't just replace the post is beyond me. I'm not sure how reliable by neighbours account is.
Must be more to it than that, in today's money 1 x pole replacement approx £600 compared to 100m of ducting (between the 2 remaining poles) at a conservative cost of £100 a metre is £10,000
Standard User Taras
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 02-Jul-20 08:09:45
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
Also two poles aren't spaced out by 100m - its either 25m or 50m (can't remember which)
Standard User dect
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 02-Jul-20 08:40:55
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: Taras] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Taras:
Also two poles aren't spaced out by 100m - its either 25m or 50m (can't remember which)
Don't forget the pole thats been removed, it would have been approx half way been the two that now exist so if it was in the middle it would have been approx 50m which is acceptable, even now fibre can span 65m and has recently gone up to a max span of 75m

Edit: Just to add 75m is between poles although drops to properties may still be limited to a smaller span.

Edited by dect (Thu 02-Jul-20 09:26:54)

Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 02-Jul-20 10:39:41
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by dect:
In reply to a post by inmcdonalds:
Apparently they were checking the posts to see if any looked dodgy and these did but why they didn't just replace the post is beyond me. I'm not sure how reliable by neighbours account is.
Must be more to it than that, in today's money 1 x pole replacement approx £600 compared to 100m of ducting (between the 2 remaining poles) at a conservative cost of £100 a metre is £10,000


It's £112 to dig on a carriageway.

It's a fraction of that to dig on private land, gardens, etc.

It would cost nowhere near £10,000 to dig between 2 poles.
Standard User dect
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 02-Jul-20 10:49:20
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by j0hn83:
It's £112 to dig on a carriageway.

It's a fraction of that to dig on private land, gardens, etc.
From what the OP has said the two poles are not on his land/garden but I agree it may not be on a carriageway either.

Edit: We also don't know how many footway boxes have been built as well which all adds to the price.

Edited by dect (Thu 02-Jul-20 10:51:37)

Standard User inmcdonalds
(newbie) Sat 04-Jul-20 22:01:29
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Re: FTTP for neighbour not for me?


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
sorry I forgot to check in on the thread. The bit that has been undergrounded is a road section bisected by a power line. So I`m wondering if it was actually done originally to avoid the power line. It keeps going underground along the road beyond that (a stretch in front of his house), which is what my neighbour was referring to i think, and I don`t recall the exact reason. He did say something about slipping the engineer 50 quid to sign it off as needing to go underground because it was spoiling his views, but i expect that is apocryphal aka BS. Anyway,.. we will just wait and see what happens.
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