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Standard User Cockroach
(learned) Mon 05-Apr-21 10:52:14
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Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[link to this post]
 
Is anyone aware of Openreach upgrading apartment blocks as part of a local FTTP rollout?

I can see all the adjacent streets have been upgraded and are taking orders so am concerned my building was missed.

Are Openreach including MDUs during area upgrades or are they handled separately due to wayleave and access issues?

I've tried Hyperoptic as an alternative avenue but they aren't getting any love from the managing agent.

Iain
Standard User Woolwich
(experienced) Mon 05-Apr-21 11:03:32
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Cockroach] [link to this post]
 
Yes. Not twenty story tower blocks but 'walk up' three or four story blocks. I'm sure they count as MDUs, but who knows.
I also know of streets with blocks like this where one or two were missed while others were connected. Again, who knows? (Openreach but they won't tell you.)
Standard User Pheasant
(experienced) Mon 05-Apr-21 11:36:53
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Cockroach] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Cockroach:
I've tried Hyperoptic as an alternative avenue but they aren't getting any love from the managing agent.

The law recently changed to make your life easier...

Telecommunications Infrastructure (Leasehold Property) Act 2021

Edit: apparently, even though the act received royal assent last month, it is not yet fully in force until certain regulations are made to specify conditions that providers need to comply with. However that said, it puts a lot more pressure on landlords to no longer play dumb and actively engage with service providers before they get either dragged into court or face code powers.

My Broadband Speed Test

Edited by Pheasant (Mon 05-Apr-21 11:54:17)


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Standard User Cockroach
(learned) Mon 05-Apr-21 12:48:57
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Woolwich] [link to this post]
 
My block goes up to floor 7 and has 41 flats so it's medium sized. Not sure how that impacts Openreach's rollout plans...

I can't believe a new build in SW London (zone 3) completed in 2019 was only provisioned with standard copper in the first place.

Iain
Standard User Grimers
(learned) Mon 05-Apr-21 16:17:41
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Cockroach] [link to this post]
 
I think it depends on the developer. For example, there are 2 new build areas in my village, one has FTTP, one doesn't.
Standard User Fastman3
(member) Mon 05-Apr-21 17:34:02
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Cockroach] [link to this post]
 
depends when the developer registered the design with Openreach . there are 3 things that could have happened .(1), it was called off / Registered with Openreach pre 2016 then copper was only option (irrelevant when you bought it or it was sold) - . (2) it was possible FTTP site but the developer chose not to fund the FTTP and then had copper only (3) they had and FTTP offer chose not to do it but dedided that FTTC would be suitable (4) they didnt registered it in time and copper was the only option available (driven by when first person occupying - needing Telephony) - This is called the First Occupancy Date
Standard User Cockroach
(learned) Mon 05-Apr-21 19:12:18
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Fastman3] [link to this post]
 
I suspect it was (2) but at believe it was at least considered. I asked the site manager from the construction company who said:

"We do usually get free supply of fibre and install it now in new buildings but it depends on Openreach... they didn’t have the fibre network ready."

The construction probably started in 2016/17 based on planning applications and street view and was handed over in early 2019. No idea when Openreach would have got involved. Frustratingly there is a development exactly opposite on the other side of the main road that was completed less than a year later and has Openreach FTTP and Hyperoptic.

I'm sure if the developer had got Hyperoptic or Community Fibre involved they'd have been much more keen than Openreach to get fibre to the site.

Anyway, was just wondering how Openreach approach these sort of copper-only developments after the fact and how they go about retrofitting when doing the rest of the area.

Iain
Standard User jpm
(member) Tue 06-Apr-21 10:18:53
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Cockroach] [link to this post]
 
I don't think anybody knows. I've not seen any discussion of Openreach plans to serve these buildings since the original plans for G.fast based around remote nodes were being made ~7 years ago.
Standard User Fastman3
(member) Tue 06-Apr-21 10:41:26
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: jpm] [link to this post]
 
i assume that was registered in the period where fibre was no an option or Developer chose least path of resistance
Standard User Fastman3
(member) Tue 06-Apr-21 10:42:51
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Grimers] [link to this post]
 
which is utterly ridiculous so you can see whih one of these will sell easily and one which will generate a shed load of issues -- PS Developer get paid to have infrastrcutre from whoever provides it
Standard User Cockroach
(learned) Tue 06-Apr-21 13:42:30
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: jpm] [link to this post]
 
Well this doesn't sound very promising. I guess I'll just have to keep trying with the managing agent and freeholder's agent. Any advice on that would be appreciated.

Iain
Standard User Mygri
(member) Tue 06-Apr-21 18:04:36
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Cockroach] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Cockroach:
Well this doesn't sound very promising. I guess I'll just have to keep trying with the managing agent and freeholder's agent. Any advice on that would be appreciated.

From my own experience some 7 years ago and taking account of legislation changes in the meantime, I agree that the management and freeholder's agents will be where you will need to apply the pressure.

Ours was a 4 dwelling unit which was a completely refurbished and renovated former industrial building in the far reaches of Cornwall. The management committee was comprised of the dwellings' owners, and the management company was the plot freeholder. Copper was the only available option at the time of renovation, but it was all ducted and made running the fibre into the building very straightforward. Cornwall Council was ahead of the game in getting high speed internet established, and when the fibre rollout started in in our neck of the woods, it didn't take me long to realise that we were being bypassed.

I was at a bit of a loss as to how to deal with this initially. but the good folks on this site got me pointed in the right direction, namely our local BDUK organisation, Superfast Cornwall. After a slow start, they really came good and pulled in Openreach who surveyed the site. I signed off the wayleave on behalf of the management company, and the fibre got run in.

Ironically, by this point, my wife had got fed up with life in a flat, and I (very) reluctantly agreed to move, so didn't feel able to pursue the switch to fibre as it would have risked a substantial payment for the unused portion of the contract. The new owner will have had the full benefit of my efforts!

One aspect I didn't have a chance to get to grips with was fibre distribution within the building. Unfortunately, the telephone lines to the individual flats had not been ducted, and pulling fibre through was not feasible. With only 4 flats, and the new much more flexible fibre starting to become available, it was probably not a major problem, but for your situation, with 7 floors and 41 dwellings it may need careful consideration.

Good Luck!
Standard User Cockroach
(learned) Sat 24-Apr-21 10:37:41
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Mygri] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for all your advice.

I've recently heard that Openreach are using Invisilight for this sort of deployment, so there are definitely circumstances when they will retro-fit in my sort of building.

Meanwhile I've been told by the managing agent that the Hyperoptic proposal has been passed on to the freeholder.

I also heard back from the freeholder's agent: "we are currently working with the larger broadband providers looking to upgrade all of our buildings to fibre. The providers have been given a list of our buildings across the UK of which they are currently working through and addressing within geographical parcels.".

So it looks like a few things might be happening behind the scenes. Bit of a waiting game now, I guess.

Iain
Standard User Fastman3
(member) Sat 24-Apr-21 11:02:48
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Cockroach] [link to this post]
 
the good news is your managing agent has a a number of building in the same state so is getting heat across the board and has reached out to the infrastructure builders - its not like its just a small management Agent with a problem in one MDU
Standard User Thinker27
(newbie) Sun 25-Apr-21 16:44:50
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Cockroach] [link to this post]
 
I am going through an MDU install in a small block off Fleet Street (where incidentally FTTC has never been available, like much of central London).

Openreach are (or were - it has been well over a year since we started) installing under a scheme called FibreCity, and a card arrived in the post initially. The procedure is that fibres are run to a small point of entry (POE) box outside each flat, and that is all that happens until such time as the resident orders a service from an ISP.

The contractor uses the Furukawa Invisilight system, in which I think there may be 12 fibres in a single round white 2mm sheath. This is typically routed in the corner where the ceiling (or coving) meets the wall, although in my case it ran along the skirting and up and over doorways. The sheath is stripped inside the first (and subsequent) POE box to break out one fibre to a connector, and the rest carry on in the sheath to the next flat.

The site is sensitive - Victorian cornices and new paintwork, with a staircase and no riser, but the installation is unobtrusive. The POE box is about 80x150 from memory and can be painted the colour of the wall. The boxes were positioned where I asked (having previously looked in each flat) so the future installation can be drilled through the centre of the box to a sensible point in the flats.
Standard User Pheasant
(experienced) Sun 25-Apr-21 17:20:55
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Thinker27] [link to this post]
 
For the benefit of other readers the InvisiLight system in-dwelling installation is covered in these promo videos; video 1 and video 2 by OFS/Furukawa.

A typical hallway MDU install is shown here. Individual components are shown here

Note these are all North American promo videos, not those of Openreach in the UK.
Standard User Cockroach
(learned) Sun 02-May-21 18:53:42
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Re: Openreach FTTP upgrades for MDU (Apartment Blocks)?


[re: Thinker27] [link to this post]
 
My building has plenty of riser space and removable ceiling panels in the communal areas - not sure how that would impact an Invisilight install. It would be shame if it isn't hidden but I guess the problem is routing inside each flat above ceiling level.

I've also learned that Hyperoptic now use Invisilight as the default for internal installs. Might end up with two of them at some point!

Iain
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