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Standard User agregson
(newbie) Thu 03-Dec-20 14:43:22
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Moving FTTP from Zen to BT


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After a protracted install taking over 3 months and numerous visits Zen activated FTTP on 20/10. (There were issues getting underground delivery finally resolved after duct was repaired and CBT reassigned). It has had variable performance and was advised that my location (NI) and how Zen deliver backhaul may be a reason why the performance and latency did not compare well with another family member's BT FTTP in same area. Zen agreed to release the line from contract to facilitate a move without penalty - very helpful and generous of them (part of reason I have been a Zen user for over 20 years).

I am in process of moving to BT and wondered how it would happen. When I went to place the order online the checker suggested I could not get digital voice. I spoke to them by phone and they said they would delver a land line service but would need an engineer visit. When the fibre was installed the copper was not brought into the premises and I had the small ONT installed. Others I know on BT FTTP have the larger ONT. The agent taking order said they could see the modem and the system suggested I need an engineer visit "to configure landline services" then I could look at options.

When the order was placed all seemed to happen as planned. I was wondering as I have moved many ADSL and VDSL over the years and wondered how FTTC would work. It appears to be post code linked and BT could detect the modem, serial and type etc. No surprise as this happened during install when the installer called Openreach to activate and confirm the modem.

I am wondering what happens for voice service. I asked the sales people and they said they would not use copper as they do not do that now. My exchange is already listed as ending copper ordering from June 2021 and my whole area has FTTP - every house has access. The sales agent also said there was no option presented to even order a copper based service for my premises - curious.

Does anyone have any experience moving from a data only service such as Zen to a service with digital voice? I am guessing the ONT needs changed to support some sort of split service probably by VLAN or multiple login. The install just completed for another family member has a different ONT and this does support digital voice. I am guessing as Zen were data only they did not have the option or request to install an ONT that would support a BT digital voice service.

Just curious what happens. I retain FTTC so if worst comes to worst an end up with no FTTP I can revert to the 80/20. BT stressed the data would go live on the activation date (14/12) and they would then resolve the voice if needed. I noted the account has a new telephone number allocated so somewhere I am sure the system works. I just dread someone showing up, realising the copper was "stripped back" and the line needs replaced. The original Openreach engineer said he has never been requested to fit an old-style copper with fibre and BT master socket in many months.

I will update when it all happens. Wondered if anyone had any experience.
Standard User candlerb
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 03-Dec-20 14:56:10
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Re: Moving FTTP from Zen to BT


[re: agregson] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by agregson:
I am wondering what happens for voice service. I asked the sales people and they said they would not use copper as they do not do that now. My exchange is already listed as ending copper ordering from June 2021 and my whole area has FTTP - every house has access. The sales agent also said there was no option presented to even order a copper based service for my premises - curious.


In that case it sounds like you'll most likely get BT Digital Voice, rather than them pulling in a new copper line.

Note that it is now possible to order FTTP from BT without voice, but it's not any cheaper, and many of the cheaper deals from BT only come with voice.

You can of course just ignore the BT voice service, and use your FTTC line, or a third-party VOIP service.

In reply to a post by agregson:
I am guessing the ONT needs changed to support some sort of split service probably by VLAN or multiple login.


Nope. BT "Digital Voice" is voice-over-IP from the SH2 router that BT provide. The ONT is not involved (except for providing the Internet access, of course)

In reply to a post by agregson:
The install just completed for another family member has a different ONT and this does support digital voice.


If you mean the ONT has a phone jack, that's not "Digital Voice" - it's the Fibre Voice Adapter (FVA) port, which is a legacy port. It is not used for any new installs, although people currently using FVA can continue to use it.

Edited by candlerb (Thu 03-Dec-20 14:58:07)

Standard User wtfnub
(newbie) Thu 03-Dec-20 19:01:15
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Re: Moving FTTP from Zen to BT


[re: agregson] [link to this post]
 
I’ve just had OR hook me upto FTTP, with Zens 900 package..

For the price I’ve paid for it, it would be good to get more than 200mbps, I’ve seen speeds in the range on 800mbps to 900mbps in speedtests, but thats late at night and early morning, all other times it’s not worth paying for the 900 package, 300mbps package is probably the sweet spot.

The OR engineer who installed it was a clown, he did tell me that bt will only class speed faults if they are 60% slower than the package that they are on, example, 100mbit line would need to be at a minimum of 40mbits before its classed as a fault.

I’m gunna call zen up to moan about the speed, I know that 90% of the internet is not as fast as fttp, but if they cant guarantee ultrafast speeds then why market them, as it’s a much more fault tolerant compared to dsl.


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Standard User candlerb
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 03-Dec-20 21:37:15
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Re: Moving FTTP from Zen to BT


[re: wtfnub] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by wtfnub:
it’s not worth paying for the 900 package, 300mbps package is probably the sweet spot.


Aside: last time I looked, Zen only do 100, 500 and 900. I agree that 300 is more than enough for most people, and it's what I have (on Cerberus). Faster upload would be nice, but I can't justify the extra cost.

In reply to a post by wtfnub:
The OR engineer who installed it was a clown, he did tell me that bt will only class speed faults if they are 60% slower than the package that they are on, example, 100mbit line would need to be at a minimum of 40mbits before its classed as a fault.


BT and Zen are of course not the same, and they will have their own policies.

In reply to a post by wtfnub:
I’m gunna call zen up to moan about the speed, I know that 90% of the internet is not as fast as fttp, but if they cant guarantee ultrafast speeds then why market them, as it’s a much more fault tolerant compared to dsl.


Once you get to such high speeds, you're often limited by the speed of the remote site, and the remote site's ISP (which your ISP has no control over). With all these people running 900M speedtests, the speedtest sites are likely being overloaded with traffic - especially if the server is only connected at 1Gbps.

I've found very few sites which can actually fill even 300 meg. Software updates from Apple are a rare case that can; their CDN (Content Distribution Network) appears to work extremely well.

The main benefit of a gig line is when you have multiple people in the same house or office, all using the Internet heavily at the same time. Nine people people downloading 100Mbps each from different sites is more likely to succeed than one person trying to download 900Mbps from a single site.
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