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Standard User Dean83
(newbie) Mon 27-Jul-20 13:57:04
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Talk Talk FTTP


[link to this post]
 
Looks like talk talk are now selling openreach based FTTP.

i live in an FTTP greenfield area and received a mailer from them this morning for 'Future Fibre 150' which shows it as a full fibre connection ( not G.fast ).

mailer states that 'No landline service is provided'

£34.95 for 24 months.

the web address given in the flyer does not allow online orders though , it lists a number to call in
Standard User APTMAN
(member) Mon 27-Jul-20 14:35:40
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Dean83] [link to this post]
 
https://www.talktalk.co.uk/shop/ufo/broadband £27.50 ! ?
Standard User Highland76
(member) Mon 27-Jul-20 14:45:59
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: APTMAN] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by APTMAN:
https://www.talktalk.co.uk/shop/ufo/broadband £27.50 ! ?

No, that’s for their York FTTP rollout which is totally different to their Openreach based FTTP products. Their Openreach based FTTP services are called Future Fibre and cost £40/m for 500Mbps and £35/m for 160 Mbps on a fixed price 24 months min term. They’ll be launching the 1 Gig tier in a few months.

At present orders can only be placed over the phone.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200


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Standard User Wangmaster
(newbie) Mon 27-Jul-20 15:07:27
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
From what I've heard, they also don't provide a phone service with future fibre? Might be a problem for some, but I haven't used the house phone in years. I assume they will offer some sort of IP based telephony in the future, though.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Mon 27-Jul-20 15:10:20
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Wangmaster] [link to this post]
 
Correct, it’s a data only FTTP service from TT.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User burble
(committed) Mon 27-Jul-20 15:33:09
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Rather annoyingly my earlier reply has disappeared.
As I type this I'm on hold trying to find what's happening to my TT FTTP 'order', it was actioned by CEO's office around 16th July.
As per my earlier thread it appears that TT will not do a landline or offer a VoIP service so will need to port number to someone like Sipgate.
quick update, TT helpline has failed (yet again) they transfered me to the wrong ext. have now had to redail as they can't get me through to right ext.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 27-Jul-20 15:36:39
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Dean83] [link to this post]
 
Their website is saying £28/m on 18 month contract.

Tried a few FTTP (only and mixed) and none are passing eligibility check.

So still not enough to flip our listings to add the package.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User burble
(committed) Mon 27-Jul-20 15:39:07
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
Their website is saying £28/m on 18 month contract.

Tried a few FTTP (only and mixed) and none are passing eligibility check.

So still not enough to flip our listings to add the package.


That's for gfast, not 'future fibre'.
p.s. the FTTP page isn't easy to find, and you seem to end up on gfast page if not careful

Edited by burble (Mon 27-Jul-20 15:40:14)

Standard User Highland76
(member) Mon 27-Jul-20 15:42:27
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
Call TT full fibre team on 0345 172 0074, option 1.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User Highland76
(member) Mon 27-Jul-20 15:47:54
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
TalkTalk Fibre 'terminology' :

Faster Fibre & Superfast Fibre: FTTC

Faster 150 Fibre: G.Fast

Future Fibre: FTTP (Openreach flavoured)

UFO: FTTP (CityFibre flavoured) - only available in York area
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To be released

????: FTTP (CityFibre flavoured) - available nationwide in place of or in addition to Vodafone FTTP

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200

Edited by Highland76 (Mon 27-Jul-20 16:05:00)

Standard User burble
(committed) Mon 27-Jul-20 15:53:09
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
Call TT full fibre team on 0345 172 0074, option 1.


I'll probably be phoning that number next, as per usual at TT confusion reigns, I've been passed through several teams, for some odd reason I'm now been passed to the Fibre Trials team, they can.t find my info so are right now chasing around trying to find what the hell is happening.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Mon 27-Jul-20 16:00:19
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
That number definitely puts you through to their dedicated FTTP team via option 1 - I was talking to them this morning smile

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User burble
(committed) Mon 27-Jul-20 16:00:27
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Hopefully this should link to the correct page.
https://www.talktalk.co.uk/shop/broadband/futurefibre

p.s. AFAIK 150 is £34.95, and 500 is £39.95

Edited by burble (Mon 27-Jul-20 16:02:59)

Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 27-Jul-20 17:02:37
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
The York UFO is also now in Dewsbury and still called UFO

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 27-Jul-20 17:03:16
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for link - phone call order only.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Mon 27-Jul-20 17:38:59
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
The York UFO is also now in Dewsbury and still called UFO

Ah ok, in that case they might be calling all Cityfibre based FTTP services, UFO.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User zzing123
(regular) Mon 27-Jul-20 19:21:39
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Also nada on the business site yet, but good to see they've done something by their deadline this July.

Meanwhile, Cityfibre has been mentioned as "later this year", but no one knows whether that's calendar year (Dec 2020) or financial year (Mar 2021).

Has TT actually mentioned anything on the wire, Andrew?
Standard User Highland76
(member) Mon 27-Jul-20 20:14:16
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: zzing123] [link to this post]
 
Apparently TT Business are launching FTTP "from July 2020". And they mention "Ultrafast speeds up to 1 Gbps" so will be interesting to see if they launch the top end 1 Gig tier from the beginning

https://www.talktalkbusiness.co.uk/products/business...

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User Highland76
(member) Tue 28-Jul-20 09:48:21
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
Apparently TT Business are launching FTTP "from July 2020". And they mention "Ultrafast speeds up to 1 Gbps" so will be interesting to see if they launch the top end 1 Gig tier from the beginning

https://www.talktalkbusiness.co.uk/products/business...

TalkTalk Business will be launching Openreach FTTP tomorrow:

0.5 Gig for £59.95/m (ex vat) including copper line rental + unlimited landline + mobile calls + static ip

1 Gig for £69.95/m with same phone package

No idea how they supply the voice service if there’s no copper ( I have both copper + fibre) Anyway if BT business keep delaying in launching the 1 Gig service, I’ll be moving over to TTB. Had superb service from them in the past along with top class phone support.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200

Edited by Highland76 (Tue 28-Jul-20 09:49:35)

Standard User CarlTSpeak
(committed) Tue 28-Jul-20 10:23:14
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
Thanks for link - phone call order only.


Phone call availability check only. Bemusing.

Building better networks, not just faster ones.
Standard User threelegs
(member) Tue 28-Jul-20 11:12:14
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: CarlTSpeak] [link to this post]
 
the lack of a bundled copper landline will put many people off,me included, from signing up to tt fttp
Standard User burble
(committed) Tue 28-Jul-20 11:20:53
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Well the shear level of incompetence at TT has stepped up a notch, I don't think I've ever spoken to so many people at a company who know so little about what they are doing, I've normally had reasonable service from TT in the past, but this is not like 'banging your head against a wall', this is taking a run up and diving head first at reinforced concrete. I've had a frustrating year of promises from TT on when FTTP would be available, now they have cocked it up big time.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Tue 28-Jul-20 11:37:40
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
Is it the lack of a bundled voice service with FTTP which is stopping you taking out fibre with TT? IMHO it’s not really an issue, just sign up with Vonage or Sipgate for the voice part. The latter charge no monthly fees for their ‘Basic’ PAYG plan and if you make a lot of calls to landlines/mobiles then their unlimited calling plan is only £9.95/m.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User burble
(committed) Tue 28-Jul-20 11:54:08
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
No it's TT's inability to handle my order, bare in mind I had been told by CEO's office that FTTP had been ordered on my line (that's another long story), I wanted to double check the time scale and also that porting my number to Sipgate wouldn't trigger a cease of my present service.
The FTTP order has been 'lost', but not only that they can't put in the order again as my house doesn't show on the system (it took three calls of nearly an hour each time to find this out), I can go on OR website and my whole street including my house is listed as having FTTP available, if I do a speed test on here it flags up that FTTP is available, but for my post code TT system only shows the school down the road as having FTTP available. On TT's forum there are several others who have same problem. I've now been on my 4th phone call, and got cut off whilst it was being escalated up the system.
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 28-Jul-20 14:15:46
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by burble:
I wanted to double check the time scale and also that porting my number to Sipgate wouldn't trigger a cease of my present service.


In most cases where broadband/landline is a bundled service if you port the landline number to a VOIP provider it will cease the entire service from the ISP.

ISP's need to take advantage of OpenReach's "Renumber with number export" service to do this but very few do.
Standard User threelegs
(member) Tue 28-Jul-20 15:17:11
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
No it is the fact that they dont have an option to keep the landline. yes i could use voip but that then means another monthly bill when BT and others keep it simple and cheaper than tt

Edited by threelegs (Tue 28-Jul-20 15:18:24)

Standard User kommando
(regular) Tue 28-Jul-20 16:08:11
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: threelegs] [link to this post]
 
Basic Sipgate is free is you never make an outgoing phonecall, I added £10 credit to my account and its down to £9.80 12 months later.
Standard User dogcat
(learned) Tue 28-Jul-20 16:22:21
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
TalkTalk Business will be launching Openreach FTTP tomorrow:

0.5 Gig for £59.95/m (ex vat) including copper line rental + unlimited landline + mobile calls + static ip

1 Gig for £69.95/m with same phone package


edit. forgot the VAT. Its still cheap, but is a only a bit more than BT retail.

Edited by dogcat (Tue 28-Jul-20 16:23:40)

Standard User burble
(committed) Tue 28-Jul-20 17:37:54
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
At the moment I'm awaiting another call back, they haven't got a clue. One of the questions asked was "why do you want to port your number?" I then had to explain to the so called 'expert on FTTP' (their term not mine) that they weren't providing a voice service with FTTP, they are now discussing how to handle it.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Tue 28-Jul-20 18:47:39
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
Why don’t you keep your existing TT copper broadband & voice active and place a new order for TT FTTP (data only). Once you’re up and running on FTTP, simply ask your chosen VoIP provider to port your TT number. Once the port is completed, this will automatically cease your copper voice & broadband on TT.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 28-Jul-20 19:02:00
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
Do as Highland76 suggested and port the Talktalk number after the FTTP is live. This ceases the Talktalk broadband and phone.

I really can't see Talktalk residential being able to organise a number export while the service is live.
It's also a service which OpenReach charges the ISP a flat fee for (£35+vat) which Talktalk probably don't have a system in place to pass on to you the customer.

If porting the number to VOIP is a process that takes a couple weeks you could start it before the FTTP goes live and time it to happen a few days after that.
With the higher chance of delays in FTTP installs I would just wait till the service is active then port the number.
Standard User threelegs
(member) Tue 28-Jul-20 19:35:28
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: kommando] [link to this post]
 
that is like saying lots of things are free if you dont use them. all isps should provide a landline or a bundled voip
Standard User zyborg47
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Jul-20 00:08:43
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: threelegs] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by threelegs:
the lack of a bundled copper landline will put many people off,me included, from signing up to tt fttp


As been said you can sign up for a VoIP system I have been using sipgate for years as i used it when I went for a wireless network and kept hold of it even when I went to FTTC. So if it came here, the lack of a copper landline would not be the problem, using Talk Talk would be and also I do not need the speed, so I would not pay the extra for the speed.

Adrian

Desktop machine Ryzen powered with windows 10 , reluctantly.

Plusnet FTTC
Standard User Pheasant
(regular) Wed 29-Jul-20 05:51:23
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: zyborg47] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by zyborg47:
As been said you can sign up for a VoIP system I have been using sipgate for years as i used it when I went for a wireless network and kept hold of it even when I went to FTTC. So if it came here, the lack of a copper landline would not be the problem, using Talk Talk would be and also I do not need the speed, so I would not pay the extra for the speed.

100% with you there and my experience with SIP trunks over a multitude of broadband connection types mirrors your own.

ISPs should absolutely NOT be bungling (typo but I’ll leave it to emphasise the point) a voice service whether it be copper or VoIP with their broadband.

It stifles customer choice and flexibility and ties you into a tariff arrangement - great for the service provider and terrible for the customer - it’s akin to Microsoft bundling IE in their products....that didn’t end well.
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Jul-20 07:45:54
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Pheasant] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Pheasant:
ISPs should absolutely NOT be bungling (typo but I’ll leave it to emphasise the point) a voice service whether it be copper or VoIP with their broadband.

Whilst I agree with your sentiment, one reason to bundle it into the ISP provided router (e.g. "hub") is to ensure there is no QoS complexity for the home user. More important on slower lines than faster.

When the PSTN voice-over-copper switch off arrives, it will confuse a lot of people.

20 years of broadband connectivity since 1999 trial - Live BQM
Standard User CarlTSpeak
(committed) Wed 29-Jul-20 08:20:12
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: threelegs] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by threelegs:
the lack of a bundled copper landline will put many people off,me included, from signing up to tt fttp


I'd avoid the news about PSTN switch off and how even LLU operators are increasingly delivering services over VoIP rather than using regular copper landlines due to the cost savings.

Building better networks, not just faster ones.
Standard User simon194
(fountain of knowledge) Wed 29-Jul-20 08:26:23
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: kommando] [link to this post]
 
I had to top my Sipgate account up for the first time in around 4 years last month. I really only use it for daytime calls and phoning the UK when I'm abroad.
Standard User CarlTSpeak
(committed) Wed 29-Jul-20 08:27:17
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Pheasant] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Pheasant:
ISPs should absolutely NOT be bungling (typo but I’ll leave it to emphasise the point) a voice service whether it be copper or VoIP with their broadband.

It stifles customer choice and flexibility and ties you into a tariff arrangement - great for the service provider and terrible for the customer - it’s akin to Microsoft bundling IE in their products....that didn’t end well.


It doesn't tie you into anything. You can run a VoIP service over the top if you wish and for the most part digital voice services are basically free - the ISP is hoping to make a little money from calls and digital voice costs are negligible.

As far as ISPs not bundling services under apparently any circumstances cable companies do it because they can use a separate service flow for the voice which guarantees bandwidth on a shared network and uses modulation orders more resilient to noise so that even under network congestion or fault conditions the voice service continues to function short of total outage.

FTTP providers do it because they can use a separate VLAN with higher priority over the infrastructure provider's network, again to protect against congestion conditions, and using their own CPE they can also protect the voice call against congestion on the user's own capacity.

I'm thinking you've a lot of experience running services over broadband connections but none with broadband infrastructure itself. There are valid reasons for ISPs to at very least offer customers the option so writing it off in absolute terms is a bit much.

Building better networks, not just faster ones.
Standard User CarlTSpeak
(committed) Wed 29-Jul-20 08:29:14
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: threelegs] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by threelegs:
that is like saying lots of things are free if you dont use them. all isps should provide a landline or a bundled voip


ISP = Internet Service Provider. They should no more be obliged to provide a landline/VoIP than they are a Zoom account.

Building better networks, not just faster ones.
Standard User zyborg47
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Jul-20 08:31:29
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Pheasant] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Pheasant:
[
100% with you there and my experience with SIP trunks over a multitude of broadband connection types mirrors your own.

ISPs should absolutely [b]NOT be bungling (typo but I’ll leave it to emphasise the point) a voice service whether it be copper or VoIP with their broadband.

It stifles customer choice and flexibility and ties you into a tariff arrangement - great for the service provider and terrible for the customer - it’s akin to Microsoft bundling IE in their products....that didn’t end well.


In another thread in a different part of this forum, someone said something about Trunk and when I had a look they offered SOGEA, but the price difference between that and normal FTTC was minimal. FTTP is a different thing, not that I have had anything to do with it as I doubt we will get it here and i have not been anywhere that has FTTP.
the one good thing about having a normal landline is if you use it for an emergency and you get cut off, before you say where you are, it is easier for the emergency services to find you.

I have not used my landline since going back to fixed lined broadband about 5 years back, maybe longer.

I doubt we will see FTTP here for years,

Adrian

Desktop machine Ryzen powered with windows 10 , reluctantly.

Plusnet FTTC
Standard User Highland76
(member) Wed 29-Jul-20 08:51:46
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Pheasant] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Pheasant:
ISPs should absolutely NOT be bungling (typo but I’ll leave it to emphasise the point) a voice service whether it be copper or VoIP with their broadband.


Difference in wholesale costs between standalone broadband (SoGEA) and broadband with voice bundled is very small. For example Openreach charges CPs £265 pa for the SoGEA 330/50 FTTP product (sauce) whilst its £291 pa for the data+ voice product (sauce). So a difference of just over 2 quid per month. Which explains why some CPs like BT include voice as standard on their broadband offerings. It makes no sense to take out a third party VOIP service where voice is already included by the broadband provider, especially if its just to receive incoming calls.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 29-Jul-20 09:04:21
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
Say QoS to the average person an the street and you will get quizzical looks

Mention VoIP and some may have heard of it but see it as incredibly complex, and with the games one sometimes has to undergo to get third party voip handsets working via random broadband routers you can understand it.

Bundled and supported voice service either over copper or the broadband reduces complexity for the public.

Before anyone calls for big changes to how telephone and broadband packages are sold in the UK they should consider not just their own needs but those of the much wider population.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Jul-20 10:33:04
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
Say QoS to the average person an the street and you will get quizzical looks

Agree completely, hence why my ISP (Virgin Media) has stopped installing copper pair, and now uses the RJ11 sockets on their Hub.

Mention VoIP and some may have heard of it but see it as incredibly complex, and with the games one sometimes has to undergo to get third party voip handsets working via random broadband routers you can understand it.
Agreed, most people think of VoIP in 2020 as the apps on their mobile device,e.g. WhatsApp, FaceTime or similar.

Before anyone calls for big changes to how telephone and broadband packages are sold in the UK they should consider not just their own needs but those of the much wider population.
100% agreement.

20 years of broadband connectivity since 1999 trial - Live BQM
Standard User Nick_W789
(learned) Wed 29-Jul-20 10:33:36
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
It's as much a cultural shift, for the phone providers too (BT still struggling with using an identifier other than phone number for a domestic circuit). But those who most use a conventional landline are those least likely to be able to (or want to) configure multiple devices; building ATA functionality into broadband routers must cost pence and standard kit makes support feasible.
Standard User burble
(committed) Wed 29-Jul-20 11:06:26
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Well the latest is TT will not provide FTTP for me, their advise (after a year of promises from CEO's office of it coming soon) was to go with BT, they can see it's in my area but I can only assume it's the exchange equipment needing updating. Funny enough they can supply a service to the school down the road, they had fibre laid years ago through some sort of council scheme, and AFAIK that fibre is nothing to do with domestic fibre as OR didn't piggyback off it.
BTW the agent I spoke to, at first didn't understand why I wanted to port the number and had no training on this, so had to consult with a manager.
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Jul-20 11:14:31
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
The school connection will be a lease line which has no bearing on FTTP (in this context) at all.

TalkTalk unbundle exchanges and have their own backhaul - if the backhaul in the exchange isn't at a suitable capacity then they won't sell in that exchange yet. They presumably will have some sort of programme to upgrade exchanges but it could be a while as I doubt it is cheap and the FTTP market is still relatively small.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Wed 29-Jul-20 11:18:27
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Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
That’s a shame. If you don’t want to go with BT I suggest giving Sky Ultrafast FTTP team a call on 0333 759 4255 - like TT they don’t allow online orders just yet. However unlike TT, Sky do include a voice (VoIP) service as standard with their fttp offerings. Though I think sky don’t offer anything above 160/30 according to their flyer I received a few weeks ago.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User Pheasant
(regular) Wed 29-Jul-20 11:33:24
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: zyborg47] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by zyborg47:
..the one good thing about having a normal landline is if you use it for an emergency and you get cut off, before you say where you are, it is easier for the emergency services to find you.

A SIP trunk is just like a landline in the respect of a 999/112 emergency call, you register a physical address with your VOIP service provider so the blues and two's know where to go.

In other ways a VOIP service that is not physically tied to a single physical broadband service is preferable. If someone chomps through your fibre / copper its easy to flip to say a 4G connection and still get a "landline" service.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Wed 29-Jul-20 11:37:46
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: CarlTSpeak] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by CarlTSpeak:
In reply to a post by threelegs:
that is like saying lots of things are free if you dont use them. all isps should provide a landline or a bundled voip
ISP = Internet Service Provider. They should no more be obliged to provide a landline/VoIP than they are a Zoom account.
A good point, normally ignored throughout these forums. In fact, the whole site.

(As I realise you know), Ofcom generally refer to Communications Providers, (CPs), which covers most or all all aspects of nationwide electronic communications. IIRC so does Openreach.

I occasionally do, when the phone side is being discussed on the site.

Interestingly I wonder if other services such as Zoom and VOIP providers do or will soon come under their aegis as well.

Edit for clarity: "their" as in Ofcom. Not as in Openreach.

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.

Edited by RobertoS (Wed 29-Jul-20 11:40:16)

Standard User trolleybus
(experienced) Wed 29-Jul-20 14:01:15
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Dean83] [link to this post]
 
For those that just have a phone service, how will that be provided in the future?
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Jul-20 14:02:39
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
Potentially by installing the lowest cost data service possible and providing a VoIP service over top of it but the customer would pay voice service costs and wouldn't have access to the data service. To be honest it kind of reminds me of ISDN services.
Standard User Nick_W789
(learned) Wed 29-Jul-20 14:13:54
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by trolleybus:
For those that just have a phone service, how will that be provided in the future?


There is a 0.5MB/S symmetrical tier for both SOGEA and FTTP, for VOIP and for devices with low bandwidth requirements (traffic lights, alarm systems and other IOT). Although slow, it is an Internet connection. ISPs will need to provide a router with VOIP functionality.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 29-Jul-20 14:50:51
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
This data only I don't believe would be the end game for TalkTalk, my bet is that they are working on the new hardware and software side of voice service.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Wangmaster
(newbie) Wed 29-Jul-20 15:44:20
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: CarlTSpeak] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by CarlTSpeak:
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
Thanks for link - phone call order only.


Phone call availability check only. Bemusing.

I assume it's because they can't just go by the openreach checker, as it also relies on TT having cablelinks installed in the customers telephone exchange.

Annoyingly my exchange is one without cablelinks currently installed, and I still have 15 months left on my TT contract.

Edited by Wangmaster (Wed 29-Jul-20 15:46:28)

Standard User burble
(committed) Wed 29-Jul-20 16:23:10
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Wangmaster] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Wangmaster:
In reply to a post by CarlTSpeak:
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
Thanks for link - phone call order only.


Phone call availability check only. Bemusing.

I assume it's because they can't just go by the openreach checker, as it also relies on TT having cablelinks installed in the customers telephone exchange.

Annoyingly my exchange is one without cablelinks currently installed, and I still have 15 months left on my TT contract.


AFAIK BT will buy you out of contract.
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Jul-20 16:29:58
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
To be honest it kind of reminds me of ISDN services.

.... they are being phased out by 2025 too apparently.

{Praise Be ! I hate the damn things}

Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Jul-20 16:37:59
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: trolleybus] [link to this post]
 
I know of a block of ‘seniors living*’ flats, all are FTTP only. Many only take an FVA voice service .... I’m aware that FVA is going too, so it’ll be a phone jack, of some variety, on the back of a CP router.





* please note, this poster meets the criteria for said flats.

Standard User Highland76
(member) Wed 29-Jul-20 16:47:41
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by burble:
In reply to a post by Wangmaster:
In reply to a post by CarlTSpeak:
... nested quotes trimmed ...


Phone call availability check only. Bemusing.

I assume it's because they can't just go by the openreach checker, as it also relies on TT having cablelinks installed in the customers telephone exchange.

Annoyingly my exchange is one without cablelinks currently installed, and I still have 15 months left on my TT contract.


AFAIK BT will buy you out of contract.


Indeed they will, up to £300 covered in early termination charges:

http://home.bt.com/-nbsp/switching-to-bt-broadband-h...

BT Business FTTP 330/50 -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User Dean83
(newbie) Thu 30-Jul-20 12:45:16
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Also seems odd that there is such a difference in price between their G.fast based 'Fibre 150' at £28 and FTTP based 'future fibre 150' at £34.95

BT retail seem to apply the exact same price across the same speed tiers on different technologies ( e.g its the same price for g.fast or FTTP supplied 160/30 and 330/50 speeds )

is there a big difference in price at the openreach end for the circuit?
Standard User CarlTSpeak
(committed) Thu 30-Jul-20 13:17:33
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Wangmaster] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Wangmaster:
In reply to a post by CarlTSpeak:
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
Thanks for link - phone call order only.


Phone call availability check only. Bemusing.

I assume it's because they can't just go by the openreach checker, as it also relies on TT having cablelinks installed in the customers telephone exchange.


If their internal staff can carry out the checks no reason why they can't deliver those results via a web page to the public.

I'd suggest they've rushed this launch and haven't built the functionality into the public-facing checker yet.

Which remains bemusing and the only real thought is that their internal systems are a mess as if they were any cop delivering those results to the public would be easy.

Building better networks, not just faster ones.
Standard User CarlTSpeak
(committed) Thu 30-Jul-20 13:18:38
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Dean83] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Dean83:
Also seems odd that there is such a difference in price between their G.fast based 'Fibre 150' at £28 and FTTP based 'future fibre 150' at £34.95

BT retail seem to apply the exact same price across the same speed tiers on different technologies ( e.g its the same price for g.fast or FTTP supplied 160/30 and 330/50 speeds )

is there a big difference in price at the openreach end for the circuit?


Yes. Check the Openreach price lists for the respective products.

Building better networks, not just faster ones.
Standard User Dean83
(newbie) Thu 30-Jul-20 14:23:08
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: CarlTSpeak] [link to this post]
 
looking at the price lists:

160/30 FTTP openreach rental - £253.68 Per year( no requirement for PSTN rental )
160/30 G.fast £137.88 Per year, Plus LLU rental for PSTN at £85.38 = £223.26

and not currently in use my many suppliers yet :

160/30 SoG.fast - £223.02 per year ( no PSTN service )

so yeah i see there is a slight difference, and not much profit margin so i can see why they are charging different prices.
Standard User CarlTSpeak
(committed) Thu 30-Jul-20 14:47:17
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Dean83] [link to this post]
 
Yeah indeed. Chuck the 20% VAT on top of that and it increases the gap.

Building better networks, not just faster ones.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Tue 25-Aug-20 12:38:30
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Dean83] [link to this post]
 
TalkTalk Business are now selling Openreach based FTTP services. Prices are a bit more than their Residential sibling but they offer better support, static IPs etc.

https://postimg.cc/jnyVS6Tq

At present their phone service on FTTP is copper based so not possible to get this if you don't have a copper feed (eg new build) but they're looking to roll out a VOIP service by early next year. So TalkTalk Residential should follow suit.

https://www.talktalkbusiness.co.uk/products/business...

BT Business FTTP 330/50 Mbps -- Asus RT-AX89X
Standard User APTMAN
(member) Tue 25-Aug-20 12:47:58
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Remember 'TalkTalk Business' you need to add VAT on those prices.

Hope there support is better than there Business sales as they have not answered my emails about FTTP sent a month ago.

Edited by APTMAN (Tue 25-Aug-20 12:53:17)

Standard User candlerb
(experienced) Tue 25-Aug-20 13:35:47
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: APTMAN] [link to this post]
 
Also remember that Talktalk doesn't give you IPv6.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Tue 25-Aug-20 13:37:42
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: APTMAN] [link to this post]
 
Yep those prices are ex vat.

At present their full fibre Sales team is separate from their regular sales dept, you’re better off calling them to get a quick answer.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 Mbps -- Asus RT-AX89X
Standard User Highland76
(member) Tue 25-Aug-20 13:43:31
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
IPv6 is only a must have if you can’t use your connection without it, typically those working in IT. For the majority of users, a static (or multiple) ipv4’s is perfectly adequate.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 Mbps -- Asus RT-AX89X

Edited by Highland76 (Tue 25-Aug-20 14:17:52)

Standard User APTMAN
(member) Tue 25-Aug-20 14:57:53
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by candlerb:
Also remember that Talktalk doesn't give you IPv6.

Happy with my block of IP4's I have .
At least I can understand them better.
Standard User jpm
(regular) Tue 25-Aug-20 15:50:24
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
TalkTalk Business are now selling Openreach based FTTP services. Prices are a bit more than their Residential sibling but they offer better support, static IPs etc.

https://postimg.cc/jnyVS6Tq

At present their phone service on FTTP is copper based so not possible to get this if you don't have a copper feed (eg new build) but they're looking to roll out a VOIP service by early next year. So TalkTalk Residential should follow suit.

https://www.talktalkbusiness.co.uk/products/business...


That's very good pricing
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Tue 25-Aug-20 16:56:46
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: CarlTSpeak] [link to this post]
 
Maybe they have to look up the results on a photocopied set of pages

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User jpm
(regular) Wed 09-Sep-20 17:12:22
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Does anybody know if TalkTalk Business use PPPoE on their GEA (FTTC/FTTP) services, or whether it's like their home broadband that is just ethernet and DHCP to assign an address?
Standard User Highland76
(member) Wed 09-Sep-20 17:28:00
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: jpm] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jpm:
Does anybody know if TalkTalk Business use PPPoE on their GEA (FTTC/FTTP) services, or whether it's like their home broadband that is just ethernet and DHCP to assign an address?


TTB use PPPoE. They gave me the login credentials over the phone for their Fibre 900 service so that I can use my own router - this is going live next Thursday. Though a bit miffed they're taking 2 weeks to provision a new FTTP circuit on an already active 4 port ONT when Giganet and Trunk Networks did the same within 48hrs. But it is what it is.

IIRC I was also using PPPoE on their FTTC service up until 2017, again I was using my own router.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 Mbps -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User jpm
(regular) Wed 09-Sep-20 18:12:36
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for confirming. I assume the use of PPPoE is related to having wholesale customers on the network and needing to split the realms up to pass to different RADIUS servers, but that's just a guess.

Have you tried using baby jumbo frames on a TTB GEA service?
Standard User Highland76
(member) Wed 09-Sep-20 18:25:21
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: jpm] [link to this post]
 
Could never get a MTU of 1500 to work on TTB FTTC but will try on their FTTP service and let you know.

BT Business FTTP 330/50 Mbps -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User burble
(committed) Wed 09-Sep-20 20:02:37
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
Maybe they have to look up the results on a photocopied set of pages


After my recent contact with them, I'd say more likely hand written with a quill pen.
Standard User Ixel
(committed) Wed 09-Sep-20 23:04:47
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Even with VAT on top that's not far from half the price I'm paying Cerberus at the moment for the gigabit package (120Mbps upload). Obviously TTB don't go via BT Wholesale though, so costs are cheaper. When my contract term is finished, and if overall feedback seems fine, I might switch.
Standard User donka
(newbie) Mon 14-Sep-20 17:50:27
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Ixel] [link to this post]
 
Is anyone here running TT FTTP and if so, would you recommend? I'm currently with Plusnet for the past 12 year who to be fair have been excellent with a rock solid connection. Happy with my current FTTC connection but they don't offer FTTP so considering the switch to the TT 500MBPS package for not much more money.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Mon 14-Sep-20 18:40:22
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
I'll let you know on Thu when I go live ๐Ÿ˜‹

BT Business FTTP 330/50 Mbps -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User Pheasant
(member) Mon 14-Sep-20 21:10:00
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
I'll let you know on Thu when I go live ๐Ÿ˜‹

Let us know how it goes when something breaks, how they fayre!

I’ve renewed with Cerberus for another 12 months on my (recently native) FTTP, and they have in all honesty been great in the initial 12 month term, and generally very responsive when things have gone wrong or needed errr fixing, but it’s always good to know how well other suppliers are performing smile

I did look at TTB last month for a LL install in London but couldn’t get in the ballpark.
Standard User donka
(newbie) Tue 15-Sep-20 11:59:26
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
I'll let you know on Thu when I go live ๐Ÿ˜‹


Yes, please keep us posted how the initial install goes and connection speed.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Wed 16-Sep-20 16:07:44
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
Went live a day early on TalkTalk Business, speeds are great:

My Broadband Speed Test

Speedtest.net

https://www.speedtest.net/result/10093510696

The above speedtests are on the supplied TT Wifi Hub, all wired. Results over wifi 5 are only 100-200 Mbps, I will try my Netgear wifi 6 router later on. But so far very pleased on TT smile

Edit: I should add as I already have an active ONT (4 port), TalkTalk activated their service remotely, on port 2 of the ONT. Port 1 has the BT FTTP line (330/50)

BT Business FTTP 330/50 Mbps -- Netgear RAX200

Edited by Highland76 (Wed 16-Sep-20 16:22:20)

Standard User donka
(newbie) Wed 16-Sep-20 16:43:07
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
Went live a day early on TalkTalk Business, speeds are great:

My Broadband Speed Test

Speedtest.net

https://www.speedtest.net/result/10093510696

The above speedtests are on the supplied TT Wifi Hub, all wired. Results over wifi 5 are only 100-200 Mbps, I will try my Netgear wifi 6 router later on. But so far very pleased on TT smile

Edit: I should add as I already have an active ONT (4 port), TalkTalk activated their service remotely, on port 2 of the ONT. Port 1 has the BT FTTP line (330/50)


So which package are you on? Is the bottom row your figures in that image?
Standard User Highland76
(member) Wed 16-Sep-20 17:00:31
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
I’m on Fibre 900 (FTTP 1000/115).

BT Business FTTP 330/50 Mbps -- Netgear RAX200
Standard User donka
(newbie) Wed 16-Sep-20 17:31:46
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
I’m on Fibre 900 (FTTP 1000/115).


Thanks. TT are calling me back Friday to follow up so please keep us posted over the next day or two and enjoy your new speeds! ๐Ÿ‘
Standard User Highland76
(member) Wed 16-Sep-20 20:06:43
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Speeds over wifi 6 looking good as well smile

My Broadband Speed Test

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Thu 17-Sep-20 19:49:25
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
Edit: I should add as I already have an active ONT (4 port), TalkTalk activated their service remotely, on port 2 of the ONT. Port 1 has the BT FTTP line (330/50)
That's just cruelty to (many) other readers.
๐Ÿ˜๐Ÿ˜Ž๐Ÿฑ‍๐Ÿ๐Ÿงจ๐ŸŽก๐Ÿคฃ

Edited by RobertoS (Thu 17-Sep-20 19:51:37)

Standard User Highland76
(member) Thu 17-Sep-20 20:19:12
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
In reply to a post by Highland76:
Edit: I should add as I already have an active ONT (4 port), TalkTalk activated their service remotely, on port 2 of the ONT. Port 1 has the BT FTTP line (330/50)
That's just cruelty to (many) other readers.
๐Ÿ˜๐Ÿ˜Ž๐Ÿฑ‍๐Ÿ๐Ÿงจ๐ŸŽก๐Ÿคฃ

Sorry! ๐Ÿคฆ

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User APTMAN
(member) Thu 17-Sep-20 21:24:23
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Is it this one you are on at £108 per /M ?.

https://www.talktalk.co.uk/business/product/fibre


It states.
'Your own connection that's not shared'
If you are connected to a 'PON' then it will be 'Shared' surely .
Standard User donka
(newbie) Thu 17-Sep-20 21:26:53
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
I’m on Fibre 900 (FTTP 1000/115).


All going well these past couple of days?
Standard User Highland76
(member) Thu 17-Sep-20 22:12:52
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: APTMAN] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by APTMAN:
Is it this one you are on at £108 per /M ?.

https://www.talktalk.co.uk/business/product/fibre


It states.
'Your own connection that's not shared'
If you are connected to a 'PON' then it will be 'Shared' surely .

No, that's their leased line product which is a totally different product. And yes leased lines really can offer uncontended service to the CP's network but you pay handsomely for this.

I'm on their Openreach 1 Gig FTTP service which at present can only be ordered through telesales and is £59.95/m + vat for a data only service.:

https://www.talktalkbusiness.co.uk/products/business...

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User Highland76
(member) Thu 17-Sep-20 22:15:12
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by donka:
In reply to a post by Highland76:
I’m on Fibre 900 (FTTP 1000/115).


All going well these past couple of days?


Yep, so far seeing speeds of 800+ Mbps day & night. BQM looks solid as well, no complaints at all smile

https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/monitoring/...

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User donka
(newbie) Thu 17-Sep-20 22:22:38
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
In reply to a post by donka:
In reply to a post by Highland76:
I’m on Fibre 900 (FTTP 1000/115).


All going well these past couple of days?


Yep, so far seeing speeds of 800+ Mbps day & night. BQM looks solid as well, no complaints at all smile

https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/monitoring/...


Nice, thanks for the update. ๐Ÿ‘
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Fri 18-Sep-20 00:44:18
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
smile
There were lots of our recently-available ๐Ÿ˜‚s.

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connections: OnePlus 8 Pro max 165Mbps down, 24Mbps up on Three, and B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
========================
To argue with mindless bigots is foolish.
Standard User APTMAN
(member) Fri 18-Sep-20 10:18:35
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Thanks, there website very confusing.

At £59.95/m + that's a lot better that what Eclipse Business want for there 160/30
Is the £59.95/m + on offer or is that the long term price ?.

Is there a VOIP phone service with this or was that on the BT Business line or both ?.

Re ''Edit: I should add as I already have an active ONT (4 port), TalkTalk activated their service remotely, on port 2 of the ONT. Port 1 has the BT FTTP line (330/50)''


Can you just expand on this .

1... 4 port ONT ... Are these the the Ethernet ports ?
2.. So you only have 1 x Fibre port ?
3.. Both services are routed via the one Fibre, one to port 1 and the other on port 2 ?.

Edited by APTMAN (Fri 18-Sep-20 10:26:49)

Standard User candlerb
(fountain of knowledge) Fri 18-Sep-20 10:30:12
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: APTMAN] [link to this post]
 
A 4-port ONT allows up to four separate ISP services to be delivered. They *are* ethernet ports, but they are for the WAN uplinks for up to four different routers.

This means you can buy additional FTTP services, even from different ISPs, without new fibres being pulled into your building.

Unfortunately, 4-port ONTs are no longer being supplied, so this isn't possible unless you are a legacy FTTP customer.
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Fri 18-Sep-20 10:39:18
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: APTMAN] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by APTMAN:
3.. Both services are routed via the one Fibre, one to port 1 and the other on port 2 ?.

And you are sharing the PON (one fibre out of your premises), so you can't max out both ISPs at the same time.

21 years of broadband connectivity since 1999 trial - Live BQM
Standard User candlerb
(fountain of knowledge) Fri 18-Sep-20 10:48:52
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
And you are sharing the PON (one fibre out of your premises), so you can't max out both ISPs at the same time.


The PON isn't the limit here. The PON bandwidth is 2.4G down, 1.2G up (shared by all the users connected to the same splitter).

However, I have heard suggestions that the old 4-port ONT had an internal 1G connection to the CPU, such that the total bandwidth to all four ethernet ports could not exceed 1G.
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Fri 18-Sep-20 10:53:42
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by candlerb:
The PON isn't the limit here. The PON bandwidth is 2.4G down, 1.2G up (shared by all the users connected to the same splitter).
Oops, thanks!

However, I have heard suggestions that the old 4-port ONT had an internal 1G connection to the CPU, such that the total bandwidth to all four ethernet ports could not exceed 1G.

I was thinking a 1G limit between Ethernet and PON. Given how little hardware today supports anything faster than 1G, I wouldn't be surprised. Maybe faster (2.5 Gbit?) will come in time.

21 years of broadband connectivity since 1999 trial - Live BQM
Standard User candlerb
(fountain of knowledge) Fri 18-Sep-20 11:00:10
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
It's moot, because they are not supplying 4-port ONTs any more - presumably a cost-saving measure since most users don't take multiple services. However it's annoying for those of us who do want to, and especially when the CBT or splitter has no free ports.

CPUs and switches with 2.5G ports do exist, e.g. see this block diagram of a Mikrotik router:
https://i.mt.lv/cdn/product_files/RB4011iGSplusRM_18...
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Fri 18-Sep-20 11:10:07
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
Yes, I realise you can buy, but not much equipment yet supports. So it’s either expensive at the chip level or just not seen as needed.

I was thinking of the designers of the ONT internals.
As you say a moot point as the 4 port has now gone.

Similar issue with Virgin Media’s gig1 service that is configured for 1.1 Gbit on the DOCSIS side, but only a 1G Ethernet port.

21 years of broadband connectivity since 1999 trial - Live BQM
Standard User Highland76
(member) Fri 18-Sep-20 11:12:42
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: APTMAN] [link to this post]
 
The £59.95/m (+vat) price is an introductory price and is fixed for 24 months. I've been told their regular prices will be at least an extra tenner each month. Its a data only service, voice is an extra £10/m but the voice part is over copper, until they release voip sometime in early 2021.

https://postimg.cc/jnyVS6Tq

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User Highland76
(member) Fri 18-Sep-20 11:18:41
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by candlerb:
However, I have heard suggestions that the old 4-port ONT had an internal 1G connection to the CPU, such that the total bandwidth to all four ethernet ports could not exceed 1G.


I'm seeing max speeds on both lines simultaneously (~ 310 & ~ 900 Mbps) though I'm not sure if the 4 port ONT could cope with multiple Gigabit lines. The fact that I'm the only one with FTTP in my street probably helps a lot - I had FoD installed in 2017 when neighbouring properties were not enabled with 'native' FTTP on the back of my FoD build.

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test

Edited by Highland76 (Fri 18-Sep-20 11:24:48)

Standard User kitcat
(experienced) Fri 18-Sep-20 11:52:04
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
candlerb

I think each port has a 1G connection to the CPU, the CPU can handle more than 1G (depending on packet size, small packets will lower the limit considerably as seen when running multiple VOIP services).

The CPU has to handle at least 2.5G to filter out the packets for your ONT port (s) as this is the 'line rate' the PON is working at.
Standard User Pheasant
(member) Sun 20-Sep-20 21:40:49
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
As you say a moot point as the 4 port has now gone.

Given the 4-port ONT is defunct, what is current means of delivering more than one FTTP service to a single dwelling as with Highland76's situation?

Do OR install another passive splitter in the premises and then hang both (or more!) ONTs off it or do they drop another cable from the CBT (yuck)?
Standard User dect
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 20-Sep-20 21:46:57
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Pheasant] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Pheasant:
do they drop another cable from the CBT (yuck)?
Assuming there is a spare CBT port.
Standard User Pheasant
(member) Sun 20-Sep-20 21:52:41
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by dect:
In reply to a post by Pheasant:
do they drop another cable from the CBT (yuck)?
Assuming there is a spare CBT port.

£7.68 from fs.com. Sorted! (I jest by the way)

https://www.fs.com/uk/products/30072.html
Standard User Highland76
(member) Mon 21-Sep-20 00:29:05
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Pheasant] [link to this post]
 
I don’t believe the 4 port ONT is *completely* extinct as Openreach still carry a limited supply either to replace the existing installed kit or in rare cases replace the single port one where someone wants more than 1 FTTP service - would certainly be less hassle than running new fibre(s) and installing additional ONT(s). I have the old style CSP fed by blown fibre tubing (BFT) with 3 spare fibres available. That means technically I could have up to 16 FTTP services running simultaneously ( 4 x 4 port ont) without the need to run/blow extra fibre from the DP/CBT to the CSP. Not that I ever see that happening!

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Mon 21-Sep-20 04:47:54
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
I don’t believe the 4 port ONT is *completely* extinct as Openreach still carry a limited supply

We have the original Huawei ONT that has 4 data ports and 2 phone ports and I know loads of engineers working in my area before this Covid issue still had them in their van still boxed up unused.

Paul

Standard User candlerb
(fountain of knowledge) Mon 21-Sep-20 08:09:08
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
I asked for one at FTTPoD installation time a year ago - they said they could not provide them for new installs. But they did agree to pull a second fibre from the pavement chamber.

I very much doubt that they'd use an on-site splitter, because of the light losses. I believe it would have to be another cable back to the CBT, hence going to a different port on the main splitter. If the CBT or the splitter is full, you are out of luck.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Thu 24-Sep-20 09:30:50
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by donka:
Thanks. TT are calling me back Friday to follow up so please keep us posted over the next day or two and enjoy your new speeds! ๐Ÿ‘


Did you end up joining them?

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User donka
(newbie) Thu 24-Sep-20 09:49:21
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
Did you end up joining them?


Yup. Had site survey yesterday and engineer due 6th Oct for go live. Hopefully it all goes smoothly but also keeping my current FTTC for a month to ensure TT are stable.
Standard User Highland76
(member) Thu 24-Sep-20 09:53:20
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by donka:
In reply to a post by Highland76:
Did you end up joining them?


Yup. Had site survey yesterday and engineer due 6th Oct for go live. Hopefully it all goes smoothly but also keeping my current FTTC for a month to ensure TT are stable.


Hope it all goes well! ๐Ÿคž

Which FTTP speed did you go for?

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User donka
(newbie) Thu 24-Sep-20 10:02:22
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
Hope it all goes well! ๐Ÿคž

Which FTTP speed did you go for?


Cheers. Fastest home option they currently offer which is the 500Mbps.
Standard User zag164
(learned) Thu 24-Sep-20 15:38:22
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
I'm also very interested to hear what the performance is like. I read in the TT forums that Future Fibre users are unable access their accounts online as it requires a phone no to log in (which TT don't offer with Future Fibre!). It doesn't sound very well thought through to me but their pricing is very competitive. This swayed me to BT but my install date is not until 15th October.
Standard User Highland76
(committed) Fri 25-Sep-20 09:09:36
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: APTMAN] [link to this post]
 
FTTP prices are now shown on the TTB website (all ex-vat)

https://www.talktalkbusiness.co.uk/products/business...

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Mon 05-Oct-20 16:36:20
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: CarlTSpeak] [link to this post]
 
They finally added an online availability checker.

https://cloud.consumer.talktalk.co.uk/fttp-form

It says it's (still) not available to me.

I called up to query just in case. The guy on the phone tells me if it isn't available my property must still be within BT's 5 year exclusivity period and i need to wait for Talktalk to get a license to sell it in my area.

I do wonder if they are actually trained with answers like that or if they just make it up.
I politely corrected him.
Standard User candlerb
(fountain of knowledge) Mon 05-Oct-20 17:01:07
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
FTTP prices are now shown on the TTB website (all ex-vat)

https://www.talktalkbusiness.co.uk/products/business...


Ha, this feature made me smile: "FREE Dynamic IP available" !!

(No thanks, I prefer my Internet access with no IP address. Much more secure)
Standard User Highland76
(committed) Mon 05-Oct-20 18:01:21
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by candlerb:
In reply to a post by Highland76:
FTTP prices are now shown on the TTB website (all ex-vat)

https://www.talktalkbusiness.co.uk/products/business...


Ha, this feature made me smile: "FREE Dynamic IP available" !!

(No thanks, I prefer my Internet access with no IP address. Much more secure)

They charge £1/m for a static IPv4 (used to be free) which is why I think they’re making a big song & dance about offering a free dynamic IP....yeah made me chuckle as well ๐Ÿ˜‚

Anyway connection is rock solid, seeing 800-900 Mbps day & night, no complaints at all. BQM looks great:

https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/monitoring/...

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User jpm
(member) Mon 05-Oct-20 18:22:10
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
A free dynamic IP is better than you get with Hyperoptic as standard wink
Standard User candlerb
(fountain of knowledge) Mon 05-Oct-20 18:27:32
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: jpm] [link to this post]
 
I guess you mean they stick you behind a CGN? OK, that sucks smile
Standard User jpm
(member) Mon 05-Oct-20 19:53:56
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
Yes, as standard they use CGNAT which seems to have really low-quality IP addresses in use on the gateways.

At least they provide IPv6 but it would be nice if their IPv6 as standard was a static allocation, rather than having to pay £5/month just to get a real IPv4 address and a static v6.
Standard User burble
(committed) Mon 05-Oct-20 23:38:19
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
The 'Future Fibre' team are trained to [censored] to the extreme, I've been offered FTTP three times then had it cancelled. I have a theory after a small slip from one operative. On exchanges like mine with limited capacity, they are happy to take new customers, but reluctant to upgrade existing customers.
Standard User Highland76
(committed) Tue 06-Oct-20 03:50:33
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
Sorry to hear they gave you the run around but I had zero issues ordering the service. It’s the same team dealing with both residential and business orders at present.

My only ‘complaint’ with them was that it took 2 weeks to go live when Openreach can activate a new FTTP circuit on an existing ONT (4 port) within 48 hrs like it’s been done previously on my line. But a very minor issue in the grand scheme of things smile

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test

Edited by Highland76 (Tue 06-Oct-20 10:09:27)

Standard User Highland76
(committed) Wed 07-Oct-20 07:23:11
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
Gone live yet?

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User donka
(newbie) Wed 07-Oct-20 08:08:54
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
Gone live yet?


Unfortunately not. Should have been yesterday but Openreach could not get the new cable through the current ground trunking as it was blocked. I’m expecting an update today on when they will be out to clear it.
Standard User Highland76
(committed) Wed 07-Oct-20 08:31:43
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by donka:
In reply to a post by Highland76:
Gone live yet?


Unfortunately not. Should have been yesterday but Openreach could not get the new cable through the current ground trunking as it was blocked. I’m expecting an update today on when they will be out to clear it.


Sorry to hear that, hope it gets resolved soon.

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User donka
(newbie) Wed 07-Oct-20 10:23:55
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
In reply to a post by donka:
In reply to a post by Highland76:
Gone live yet?


Unfortunately not. Should have been yesterday but Openreach could not get the new cable through the current ground trunking as it was blocked. I’m expecting an update today on when they will be out to clear it.


Sorry to hear that, hope it gets resolved soon.


Cheers. No issue as I still have my FTTC connection at the moment so just need to be patient until OR get the blockage cleared.
Standard User donka
(newbie) Mon 26-Oct-20 17:00:56
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
Quick update.
TT were waiting on Openreach who needed a dig team to come out and investigate. Initial estimate was before the 19 Jan! Got an update over the weekend that this was now expected on 15th Nov. Out of frustration I bought myself a flexible grab tool and took it upon myself to clear the blockage from the underground ducting myself. Managed to get it cleared today after removing about 30 stones - we had the garden done last year and this section was finished with decorative stone chips but a number of them found their way inside the duct creating the blockage. Surprised the OR engineer didn't have suitable tools to clear it himself but long story short, it's now cleared and I updated TT today so hopefully get word when the engineer can come back out to route the fibre soon.
The things you need to do... smile
Standard User dect
(fountain of knowledge) Mon 26-Oct-20 17:55:52
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by donka:
I bought myself a flexible grab tool and took it upon myself to clear the blockage from the underground ducting myself.
Have you a link to the flexible grab tool you bought smile
Standard User donka
(newbie) Mon 26-Oct-20 17:59:16
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
Yup, it was this one:

https://www.toolstation.com/magnetic-pick-up-tool/p7...
Standard User dect
(fountain of knowledge) Mon 26-Oct-20 18:02:06
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by donka:
Yup, it was this one:

https://www.toolstation.com/magnetic-pick-up-tool/p7...
Thanks, may have a few uses for that wink
Standard User burble
(committed) Mon 26-Oct-20 21:12:18
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
We have them in the toolbox, never a good idea to leave a dropped bolt, or whatever, floating about in a aircraft.
Lucky you getting sorted, I've given up on TT, they can't answer what should be the most simple of questions, and when they think I'm a new customer (on my exchange) they offer FTTP, but when it goes further the order gets cancelled.
We are now considering moving from this house into one we built a few years back, once we have got some changes made to it, so a two year contract is out of question.
Standard User Holloway
(newbie) Tue 27-Oct-20 13:48:35
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Dean83] [link to this post]
 
Have many people signed up for TalkTalk's Openreach FTTP? I'm with BT and have been for nearly 3 years. I'm tempted to switch to their 500 package as it's £10 cheaper than BT. I was on BT's 300 package and upgraded as was out of contract, but I'm not seeing anywhere near 500 over WiFi when I was consistently getting 300 over WiFi on my old package. Not worth 49.99 in my opinion!

I'm also worried that my connection might drop or TT's backhaul isn't as reliable as BT's. I've not had any drop outs or issues with BT so far and I've never had to contact support.

What's the switch like from BT to TT? Is there any downtime?
What's the router like that's provided from TT? What's the model?
Standard User gary333
(experienced) Tue 27-Oct-20 14:06:21
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Holloway] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Holloway:
Have many people signed up for TalkTalk's Openreach FTTP? I'm with BT and have been for nearly 3 years. I'm tempted to switch to their 500 package as it's £10 cheaper than BT. I was on BT's 300 package and upgraded as was out of contract, but I'm not seeing anywhere near 500 over WiFi when I was consistently getting 300 over WiFi on my old package. Not worth 49.99 in my opinion!

I'm also worried that my connection might drop or TT's backhaul isn't as reliable as BT's. I've not had any drop outs or issues with BT so far and I've never had to contact support.

What's the switch like from BT to TT? Is there any downtime?
What's the router like that's provided from TT? What's the model?


Getting 500mbps over WiFi isn't very easy and most equipment won't be able to do this.

Most 2x2 AC WiFi cards top out at around 866mbps, however that is full duplex. As WiFi is half duplex the maximum speed is actually half this at around 433mbps. Added (well reduced) from this are overheads. I don't think you'd get more than 95% of the above 433mbps which then leaves you in best case at 390mbps. Then conitnue to add in distance from the router (as you'd only get the 390mbps really close to the router) and you can see where this is going. After all this you've then got interference from other networks. This all adds up to give WiFi quite the bottle neck for a 500mbps connection.

Of course, there is now WiFi 6, and there were also 3x3 AC cards etc, but these are not that common.
Standard User Holloway
(newbie) Tue 27-Oct-20 14:58:30
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: gary333] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by gary333:
In reply to a post by Holloway:
Have many people signed up for TalkTalk's Openreach FTTP? I'm with BT and have been for nearly 3 years. I'm tempted to switch to their 500 package as it's £10 cheaper than BT. I was on BT's 300 package and upgraded as was out of contract, but I'm not seeing anywhere near 500 over WiFi when I was consistently getting 300 over WiFi on my old package. Not worth 49.99 in my opinion!

I'm also worried that my connection might drop or TT's backhaul isn't as reliable as BT's. I've not had any drop outs or issues with BT so far and I've never had to contact support.

What's the switch like from BT to TT? Is there any downtime?
What's the router like that's provided from TT? What's the model?


Getting 500mbps over WiFi isn't very easy and most equipment won't be able to do this.

Most 2x2 AC WiFi cards top out at around 866mbps, however that is full duplex. As WiFi is half duplex the maximum speed is actually half this at around 433mbps. Added (well reduced) from this are overheads. I don't think you'd get more than 95% of the above 433mbps which then leaves you in best case at 390mbps. Then conitnue to add in distance from the router (as you'd only get the 390mbps really close to the router) and you can see where this is going. After all this you've then got interference from other networks. This all adds up to give WiFi quite the bottle neck for a 500mbps connection.

Of course, there is now WiFi 6, and there were also 3x3 AC cards etc, but these are not that common.


This is exactly my logic for the 500 product not being worth 49.99. BT are offering their 300 product to new customers for 39.99 but they won't let me choose that, only 500 for 49.99. There doesn't seem to be much point in paying BT 49.99 when I could pay 39.99 to TalkTalk and still get 300 easily on WiFi.
Standard User gary333
(experienced) Tue 27-Oct-20 15:02:44
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Holloway] [link to this post]
 
If you wanted to make use of the 500mbps you could by utilising a network cable and/or upgrading you WiFi, so I don't think £10 extra is unreasonable, however it comes down to use cases.

If people don't need 300mbps, then they also don't need 500mbps, so yes, in this case it's a waste of money.
Standard User Highland76
(committed) Tue 27-Oct-20 15:07:36
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: gary333] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by gary333:
Getting 500mbps over WiFi isn't very easy and most equipment won't be able to do this.

Most 2x2 AC WiFi cards top out at around 866mbps, however that is full duplex. As WiFi is half duplex the maximum speed is actually half this at around 433mbps. Added (well reduced) from this are overheads. I don't think you'd get more than 95% of the above 433mbps which then leaves you in best case at 390mbps.


Sorry but that's incorrect. Quite easy to get more than 500 Mbps on 2x2 WiFi ac clients. Its all about the quality of hardware used at both ends and the environment. Its even possible to get over a Gigabit over wifi 5 if using a 1024QAM 4x4 router and pairing that with a 1024 QAM wifi 5 card such as the Asus PCE-AC88U.

This is what I'm consistently getting on an iPhone X (2x2 wifi ac) on a 1 Gig FTTP line, i'm 100% sure the phone isn't breaking any laws of physics.

https://postimg.cc/fJPzY714

And on an iPhone 12 Pro (2x2 wifi ax):

https://postimg.cc/K1gZfky1

Contrary to popular opinion, using a wifi 6 router will even improve speeds on wifi 5 clients as the wifi 6 chipsets used offer better performance on legacy clients than previous wifi 5 & wifi 4 chipsets. I would also recommend using a proper high end 4x4+ consumer router (even as additional APs) rather than 2x2 or 3x3 wifi access points as the high end routers massively outperform ceiling mounted APs.

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test

Edited by Highland76 (Tue 27-Oct-20 17:35:17)

Standard User Highland76
(committed) Tue 27-Oct-20 15:37:38
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Holloway] [link to this post]
 
I have both a BT Business* FTTP 330/50 and a TalkTalk Business* FTTP 1000/115 line.

Both perform as expected, seeing speeds of 300+ on the BT line and 800+ on the TT line, both over wired and wifi 6 connections. I've found both BT's and TalkTalk's networks to be very good, no issues at all. This is the TBB BQM on my TalkTalk line:

https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/monitoring/...

TalkTalk supply their 'Wifi Hub' which I've found very good for wired speeds but a bit meh for wireless speeds. Couldn't get more than 300 Mbps over wifi 5 but I prefer using my own router so not a big deal. The Netgear RAX200 which I'm using is light years ahead of the TalkTalk router wrt wifi speeds (with a price tag to match of course!)

*Despite being business products, the underlying Openreach product is the same as the one offered by BT Residential and TalkTalk Residential. The business features such as better SLA, static IPs, 7 day support etc don't actually affect the throughput and are purely extras.

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User busterboy
(committed) Tue 27-Oct-20 16:16:38
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
And on an iPhone 12 Pro (2x2 wifi ax):

https://postimg.cc/K1gZfky1


WOW first time I have seen an iPhone 12 speed tested wired or WiFi.

Quite remarkable if I'm honest. shocked

What hardware does the latest iPhone have to achieve those speeds over the likes of my current iPhone 11 Pro Max, I know they are 5G capable.

BTBroadband
Standard User Highland76
(committed) Tue 27-Oct-20 16:31:29
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: busterboy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by busterboy:
In reply to a post by Highland76:
And on an iPhone 12 Pro (2x2 wifi ax):

https://postimg.cc/K1gZfky1


WOW first time I have seen an iPhone 12 speed tested wired or WiFi.

Quite remarkable if I'm honest. shocked

What hardware does the latest iPhone have to achieve those speeds over the likes of my current iPhone 11 Pro Max, I know they are 5G capable.


Your iPhone 11 Pro Max should be able to achieve similar speeds over wifi 6, I *think* both this years and last years iPhones use the same wifi 6 chipset. I upgraded from an iPhone XS so I was due an upgrade (I usually upgrade every 2-3 years). But if I was in your shoes, I would keep the 11 Pro max as its still a very good phone. My other half will have to stick to her rusty iPhone X though ๐Ÿ˜‚

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User candlerb
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 27-Oct-20 16:46:54
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Holloway] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Holloway:
This is exactly my logic for the 500 product not being worth 49.99. BT are offering their 300 product to new customers for 39.99 but they won't let me choose that, only 500 for 49.99.


It changes, almost daily.

Right now, BT are offering me at https://www.bt.com/broadband/deals

150M: £39.99
300M: £49.99
900M: £59.99

and at https://www.bt.com/campaign/full-fibre

150M: £34.99
300M: £44.99

They don't offer me 500M at all. Nor do they offer me 300M for £39.99 (which you say you have seen).

BT are not the only players in this game now, but it does seem that the 300M level is being squeezed out. Zen residential have cut out everything between 100M (£39) and 500M (£55). Sky will sell you 150M for £35. Talktalk do 150M for £34.95 and 500M for £39.95.

Basically, if you're cost-sensitive, try to live with 150/30. If you want performance, then you can get 500/70 for not much more.

I'm on Cerberus (a business provider), where their 300/50 level still makes sense. It's only marginally more expensive than 150/30, but going up to 450/70 is significantly more expensive.
Standard User gary333
(experienced) Tue 27-Oct-20 19:56:49
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Highland76:
In reply to a post by gary333:
Getting 500mbps over WiFi isn't very easy and most equipment won't be able to do this.

Most 2x2 AC WiFi cards top out at around 866mbps, however that is full duplex. As WiFi is half duplex the maximum speed is actually half this at around 433mbps. Added (well reduced) from this are overheads. I don't think you'd get more than 95% of the above 433mbps which then leaves you in best case at 390mbps.


Sorry but that's incorrect. Quite easy to get more than 500 Mbps on 2x2 WiFi ac clients. Its all about the quality of hardware used at both ends and the environment. Its even possible to get over a Gigabit over wifi 5 if using a 1024QAM 4x4 router and pairing that with a 1024 QAM wifi 5 card such as the Asus PCE-AC88U.

This is what I'm consistently getting on an iPhone X (2x2 wifi ac) on a 1 Gig FTTP line, i'm 100% sure the phone isn't breaking any laws of physics.

https://postimg.cc/fJPzY714

And on an iPhone 12 Pro (2x2 wifi ax):

https://postimg.cc/K1gZfky1

Contrary to popular opinion, using a wifi 6 router will even improve speeds on wifi 5 clients as the wifi 6 chipsets used offer better performance on legacy clients than previous wifi 5 & wifi 4 chipsets. I would also recommend using a proper high end 4x4+ consumer router (even as additional APs) rather than 2x2 or 3x3 wifi access points as the high end routers massively outperform ceiling mounted APs.


This is why I said “most”, i.e. the most common equipment that the average Joe has. Yes, with 160mhz channel width you could double the figures I quoted on AC. However most people have what came with their mid priced / lowish end machines, and as you will know it is cheapo poor performing gear.

I was referring to a 80mhz channel width over AC. Happy for you to point out if my numbers are wrong, however the intent was to demonstrate to the person above talking about Wifi speed being poor. I didn’t say AC couldn’t go higher. I assume you are not using a basic/ISP router, as not many support 160mhz channel width.

Edited by gary333 (Tue 27-Oct-20 19:59:40)

Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 27-Oct-20 20:31:00
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: busterboy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by busterboy:
What hardware does the latest iPhone have to achieve those speeds over the likes of my current iPhone 11 Pro Max, I know they are 5G capable.

The iPhone 11 Pro (and Pro Max), the iPhone SE (2020) and all the iPhone 12 models are WiFi 6 capable. You just need to pair them with a WiFi 6 router and a fast network smile

21 years of broadband connectivity since 1999 trial - Live BQM
Standard User Holloway
(newbie) Tue 27-Oct-20 22:38:04
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by candlerb:
In reply to a post by Holloway:
This is exactly my logic for the 500 product not being worth 49.99. BT are offering their 300 product to new customers for 39.99 but they won't let me choose that, only 500 for 49.99.


It changes, almost daily.

Right now, BT are offering me at https://www.bt.com/broadband/deals

150M: £39.99
300M: £49.99
900M: £59.99

and at https://www.bt.com/campaign/full-fibre

150M: £34.99
300M: £44.99

They don't offer me 500M at all. Nor do they offer me 300M for £39.99 (which you say you have seen).

BT are not the only players in this game now, but it does seem that the 300M level is being squeezed out. Zen residential have cut out everything between 100M (£39) and 500M (£55). Sky will sell you 150M for £35. Talktalk do 150M for £34.95 and 500M for £39.95.

Basically, if you're cost-sensitive, try to live with 150/30. If you want performance, then you can get 500/70 for not much more.

I'm on Cerberus (a business provider), where their 300/50 level still makes sense. It's only marginally more expensive than 150/30, but going up to 450/70 is significantly more expensive.


https://www.bt.com/campaign/full-fibre-240 for 300 at 39.99. BT won’t offer it to existing customers.
Standard User Holloway
(newbie) Fri 13-Nov-20 08:50:04
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Holloway] [link to this post]
 
Just went live on TalkTalk and I'm getting higher speeds than I was on BT.

My Broadband Speed Test

The router supplied isn't bad either and one of the good things is being able to set your own DNS on the router itself.

Edited by Holloway (Fri 13-Nov-20 08:56:52)

Standard User Highland76
(committed) Fri 13-Nov-20 09:13:52
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Holloway] [link to this post]
 
Great speeds! Yeah, the TalkTalk Wifi Hub is an excellent piece of kit, I have the same router on their business service.

Re: DNS, I'm using Oracle DNS (aka Dyn DNS) on TalkTalk Business. I was previously using Cloudflare DNS but got fed up with sporadic outages on their DNS service lately.

https://help.dyn.com/dyn-internet-guide/

TalkTalk Business Fibre 900 -- Netgear RAX200

My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User Holloway
(newbie) Tue 17-Nov-20 21:07:14
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for the DNS tip, I was using CloudFlare too and noticed images not loading on sites and all sorts so I'll give DynDNS a go.

Speeds are exceptional now and I'm getting this on the TalkTalk router on a 2015 MacBook Pro:

My Broadband Speed Test

And all for £40...
Standard User jpm
(member) Tue 17-Nov-20 23:41:00
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Highland76] [link to this post]
 
Do you know how TalkTalk handle an IP block on their Hubs? I am considering getting a business service installed for someone I help out, and I think the best way to try and get the router configured would be to have the /29 block appear on the 'LAN' interface (Wi-Fi, NAT, DHCP, firewall etc. all disabled) and then connect whatever firewall they have currently to this, which should keep things like the admin interface accessible from inside the network to view line stats (this would be FTTC).

I can't really find much information on TalkTalk's website about how their static IP service works - even if there was a single static IP service available with a bridge mode in the Hub that would also be acceptable, as long as there was a way of still accessing the UI to get connection stats like you can on the DrayTek 130 modem.

There's no reason why we couldn't buy a DrayTek modem if that's the easiest way to go, but I quite like the idea of retaining the TalkTalk equipment on the line as it can then be kept updated by them, and will feed all the relevant information back to them so there's no need to swap kit around for testing. This is reliant on it being able to be set up in an appropriate way though, and TTBs product documentation is quite poor.
Standard User donka
(newbie) Tue 24-Nov-20 12:21:52
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
Just an update. After clearing out the duct myself, Openreach were back out two days later to lay the cable then I had to wait for the next available engineer to hook me up which was last Friday.
All up and running now although it quickly showed up the limitations of my powerline adapters at home so spent yesterday running Ethernet cable to my home office and a switch.
Should have done that a long time ago! Got the 500/70 package so happy with the speeds:

https://i.imgur.com/04ut99n.png
Standard User busterboy
(committed) Tue 24-Nov-20 12:26:05
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: donka] [link to this post]
 
Liking that donka. cool

BTBroadband
Standard User burble
(committed) Tue 24-Nov-20 14:00:52
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: busterboy] [link to this post]
 
Funny enough got an offer today of 3(?) months free FTTP if signing up to Future Fibre, this might have offset any early termination charges I might get next year, so phoned them up again.
They still can't sort out porting number to a VOIP provider without terminating FTTC service and no guarantee of date when FTTP would be laid on.
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 24-Nov-20 16:05:17
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by burble:
They still can't sort out porting number to a VOIP provider without terminating FTTC service and no guarantee of date when FTTP would be laid on.


That isn't a Talktalk limitation but an OpenReach 1.

Unless Talktalk are willing to do a renumber with export (which they don't support, and it's a chargeable service).

You will need to overlap the services and port the landline number to VOIP, ceasing the FTTC.
There is no way around it that I can think of.

Unless you specifically port the landline number to VOIP while it's still active then your risk losing it completely.
My last experience of trying to recover a landline number from Talktalk after a service was ceased didn't end well.
The person lost their 30+ year old number.
Standard User burble
(committed) Tue 24-Nov-20 16:39:33
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by j0hn83:
In reply to a post by burble:
They still can't sort out porting number to a VOIP provider without terminating FTTC service and no guarantee of date when FTTP would be laid on.


That isn't a Talktalk limitation but an OpenReach 1.

Unless Talktalk are willing to do a renumber with export (which they don't support, and it's a chargeable service).

You will need to overlap the services and port the landline number to VOIP, ceasing the FTTC.
There is no way around it that I can think of.

Unless you specifically port the landline number to VOIP while it's still active then your risk losing it completely.
My last experience of trying to recover a landline number from Talktalk after a service was ceased didn't end well.
The person lost their 30+ year old number.


I did ask about ordering FTTP as a second service, that just seemed to cause more confusion.
If they offered a VOIP service like BT, SKY, or even TTB, it wouldn't be a problem.
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 24-Nov-20 16:45:53
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
Just order FTTP as a new customer.

Port the landline number to VOIP when the FTTP goes live which ceases all existing Talktalk services.

You could try timing the porting date to be just after the FTTP is due to go live but that risks having no service if the FTTP install is delayed.
I'd personally port the landline number the day the data only FTTP service and live. Should only give a 2 week overlap of services.

It couldn't be done as a migration as you would completely lose the landline number by moving to a data only service.
Standard User kitcat
(experienced) Tue 24-Nov-20 16:46:50
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
j0hn83

The 30yeard old number would have originally been ported from BT ( or possibly Virgin) as soon as it ceases it reverts to the original range owner and there is no way for TalkTalk to get it back. The original range owner would have been paying OFCOM for the number and Talktalk have to then pay the range owner. They won't keep hold of a number if they are no getting revenue from it. Originally practically all Talktalk numbers were ported from other suppliers.
Standard User burble
(committed) Fri 27-Nov-20 15:59:14
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by j0hn83:
Just order FTTP as a new customer.

Port the landline number to VOIP when the FTTP goes live which ceases all existing Talktalk services.

You could try timing the porting date to be just after the FTTP is due to go live but that risks having no service if the FTTP install is delayed.
I'd personally port the landline number the day the data only FTTP service and live. Should only give a 2 week overlap of services.

It couldn't be done as a migration as you would completely lose the landline number by moving to a data only service.


I asked this with the online support and got no answer, I then phoned Future Fibre team again to see if they had updated their advice, the answer was, they will not support two services to the same address, if I try and order FTTP for my home it detects me as an existing customer and would treat it as a change to FTTP and not allow it as a second service to the home.
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Fri 27-Nov-20 17:33:07
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by burble:
the answer was, they will not support two services to the same address, if I try and order FTTP for my home it detects me as an existing customer and would treat it as a change to FTTP and not allow it as a second service to the home.


Sounds like odd (probably wrong) advice.

I've had 2 separate Talktalk services (I had an ADSL and an FTTC line) and know of a few others who have had 2 separate Talktalk FTTC lines at the same address.

All that was required was a unique email address for each account.
I was even able to use the same payment details for both accounts

If you order FTTP as a new customer with a different email address to your other Talktalk service then they should simply activate it as a new account.

It can't hurt to give it a try.
Just don't mention you already have a Talktalk account and see if they detect it during the ordering process.
If they detect an existing service and prevent the order then no harm done.
My guess is they won't pick up on it and will allow the FTTP order to be placed without affecting the FTTC.

They have recently been promoting 2nd lines for working from home so no idea why they would be blocking a 2nd service.
The Talktalk community forums also have a decent number of posts from users with 2nd Talktalk lines.

As you will have noticed during your enquires Talktalk don't have the best front line support.
Any question you ask that isn't on their script needs passed on to someone else or sometimes they just make up responses.

FTTP still isn't available on my exchange from Talktalk.
The FTTP team advised me my street must still be under BT's exclusivity period (they get 2 years exclusivity apparently) and when that runs out Talktalk will buy the license to sell it in my street.
I asked why could i order with Sky, EE, Zen, Cerberus, Giganet and about a dozen other FTTP ISP's and he said they must be sharing BT's license.
I corrected him, going in to detail on how GEA Cablelinks work and how there's no license or exclusivity period.
I don't believe Talktalk train their staff with that nonsense and believe the rep was making it up as he went.
I would take much of what they tell you with a pinch of salt.
Standard User burble
(committed) Wed 16-Dec-20 23:46:35
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
Well I'm getting a headache from battering my head against a wall.
Spoke to TTB, "yes we can offer you FTTP and keeping your landline".
OK that's good.
"No need to write this down, I'll send you a email with the offer and t&c's"
Great.
No email.
Couple of days later, after checking website for what was on offer on my line, got phone call from TTB (non FTTP), I explain and am transferred to FTTP team, spoke to same operator, "Ah I spelt email wrong, I'll send it again"
No email.
Once again couple of days later I'm checking website as couple of things seemed odd, and again get call from 'non FTTP'. we chat and he sends me a blank email to check, and promises to pass this on the FTTP team,
Couple of days later still no email, is their service really that bad?
From what I recall of first phone call, to retain my landline number they will supply FTTC and FTTP, 100/20(145/25) plus anytime landline/mobile calls @£48/month on two year contract, there may, (or may not) be in t&c's option to transfer to new address mid contract.
Standard User Banger
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 17-Dec-20 00:25:45
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
Yes CS is pretty rubbish at TTB as I have found out. I accidentally ordered a new broadband and phone line whilst trying to upgrade my current package with Talk Talk Biz. I cancelled the order within the cooling-off period realising my mistake but they sent me a router. I asked CS to send me a returns packet for the router, they sent another router. I give up!

I am waiting to see if an Openreach Engineer turns up this morning to fit my second line. I have left numerous tickets to cancel his visit. We will see.

Tim
talktalkbusiness.net & freenetname
TTB Router, Asus RT-AC68U and ZyXEL VMG1312-B10A Bridge on 80/20 Meg Fibre
Speed Test

Highest Sync: 79993/19661

BQM
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 17-Dec-20 14:08:32
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
That's such a fudge.

If you need to keep the landline number and need to upgrade to FTTP then just pick another ISP or take your landline number elsewhere.

Talktalk do no provide a landline with FTTP.
They do not sell a landline service on its own.
Taking out a separate FTTC and FTTP package is such a fudge. It's going to cost you more in the longer term particularly when the minimum term for whatever deal they just offered you runs out.

I wouldn't trust Talktalk as far as i could throw them to not lose your landline number during all this.
They have already told you that your couldn't order both. Now you magically can.

Why why why do you need to recontract your FTTC to order FTTP???? Doesn't that sound wrong to you that they want to lock you back in to a minimum term on 1 product just so you can order a completely different product that in no way relies on the other?

That's £48 a month for 24 months. That's a mad price to pay Talktalk.
You can get BT's 1000/115 package for £49.99 much of the time.
You could also take the Talktalk FTTP and a £12 a month landline only from BT for cheaper.

Is there any reason you are so determined to keep the landline number with Talktalk?
Standard User burble
(committed) Thu 17-Dec-20 15:28:38
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
Here's what I'm looking at.
Can't wean GF off TT email, so if I go to another ISP it will cost an additional £5/m.
Need to keep landline number with unlimited UK landline/mobile calls, either with an actual landline or by VIOP.
Anything with a speed of 40Mb plus should be fine.
I've recently looked at 3 options to give me an idea of the market.
Sky 80/20 £27+£8+£5 = £40.
BT 50/10 £28+£15+£5 = £48.
TTB 100/20(145/25) £48.
Ideally I would port number to a VIOP provider such as Sipgate and have a cheap FTTP service, but as the FTTP is not laid from pole to house I could lose internet for a unknown time and with erratic mobile service that's a non runner.
Standard User burble
(committed) Fri 18-Dec-20 16:28:12
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
Jesus effing H Christ, what's so difficult about getting FTTP and keeping present landline number?
So yet another phone call to TTB, what a shambles, passed from pillar to post and no answers.
So I decide to further investigate Sky FTTP. So I want to know the procedure, I'm on FFTC at moment I guess I swap to them and then they upgrade to FTTP, and I believe they offer VIOP, well the website seems a bit sparse on fact for this type of move, so I look for a sales number to discuss my requirements, I cannot find a sales number, it looks like they don't have one for internet.
Meanwhile my extension of TT contract price has come to an end, no notice just a bill, and also notification that next month anytime calls are going up to £14 per month!
Standard User Woolwich
(committed) Fri 18-Dec-20 16:34:34
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by burble:
Jesus effing H Christ, what's so difficult about getting FTTP and keeping present landline number?


Nothing. In fact the best advice was given earlier.
1) Order FTTP from whoever.
2) Wait for live FTTP service
3) Transfer landline number to (for example Sipgate) and automatically cease landline and FTTC service.
4) Enjoy VoIP via FTTP

What seems to be the problem?
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Fri 18-Dec-20 17:33:31
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Woolwich] [link to this post]
 
That could incur a cease fee of the FTTC course.

Mind you, I suppose that could happen however it's done.

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connections: OnePlus 8 Pro max 165Mbps down, 24Mbps up on Three, and B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
========================
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Antoine de Saint-Exupéry.
Standard User clyde123
(member) Fri 18-Dec-20 17:55:44
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: burble] [link to this post]
 
Not exactly on the main topic, but big changes down the road at Talk Talk.
It's in process of a buyout by major shareholder and a "private equity" outfit.
Which might mean it goes through layers of refinancing, getting loaded with debt, broken up and sold off in maybe 3 to 5 years. Then going down the tubes.

The point is - no 'talktalk' email address is safe.
It would be very wise for GF to start changing over to a mainstream email provider sometime soon.
Standard User Woolwich
(committed) Fri 18-Dec-20 18:04:06
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
That could incur a cease fee of the FTTC course.


I _thought_ OP was suggesting s/he was out of contract so there shouldn't be. Long thread so I may have missed a bit! There is €20 ish fee to transfer in a number to Sipgate though.
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Sat 19-Dec-20 00:18:22
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: Woolwich] [link to this post]
 
Some backhaul providers charge a cease fee for completely ceasing the copper service, even when out of contract.
It also applies during certain migrations, even when out of contract.
Some ISP's pass this on to the customer and others take the hit themselves.

I don't believe Talktalk residential charge any cease fees. I'm not certain on that though.
Standard User candlerb
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 26-Jan-21 09:14:39
Print Post

Re: Talk Talk FTTP


[re: candlerb] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by candlerb:
BT are not the only players in this game now, but it does seem that the 300M level is being squeezed out. Zen residential have cut out everything between 100M (£39) and 500M (£55). Sky will sell you 150M for £35. Talktalk do 150M for £34.95 and 500M for £39.95.


Update: Zen have reintroduced the 300M level and added 900M. They are currently offering me:

100M £39
300M £49
500M £56
900M £63
(all with £30 setup fee, no phone service)
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